Skip to top
Skip to bottom


The removing process of Techyan's linksEdit

How to deal with an IP range messing up templates on one article?Edit

At List of Talking Tom & Friends (TV series) episodes, an IP range (first 4 character sets are matching in all 3 addresses) has been messing up templates. Their first disruptive edit spree was on 17 September, then they made three edits yesterday with an 8-hour gap between each edit, all of which were reverted. I will be taking action if he does this one more time, but which of these would be an appropriate course of action?

  1. Request PCP for the page and let reviewers block the bad edits (can allow good edits if the editor changes, and can also stop other vandals, but needs a pending changes reviewer to spend time checking edits)
  2. Request a range-block for these IP addresses specifically for the aforementioned article (can completely stop this problem as long as he stays on that IP range but won't stop him if he moves to a different IP range (though it is unlikely IMO that he'll move to another range))

Thanks, Tube·of·Light 03:48, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@Tube of Light: None of those. The range is too broad to block, and PCP is usually not effective in reducing workload of the good editors; they still have to check and approve or revert the disruptive edits, which is somewhat more work. Semi-protection seems like the better alternative. I have semi-protected the article for two weeks. ~Anachronist (talk) 07:30, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Thanks, @Anachronist! So if I understand correctly, PCP would be useful only if there were many other good editors who could be restricted by semi-protection? Tube·of·Light 03:22, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@Tube of Light: That rarely occurs. If there are many other good editors, they'll notice when vandalism happens and revert it without the need for protection. PCP can be useful in low-volume articles with few watchers and few editors. In that case the vandalism is permitted but it doesn't appear until a reviewer comes along and approves it. ~Anachronist (talk) 04:15, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Understood. Tube·of·Light 02:42, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

musical notability criteria for unreleased musicEdit

theres an article i'm trying to make and it's for an unreleased single. it will be released on September 27, 2021. what kind of references should i use? i've used some references but the person said that it needs reliable sources although i've put them already. could you please help me find a proper example for this too? thx BaaBaaTheSheep(talkctb) 08:07, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Courtesy link: Draft:Bad Love (Key song).
Please see Wikipedia:Notability (music)#Songs within the broader Wikipedia:Notability (music), to which the reviewer @Robert McClenon: has already referred you, for the specific criteria applied to such a case. A source may be reliable for corroborating a fact about a subject (in this case a song), but still not sufficient to demonstrate the song's Notability.
It seems to me that it would be very exceptional for a song to qualify as Notable even before it has been released. If this were not so, every song ever released would qualify for an article.
See also WP:TOOSOON. {The poster formerly known as} (talk) 08:29, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Nobody will remember either an IPv4 address or an IPv6 address. Just register an account. Robert McClenon (talk) 00:12, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]
That isn't the intention, I just use it to ensure continuity of identity in a given conversation (since I have a dynamic IP), not to have people associate all my posts with an established identity and 'reputation', which would be contrary to my wiki-principles. I've been IP-editing here for 16 years and will continue to do so as long as it's permitted or until I decide otherwise (which I might, for my reasons). {The poster formerly known as} (talk) 12:56, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Should the article Bad Love (EP), which seems closely related, also be moved to draft for further review? Feline Hymnic (talk) 10:38, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
User:Feline Hymnic, User:BaaBaaTheSheep - Just wait until the album is released, including the song. Some editors are in too much of a hurry to get articles on songs and albums before they are released, when there is very little of encyclopedic value, just gossip and chatter. However, with the release in two days, there is also little reason to push the album article into draft space, even though it jumped the gun also. Robert McClenon (talk) 00:12, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]
The topic of this thread is "musical notability criteria for unreleased music", which can be summarized as "very little notability until release". Robert McClenon (talk) 00:14, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

review draf pleaseEdit

Hello, can you review my draf please. I add more sources. Sulovari (talk) 11:09, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]

You presumably didn't notice what it says in the box on your draft: "Review waiting, please be patient. This may take 6 weeks or more, since drafts are reviewed in no specific order. There are 1,707 pending submissions waiting for review." --David Biddulph (talk) 11:36, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
  Courtesy link: Draft:Mickie McGowan -- ColinFine (talk) 11:39, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
ARE YOU UNDECLARED PAID? Curious as to how you recently started your account and your first two activities were to create articles about an Albanian politician and an American movies voice actor. (talk) 11:47, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
  • @Sulovari, hello and welcome to the Teahouse. I note that KylieTastic is the declining reviewer. You see, coming to the Teahouse is a good move but even better, is to try and initiate a dialogue with the declining reviewer, that way, you get to learn what and what you need to correct or adjust before re-submitting. Now, speaking on re-submissions, it appears the article was declined barely 46 hours ago. It is frustrating for reviewers when you binge submit articles without addressing the problem. Celestina007 (talk) 17:24, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Creating editor di make the draft 50% longer before resubmitting, assumption being addressed Decline comments. Query about PAID still hanging. (talk) 08:32, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

German humour!Edit

This is more a comment than a question, though I'd still welcome opinions! I'm busy translating a German wikipedia article to create a draft at Draft:Gasolin_AG, and came across a lovely comment in the original German article that Gasolin proposed a helicopter-operated air-petrol-delivery service by which broken-down vehicles could be refilled, the pilot radioing the details of the car number plate and petrol supplied, to a local admin centre. I was busy typing away, and adding the reference, when I noticed it was 1st April. This fact is presented in a thoroughly dead-pan way in the German Wikipedia. Of all the hazards one expects in translating a German page, bumping into a lovely example of German humour wasn't one I'd envisaged. Now I have no idea whether to include this "fact", or consider it highly suspicious and exclude it, or to translate in equally dead-pan style. It is so beautifully poised on the boundary between believable and far-fetched. To be on the safe-side, I am omitting it. I am rather sad. Elemimele (talk) 11:26, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Hello, Elemimele. When translating an article, what is important is whether what you produce meets English Wikipedia standards, in particular on sourcing. You are free to translate as much or as little of the original as you choose, and to rewrite it as much or as little as you choose. If the hoax in the German is cited to a reliable source (presumably that reveals that it is a hoax) then your translation could do likewise. Otherwise, it has no business being in the en-wiki article. (I strongly suspect that it should be removed from the de-wiki article as well). --ColinFine (talk) 11:43, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@ColinFine: it's from 1961, so we will probably never know! I've posed the question on the talk-page at German WP in case someone there with a better understanding of German culture can assess the chances. Even if it was a hoax, I doubt there's a source to say so, given the time that's passed. Thanks for reassuring me that I can miss it out. I think I might submit in the current state and see what people think. Elemimele (talk) 11:48, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Elemimele, I hardly think that "Landscape and Garden Design Advisor", even if it existed, is going to be a reliable source on this subject! --ColinFine (talk) 12:03, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
ColinFine hey, the author's a Diplomlandwirt Dr Agr.! How can you possibly doubt his word? I can almost see his upright respectability from here! Yes, this is surely a magazine's bit of fun for April, and best left out. Elemimele (talk) 12:25, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
And judging by this, Elemimele, a 1961 edition should have been in volume 27, not volume 13. I don't think it was a magazine's bit of fun: I think it was a bit of Wikipedia vanadalism masquerading as an April Fool joke. -ColinFine (talk) 14:16, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Let me start deadpan: (We) Germans don't do humour, this is well known. In consequence, the joke has been enfernt from the article in DE-Wikipedia. Lectonar (talk) 17:32, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@Lectonar:, @ColinFine: Ohje, my sole contribution to German WP: to induce the the stamping-out of Germanic humour... I am not proud of this act! I notice that English WP does have a terribly serious article on German_humour, and Gråbergs Gråa Sång has pointed out Rhinogradentia, which is absolutely gorgeous. Elemimele (talk) 18:01, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Reminds me of Joan Fontcuberta#Fauna (1987), Elemimele. --ColinFine (talk) 22:05, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Anecdotal evidence to the contrary: John Cleese says that once when he checked into a hotel in Germany, a German guest called out from across the lobby "Hey, John! Don't mention the war, ok!", and the room exploded in laughter. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 17:46, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]


In the lead section of any article about a person we have to mention date of birth. My question is where should I put the citation for the date of birth; inside or outside the bracket. Which one of the following is correct.

