Wikipedia:In the news/Candidates/March 2009

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Archived discussion for March 2009 from Wikipedia:In the news section on the Main Page/Candidates.

March 31

ITN candidates for March 31

Libya boats sinking
  • Boats carrying hundreds of migrants inside wrecked off Libya. Only few of them survived: (talk) 06:01, 31 March 2009 (UTC)
  • Between 300 and 500 African migrants are feared dead after their boats sink off the coast of Libya? I know we have had a lot of "bad news" recently but this is surely a huge event? If someone can suggest an article title I will create one. (BBC report)- Dumelow (talk) 11:43, 31 March 2009 (UTC)
Definitely big news. How abt 2009 Mediterranean Sea shipwrecks? —SV 12:51, 31 March 2009 (UTC)
First we need an article. Then, I don't really like speculations on ITN but here it is probably impossible to get exact numbers. I'd wait for now. --Tone 14:43, 31 March 2009 (UTC)
We now have an article at 2009 Mediterranean Sea shipwreck, around 230 are presumed dead with a further 250 missing. Perhaps: "230 people are presumed dead after a boat carrying migrants from Libya to Italy sinks", once we get the Fools' Day silliness out of the way - Dumelow (talk) 11:04, 1 April 2009 (UTC)
Although since it actually sank on 27 March but Libya did not release any information until yesterday, how about: "The Libyan government announces that a migrant boat has capsized in the Mediterranean Sea causing the presumed deaths of around 230 people? - Dumelow (talk) 14:36, 1 April 2009 (UTC)
I though they were feared dead. Did Libya declare all of the people presumed dead? People do survive for days in such shipwrecks..—SV 17:17, 1 April 2009 (UTC)
The police said "The rest are believed dead" (AP report) and the search and rescue attempts have been called off - 19:03, 1 April 2009 (UTC)
Posted. --BorgQueen (talk) 07:36, 2 April 2009 (UTC)

Special Congressional election in New York My first ITN suggestion, so let me know if I did anything wrong. Anyway, a special congressional election takes place today to replace Kirsten Gillibrand, who was appointed by NY Gov David Paterson to replace Hillary Clinton upon her appointment to the office of US Secretary of State. This election has garnered national attention due to high profile endorsements (Obama, for one). Here is my proposed wordering:

Let me know what happens next. Thanks. ~ ωαdεstεr16«talkstalk» 04:57, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

Don't think this is really ITN worthy, regional and local elections go on all the time and there's nothing that makes this stand out --Daviessimo (talk) 14:38, 31 March 2009 (UTC)
You did everything fine but I think this is not ITN type of news. Usually we just have elections for top positions in the country, this is for Senate. --Tone 14:43, 31 March 2009 (UTC)
I expected this response. I just want to make sure that you both read the article (see wikinews for the short version). This is getting much national attention even though it's just a House race in upstate New York. It is being described as Obama's "first test". So it is noteworthy. ~ ωαdεstεr16«talkstalk» 15:07, 31 March 2009 (UTC)
I am leaning toward oppose, per Daviessimo and Tone. And yes, I read the article. --BorgQueen (talk) 15:20, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

←Fair enough; worth a shot. ~ ωαdεstεr16«talkstalk» 02:03, 1 April 2009 (UTC)

If this would change the composition in the Senate this would had a shot, but whatever happens the Democrats are still the majority party in either House. If the composition was 50-all (Democrat Joe Biden breaks the tie) this special election would change the majority party in the Senate and might had a shot. –Howard the Duck 14:31, 1 April 2009 (UTC)

National Ignition Facility

What about this [1]? We had the hadron collider and from the looks of it this is another major scientific experiment --Daviessimo (talk) 14:37, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

Looks good. Of course, we need an article first. --Tone 14:43, 31 March 2009 (UTC);;
My reading of it is that the National Ignition Facility is the experiment (just like the hadron collider), although I not definately sure so wouldn't want to say for definite. If that is correct I think all that is needed is a section in this stating that it is now complete and has been fired up --Daviessimo (talk) 14:48, 31 March 2009 (UTC)
Seems that's it. Great article BTW, it's always a pleasure to feature a long and informative article on ITN. And yes, we need an update and a proposed wording. --Tone 14:52, 31 March 2009 (UTC)
I've updated the article with a small section at completion. As for wording something like The National Ignition Facility begins firing its lasers as part of an experiment to recreate conditions at the centre of the sun
Posted, with a different blurb. --BorgQueen (talk) 16:20, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

