Wikipedia:Requested moves

Closing instructions

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Requested moves is a process for requesting the retitling (moving) of an article, template, or project page on Wikipedia. For retitling files, categories and other items, see When not to use this page.

Please read the article titling policy and the guideline regarding primary topics before moving a page or requesting a page move.

Any autoconfirmed user can use the Move function to perform most moves (see Help:How to move a page). If you have no reason to expect a dispute concerning a move, be bold and move the page. However, it may not always be possible or desirable to do this:

  • Technical reasons may prevent a move: a page may already exist at the target title and require deletion, or the page may be protected from moves. See: § Requesting technical moves.
  • Requests to revert recent, undiscussed, controversial moves may be made at WP:RM/TR. If the new name has not become the stable title, the undiscussed move will be reverted. If the new name has become the stable title, a requested move will be needed to determine the article's proper location.
  • A title may be disputed, and discussion may be necessary to reach consensus: see § Requesting controversial and potentially controversial moves. The requested moves process is not mandatory, and sometimes an informal discussion at the article's talk page can help reach consensus.
  • Unregistered users and new (not yet autoconfirmed) users are unable to move pages.

Requests are generally processed after seven days. If consensus is reached at or after this time, a reviewer will enact the request. If not, the request may be re-listed to allow more time for consensus to develop, or the discussion closed as "no consensus". See Wikipedia:Requested moves/Closing instructions for more details on the process.

Wikipedia:Move review can be used to contest the outcome of a move request as long as all steps are followed. If a discussion on the closer's talk page does not resolve an issue, then a move review will evaluate the close of the move discussion to determine whether or not the contested close was reasonable and consistent with the spirit and intent of common practice, policies, and guidelines.

When not to use this page

Separate processes exist for moving certain types of pages, and for changes other than page moves:

Undiscussed moves

Autoconfirmed editors may move a page without discussion if all of the following apply:

  • No article exists at the new target title;
  • There has been no discussion (especially no recent discussion) about the title of the page that expressed any objection to a new title; and
  • It seems unlikely that anyone would reasonably disagree with the move.

If you disagree with such a move, and the new title has not been in place for a long time, you may revert the move. If you cannot revert the move for technical reasons, then you may request a technical move.

Move wars are disruptive, so if you make a bold move and it is reverted, do not make the move again. Instead, follow the procedures laid out in § Requesting controversial and potentially controversial moves.

Requesting technical moves

If you are unable to complete a move for technical reasons, you can request technical help below. This is the correct page if you tried to move a page, but you got an error message saying something like "You do not have permission to move this page, for the following reasons: ..."

  • To list a technical request: edit the Uncontroversial technical requests subsection and insert the following code at the top of the list, filling in pages and reason:
    {{subst:RMassist|current page title|new page title|reason=reason for move}}
    This will automatically insert a bullet and include your signature. Please do not edit the article's talk page.
  • If you object to a proposal listed in the uncontroversial technical requests section, please move the request to the Contested technical requests section, append a note on the request elaborating on why, and sign with ~~~~. Consider pinging the requester to let them know about the objection.
  • If your technical request is contested, or if a contested request is left untouched without reply, create a requested move on the article talk and remove the request from the section here. The fastest and easiest way is to click the "discuss" button at the request, save the talk page, and remove the entry on this page.

Technical requests

Uncontroversial technical requests

Administrator needed

Contested technical requests

Requests to revert undiscussed moves

Requesting controversial and potentially controversial moves

The discussion process is used for potentially controversial moves. A move is potentially controversial if either of the following applies:

  • there has been any past debate about the best title for the page;
  • someone could reasonably disagree with the move.

Use this process if there is any reason to believe a move would be contested. For technical move requests, such as to correct obvious typographical errors, see Requesting technical moves. The technical moves procedure can also be used for uncontroversial moves when the requested title is occupied by an existing article.

Do not create a new move request when one is already open on the same talk page. Instead, consider contributing to the open discussion if you would like to propose another alternative. Multiple closed move requests may be on the same page, but each should have a unique section heading.

Do not create a move request to rename one or more redirects. Redirects cannot be used as current titles in requested moves.

Requesting a single page move

To request a single page move, click on the "New section" (or "Add topic") tab of the talk page of the article you want moved, without adding a new subject/header, inserting this code:

{{subst:requested move|NewName|reason=Place here your rationale for the proposed page name change, ideally referring to applicable naming convention policies and guidelines, and providing evidence in support where appropriate. If your reasoning includes search engine results, please prioritize searches limited to reliable sources (e.g. books, news, scholarly papers) over other web results. You don't need to add your signature at the end, as this template will do so automatically.}}

Replace NewName with the requested new name of the page (or with a simple question mark, if you want more than one possible new name to be considered). The template will automatically create the heading "Requested move 1 October 2022" and sign the post for you.