  1. Name (born DD MM YYYY)citation is...
  2. Name (born DD MM YYYYcitation) is... Eevee01(talk) 18:54, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
The first one is correct. Citations always go after any punctualtion, per MOS:CITEPUNCT.--Shantavira|feed me 19:13, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@Shantavira Thanks! Eevee01(talk) 19:18, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@Eevee01:@Shantavira: MOS:CITEPUNCT says, "Where a footnote applies only to material within parentheses, the ref tags belong just before the closing parenthesis" (my emphasis), from which one gathers that the second example, not the first, is correct. Deor (talk) 17:12, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Thak you Deor. I stand corrected.--Shantavira|feed me 08:41, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
  1. Per MOS:BADDATE, do not use the dd-mm-yyyy format for dates (either spell out the month, or use yyyy-mm-dd)
  2. Per WP:BLPPRIVACY, only give the precise date of birth if it is likely the subject does not object, otherwise give only the year (even if the source gives the full date). TigraanClick here for my talk page ("private" contact) 07:59, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Do you need to ask before editing an article?Edit

Are you meant to do so? If yes, where do I ask? If no, what next? ElectricGirl123 (talk) 23:52, 25 September 2021 (UTC) ElectricGirl123 (talk) 23:52, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@ElectricGirl123: Welcome, and thanks for wanting to improve Wikipedia. No, you don't need to ask. See WP:BRD. Wikipedia encourages editors to be bold. If someone disagrees with your edit, they will revert it, and then you can discuss on the article's talk page. RudolfRed (talk) 23:56, 25 September 2021 (UTC)[]
ElectricGirl123, simply ask yourself whether your edit will improve the encyclopedia. If your sincere answer is "yes", then make the edit.Cullen328 Let's discuss it 02:22, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@RudolfRed: Thanks, I'll be aware of this. Electric Ask me a question, get answered in a ZAP! 08:59, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Indigenous MaterialEdit

what is recommended when dealing with indigenous references? My subject underwent a ceremony bestowing an honour on him which cannot be verified by contemporary standards Viraload (talk) 06:53, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

First of all, have you disclosed your COI (see Wikipedia:DISCLOSEPAY)? ― Qwerfjkltalk 07:11, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Viraload (talk) 07:17, 26 September 2021 (UTC) yes, on my user page Viraload (talk) 07:47, 26 September 2021 (UTC) from what I can make out, there is some discussion about the oral document becoming a source but at this time we are advised not to include such "unverifiable" accounts[]

@Viraload: all information in Wikipedia must be publicly available in published sources. This excludes oral tradition, which has garnered us some criticism from outsiders, but the fact of the matter is that so many people (whether paid actors or amateur vandals) come to add false information to Wikipedia that we need a system that makes it easy for experienced editors to verify information. Take a look at the essay Wikipedia:Oral history. — Bilorv (talk) 12:02, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Updating Janet Jackson Total Album Sales To The Correct Number.Edit

Janet Jackson total album sales have been wrong for a long time on the site. Her sales should be updated to over 180 Million Albums Sold. I will post several links below to support the change to the accurate number. Rodneygunn (talk) 07:31, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Rodneygunn Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Please direct this comment to the article talk page, Talk:Janet Jackson, where the editors that follow that article can see it. 331dot (talk) 07:50, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]


Do you do test edits in your sandbox userpage or your sandbox talk page? Electric Ask me a question, get answered in a ZAP! 10:51, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Your test edits would be at User:ElectricGirl123/sandbox, which you have started. If anyone wishes to discuss that page, they would do so at User talk:ElectricGirl123/sandbox. - David Biddulph (talk) 11:04, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@David Biddulph: Thank you, I will take notice of that and edit at my sandbox. Is there an article about MeowChat? I'd be delighted to create my first article. Electric Ask me a question, get answered in a ZAP! 11:17, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@ElectricGirl123: Welcome to the Teahouse. You can make test edits in your own sandbox or the community sandbox, though the latter is periodically wiped. There doesn't seem to be an article about MeowChat, so if you're interested in starting one, I'd suggest reading through Your first article carefully and follow the Articles for Creation process by starting a draft. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 15:11, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Need helpEdit

Hi! I need anyone who would like to help me to know what, how and when I can create an article. Is there anyone there? Banzhowen (talk) 11:14, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@Banzhowen: Hello and Welcome to the Teahouse. Sucessfully creating a new article from scratch is one of the harder tasks around here, and its harder than it often seems. ColinFine, an expeirenced user, said this about a similar question about 7 days ago:

I'm afraid that your question (which is one we get often at this page) is a bit like "How can I build a house?" The best answer to that is "First, spend a few years learning the trade of house-building". A Wikipedia article isn't quite as big and complicated as a house, so I would say months rather than years; but experience shows that people who come here and start trying to create an article before they have learnt quite a lot about how Wikipedia works usually have a frustrating and disappointing time, I strongly suggest that you put that idea aside for a few months, while you work on improving some of our existing six million articles (most of them could be improved) and learning how the huge monster that is Wikipedia actually works.

— User:ColinFine, here
That being said, I have left a welcome message on your talkpage, which includes a link to this helppage, which should assist you creating a new article. Victor Schmidt (talk) 11:56, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Henry Reynolds discovered the French Broad, my grandfather.Edit

Why is Henry Reynolds not credited with discovery of the FB river? He is on the 1840 census Mechlenburg co. North Carolina as a constable. he wound up in Savannah Tn. Still several decendents here on the Tenn. river, thanks, JAMES E REYNOLDS (talk) 12:07, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Published reliable source to say he discovered French Broad River? --David Biddulph (talk) 13:34, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Hi @, this can be fixed. You cannot make the change yourself, as you have a conflict of interest, being a close relative of the person about whom you'd like to write. But if you can find a reliable, written source where someone independent of your grandfather states that he discovered the river, you can go to the talk page associated with French Broad River, and post a request that someone add text on your behalf. Give the reference as clearly as you can, and state very precisely what you would like adding to the article. The instructions are at Wikipedia:Simple_conflict_of_interest_edit_request. Note that if you can't find an independent source that backs up the statement, there is no hope of getting it in Wikipedia, no matter how true it's known to be. Wikipedia is a tertiary source, it only reports things that have already been written-about in secondary sources. If you can't find a source, your best bet is to raise awareness amongst local historians in hopes that one of them will be inspired to write about your grandfather. Good luck! Elemimele (talk) 16:26, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]
The French Broad River is in an area inhabited by the Cherokee people for hundreds or perhaps thousands of years before Europeans came to the area, and there were predecessor mound building Native American cultures in that area for millenia So, the notion that your purported grandfather Henry Reynolds discovered this river is false on the face of it. As for Henry Reynolds being your grandfather, if he was a constable in 1840, he must have been born 200 or more years ago. How old was Henry when your father was born, and how old was your father when you were born? What evidence other than family lore do you have for all of this It? It is possible but highly unlikely. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 05:29, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
As Pterry noted, "living there" doesn't count when it comes to exploration. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 07:52, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
I wish I could do maths! I assume by grandfather we're talking "ancestor" here. Elemimele (talk) 12:55, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
"Grandfather" and "Ancestor" have different definitions. David notMD (talk) 13:41, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Here is a page from a book that says there is a "legend" that a Henry Reynolds and another man discovered warm springs in the river (not the river itself) in 1778. It also points out that the Cherokee already knew about the warm springs. That was 62 years before the 1840 description of a Reynolds who was a constable. It is highly unlikely that these were the same men. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 17:38, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Well found! Unfortunately Reynolds is hardly a rare name, and nor is Henry. It is not unlikely that a few of them would have been found around the area. And once you've found one, they will probably have family. Elemimele (talk) 19:36, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]