Great Ex-President (a argentinian hero) death is a news a event of 31 March, not just a little recent death
That is what i wrote of that day and somebody just take that out; Lady Di death, Reagan death, and Alfonsin death Are News (I think), president of all South America are talking about that right now, Capital city of the nation have many people screaming her name, is a popular manifestation of love. Sorry i not logged in this languaje of wikipedia and sorry for my english. Please somebody add that again-- (talk) 17:51, 1 April 2009 (UTC)
The "first president to be democratically elected after the "Dirty War" military dictatorship", "won international admiration for putting on trial and jailing former military officials who had tortured and killed thousands of suspected leftists" and the talk of South America and three days of national mourning, you say? Support from me. His death seems to be geographically disadvantaged in the eyes of most of Wikipedia in the same way that almost saw the deletion of Susan Tsvangirai. --candlewicke 19:06, 1 April 2009 (UTC)

March 30

ITN candidates for March 30

Lahore police academy attack

It's as ongoing and a major attack.yousaf465'

Support BigHairRef | Talk 09:44, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
support What are we waiting for?--Cerejota (talk) 10:04, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
Suggested text: Unidentified gunmen attack a police academy in Lahore, Pakistan. Thue | talk 10:30, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
Support but the academy has now been retaken. Suggest "Pakistani security forces retake a police academy in Lahore which had been seized by gunmen". The article has not yet been updated though. I will take a look at it and update it, will try to reorganise the prose as well - Dumelow (talk) 12:11, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
OK I think I have done enough to the article to make it OK to put on the main page - Dumelow (talk) 14:00, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
We have another article: Lahore police training academy siege. It is best if we merge before putting it on Main Page. --BorgQueen (talk) 14:25, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
I have merged that article in - Dumelow (talk) 17:04, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
Good work, I support this now. Rambo's Revenge (How am I doing?) 17:16, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
Posted. --BorgQueen (talk) 17:44, 30 March 2009 (UTC)

2009 Northern CA earthquake swarm

just this minute MSNBC is reporting a 4.3 earthquake near San Jose. In the past few days there has been a 4.8 and several 3.0s and a grand total of over 250 earthquake events since 3/25. There not an actual page yet on this buts its mentioned near the very bottom of List of 2004-2009 earthquakes. I don't really know anything about seismic events so I won't be doing the editing, but I think its pretty newsworthy and it might make ITH anyways, especially if these turn out to be just preshocks like in the case of the China quakes. (talk) 18:53, 30 March 2009 (UTC)

Wait until The Big One hits. Then tentative support.-gadfium 19:45, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
Currently oppose. According to the wikinews article there doesn't seem to be any newsworthy material here yet. Rambo's Revenge (How am I doing?) 21:09, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
Only _tentative_ support when the big one hits?!? :) Thue | talk 21:18, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
The Wikimedia Foundation may no longer exist. The servers, being in Florida, will probably be okay unless the Canary Islands megatsunami occurs simultaneously. Good luck getting a decent article written on the event then.-gadfium 05:21, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

March 29

ITN candidates for March 29

Automobile crisis

Rick Wagoner resigns, Christian Streiff is removed, two major automotive groups lose their CEO the same day. Hektor (talk) 21:54, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

I don't really find anything particularly unusual about that. There is no guarantee that this hasn't happened before. --candlewicke 23:42, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
I'd like to come back just for this one and support this. They head the largest auto company of their respective countries, countries so large that the status also makes them among the largest in the world. Therequiembellishere (talk) 01:52, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
Oh right. Actually I might support now that it's put like that. I still prefer the stampede, the shooting, the boat race and the referendum though. --candlewicke 03:28, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
I'm not quite sure how to word it though. Therequiembellishere (talk) 14:42, 30 March 2009 (UTC)

I think that this should be added "Milo Đukanović secures the sixth term as the Prime Minister of Montenegro as his Coalition for a European Montenegro wins the absolute majority in early election." --Avala (talk) 21:29, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

This is an ITN story, sure. The article needs some updates and then it's ready to post. --Tone 21:33, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
Just updated the whole article.--Avala (talk) 10:47, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
What about Coalition for a European Montenegro wins the absolute majority at the parliamentary election, securing Milo Đukanović the sixth term as the Prime Minister of Montenegro. I think this is slightly better. If you agree, I am going to post it. --Tone 17:49, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
Yep it sounds perfect. Go ahead and post it.--Avala (talk) 20:18, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
Done. --Tone 20:49, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
Houphouët-Boigny Arena Stampede