There is no need to edit the article in question. Once the above code is added to the Talk page, a bot will automatically add the following notification at the top of the affected page:

Unlike other request processes on Wikipedia, such as Requests for comment, nominations need not be neutral. Make your point as best you can; use evidence (such as Google Ngrams and pageview statistics) and refer to applicable policies and guidelines, especially our article titling policy and the guideline on disambiguation and primary topics.

WikiProjects may subscribe to Article alerts to receive RM notifications. For example, Wikipedia:WikiProject Biography/Article alerts/Requested moves is transcluded to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Biography. RMCD bot notifies many of the other Wikiprojects listed on the talk page of the article to be moved to invite project members to participate in the RM discussion. Requesters should feel free to notify any other Wikiproject or noticeboard that might be interested in the move request, as long as this notification is neutral.

Single page move on a different talk page

Occasionally, a move request must be made on a talk page other than the talk page of the page to be moved. For example, a request to rename Wikipedia:WikiProject Articles for creation/Resources to Wikipedia:WikiProject Articles for creation/Reviewing and templates would need to take place at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Articles for creation because the talk page of the project page to be moved, Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Articles for creation/Resources, is a redirect to that centralized discussion page. In this type of case, the requested move should be made using the following code:

{{subst:requested move|reason=(the reason for the page move goes here).|current1=(present title of page to be renamed)|new1=(proposed title of page)}}

The |1= unnamed parameter is not used. The |current1= and |new1= parameters are used similar to multiple page moves described below.

Requesting multiple page moves

A single template may be used to request multiple related moves. On one of the talk pages of the affected pages, create a request and format it as below. A sample request for three page moves is shown here (for two page moves, omit the lines for current3 and new3). For four page moves, add lines for current4 and new4, and so on. There is no technical limit on the number of multiple move requests, but before requesting very large multi-moves, consider whether a naming convention should be changed first. Discuss that change on the talk page for the naming convention, e.g., Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (sportspeople).

To request a multiple page move, edit at the bottom of the talk page of the article you chose for your request, without adding a new header, inserting this code:

{{subst:requested move
| current1 = Current title of page 1
| new1     = New title for page 1 with the talk page hosting this discussion
| current2 = Current title of page 2
| new2     = New title for page 2
| current3 = Current title of page 3
| new3     = New title for page 3
| reason   = Place here your rationale for the proposed page name change, ideally referring to applicable naming convention policies and guidelines, and providing evidence in support where appropriate. If your reasoning includes search engine results, please prioritize searches limited to reliable sources (e.g. books, news, scholarly papers) over other web results. You don't need to add your signature at the end, as this template will do so automatically.

For example, to propose moving the articles Wikipedia and Wiki, put this template on Talk:Wikipedia, and replace current2 with Wiki. The discussion for all affected articles is held on the talk page of the article at page 1 (Talk:Wikipedia). Do not sign a request with ~~~~ as the template does this automatically. Do not skip pairs of numbers.

RMCD bot automatically places a notice section on the talk page of the additional pages that are included in your request, advising that the move discussion is in progress, where it is, and that all discussion for all pages included in the request should take place at that one location.

Occasionally the discussions for significant multi-move requests may be hosted on WikiProject talk pages or other pages in Project namespace. For multi-move discussions hosted on a page which is not itself proposed to be moved, specify |current1=Current title of page 1 for the first page to move.

Request all associated moves explicitly

Please list every move that you wish to have made in your request. For example, if you wish to move Cricket (disambiguation) to Cricket because you do not believe the sport is the primary topic for the search term "Cricket", then you actually want to move two pages, both Cricket (disambiguation) and Cricket. Thus you must list proposed titles for each page affected by your request. For example, you might propose:

If a new title is not proposed for the sport, it is more difficult to achieve consensus for a new title for that article. A move request that does not show what to do with the material at its proposed target, such as:

is incomplete. Such requests may be completed as a request to decide the best new title by discussion.

Template usage examples and notes
Talk page tag Text that will be shown (and usage notes)
{{subst:Requested move|new|reason=why}}
links talk edit
Requested move 1 October 2022

Wikipedia:Requested movesNew – why Example (talk) 03:19, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

Use when the proposed new title is given.
Do not sign this template—this tag is auto-signed when substituted. Be sure to use the subst:.
This tag should be placed at the beginning of the section containing the relevant discussion.

{{subst:Requested move|?|reason=why}}
Requested move 1 October 2022

Wikipedia:Requested moves → ? – why Example (talk) 03:19, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

Use when the proposed new title is not known.
Do not sign this template—this tag is auto-signed when substituted. Be sure to use the subst:.
This tag should be placed at the beginning of the section containing the relevant discussion.