How to start a ARTICLE Bdetfehigj (talk) 16:05, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Your user talk page has a welcome message with a number of useful links, one of which is WP:Your first article. - David Biddulph (talk) 16:08, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Archiving my Talk PagesEdit

Is there a way to convert my talk page archiving from monthly to yearly? I realized retrospectively that a monthly archive will lead to dozens and dozens of archive links if I continue to edit for a few years. TipsyElephant (talk) 17:27, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Hi TipsyElephant! You can change the "archive" parameter on the MiszaBot config template. Setting it to User talk:TipsyElephant/%(year)d will work, but keep in mind this won't convert your existing archives, as you'd have to do that yourself. To make the archives box on your talk page show the year-based archives, {{Archives|image=none|{{Center|{{Yearly archive list|prefix=}}}}}} should look fairly similar. Best regards, Vukky! :) (talkcontributions) 07:25, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

DavidJMoss Draft:Tobey C Moss Gallery. my latest submission does not show up under "History".Edit

  Courtesy link: Draft:Tobey C. Moss Gallery
My webpage was rejected on July 9th by Robertsky and I resubmitted it on Aug 31st with corrections based on his and prior input. Why doesn't my resubmission show up under "history". The only way I found it was by going to user contributions, which makes no sense. And, how do I see where the corrections are in the queue? DavidJMoss (talk) 20:09, 26 September 2021 (UTC) DavidJMoss (talk) 20:09, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@DavidJMoss: I'm not too sure as to what you're asking, but you introduced copyrighted content (not okay), which has resulted in a slew of revisions deleted. As of this diff you have not resubmitted it for review. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 20:38, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Hi DavidJMoss. In addition to what Tenryuu posted about above "copyrighted content", the fact that you began you Teahouse question with My webpage was rejected sort of indicates (at least to me) that you might be misunderstanding something quite important about Wikipedia. I suggest taking a look at Wikipedia:The answer to life, the universe, and everything and Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not for some more information about what kinds of subjects are generally considered OK to try and create Wikipedia articles about. -- Marchjuly (talk) 21:42, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]
To answer your specific question, DavidJMoss, you made some edits to the article on 31 August, but it doesn't appear that you resubmitted it for review. --ColinFine (talk) 21:49, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]
DavidJMoss, I think this gallery is probably notable and probably deserves a Wikipedia article, but the promotional tone of your draft is shooting yourself in the foot. The neutral point of view is a core content policy and is non-negotiable, even about businesses thst have closed. When you write something like It showcased Los Angeles and California modernism from the 1930s through the 1990s, steering collectors and museum curators away from the male-dominated East Coast art scene toward Southern California artists and women artists, then please be aware that neutral, uninvolved editors see that as the sort of PR language that might have been written by a Southern California advertising agent. And then when you write My webpage was rejected, that is another strike against you. Wikipedia is not a web host for individual webpages. It is an encyclopedia containing neutrally written, properly referenced educational articles, and it is not a venue for any promotional activity whatsoever. Sorry to be tough, but you need to know the facts at the beginning. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 05:51, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Concise reference sectionEdit

Is this feature of French wikipedia also exist in English? Mosesheron (talk) 21:45, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@Mosesheron: Not quite sure what you're referring to. If you mean the short form references then yes, they exist, have a look at Template:Sfn. If you're talking about the scrolling list then the equivalent template here was deleted in 2007 following Wikipedia:Templates for deletion/Log/2007 June 11#Template:Scrollref. If you want to make a scrolling list you can use something like Template:Scrolling window or Template:Scroll box, but these must not be used in articles. (talk) 22:28, 26 September 2021 (UTC)[]

How to view drafts?Edit

How to view my drafts? which button should I press? Help please? MrDude1881 (talk) 00:44, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@MrDude1881: Hello MrDude1881, welcome to the teahouse!
You can see a link of all the edits you have made by looking at your contributions: Special:Contributions/MrDude1881. There's also a much more detailed edit counter availiable on the WMF labs server, which includes useful things like a list of all the pages you've started Hope this helps, (talk) 01:39, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

are Fangans notable subjects, and how do I get information from credible sources on them?Edit

Context: a Fangan (short for fanganronpa) is a fanmade, original story modelled after the video game series Danganronpa by Spike Churnsoft. I usually see fangans in the form of playable games, video series's, and text on fanfiction sites. There is currently no wiki page for fangans, and I want to create one. However, I am not sure if there are any credible sources on them that Wikipedia will accept. please help im desperate Itsaraggedyphrog (talk) 02:10, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@Itsaraggedyphrog: Welcome to the Teahouse. You might want to browse WikiProject Video Games' reliable sources to see if any of them talk about the fangames in significant detail. Otherwise you're probably better off contributing to a wiki specifically for Danganronpa. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 03:45, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Aligning side by side tablesEdit

Hello again, the tables under the heading "Mouse varieties" in the mouse tutorial for ETH Oberon are now side by side but misaligned. Misaligned in Firefox and in Chrome. The lowermost two tables on the page align nicely. Help fixing the misalignment will be appreciated. Thanks, ... PeterEasthope (talk) 03:31, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@PeterEasthope: Hello, welcome to the teahouse! I think I've fixed the issue for you, what I've done is add vertical-align:top; to get the tables aligned at their top. I think the underlying issue here is that in two of the tables you have two sub tables, in the other you have one sub table and an empty table. The parser automatically supresses the rendering of empty table rows, wo whatever point it was using for vertical alignment was in a different place in the single sub table table. (talk) 04:38, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@ Thanks for fixing alignment and centering. Nice! ... PeterEasthope (talk) 14:00, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Lock pageEdit

 2405:204:3484:231B:BF91:EAB1:91FC:29FB (talk) 06:27, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Hello IP, could you be more specific about your question? Requests for page protection are done at WP:RFPP.  Ganbaruby! (talk) 06:37, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Hello, IP. If you mean "lock an article to the version I want it to have", then I'm afraid the answer is a resounding and emphatic "No!" Wikipedia is a collaborative encyclopaedia: almost anybody can edit almost any article within Wikipedia's rules. --ColinFine (talk) 11:28, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Why was my addition removed?Edit