Once I or someone else can find the time (unfortunately I can't tonight) to create an article for this, I think this would be worthy being on. BigHairRef | Talk 21:15, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

Support, it's 22 now with 130 injured. We need more African ITNs and we don't seem to have too many stampedes amidst all the crashes and bombs. So an original way to die is pretty good for a change. And, as ever, the BBC provides a magnificent array of sources for the article's creator to use. --candlewicke 23:47, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
Created article, now working on it. BigHairRef | Talk 08:47, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
Finished main bones, Suggested Blurb "Twenty-two people die and at least 130 are injured in a stampede during a 2010 FIFA World Cup qualifying match in Abidjan, Côte d'Ivoire (Stadium pictured).
Also fouund appropriate picture as well  BigHairRef | Talk 10:15, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
Posted. --BorgQueen (talk) 12:15, 30 March 2009 (UTC)

Carthage, North Carolina shooting

6 killed, more injured [2] TouLouse (talk) 19:29, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

Support, this is the polar opposite to Dendermonde... which would make it Carthage nursing home attack... --candlewicke 21:01, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
Sources located in the BBC article. The Irish Times Reuters Baltimore Sun Telegraph Sydney Morning Herald So that's Ireland, United Kingdom and Australia which have already featured the story... --candlewicke 21:06, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
An article has been started by an editor here. Please contribute. --candlewicke 23:50, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

2009 Red River flood

Anyone? –Howard the Duck 09:52, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

What would be the wording? The article looks good. --Tone 10:49, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
How about "Flooding in the Red River causes evacuations in northern United States and southern Canada"? Could've been more concrete but I haven't contributed much at all to the article. –Howard the Duck 11:24, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
Posted. --BorgQueen (talk) 11:32, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
Pursuant to the error report, here's my stab at a re-wording:
Flooding in the Red River causes evacuations in North Dakota and Minnesota in the United States and in Manitoba, Canada. --Random89 21:14, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

Brawn F1 1st & 2nd, in Qualifying & Race
  • It's the first time this has happened since 1954, quite notable indeed. Nick carson (talk) 08:24, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
    • I'd support adding this. D.M.N. (talk) 08:49, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
      • I think this was the first ever so I'd support. –Howard the Duck 09:23, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

Formula One
  • Suggestion: "The 2009 Formula One season begins, with Jenson Button leading a Brawn GP one-two on their debut, the first time this has occured in Formula One history." - not sure about the last bit, but I think it needs to be made clear that its the first race of the '09 season and not just any old race. D.M.N. (talk) 09:29, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
    • Well logically, this was also true at least for the first Formula one grand prix in history. Hektor (talk) 09:37, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
    • According to the 1950 British Grand Prix, the very first Formula One race, the Alfa Romeo team was 1-2-3-4 in qualifying and 1-2-3 in the race so I guess it should be "first since 1950" or something... –Howard the Duck 11:43, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
      • Is this such an important record? I doubt, I find it more statistically interesting. --Tone 10:49, 29 March 2009 (UTC)


Mahoran status referendum, 2009

  • Mayotte is taking a referendum to change its status. We should keep an eye on it. --Tone 10:49, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
  • I've added a heading to this as my first thought was that a User:Mayotte was pushing for some sort of Wiki-constitutional change on Formula One... --candlewicke 11:00, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
  • Mayotte approved its change of status to become an overseas department of France : International clash with Comoros, African countries, and UN, etc...Hektor (talk) 17:37, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
  • The relevant article is here, but not sufficiently updated yet. The Tom (talk) 19:15, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
  • I had the chance to expand the article tonight. Hopefully this will be enough to get the article posted on the main page, though the intro could use some fine tuning if anyone has the chance. (I didn't have enough time for that). It would be a good move since Mayotte is rarely covered by the media outside of France. Scanlan (talk) 02:27, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
Posting. SpencerT♦Nominate! 04:37, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
The Boat Race

This was brought up on Talk:Main Page. Should it possibly even be a recurring item as it's quite old and there doesn't appear to be any event like it? A mention in the 62-and-a-half-year-old Bangkok Post too. --candlewicke 15:44, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