{{subst:Requested move|new|reason=why|talk=yes}}
Requested move 1 October 2022

Wikipedia:Requested movesNew – why Example (talk) 03:19, 1 October 2022‎ (UTC)

Feel free to state your position on the renaming proposal by beginning a new line in this subsection with *'''Support''' or *'''Oppose''', then sign your comment with ~~~~. Since polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account Wikipedia's policy on article titles.
Any additional comments:

This template adds subsections for survey and discussion.
Do not sign this template—this tag is auto-signed when substituted. Be sure to use the subst:
Click the "New Section" tab on the talk page and leave the Subject/headline blank, as the template by default automatically creates the heading.

{{subst:Requested move|new1=x|current2=y|new2=z|reason=why}}
Requested move 1 October 2022

– why Example (talk) 03:19, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

Do not sign this template—this tag is auto-signed when substituted.
Be sure to use the subst: and place this tag at the beginning of the section containing the relevant discussion.
Add additional related move requests in pairs (|current3= and |new3=, |current4= and |new4=, etc.).

{{subst:Requested move|new1=?|current2=y|new2=?|reason=why}}
Requested move 1 October 2022

– why Example (talk) 03:19, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

Commenting on a requested move

All editors are welcome to contribute to the discussion regarding a requested page move. There are a number of standards that Wikipedians should practice in such discussions:

  • When editors recommend a course of action, they write Support or Oppose in bold text, which is done by surrounding the word with three single quotes on each side, e.g. '''Support'''.
  • Comments or recommendations are added on a new bulleted line (that is, starting with *) and signed by adding ~~~~ to the end. Responses to another editor are threaded and indented using multiple bullets.
  • The article itself should be reviewed before any recommendation is made; do not base recommendations solely on the information supplied by other editors. It may also help to look at the article's edit history. However, please read the earlier comments and recommendations, as well as prior move requests. They may contain relevant arguments and useful information.
  • Vested interests in the article should be disclosed per Wikipedia:Conflict of interest#How to disclose a COI.

When participating, please consider the following:

  • Editors should make themselves familiar with the article titling policy at Wikipedia:Article titles.
  • Other important guidelines that set forth community norms for article titles include Wikipedia:Disambiguation, specific naming conventions, and the manual of style.
  • The debate is not a vote; please do not make recommendations that are not sustained by arguments.
  • Explain how the proposed article title meets or contravenes policy and guidelines rather than merely stating that it does so.
  • Nomination already implies that the nominator supports the name change, and nominators should refrain from repeating this recommendation on a separate bulleted line.[a]
  • Do not make conflicting recommendations. If you change your mind, use strike-through to retract your previous statement by enclosing it between <s> and </s> after the bullets, and de-bold the struck words, as in "• Support Oppose".

Please remember that reasonable editors will sometimes disagree, but that arguments based in policy, guidelines, and evidence have more weight than unsupported statements. When an editor offers an argument that does not explain how the move request is consistent with policies and guidelines, a reminder to engage in constructive, on-topic discussion may be useful. On the other hand, a pattern of responding to requests with groundless opinion, proof by assertion, and ignoring content guidelines may become disruptive. If a pattern of disruptive behavior persists after efforts are made to correct the situation through dialogue, please consider using a dispute resolution process.

Closing a requested move

Any uninvolved editor in good standing may close a move request. Please read the closing instructions for information on how to close a move request. The Simple guide to closing RM discussions details how to actually close a requested move discussion.

Relisting a requested move

Relisting a discussion moves the request out of the backlog up to the current day in order to encourage further input. The decision to relist a discussion is best left to uninvolved experienced editors upon considering, but declining, to close the discussion. In general, discussions should not be relisted more than once before properly closing.[b] Users relisting a debate which has already been relisted, or relisting a debate with a substantial discussion, should write a short explanation on why they did not consider the debate sufficient to close. While there is no consensus forbidding participation in a requested move discussion after relisting it, many editors consider it an inadvisable form of supervote. If you want to relist a discussion and then participate in it, be prepared to explain why you think it was appropriate.

Relisting should be done using {{subst:relisting}}, which automatically includes the relister's signature, and which must be placed at the very end of the initial request after the move requester's signature (and subsequent relisters' signatures).

When a relisted discussion reaches a resolution, it may be closed at any time according to the closing instructions; there is no required length of time to wait before closing a relisted discussion.

If discussion has become stale, or it seems that discussion would benefit from more input of editors versed in the subject area, consider more widely publicizing the discussion, such as by notifying WikiProjects of the discussion using the template {{RM notification}}. Banners placed at the top of the talk page hosting the move request can often be used to identify WikiProjects suitable for notification.


  1. ^ A nominator making a procedural nomination with which they may not agree is free to add a bulleted line explaining their actual position. Additional detail, such as sources, may also be provided in an additional bullet point if its inclusion in the nomination statement would make the statement unwieldy. Please remember that the entire nomination statement is transcluded into the list on this page.
  2. ^ Despite this, discussions are occasionally relisted more than once.

Current discussions

This section lists all requests filed or identified as potentially controversial which are currently under discussion.

This list is also available in a page-link-first format and in table format. 47 discussions have been relisted.