Hello I edited a page "New Man(Utopian concept)" to add the category of "Osho's vision of New Man" yesterday. Today it was not there. Can someone help me understand why it was removed? As Ordinary As Anyone (talk) 07:06, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Hi As Ordinary As Anyone. The edit you made was WP:REVERTed for the reasons given here by an editor named DanCherek. At first glance, the main problems with your edit seem to be that some of the sources you cited in support aren't considered reliable sources for Wikipedia's purposes and that you used quite a lot of (perhaps too much of) quoted material from those sources. If you would like to more clarification from the editor who made the revert, you can go to Talk:New Man (utopian concept) and start a discussion about it. -- Marchjuly (talk) 07:20, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
This was also asked on my talk page so I've answered there. Thanks! DanCherek (talk) 12:39, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Hi @As Ordinary As Anyone. You can directly cite the book instead of citing non reliable sources. Eevee01(talk) 14:15, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

2022 and 2023 movies page:Edit

Can I edit 2022 and 2023 movies please? There's no movies for August 2022 for some reason and no one put movies for 2023 in a month and there's heaps to add. Dinoman21 (talk) 07:37, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

How do I create a table?Edit

I'm trying to edit in my sandbox, trying to make an article for later (about MeowChat), but I don't know how to make a table. can anyone help me please? Electric Ask me a question, get answered in a ZAP! 11:21, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@ElectricGirl123 Please see Help:Table. Paper9oll (🔔📝) 11:27, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
(edit conflict)Hi ElectricGirl123. You can find some general information on tables at MOS:TABLE and Help:Table, but often a way to learn about such things is to find a table that you like that's already been added to some existing article, copy the syntax into your sandbox (be careful to hit "Cancel" and "Publish changes" when you copy the syntax from the existing article), and then play around with the syntax to find how changing one part of it might affect the table. -- Marchjuly (talk) 11:29, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@Paper9oll and Marchjuly: Thank you both. I will try your suggestions. Electric Ask me a question, get answered in a ZAP! 11:36, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Who controls Wikipedia Bots?Edit

I edited an Wikipedia article; All was well for about a week until I attempted to make minor format changes mid-edit ClueBot NG restored the prior edition of the article "Lp space". ClueBot NG viewed by edits as vandalism. How can I restore my edits? RalphZero (talk) 11:44, 27 September 2021 (UTC) RalphZero (talk) 11:44, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

RalphZero Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. I am not an expert in how bots work, but I would guess that the math formatting that you added may have appeared as vandalism to the bot. You can click on the "Report false positive" link in the edit history of your edit to report that. 331dot (talk) 12:07, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
As it says here you can report false positives, which will help train the bot. Bots are written by different people for different purposes. The one that reverted your edits is well-documented here. I'd report the false positive first, then try again, and if that doesn't work, contact the bot's authors (who are listed on the page I linked to above). Good luck. EVhotrodder (talk) 12:12, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@RalphZero: If ClueBot NG thinks an edit should be reverted then it reverts all consecutive edits by the same user. Your second edit [1] modified the first edit in a way which looked suspicious to the bot with the way the diff is interpreted by our software. If you make the same changes in a single edit then it may work. PrimeHunter (talk) 14:12, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

I'm wanted for saying the truth about Abbie EatonEdit

Abbie Eaton Abbie Eaton came out as lesbian when she was 16, according to her "Behind the Visor" on the official website of W Series. Someone reverted my addition and called it vandalism (!!!) 2A01:36D:1200:4530:1D83:90EA:8771:2BF (talk) 12:00, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. The way in which you did it is not the proper format. I would suggest starting a discussion on the article talk page so that you can explain what you are doing to other editors. 331dot (talk) 12:04, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Your edit, however well or badly it was done (and I haven't looked) was, by Wikipedia's own definition, not vandalism--as the reverter termed it. And that User's reversion was not "blatant homophobia"--as you termed it. Uporządnicki (talk) 15:13, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Is there any mechanism for adding tooltips to images?Edit

...Specifically, multiple tooltips? I've got a group image in an article, and the photo contains many people who have their own articles, and I'd love to be able to have mouseover tooltips for people looking at the image. I could do it with a "From left to right, starting in the back row..." text caption underneath, but the people aren't standing in clear rows, and it would be a lot less clunky and awkward if there's a way to add active areas within the image. Thanks, EVhotrodder (talk) 12:05, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Hi EVhotrodder. You can add tooltips with links to the articles with mw:Extension:ImageMap. PrimeHunter (talk) 14:00, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Perfect! Thank you so much! EVhotrodder (talk) 14:04, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

How to create a wikipedia page for my client's websiteEdit

How to create a wikipedia page for my client's website Sravanthi2233 (talk) 13:00, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

You don't. —A little blue Bori v^_^v Jéské Couriano 14:08, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Sravanthi2233 A more general reply to your question is to see WP:PAID. That describes the steps required for creation and submission of drafts of articles if the editor is paid. P.S. The draft would be about your client, not your client's website. This can succeed only if your client meets Wikipedia's notability requirements. David notMD (talk) 14:54, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Then accept that if your client is sufficiently notable that the article passes muster, then s/he might be sufficiently notable that someone else might come behind you and edit the article beyond your recognition, possibly in some way not to your or your client's liking, and with no need of your or your client's approval. It will not be a "page for [your] client's website" or for your client; it will be an encyclopedia article about your client. Uporządnicki (talk) 15:06, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Yeah. Nobody 'owns' articles. David notMD (talk) 17:03, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Sravanthi2233 I'll disagree with David notMD and state that it's possible that a website might meet Wikipedia:Notability (web content) even if your client doesn't meet Wikipedia:Notability (people). What is the website? GoingBatty (talk) 19:42, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

How to report disruptive editing/vandalism?Edit

Hi, how should I go about reporting a user or IP address that is clearly engaged in vandalism and similar behaviours? Tamptonato (talk) 13:17, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@Tamptonato: You can report vandalism to WP:AIV. Assuming this is about 2600:387:C:2E12:0:0:0:117 (talk · contribs · (/64) · deleted contribs · filter log · WHOIS · RBLs · http · block user · block log), Zzuuz has set that one into read-only mode for 12 hours. Victor Schmidt (talk) 13:55, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

change from unpaid to paid editorEdit

I created an article for my employer and should be listed as a paid editor but I somehow screwed that up and I want to correct it. How do I go about it? Tomsapid (talk) 15:42, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Tomsapid Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. There are no other edits from your account other than this post; have you actually created your article yet? New users cannot directly create articles and need to use Articles for Creation to create and submit a draft. This is a good idea for anyone inexperienced in creating articles, even if they could technically create one themselves.
To answer you, there are formal ways to declare a paid relationship(see WP:PAID) but a simple statment on your user page (User:Tomsapid) will suffice. Something like "I am Tomsapid and I have been paid by (name of employer) to edit on their behalf". 331dot (talk) 15:49, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

I'm confused, I created the page Kinetic Exclusion Assay and submitted it for approval about a year ago. The page exists and I can sign in as tomsapid and edit the page (I made a couple of small changes early on) but there is no User:Tomsapid page that I can find. Do i need to create one? Thank you for your help on this. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tomsapid (talkcontribs)

Tomsapid You created the account User:Tomofidabio on July 15, 2020. That account created the page that you describe, which is now at Kinetic exclusion assay as it was accepted. 331dot (talk) 16:15, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@Tomsapid: Please, on your user page, also list other accounts you have used. You shouldn't use them anymore but you should disclose them. ~Anachronist (talk) 00:10, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

331dot and Anachronist thank you both for your help, hopefully I am in compliance with wikipedia's rules now — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tomsapid (talkcontribs) 13:49, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]