March 28

ITN candidates for March 28

Dubai World Cup
  • Is the Dubai World Cup a big event? ITN doesn't feature very many Asian sports. And it's not "bad news". --candlewicke 19:56, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
  • Probably due to nobody pointing it out at the time? --candlewicke 10:56, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
I did support 2007 AFC Asian Cup w/c was not all about football since Iraqis celebrated by killing each other but sadly it didn't make it. –Howard the Duck 11:21, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
ITN must've been featuring a lot of Asian sports then if that failed... that decision doesn't make any sense to me... --candlewicke 13:19, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
I don't remember any Asian-exclusive sport that made it to the ITN. Save maybe for the up-to-goal updates during the first days of the 2006 World Cup that quickly became an edit/wheel/admin protect war and I dunno how it was resolved (admins did post the semifinals and the final, though, as it should had been). Oh yes, the 2006 FIBA World Championship held in Japan was also added. If the Aussie Open counts as "Asian" it can be considered. –Howard the Duck 14:38, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
I find it very strange that "the world's largest and most populous continent" cannot provide a decent sports-related ITN on, at the very least, an annual basis... --candlewicke 15:27, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
Looking at ITN/R, on the soccer section, all of the intercontinental championships are there save for the Oceanian (understandable) and Asian (!!!) tournament. The quadrennial Asian Games is listed, along with the India-Pakistan Test Series, and oh, the Indian Premier League should be a shoo-in now. That's all there is to it, unless an Asian team wins the FIFA and Rugby World Cup (hasn't happened), the Cricket World Cup and the World Baseball Classic (happened already) or if an Asian wins any of the competitions in the sports or prizes sections. –Howard the Duck 16:21, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
Well, as long as it remains so, anyone from Asia complaining about Euro/US sports bias has a pretty valid point. Is there a genuine reason for the absence of the Asian intercontinental soccer championship, which is, what, held every four years? I counted about five annual US events on that list... one country versus "the world's largest and most populous continent"... you would think there would only be one winner... --candlewicke 17:08, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
Better tell that to FIFA so the AFC can have a lot more World Cup berths... –Howard the Duck 17:30, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
That might go some way to explaining it... --candlewicke 18:58, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

Earth Hour
  • Looking for a "good news" story: Apparently a lot of people in 88 countries are turning their lights off at 8.30 pm tonight to raise awareness of climate change. The article is pretty good, but it is mentioned at OTD so perhaps it is not eligible? - Dumelow (talk) 20:18, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
Let's wait for a final report. By the way, this is already mentioned in OTD section so I'd prefer having it tomorrow. --Tone 20:33, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
Here. Apparently Ireland was the only European country which supported this in 2008? I thought it was bigger than that... --candlewicke 23:20, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
This report from the BBC's main page... with lots of links to other news sites so there's plenty of coverage. --candlewicke 23:26, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
We had this last year, and last year there was a April Fools joke when a fully-lighted building was the thumbnail (for a different blurb). We could do so this year too. –Howard the Duck 09:25, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
Australia blocks Chinese takeover attempt
"Citing national security, Australia blocked on Friday one of several acquisitions China is seeking in the country’s natural resources sector, a move that may stoke concerns about rising protectionist tendencies around the globe." I'd wait until these blocks over "rising protectionist tendencies" are given wider and more concrete coverage. --candlewicke 00:58, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
The fears of protectionism are already widespread especially in the world trade relationship with China after the recent move by the Chinese to block the Coke buyout of a domestic firm. I see this story as very fitting of the climate so I say the time is right for a post. Shiplevelone (talk) 01:23, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
But these are just "fears"... --candlewicke 02:16, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
And fears are "bad news"... --candlewicke 02:20, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
How about: The Chinese government unblocks access to Youtube. ?

Good news. Shiplevelone (talk) 03:46, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

But is that a big deal? Or are we clutching at straws? It could be saved for AFD... --candlewicke 04:04, 29 March 2009 (UTC)


Note: An article has been created for that significant Canadian discovery... --candlewicke 07:43, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

Strongly support. Any nice wording? --BorgQueen (talk) 08:22, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
Support. Nick carson (talk) 08:39, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
Posted. --BorgQueen (talk) 09:14, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
"Researchers from the University of Toronto" maybe? I'm sure there are lots more researchers there who will feel very forgotten about...--candlewicke 09:19, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