October 1, 2022

  • (Discuss)The Angel (2018 American film)The Angel (2018 English-language film) – This film was an Israeli-Egyptian-British co-production airing on Netflix, so there is nothing justifying the "American" label. I'm open to suggestions as to a better disambiguator ("spy film"?), but "American" it is not. The Belgian French-language film was shot in the same year, so it should be moved to either "(2018 Belgian film)" or "(2018 French-language film)". Finally, there was the third Angel shot in 2018, but its Spanish title El Angel (film) seems to be its common name, so I'm not including it in the nomination. No such user (talk) 10:49, 23 September 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. — Ceso femmuin mbolgaig mbung, mellohi! (投稿) 00:51, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

September 30, 2022

  • (Discuss)UthsavarUtsava murti – Literature review * The Illustrated Encyclopedia of Hinduism p. 726 - entry "Utsava murti" * Puja and Piety: Hindu, Jain, and Buddhist Art from the ... - Page 71 by Pratapaditya Pal, Stephen P. Huyler, John E. Cort - "Processional images" section * Everyday Hinduism by Joyce Burkhalter Flueckiger - Page 77, 106-9 "murti is also commonly used in the South in reference to festival images (utsava urtis) and the primary image of a temple (mula murti)." * The Camphor Flame: Popular Hinduism and Society in India by C. J. Fuller ·p. 108 "Movable images (utsava murti, “festival image”) of the presiding (and subsidiary) deities," * Gods Beyond Temples - Page 165 by Harsha V. Dehejia Redtigerxyz Talk 14:18, 22 September 2022 (UTC)— Relisting. User:Ceyockey (talk to me) 01:20, 30 September 2022 (UTC)

September 29, 2022

  • (Discuss)Family tree of the Norse godsGenealogies of the Norse gods – 'Family trees of the Nordic/Norse gods' would also work. Really up for discussion on the title but I am completely in agreement with comments made many years ago on this page that the matter is full of nuance and contradiction. I think there is merit in the page but a name change would, in addition to making more sense given that there are multiple trees presented, facilitate a proper explanation and discussion e.g. Snorri making Odin the father of basically everyone - potentially not a view of heathens at the time and before, if they'd even think of matters in the categorical manner we do. I've tried to make this as usable as I can without a major rework to remove misleading information and add notes to explain ambiguities but I think more explanation would help. Ingwina (talk) 20:53, 22 September 2022 (UTC)— Relisting. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 21:16, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Paige (wrestler)Saraya (wrestler) – Saraya is no longer with WWE and no longer uses the name Paige as a professional wrestler. She's currently going by Saraya, her actual first name, in AEW. Even her former Twitter account (@RealPaigeWWE) is inactive, and the one she's using now is simply Saraya. TJ AJ RJ Backslashinfourth V (talk) 17:28, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Hidden ChildrenHidden children – Proposing lowercase since this term is clearly not a proper name and is not capitalized in the body of any of the cited sources that I could find (only in title-case headlines). I originally performed this move without discussion, but just self-reverted that after an objection on the article Talk page. Although I performed a self-revert in response to the objection, I still have the same opinion. The objection seems like advocacy of a different capitalization convention to me, as discussed at MOS:SIGCAPS, with the idea that capital letters should be used to signify that this is a "special group" of children. My impression is that capitalization to indicate specialness is not supported by Wikipedia policies and guidelines. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 17:25, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Sherlock: The Game Is NowSherlock: The Official Live Game – I made an edit to the content on the Sherlock: The Game Is Now page which was rejected - In my edit I changed the first line to: "Sherlock: The Official Live Game (formerly known as Sherlock: The Game is Now) is an escape room based on the television program Sherlock." which i don't believe breaks any of the content policies. The brand name has changed and as the marketing team working with them we are attempting to realign their brand name across the internet and increase brand awareness. The company now goes by "Sherlock: the official live game" as seen on the homepage of their website (domain to be changed soon). We also need the name of the Wikipedia page changed to Sherlock: The Official Live Game & the Url to be updated too. (talk) 16:15, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Bahrani peopleBaharna – the much more common naming used in the article itself and its sources[1][2][3][4]. "Bahrani" is correct as an adjective or referring to one person, but Baharna is the communal term referring to the ethnic group as a whole. It also becomes consistent with Baharna in Kuwait, and not as easy to confuse with Bahraini people (this confusion persisted in wikipedia for years until Privybst's move earlier today). High surv (talk) 14:43, 29 September 2022 (UTC) High surv (talk) 14:43, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Toronto van attack2018 Toronto van attack – The current convention on article titles for events, WP:NCEVENTS, demands that in the majority of cases a date come before the article title. I see no good reason to make an exception here, especially given the fact that the article previously had the date in the title, until a unilateral move that did not respect the requested move process for controversial moves. Currently, this is one of the few articles from the List of vehicle-ramming attacks that lack the date in the title; adding the date would make it WP:CONSISTENT with the rest. Pilaz (talk) 13:48, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Société BicBic (company) – In common parlance, the company in the U.S. is referred to as simply "Bic", as opposed to its French name "Société Bic". This move would make it a bit easier for readers to find the article and read more about the company if they so wish. Further, the new title better obeys WP:COMMONNAME and is more precise (WP:PRECISE). Thanks, and let me know what you think. :) — That Coptic Guy (talk) 00:06, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