Hi. I'm partial blocked for copyrighting for 6 months. How can I get rid from this? Can anybody give me suggestions? I'm feeling very bad! Thanks. Tajwar.thesuperman Talk 16:34, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Tajwar.thesuperman You've made an unblock request; that's the correct thing to do. It will help for you to demonstrate that you know what copyright is, and when and how copyrighted content can be used on Wikipedia. 331dot (talk) 16:38, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

hello everyoneEdit (talk) 17:16, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Hi. ― Qwerfjkltalk 18:38, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

What's the right thing to do, when an article could refer to a different subject (needs a hatnote), but the other subject has no article?Edit

The example in mind is the Protector_lock, which article describes Alfred Hobbs' lock. There was, however, another lock also called "Protector" made by Theodore Kromer in Germany. Confusion is likely because both locks are amongst the best ever made, both were regarded for a time as the pinnacle of unpickability, and both are of considerable historical interest. Ideally, someone would write an article about Kromer and his work, but I lack the expertise. Nevertheless, it'd be a good idea if Hobbs' article mentioned the existence of the other. Is it okay to add a hatnote when there is no destination to point to? Or just a sentence at the start of the lead ("May also refer to...")? Elemimele (talk) 20:02, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@Elemimele: It's inappropriate to "add a hatnote when there is no destination to point to" (see WP:NOARTICLE). I'd probably, for the time being, add a one-sentence paragraph to the end of the article, saying that that the name "Protector" was also used by Kromer. Deor (talk) 22:36, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@Deor: thank you for the guidance, I've done it as suggested. Elemimele (talk) 06:00, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Elemimele, you've added the sentence before the article lede (a bit like a hatnote), which I don't think fits with Wikipedia's manual of style. Deor's suggestion was to add it at the end of the article. Cordless Larry (talk) 07:28, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@Cordless Larry:, sorry, yes, I'll shift it straight away. If I get a chance, I'll try to find some better references. If I can convince myself that there are good references out there, it might be worth starting at least a stub article for Kromer's protector locks. Elemimele (talk) 12:57, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

How to create election maps for wikipediaEdit

I'm wondering how I can make election maps like they appear on current wikipedia pages (ie 2020 New Jersey House elections). Is there a specifc service used to make these maps? Gordfather69 (talk) 20:04, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@Gordfather69: This seems more of a general graphic design question. You might want to ask on the talk pages of those who upload images, such as User talk:Putitonamap98. The person who uploaded the NJ map you linked to has been blocked as a sock. TimTempleton (talk) (cont) 21:46, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Editing pageEdit

 Shrlyn005 (talk) 20:37, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Shrlyn005 Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Do you have a question about editing? 331dot (talk) 20:39, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]


How do I reference an article? Why do I need to? Can I be blocked if I don't add references to the articles I create? Electric Ask me a question, get answered in a ZAP! 21:24, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@ElectricGirl123: References are very important to verify the information that's in the encyclopedia, and to assure that it's not original research. Without references, a draft submission will likely be declined. See Help:Referencing for beginners. TimTempleton (talk) (cont) 21:34, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@TimTempleton: Thank you, I will read the suggested page. Electric Ask me a question, get answered in a ZAP! 21:41, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Cars 3 Rev-N-Go racerEdit

Is Rev-N-Go racer named or unnamed? Taekhoon (talk) 23:27, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Taekhoon, there is no article titled Rev-N-Go, but I see that you have been busily editing List of Cars characters. If you have a question about its content, please write your question in Talk:List of Cars characters -- Hoary (talk) 00:14, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

The Four-Wheel Drive CompanyEdit

I have a copy of the book, "The Four Wheel Drive Story", by Howard William Troyer. Would it be acceptable to add some of the material in the book to the article about the Four Wheel Drive Auto CompanyKristonScott (talk) 23:39, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@KristonScott: It should be no problem as long as you don't copy text from the book. You should also remember to cite the book properly. Use the {{cite book}} template for that. ~Anachronist (talk) 23:45, 27 September 2021 (UTC)[]
It is always worth taking a look at the publisher. In this case, it is McGraw Hill, a respected general publisher at the time that book came out. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 00:00, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

False imageryEdit

in Iman Shamil image is shown that of Adolf Hitler, I don't know if this is some kind of joke but I think it is greatly disrespectful, and should be fixed as soon as possible (talk) 01:41, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

I changed it back to the original image Gordfather69 (talk) 01:44, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
And the offending editor warned. (You could have done the fix yourself by clicking on View history, and then on Undo for the edit that did the vandalism.) David notMD (talk) 01:49, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

DavidJMoss Draft:Tobey C Moss GalleryEdit

I have submitted this page for publication after correcting a number of issues brought up by the editors. Will this new version now suffice?DavidJMoss (talk) 03:52, 28 September 2021 (UTC) DavidJMoss (talk) 03:52, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@DavidJMoss: To see if your revised draft will now suffice, you may click the "Resubmit" button so an AfC reviewer will read it. Happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 04:09, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
DavidJMoss, your draft relies far too much on name dropping. It is excessive. Wikipedia is not a Hollywood cocktail party. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 07:05, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
I agree that Draft:Tobey C. Moss Gallery listing artists who had shows there does not contribute to notability (doubly so if not referenced). Notability is not contagious. Focus on content and refs that are about the contribution of the gallery to the California art community. David notMD (talk) 10:13, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Why were these edits not tagged as reverted and reverting?Edit

It appears to me that Special:Diff/1046608849 is an exact revert of Special:Diff/1046500875. I would expect such a revert to be tagged as such, and the reverted edit to be tagged as "Reverted", like this one. (In this case, I would expect the revert to be tagged as a "Manual revert" (like this one), given that there's no tag indicating any tool was used for the reversion.)

Why might it be that these edits were not tagged at all, neither the reverted edit nor the reverting edit?

(Yes, the reverted edit was mine, but I'm not here complaining about being reverted; I see that the reverter is much more experienced than I am (and I accept that it's my fault that I wasn't clearer that I meant 'traditional' in 'scare-quotes').)

2d37 (talk) 07:27, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@2d37: As far as I am aware, the edit was manually removed by editing the text out, meaning the revert and reverted tags don't apply. The manual revert tag is, as far as I am aware, added later on via a job queue, because it requires the software to compare the current text to a number of previous revisions. Once case for why this doesn't appear therefore can be that there are too many in-between revisions. which means the software will stop comparing before noticing the identical revisions. Because this is a job queue which mainly runs when the servers are under less load, the tags might not appear as quickly as one think (or not at all, sometimes). Victor Schmidt (talk) 07:44, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Also, the software applying the manual revert tag requires the two revisions to be identical. Here a number of inbetween edits changed unrelated parts of the text, resulting in the comparision failing. Victor Schmidt (talk) 07:46, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Protected pages?Edit

Why are somepages protected from editing, like Facebook or SnapChatElectric Ask me a question, get answered in a ZAP! 08:37, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Pages are protected if they have been subjected to persistent vandalism, see Wikipedia:Protection policy. - David Biddulph (talk) 08:42, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@ElectricGirl123, if you check the "Page information" link on an article page, the new page has a "View the protection log for this page." link. There you can find a list of the times an article has been protected, and the protecting admin often leaves a short note why. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 09:39, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Jeff Glassman and Draft:Lisa FayEdit

Hello, First, I love Wikipedia and this is not meant to be at all contentious. In 2006, an entry was made about me. I don't know where it came from, and I was flattered and thought it's a good thing. There were some factual errors, and didn't have some obvious footnotes. I tried to acquire enough knowledge to make the changes and eventually did, and I didn't feel right hiding who made the changes so I used my full name (Jeff Glassman) in the history. It's a stub I believe, and I didn't go into it any more and felt it wasn't for me to do. Recently, I tried to find out about how to generate a page for my collaborator Lisa Fay, so our representation in Wikipedia is balanced and fair, and reflects the amazing work Lisa has done, maybe a combined mention or page about the Lisa Fay and Jeff Glassman Duo and not about individuals only.