March 27

ITN candidates for March 27

Blast Kills 50 at Pakistani Mosque

I think this is pretty much a shoe-in: [[3]] (talk) 16:09, 27 March 2009 (UTC)

I might do it if someone supports. --candlewicke 16:40, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
There appears to already be an article at 2009 FATA mosque attack if that helps - Dumelow (talk) 16:50, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
Should have said that I support this going on the main page as well - Dumelow (talk) 16:53, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
Lihaas has sorted it. There doesn't appear to be any obstacle to this being posted. :) Unless someone is going to be mean and get picky about the unformatted reference section... :P --candlewicke 17:07, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
I have just sorted out the refs, should be good now - Dumelow (talk) 17:31, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
Make the wording "more than" 50 killed or something similar as the number seems to be going up. Ashishg55 (talk) 17:48, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
nvm some sources say less... Ashishg55 (talk) 18:00, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
I've just realised there is no wording... --candlewicke 18:13, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
  • A suicide attack kills approximately fifty people at a mosque in Pakistan's Khyber Agency. --candlewicke 18:16, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
    • Posting. Actually, I am thinking of setting a limit for bad news, such as suicide attacks, plane crashes or other catastrophes for ITN because recently we've mostly have those. Do you agree that when there are 2 "bad news" items on ITN already, the next one should replace the older of the two? --Tone 18:44, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
      • I think it depends on the story and where it comes from. We could certainly limit the plane crashes and suicide bombs but I don't think floods, disease, etc, are all that common. The epidemics that make ITN don't tend to get highlighted all that much elsewhere so at least ITN is being slightly original in giving such stories a prominent position. And if "bad news" is still happening, why not go with it? If it's notable that's the point surely? --candlewicke 18:51, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
        • If you were to look at it in more detail of course, a lack of death does not make good news either. I wouldn't consider the resignation of a Prime Minister, the relocation of an event due to security concerns, the eruption of a volcano or yet another resignation due to corruption as much more light in intensity... --candlewicke 18:59, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
          • I know, that's why I used "". What's the word for section of the newspaper that reports such things? The other things you mention can be found in politics, sports or economy section. I have it on the tip of the tongue... Well, if you look it from this point, all ITN items are bad at the moment so I hope the article for Abel prize will be ready soon. --Tone 19:08, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
            • Most ITNs tend to be negative unless they are sporting triumphs, award wins or successful space missions/scientific or historical discoveries... --candlewicke 19:42, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
Not really, one of the most standard ITN news is electing the new president/government (that could be negative, considering one's political preferences ;-)). I just wanted to suggest that, when adding a new item on ITN, we should not always remove the oldest item in the box but maybe another one from the bottom half, if appropriate. And I still can't remember that word for the newspaper, how annoying...--Tone 19:51, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
unfortunately bad news is usually more important than the good. We can always loosen up the rules for good news just a bit. most of them dont make it because people start arguing that its not "international". And there just isnt enough good international news to go around. Ashishg55 (talk) 20:15, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
Indonesian flash flood

Surely an obvious candidate for ITN? --candlewicke 13:25, 27 March 2009 (UTC)

I was just about to submit this one! I created an article and hopefully this tagline is OK:"Situ Gintung Dam in Tangerang District, Indonesia fails flooding hundreds of homes and killing at least 58 people" - Dumelow (talk) 13:26, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
Looks fine for ITN - adequate prose, numerous references, etc. Well done! --candlewicke 14:26, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
Posted. --BorgQueen (talk) 15:02, 27 March 2009 (UTC)

March 26

ITN candidates for March 26

We are already considering the meteorite story for April 1 since it can be written really nicely. --Tone 08:09, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

A first twice so to speak. --candlewicke 22:18, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

Russia X2

Russian-born French mathematician Mikhail Gromov is awarded the 2009 Abel prize.

I'll support this one. Abel prize is the equivalent of Nobel prize for mathematicians. Is it ok to post Russian-born French mathematician Mikhail Gromov is awarded the 2009 Abel prize for his contribution in geometry.? --Tone 19:02, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
How about Franco-Russian as stated in his own article? Or is that politically incorrect or controversial in any way? I like the story but doesn't ITN usually require a bit more prose to be added? I have no problems with it really, I just thought someone else might point it out. Incidentally that'll be two in a row for Russia as I presume this is a typical ITN-worthy crash if anyone ever gets round to it. --candlewicke 19:10, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
I'll start opposing accidents on ITN because recently ITN's been overwhelmed with them. We can draw a line and it should be higher than for this crash. Of course, still to be decided on case-to-case basis. Regarding Gromov, I agree that there needs to be a bit more prose in the article. I don't think Franco-Russian is problematic. --Tone 19:15, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
Of course in this case it isn't a plane. The only comparison I can think of is the one in Slovakia last month. So it isn't really a typical crash. --candlewicke 19:20, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

March 25

ITN candidates for March 25

Indian Premier League

The Board of Control for Cricket in India decides to relocate the 2009 Indian Premier League from India to South Africa citing security concerns.