September 28, 2022

  • (Discuss)Dissent from Catholic teaching on homosexualityDissent from Holy See teaching on homosexuality – "The Holy See" is an uncontroversial term, but 'Catholic' is a more controversial one. Are these dissident Priests 'truly Catholic'? There are implications to this qn: Are they in harmony with 'Catholic teaching'? (We may not all agree on the ans to these qns, which lies in theology, which we wikipedians are have no authority to debate about.) We may not have the authority to say if they're dissenting from 'Catholic teaching', BUT we all CAN agree that they're dissenting from the teaching of an institution - the Holy See. Let's remove ambiguity. Let's use uncontroversial terms. P.S. If "the HS's teaching" is more grammatically acceptable than "HS teaching", I'm fine with that. FatalSubjectivities (talk) 09:29, 17 September 2022 (UTC) — Relisting.  ASUKITE 18:38, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Dixie Chicken (album)Dixie Chicken – The album is clearly WP:PRIMARY here. The song doesn't have its own article, and the bar is named after the song. Given that all other uses are derived from the album or its song, it's clear that the album is the most common topic associated with the title "Dixie Chicken". Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 16:59, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Gorno-Badakhshan Autonomous RegionGorno-Badakhshan – Per WP:COMMONNAME, as "Gorno-Badakhshan" is the common name in English, derived from Russian. "Gorno-Badakhshan Autonomous Region" is not the official name of the region in English, and so English media variously use the suffixes "Autonomous Region", "Autonomous Province", "Autonomous Oblast", "Region" or just Gorno-Badakhshan. The sources provided in an earlier move discussion in 2008 are either dead or now use the names "Gorno-Badakhshan" or "Gorno-Badakhshan autonomous region". "Autonomous region" is in lowercase because it is a reference to the type of subnational division Gorno-Badakhshan is, and not a part of the region's name (officially, or commonly in English). Yue🌙 05:25, 21 September 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 05:54, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Jeff Chan → ? – Comparing the page views for the past 7 years, the basketball players has the higher average than the saxophonist (even Jeffery Paul Chan averages more than the saxophonist). It's clear the saxophonist is not the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC anymore, but I am also quite unsure if the page view difference is significant enough to conclude that the basketball players is the new primary topic. So I say move the saxophonist's article and create a dab page at the name without the dab. I'm unsure though if "saxophonist", "composer", or "musician" should be the dab for the new page name of the saxophonist's article (if moved). Engr. Smitty Werben 08:01, 19 September 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. Elli (talk | contribs) 05:14, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Vejle Sygehus railway haltVejle Sygehus station – I believe "station" is both standard English and standard style for train station articles; "railway halt" is a term I've never heard before and possibly resultant from an inaccurate translation. The target is a redirect with two revisions, so its history is nontrivial, and thus I cannot perform the move myself. Complex/Rational 02:20, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