In the course of doing that, I started to get the impression that I shouldn't do it because I'm not detached. I dropped that project. Then this month I went back to it to see where it left off, and to find out what would be the correct way for a new page, a bio, to occur. When I did that, the draft (or whatever it was) was undeleted briefly, then deleted again, and then the old page bio on me was removed.

It's all right. I never felt entirely right having a page about me. And I especially didn't feel right having something prestigious, as Wikipedia is, about me and not about the person who is the collaborator for everything I've done, and more, artistically for 30 years now; that was not equitable. Since I don't know how it got there I was content to have it, and a little not content too. I would also be content to forget about it now that it's not there. But if it's a simple mistake, or a blip, or a confusion of my COI Lisa Fay idea with the page that's been there re: Jeff Glassman, I thought I would let you know or ask you if you know if it's correct that the old page is no longer.

There is a misunderstanding I think about the "unambiguous promotion" etc. I'm just not into that, thanks. Information yes. My very intentional life has always been along a different path, away from promotion self or otherwise, and pretty successful, also intentionally. It's a long story of small performing collectives, non-profit organization, political involvement, and risk-taking experimental work. That Wikipedia would remove that page referring to me because it looks like promotion, or self-promotion, is something I admire about Wikipedia. And trying to create something in Wikipedia has been quite an eye-opening experience into a hugely sophisticated cultural system of information democratization. I'm in awe.

Thanks, Jeff Glassman Bubby (talk) 09:04, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

I can't say that I see "unambiguous promotion" in the deleted article. But perhaps I'm missing something. Pinging Athaenara, who deleted it. -- Hoary (talk) 09:18, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Both undeleted, tossing it back to you. – Athaenara 09:54, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
  1. on topics that are "notable" (in the Wikipedia-specific sense with lots and lots of history - for actors, the guidelines are at WP:GNG and WP:NACTOR, but in 99% of the time this means multiple reviews of their work by independent journalists, critics etc.),
  2. written in a neutral point of view (NPOV).
The first criterion is about whether a topic ought to have an article, while the second is about whether the formulation of an article is correct. In other words, failing the second criterion can always be fixed by editing the article, but failing the first criterion cannot be fixed from within Wikipedia.
Looking at the undeleted pages, while I agree there are some significant NPOV issues, I do not think they rise to the level of pages that are exclusively promotional and would need to be fundamentally rewritten to serve as encyclopedia articles, so I agree with the reversion of the speedy deletion.
We need to be on firm footing about the notability first. This Sante Fe New Mexican source is IMO the best source currently in the articles (well, I cannot read past the paywall but the preview looks promising) - got any others that are similar?
If notability is ensured, we can go about cleaning the NPOV issues. The recipe for this is to write as boringly (and precisely) as possible - more like a dishwasher user guide and less like a poem. For instance, [she] directs a vibrant ensemble of young artists with whom she originates socially contributive performance work. has a lot of value-laden words, but the bottom meaning could be either she directs the choir of school X or she directs the under-18 theater troup of city Y. TigraanClick here for my talk page ("private" contact) 10:20, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
See also Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Words to watch, particularely its first section, Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Words to watch § Puffery Victor Schmidt (talk) 10:56, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

how to editEdit

 Pentagram1123 (talk) 09:44, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@Pentagram1123 Try these links: WP:TUTORIAL, WP:ADVENTURE. Perhaps you can be more specific. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 09:47, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Pentagram1123 (ec) Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. You seem to already understand technically how to make an edit, but your edits seem to be mostly unproductive. Do you have a more specific question? 331dot (talk) 09:47, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
In the welcome link on your user talk page, the words in blue are wikilinks to further guidance. When you've read those, if you have specific questions please feel free to come back here. - David Biddulph (talk) 09:49, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

New VolunteerEdit

 Johanahyoung99 (talk) 11:16, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Welcome! Do you have any questions about editing Wikipedia? --David Biddulph (talk) 12:02, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Email SendingEdit

How do I send an email using my wikipedia account. Thanks, Jwale2 (talk) 12:11, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@Jwale2, if the user you want to email has allowed it in their user-settings, you'll find a link that says "Email this user" on the left side of their userpage, under "Tools". Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 12:16, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Thanks @ Gråbergs Gråa Sång

I'd like to add a redirect or disambiguation page for Charley KlineEdit

I learned about Charley Kline today, and tried searching for him on Wikipedia. Since I only heard his name and didn't know exactly how it was spelled, I was unable to find anything about him on Wikipedia. After going to a search engine I was able to find the correct spelling, and then a search here resulted in a few articles. I figure that a redirect makes sense since this is a search term, but reading Wikipedia:Redirect#Purposes of redirects I can't identify a primary topic (I skimmed WP:PRIMARYTOPIC). Adding a disambiguation page listing the (I count four) articles that mention Kline seems a bit odd.

So, I'm not sure what I should do. My gut instinct is to create a redirect to ARPANET#Initial four hosts, because the mention of Kline in Leonard Kleinrock is in a section about ARPANET. However, since I'm quite inexperienced on Wikipedia I don't trust my gut enough to be bold in this case. Firvqipo (talk) 13:04, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Hi Firvqipo, welcome to the Teahouse. A disambiguation page is for different subjects with the same or similar name, not different articles mentioning the same subject. I would do nothing and just let searchers see the search results. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:56, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Firvqipo On the other hand, Wikipedia:Redirects are cheap. It's slightly disturbing that a search for Charley Kline in the search box suggests I'm looking for a contract killer, so I would be inclined to create a redirect for him.--Shantavira|feed me 14:22, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Draft:Vasileios Nektarios SagonasEdit


I was wondering why is my draft being declined since the sources are reliable and completely third party and written by journalists. I am a fan of V-Sag and decided to write a new article using his full name as he is also a composer and collaborator on many projects. The sources clearly show how notable he is and a google search shows all kinds of releases on every platform. I will appreciate any kind of help. Renaki1983 (talk) 13:24, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Your draft Draft:Vasileios Nektarios Sagonas has not been declined? You have not even submitted it for review. Theroadislong (talk) 13:30, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Hello Theroad, thank you for replying. You already commented that it wouldnt meet the criteria for NP. I am researching articles and citations and will submit it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Renaki1983 (talkcontribs) 13:32, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

I have read many interviews which I have the sources of the websites and are in Greek, or are interviews who he is admitting this information of his Early Life but I think it is not allowed to add the interview references? Can you please clean up information that should not be confirmed through interviews?