September 27, 2022

  • (Discuss)Perth StadiumOptus Stadium – This is the WP:COMMONNAME. It is what most people refer to the oval as and it is in fact what the majority of sources used in this article refer to it as. It will not cause any issues with other disambiguated titles, other than possibly Optus Oval, but I would say "Perth Stadium" is a name that would cause more of an issue than "Optus Stadium" due to its broadness. - Therealscorp1an (talk) 23:26, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)MacintoshMac – There has been no move discussion since 2014. I think it's long overdue. Since there are two components to this move, here's a breakdown of arguments for each: 1. Macintosh should be moved to Mac The name Macintosh is defunct, and hasn't been used for almost two decades by either average people or reliable sources. No one today uses the term "Macintosh" to refer to Apple's computer lineup, except clearly SEO-spam content in Google search results, old content from the Macintosh era, and this Wikipedia page. The vast majority of people don't even know that "Macintosh" and "Mac" refer to the same thing. WP:COMMONNAME clearly requires a move at this point. A common argument in previous move discussions was that "Mac" was short for "Macintosh"; which is simply no longer true when "Macintosh" is no longer used by anyone (not just Apple; customers and reliable sources too). I've searched the NYTimes: the only mentions of "Macintosh" in recent articles are in captions of photographs from the 80s, or articles discussing Apple's history (an example is here: Feel free to search "macintosh" to confirm this. 2. It should be moved to Mac as opposed to Mac (computer), and the disamb should be moved to Mac (disambiguation) Though the Mac disambig page is quite full, none of the articles it links to are especially notable, save for MAC Cosmetics, which received 9k views in 30 days compared to 50k for Macintosh. Mackintosh (clothing) received 5k. This move would be fully in line with, for example, Rice, which receives 70k monthly views and takes the main page, while Rice University received 30k monthly views and is relegated to the disambig page. To be clear, my argument here is not founded on pageviews but mainly notability. Looking at Google Search results, there are about 11,400 results for the query " apple mac", compared to 2,930 results for " mac cosmetics" (note that articles on the Mac may not necessary contain the word "Apple", for example, in the NYTimes's product comparisons or buying recommendations; so the Apple results are likely incomplete). Looking at Google Trends, type "MAC Cosmetics" on one side, and MacBook (pick "topic", not "search term" for both for a fair comparison); the computer is clearly far more notable than the cosmetics brand: MacBook, only part of Apple's Mac lineup, is at 80 on Google Trends, compared to 17 for MAC Cosmetics. When users type "Mac" into Wikipedia's search bar, they likely expect to land here; users who want to go to MAC Cosmetics are likely to type that full name in the search bar. Same for MAC address, which is always called by its full name, never just "MAC", to avoid the inevitable confusion that would ensue. While I fully agree that Apple should link to the fruit to avoid excessive commercialism, I don't feel this concern applies here, since the term Mac is so associated with the computer, and since both Mac (the computer) and MAC Cosmetics represent commercialism. Though WP:NATURALDIS specifies that an alternative name that the subject is also commonly called in English reliable sources, albeit not as commonly as the preferred-but-ambiguous title may be used, I don't feel it applies here, as the Mac lineup is not at all "commonly called" Macintosh (these days, practically never, it's more of an easter egg if anything). That argument would work if the balance was 60/40 in favor of "Mac", as opposed to what seems more like 90/10 or more. The new Mac page should have, at the top: DFlhb (talk) 20:51, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Volodymyr SaldoVladimir Saldo – Saldo is a head of Russian administration in Kherson, has been a Russian citizen since recently and Kherson Oblast will be annexed by Russia any day now as the referendum passed today, which automatically makes Saldo a Russian politician. Hence I think it would be appropriate to change the name of his article to the Russian version of his name Vladimir Saldo. Elserbio00 (talk) 18:29, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)DS 7 CrossbackDS 7 – With the recent 2022 facelift, the car changed its name, ditching the Crossback subtitle (jabz) 15:37, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Russkaya PravdaRus' Justice – The rules of naming manuscripts clearly state: "If a manuscript has an English name, the manuscript's article should be under that name." This one DOES have an English name, and it should be referenced as such. DoctorWhutsup (talk) 13:59, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Tsardom of RussiaTsardom of Muscovy – The name "Tsardom of Russia" is not remotely close to beling the most common form of reference in English-speaking sources. Same precedents exist all over WIkipedia (for example, "Greeks," instead of "Hellenes". Before Peter the Great renamed his state, it was referenced as Muscovy not just externally, but occassionally even by Muscovites themeselves in legal documents (look up Sobornoye Ulozheniye, 1649). According to the common naming policy of Wikipedia, this article should not be named "Russia" as very few English-speaking authors refer to it as such. DoctorWhutsup (talk) 13:48, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)AlumnusAlumni – "Alumnus" is the male version of alumni, making the decision to locate the article here rather than at "Alumna" a clear instance of the male as norm phenomenon, and one that could potentially confuse readers about whether the article's scope (i.e. whether it also covers female alumnae). Per WP:Manual of Style#Gender-neutral language, a guideline, we should be avoiding the generic 'he' and generic 'she'" wherever "this can be done with clarity and precision." Therefore, it's desirable to move this article away from its current title if possible. There are two main alternatives. The first, "alum," is unfortunately still considered informal and appears to be popular mainly in the U.S. and Canada. For the second, the plural form "alumni," we need to consider WP:Naming conventions (plurals). That guideline advises normally using singular titles. However, it allows an exception for Articles on groups or classes of specific things, and alumni arguably fall into this category because the former students of any given institution are almost always considered as a group. It also notes the option to ignore the rules here in order to make the encyclopedia better, which I think is relevant if one disagrees with my interpretations of WP:PLURALS. If we end up having to choose between adhering to WP:PLURALS and MOS:GNL, I think it's more important to adhere to MOS:GNL given the factors above. {{u|Sdkb}}talk 05:46, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Orange Shirt DayNational Day for Truth and Reconciliation – It has been over a year since the last discussion for this, and I think it's worth reopening. Since then, the holiday has become more widespread and mainstream, and the name "National Day for Truth and Reconciliation" is not only the official name, but is also the more commonly used term (in my experience). As User:Crumpled_Fire argued over a year ago, "moving the article to the official government title is more appropriate, since its federal status makes it more notable by default, and it is a more tonally-appropriate name — "Orange Shirt day" sounds too flippant. It is also the first new Canadian federal holiday in decades, and all other articles for Canadian federal holidays use their official title, or an approximation thereof." C.monarchist28 (talk) 04:28, 27 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Chop Suey! (song)Chop Suey!Chop Suey! already redirects here so there's no reason for the parentheses. This is the only page listed on Chop suey (disambiguation) that includes an exclamation point. The official music video, YouTube audio, and Spotify audio all include the exclamation point. Official name is of course not binding but it's something to consider. I haven't analyzed whether with or without is more common in media, but here is an assortment of articles that use the exclamation point: [12] [13] [14] These show that even if the exclamation point isn't the most commonly used name, it is a commonly used name, and WP:NATURAL says we should prefer the naturally-disambiguated "Chop Suey!" over the parenthetical "Chop Suey (song)". But the current title of "Chop Suey! (song)" makes no sense, because again, "Chop Suey!" redirects here anyway. —pythoncoder (talk | contribs) 04:00, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

September 26, 2022

  • (Discuss)2015 Japanese scientific misconduct allegations → ? – Originally submitted as "Anonymous A's allegation of massive paper frauds" (translation of it's jawiki title,) from AFC, I moved it to the current one in hopes of a natural-sounding (by enwiki standards). However, prose suggests that the allegations were made before and after the year in the title. FMecha (to talk|to see log) 17:59, 19 September 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 22:23, 26 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Boxer (disambiguation)Boxer – It seems unclear, especially when using third party search engines, if readers looking up the term "boxer" are primarily looking for someone who participates in the sport of boxing or Boxer (breed). This looks like a case where there are co-dominant subjects where it is not clear which one readers are looking for when searching the term. Steel1943 (talk) 18:52, 26 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)DappDapp, Alberta – Dapp, a hamlet of 30 people, is clearly not a primary topic. DAPP is the current disambiguation page, but Dapp would be a clearer title. (disambiguation) is would be a clearer name for it, and DAPP can just redirect to Dapp (disambiguation) as it appears to be the abbreviation for more than one link. Alternatively DAPP could become DAPP (disambiguation) and we could separate out the Dapp links from the DAPP links. Bermicourt (talk) 17:51, 26 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Timeline of women's religious ordinationTimeline of women's ordination – There is no reason to specify "religious" in the article title, since "ordination" unambiguously refers to clerical ordination by religious bodies; furthermore it is an error to refer to "religious" in the context of the Catholic Church when not referring to institutes or orders of consecrated religious people. Elizium23 (talk) 15:34, 26 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Weißer See (Berlin)White Lake (Berlin) – There is a problem with the name of this article, it is written with a letter that exists only in German the letter ß, which is not available on the keyboard of many editors Hanay (talk) 13:07, 26 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Nadezhda TolokonnikovaNadya Tolokonnikova – Subject has made all official media and political appearances, including with US State Department, RISD, CNN, MSNBC, Guardian, Rolling Stone etc as Nadya not Nadezhda. Comparing Google News results for last 12 months, 622 news results for "Nadya Tolokonnikova" compared to 154 news results for "Nadezhda Tolokonnikova", showing a naturalness of Nadya vs Nadezhda. WP:CRITERIA states "article titles are based on how reliable English-language sources refer to the article's subject" therefore Russian speaking media should not apply to this discussion (this was brought up in a previous move discussion about Russian sources favoring Nadezhda). Pathofkarma (talk) 01:25, 26 September 2022 (UTC)

September 25, 2022

  • (Discuss)Izium mass gravesIzium massacre – sources are already calling this a massacre and likening it to the Bucha massacre, and sadly it already looks like an even bigger scale. Each mass grave of 10-25 people with one 440 people; the name "mass graves" suggests more of an archaeological discovery than a macabre mass-crime scene Abcmaxx (talk) 18:52, 16 September 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. – robertsky (talk) 04:16, 25 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)List of Anime Grand Prix winnersAnime Grand Prix – I suggest renaming this article from the list of winners to just Anime Grand Prix. Currently Anime Grand Prix redirects to Animage#Anime_Grand_Prix, but the interwiki from our article here (the list) to ja wiki is not to a list but to an article about the award, with list included in it, ja:アニメグランプリ, which can be used to expand the prose section here. The award is likely notable and deserves its own article, and such an article can include the list. I don't think that there is a need to spit things (yes, we could just create a separate artcle instaed of moving this one, but it already introduces the award in the lead, so by split things?). And it's strange to have a list of winners but not an article on an award. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 03:46, 25 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Nick TaylorNicholas Taylor – The legal first name for most of the entries on this page is "Nicholas", Nick being the short-form or nickname. Nicholas is better suited for the title since it covers most of the entries Ortizesp (talk) 00:10, 25 September 2022 (UTC)