The interviewsο-v-sag-μιλάει-στο-antivirus/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Renaki1983 (talkcontribs)

Interviews Draft:Vasileios Nektarios SagonasEdit

 – Section merged from below by Tenryuu. I know details of his Early life from interviews such asο-v-sag-μιλάει-στο-antivirus/ but I understand we are not allowed to reference intreviews of the artist. Should I remove the early life details? And to add in detail: i do not know personally the artist, I am a fan, and I promised i would make a wikipedia page because he deserves it! thank you Thank you Renaki1983 (talk) 15:18, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Hello, Renaki1983. You are allowed to cite interviews, but only for uncontroversial factual data: see PRIMARY. The bulk of the sources should be independent.
Whether you know the artist or not, "I promised I would make a Wikipedia page because he deserves it" is a kind of conflict of interest. Saying "he deserves it" presupposes that a Wikipedia article is in some way for the benefit of its subject; but that is absolutely false. Of course the subjects of many articles do benefit from the article about them; but that is no part of Wikipedia's purpose (and the subjects of some articles certainly wish that the article did not exist, or said something different about them). Suppose you discovered something unpleasant about the artist - eg if a reliable source reported that he had a long-running feud with another artist? (I'm not suggesting this is the case: I know nothing about V-Sag; this is an example) As a fan, you would probably want to ignore that, but as a Wikipedia editor you should consider it dispassionately, and quite probably include it in the article. --ColinFine (talk) 16:22, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Page moveEdit

Someone recently made a page move on Accuracy International AXMC, but in doing so, they moved the talk page into the Wikipedia mainspace. I tried moving it back to the talk mainspace myself, but I was unable to. Could someone move it to the talk mainspace for me? Loafiewa (talk) 13:29, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Hi Loafiewa. I have made the move. It required an administrator. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:42, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

English editing softwareEdit

Good afternoon Wikipedia editors and contributors.

Question: Is there any computer software that can be used to correct English grammar on Wikipedia ? Shumbamkay (talk) 13:53, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@Shumbamkay Welcome to the Teahouse! Some people try to use software like Grammarly to 'fix' issues, without appreciating there is not always an issue that needs fixing! Across the globe we have many different ways of spelling and saying things in English, so the best way to resolve issues is to consider carefully whether an issue flagged up by a spelling or grammar checker in a browser is genuinely an issue, or not. If it's not - leave it alone. You might wish to read WP:ENGVAR to appreciate that we don't go around changing spellings or grammar to our preferred way of speaking if it already written in an acceptable form. We do however have our own tool (called WP:AWB) for making mass changes to typographical errors and such like. See also Wikipedia:WikiProject Guild of Copy Editors, which is a project that aims to improve the way encyclopaedic content is written here. I hope this helps a bit. Others may well chip in with their own thoughts on the subject. Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 14:05, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@Shumbamkay: As someone who's part of the GOCE, I wouldn't suggest using automated software to correct grammar, as there tends to be context that it tends to miss. As Nick Moyes pointed out above, if it's common typographical errors, then yes, bots like AWB can be helpful. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 16:13, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@Tenryuu: Bots using AWB do not run the AWB typo rules. Humans using AWB may use the AWB typo rules, and are expected to review the context of the recommended fixes before saving the changes. GoingBatty (talk) 17:33, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@GoingBatty: In which case, it's probably better to just do it manually with the amount of scrutiny that should be given. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 19:02, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@Shumbamkay: Welcome to the Teahouse! Wikipedia:AutoWikiBrowser/Typos contains rules to fix typographical and grammatical mistakes. These rules can be used by AutoWikiBrowser, JavaScript Wiki Browser, WPCleaner, and wikEd. Hope this helps, and happy editing! GoingBatty (talk) 14:07, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@Shumbamkay: Yes, absolutely! Good subject to bring up! Be suspicious of tools. English is a subtle language, and well-meant improvements in grammar/spelling/typography can often mess up its meaning. Here are a couple of recent examples I've spotted: (1) the article originally said X had banned pilgrimage and had done something about "those pilgrims who continued to visit the shrine". A good-faith editor converted this to "the pilgrims who...", which probably unbeknownst to them, completely changes the meaning. "Those pilgrims" means only those who chose to ignore the ban. "The pilgrims" makes no such restriction, and is only a comma away ("the pilgrims, who continued to visit the shrine") from meaning that all pilgrims decided to ignore the ban. One should always be super-suspicious of sentences that depend on the presence or absence of a comma; ambiguity and misunderstanding loom. The danger with little grammar-rewrites of this sort, is that each editor introduces a small change, creeping further and further from what the original reference said. It is a pernicious form of inaccuracy. (2) Another more drastic example was the (experienced) editor who changed an article about some fossil finds from ovid to ovoid, not realising that ovid is an obscure word for sheep-like. Ovoid made the sheep-things egg-shaped instead! That one was bot-suggested. So be careful with bots! They do not know context (how are they to guess whether a fossil is egg-shaped or a bit of a sheep?), and their ability to mimic human reading-processes is limited. People think of proof-reading/grammar as a simple form of editing, appropriate to those practising their skills. This is a misconception. Grammarly has it wrong: writing is quite easy compared to accurate proof-reading, because when you write your own text, you only have to know the rules that govern the expressions you use. When you edit someone else's, you need to know all the rules that they might know, and their readers. But don't let me put you off editing! Good luck! Elemimele (talk) 18:10, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Eats, Shoots & Leaves. Nick Moyes (talk) 19:22, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@Shumbamkay I made a simple user script for fixing common typos listed at Wikipedia:Regextypofix - see User:Qwerfjkl/scripts/RETF. ― Qwerfjkltalk 20:26, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Cap badge on The Royal Regiment of Scotland pageEdit

Good Afternoon. On our page the image is of an old cap badge. Who can i contact to get this updated with the correct one.


Gillian Duffy (talk) 14:41, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Courtesy: Royal Regiment of Scotland. David notMD (talk) 15:17, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Can you provide a website reference that there is a new cap badge? This site appears to be identical to what is at the Wikipedia article. David notMD (talk) 15:24, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

I still don't understand why this submission regarding lacking of Corporate notability.Edit

I need help... because I added all the links to the source, and this company has been in the industry for many years and has published music working with ASCAP. My friends have releases from this label and ranked #1 on the Billboard Dance music chart. PLEASE HELP! Would any information from Billboard or would be considered as not reliable? I worked in the music industry and Billboard is a reputable media publication. (talk) 15:00, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Please read the feedback regarding why the Draft submission was declined.
Just because artists of a record label have ranked high, does not make the record label itself notable. See Wikipedia:Notability (organizations and companies) for more information about what makes a company notable enough to have an article on Wikipedia. Lectrician1 (talk) 15:17, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Subcat not workingEdit

I made the category Wikipedians who like Happy Tree Friends and added it to the categories Wikipedians by interest in an animated television series and Wikipedians by interest in a comedy television series, but it won't show up in either parent category, not even when I purge the page. Minkai (talk to me)(see where I screwed up) 16:07, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

They did appear, JulieMinkai, but they were sorted under W. I have piped them, so they appear under H. --ColinFine (talk) 16:26, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Thanks, Colin! Minkai (talk to me)(see where I screwed up) 16:28, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

What should the references be named in this article?Edit

Started drafting an article - not sure what to name the references. GREENPROCYON (talk) 17:56, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@GREENPROCYON: I assume you means the red missing or empty |title= notices. If so, the |title= param of {{cite web}} should generally contain the title of the webpage referenced in the |url= param, which is often (but doesn't need to be in some cases) what your browser displays in your tab selection bar for the particular tab. I have fixed those errors at this time, you can look here to see what I have changed. You will notice that I added a few extra parameters like a website name and an access date. This information is generally uefully to prevent link rot - should the ressource at the original location become unavailable, someone in future can use this information to find the ressource elsewhere, possibly in a web archive. Victor Schmidt (talk) 18:13, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Sockpuppet reportingEdit