September 24, 2022

  • (Discuss)Ben DavisBenjamin DavisBen Davis should redirect to Benjamin Davis, rather than the other way around. Main title headers of disambiguation pages usually indicate a full name, such as "Richard", rather than "Rick" or "Dick", or "Charles", rather than "Charlie" or "Chuck" if, among the listed people, at least one person's WP:COMMONNAME is the full name. In the case at hand, there are 26 bulleted entries listed upon the Ben Davis dab page, eight of which use the form "Benjamin". —Roman Spinner (talkcontribs) 23:10, 24 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Killing of Hae Min LeeMurder of Hae Min Lee – Just because Syed's conviction has been overturned, it doesn't mean Lee wasn't murdered. She was murdered, it's just now the murder is essentially unsolved. The article should be renamed back to what it was, "Murder of Hae Min Lee" as this is still a murder case. Inexpiable (talk) 11:12, 24 September 2022 (UTC)

Elapsed listings

  • (Discuss)The Queue → ? – During the recent AfD, it was suggested that article should be renamed. 'The Queue' is an colloquial term applied on the event surrounding the Queen's lying-in-state. Proponents for keeping the article name as it is would cite WP:COMMONNAME and it being reported as such, but a search on Google news, even with just 'The Queue' reveals that reports of the event being reported 'Queue', 'queue', queue to the...' in headlines and body text. There is no consistency and does not demonstrate the term to be a common name. Even in the article here, 'The Queue' is just simply the queue in the rest of the body text. Also, as indicated in the article, 'The Queue' refers to the main queue of the event, while the article covers more than just that. During the course of the AfD, there had been at least one attempt to move the article as well, and in the AfD discussion, various alternative names were thrown out: :A: Stage Funeral Queue of Elizabeth II :B: Queue to Elizabeth II lying in state :C: Lying-in-state of Elizabeth II :D: Queue to pass Elizabeth II lying-in-state (this is from the undiscussed move) I am opening the discussion here to solicit if the article should be renamed, and if so, rename to what? – robertsky (talk) 06:26, 23 September 2022 (UTC)


  • (Discuss)Calf (disambiguation)Calf – No primary topic, Calf (leg) has 10,807 views and The Calf has 98 compared with only 5,254[[15]] for the animal. Google returns the leg article first and most of the other results are for the leg. Images also returns slightly more results for the leg but Books mainly returns the animal. Calf (cattle) and Calf (young animal) are possibilities but with respect to the 1st the term is used for other animals and with respect to the 2nd it may be unnecessarily specific as the leg term only appears to be used to refer to humans on the other hand the "animal" disambiguator may still be ambiguous with human leg parts. Crouch, Swale (talk) 16:52, 19 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)Iberia, Byzantine EmpireTheme of Iberia – Again, per WP:CONCISE and WP:CONSIST, I still believe Theme of Iberia would be perfectly suiting name as "X of Iberia" is better description for the polity, but as it was rejected by the colleagues in previous move-request I am suggesting we offer better fitting name as the current name reads like a name of a little town in the middle of nowhere. Regards, An emperor /// Ave 01:52, 11 September 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. – robertsky (talk) 04:40, 18 September 2022 (UTC)
  • (Discuss)1948 Palestinian exodus1948 Palestinian expulsion and flight – As discussed in the prior move request, "exodus" is both euphemistic and not the common name of the subject of this article. Expulsion (75,600 results on google books, 31,500 on scholar), expelled (15,200 on books, 30,000 on scholar) are used more often in scholarly sources than "exodus" (24,800 on scholar, 46,400 on books) Also, a note on the books result for exodus, several of the first page results are about a different topic, the Jewish exodus from Arab and Muslim lands. The fourth result is about the Jewish exodus from Iraq, the tenth is about SS Exodus. There were concerns in the above request that not all Palestinians were forced from their homes, and even though "expelled" also applied to those disallowed from returning (ie all of them), this current title encompasses all categories, reflect the language more commonly used in sources, and is not euphemistic. Nableezy 19:37, 8 September 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. – robertsky (talk) 21:01, 15 September 2022 (UTC)

Possibly incomplete requests


  1. ^ "Bahrain - History Background". Archived from the original on October 11, 2015.
  2. ^ Language Variation And Change In A Modernising Arab State: The Case Of Bahrain Google Books
  3. ^ Holes, Clive (2001). Dialect, Culture, and Society in Eastern Arabia: Glossary. ISBN 978-9004107632.
  4. ^ Jastrow, Otto (2002). Non-Arabic Semitic elements in the Arabic dialects of Eastern Arabia. Clive Holes. pp. 270–279. ISBN 9783447044912.
  5. ^ [h "Charlie Shackleton on Twitter: For a long time now, I've regretted a decision I made about 15 years ago, when—in a fit of teenage reinvention—I stopped using my mum's surname, Shackleton, and started using my dad's, Lyne. (My mum raised me after my dad left us when I was a baby.)"]. Twitter. Retrieved 9 September 2016.
  6. ^ "Charlie Shackleton". BFI. Retrieved 22 September 2022.
  7. ^ "Charlie Shackleton". Internet Movie Database. Retrieved 9 September 2016.

See also