Do we need to inform the user prior to filing the report? Echo1Charlie (talk) 18:52, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

@Echo1Charlie: No. Depending on who the sockmaster is, it can be a bad idea to alert them – in any case, there is no requirement to inform them (before or after you have filed the report). --bonadea contributions talk 18:58, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
Thank you :) —Echo1Charlie (talk) 19:00, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Best Practices for Editors with a Conflict of InterestEdit

Hi friends! New Wikipedia user here. I've been asked by my employer to assist with improving our organization's article. I understand there's strong guidance around conflicts of interest, and am reviewing the COI guide. Can anyone offer best practices for collaborating with an article's editors? Thanks! EMI from CAM (talk) 19:37, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

EMI from CAM Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Thanks for asking. I have posted some information on your user talk page to review. You will need to make a formal declaration about being an employee. 331dot (talk) 19:40, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
  • Thanks 331dot! I disclosed my conflict of interest in my talk page, and the talk page for my employer's article (I'm employed by the Cincinnati Art Museum). Would you advise I take additional steps to formally declare my conflict of interest?--EMI from CAM (talk) 19:46, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
EMI from CAM Sorry, I missed that. That should suffice, but I might also make it on your user page(User:EMI from CAM). 331dot (talk) 19:48, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
EMI from CAM As you are employed in the GLAM sector there is a specific project for you, please see WP:GLAM. Unlike other paid editors, GLAM editors are actually very desirable contributors here. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 20:32, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@EMI from CAM: Since you have a COI, you should not be editing the article directly. Instead, you may post requests on the article talk page using the {{request edit}} template or use the Wikipedia:Edit Request Wizard. Thanks! GoingBatty (talk) 22:05, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
@EMI from CAM I have left what I hope is a really supportive and encouraging reply on your talk page. I just wanted to add that it would be great if you used your WP:USERPAGE to say a little about yourself. It need not reveal anything that identifies you in the real world, but whenever I see a WP:REDLINKed username, it's natural to wonder how committed the person is to Wikipedia. Just a few words about your editing motivation would address that concern. Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 22:37, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Guidance on Challenging SourcesEdit

Hi! I was reading an article in the Guardian today and found a passage that was quoted in the article that the journalist stated was an exaggeration and contained inaccuracies.


Text: “I laughed off my parents’ argument that if the government ever laid down its arms all hell would break loose. Our competing predictions were put to the test at 8am on 7 October 1969, when the Montreal police went on strike. By 11.20am, the first bank was robbed. By noon, most of the downtown stores were closed because of looting. Within a few more hours, taxi drivers burned down the garage of a limousine service that competed with them for airport customers, a rooftop sniper killed a provincial police officer, rioters broke into several hotels and restaurants, and a doctor slew a burglar in his suburban home.”

Pinker concludes: “This decisive empirical test left my politics in tatters (and offered a foretaste of life as a scientist).” But somewhat contrary to this tale of dark human instincts run riot, the Canadian historian Bryan Palmer told me that much of this violence was motivated by the political grievances of the Quebecer minority, and was targeted at Anglo businesses like the limousine service, which was given preferential treatment by the city government. The “sniper” was a security guard from the limousine service who fired a shotgun into a crowd."

This passage that the journalist is challenging is quoted on the Wikipedia page for the Murray-Hill Riots and is presented as fact. I don't like leaving inaccuracies hanging around, but I'm not sure if it's right to just edit the article once I've completed enough research to verify the journalist's assertion that Pinker is exaggerating/misremembering details.

Would appreciate some guidance on this.

Thanks! JBo1123 (talk) 19:52, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Personally, I think the whole statement should be removed as the details are covered in that section already. It's one first-hand account attempting to sum up the whole thing, and at the very least its placement in the text should not come before the chronology covered by the journalistic sources. Just my two cents. Pyrrho the Skeptic (talk) 20:37, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
  Courtesy link: Murray-Hill riot TimTempleton (talk) (cont) 22:10, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Notability, Sources, EditingEdit

I a have a couple of questions about Wikipedia's impact on notability. Since Wikipedia is ubiquitous it automatically gives notability. How can one restrict an article for lack of notability if it is not put out there to the world in order to be noted? From what I could gather on the guidelines for Wikipedia's notability are just good editorial guidelines everyone must follow. But notability is more than just editorial rules. How can I tell an article is notable if no-one else has covered it on Wikipedia? If the world would not be introduced to the first Apple computer how could Apple get to be notable. Notability is given by the consumer, integrity is given by the guidelines. Can editorial guidelines suck the life out of notability? Effectivenow (talk) 20:01, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Effectivenow Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. You have things backwards. Became the purpose of Wikipedia is to summarize what independent reliable sources say, it does not confer notability on a subject. Wikipedia is not the place to introduce a subject to the world. A subject must be written about by others unaffiliated with it in order for it to merit a Wikipedia article. If no independent sources write about a topic, it cannot be on Wikipedia. If you just want to tell the world about something, there are websites where you can do that, as well as social media. 331dot (talk) 20:06, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
(edit conflict)Wikipedia is an encyclopedia about already notable subjects. It is not within the scope of this project to make anything notable. What makes something notable enough for an article is that others have noticed it and published about the subject in reliable sources. So to answer your question, our guidelines do not give notability, only establish what we consider to be notable enough for an article based on what others have said and published. McMatter (talk)/(contrib) 20:09, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
We arrive on the scene after the action is over. Apple make a computer. Someone else finds it exciting and writes about it. Then, after everyone else has got excited, finally Wikipedia notices the excitement, arrives at the scene, and summarises what everyone else has already written. May sound a bit dull, but that's what we are. Elemimele (talk) 20:44, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]
What a brilliant summary of what we are about. Thank you, Elemimele. Nick Moyes (talk) 22:40, 28 September 2021 (UTC)[]

Using rude/slang words and terms in edit summaries - @Ghmyrtle:Edit

I have made some edits to some of the Cheshire East and Cheshire West and Chester articles by cutting down some of the leads from saying "Neston is a town in the unitary authority of Cheshire West and Chester and ceremonial county of Cheshire, England on the Wirral Peninsula" to "Neston is a town in the unitary authority of Cheshire West and Chester in Cheshire, England on the Wirral peninsula". But User:Ghmyrtle had appeared constructive in saying better before but then calls my edit on Chester ludicrous which means "so foolish, unreasonable, or out of place as to be amusing." and they using that in edit summaries means they have called my edit two things either unreasonable or foolish which would also call me foolish. I am insulted by that and if I am going to be given saracastic replies for my edits. Then that would fall under WP:Intimidate and that is uncalled for but then also when I have added to Wirrals articles I have been reverted by the same user for unconstructive edits but they appear to WP:Own the articles and if you revert them they also revert you like WP:Editwarring. So will someone on teahouse please clarify if potshots and passive-aggressive terms are even allowed on here? I have pinged the user involved in heading and mentioned it will be on teahouse the issue. I will not be bullied or intimidated by veteran editors because they think using terms like the one on Chester is acceptable and polite when it is not and their longevity on here for being allowed to say that to me and my contributions. DragonofBatley (talk) 00:37, 29 September 2021 (UTC) DragonofBatley (talk) 00:37, 29 September 2021 (UTC)[]