Update on the ongoing discussion below over this blurb. Major points again:

  1. IPL is a domestic cricket tournament.
  2. Yet this decision by the BCCI is significant because the IPL is the only domestic cricket league in the world in which high-profile cricketers from every part of the world play.
  3. Therefore drawing comparisons between IPL and other domestic cricket leagues beats common-sense.
  4. How many times do we see a domestic league, that too the most popular league of that sport by far, being relocated to a foreign nation on the ground of security concerns?

Not posting this item depicts nothing else but lack of global-viewpoint, bias and ignorance. -- (talk) 05:28, 25 March 2009 (UTC)

Ok the way i see it. If NBA, NFL or NHL had their entire season hosted in South Africa then the news most likely will be posted. IPL is up there with the big ones. So now that we have confirmed the place, it should go up. Ashishg55 (talk) 16:23, 25 March 2009 (UTC)
Ok, I am fine with it. Posting. --Tone 16:45, 25 March 2009 (UTC)
I think the points summarised above should indicate that posting this was a sensible decision. There was far too much concentration on the idea of domesticity from the opposition when in this instance there was clearly a lot more involved. --candlewicke 19:01, 25 March 2009 (UTC)
Heck, the #4 reason would had been enough for me. –Howard the Duck 08:17, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

March 24

ITN candidates for March 24

Czech political crisis?

In comparison with Hungarian situation, here there was a vote of confidence. I support when the article is updated. Still, the blurb should mention that he'll stay in office until the end of the EU presidency (according to the ref). --Tone 21:56, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
I am strongly in favour of posting this on ITN, there is an update in Topolanek's article but it's still a bit short. Can anyone add a couple of sentences? --Tone 19:16, 25 March 2009 (UTC)
How about this now: Mirek_Topolánek#Fall_of_Government. I've added some more stuff. SpencerT♦Nominate! 01:33, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
Ok, ready to go. We just need a good wording, it should mention no confidence vota and not resignation. --Tone 08:19, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
And not both? How can resignation be left out? --candlewicke 19:13, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
Ok, now it's official. Somehow I wanted to have a wording that says that they plan to finish the EU presidency before changing the government - this is important in this case. --Tone 19:20, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
You want a wording that features "no confidence vote", "resignation" and "they plan to finish the EU presidency before changing the government"? Is that possible? That doesn't even take into account that the sentence has to feature his name... --candlewicke 20:00, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

Mirek Topolánek (pictured) resigns as Prime Minister of the Czech Republic following his government's loss of a parliamentary confidence vote. I really don't think it's possible to get the rest in... there's no guarantee for when they will change the government... WP:CRYSTALBALL, speculation, etc... --candlewicke 21:47, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

This is probably the best solution. Posting. Someone upload the photo, please. --Tone 21:49, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
Well there goes Ireland and the Six Nations Grand Slam... :( --candlewicke 22:08, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

Dalai Lama banned from attending South African conference

So much is going on in Tibet in recent days yet there isn't a posting. This event appears fitting. Shiplevelone (talk) 02:36, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

Turks and Caicos

How about the Turks and Caicos story? Whilst the premier's resignation isn't inherently notable (as it is not a country) the British Foreign Office is to put a bill before the Commons to suspend the constitution and transfer power to the governor, Gordon Wetherell. This has only happened once before in the islands' history and will effectively remove British citizens from the rule of the democratically elected assembly and place them under direct rule due to allegations of systemic corruption within the administration. Maybe it will only affect 30,000 people but it is quite an interesting story, perhaps it doesn't have international appeal though (but that is what discussion is for!). The article at Michael Misick is of reasonable quality and the controversies section is well sourced and Turks and Caicos Islands#Politics contains the details of the situation - Dumelow (talk) 11:10, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

Strongly support. I've been reading up on this and it appears to be a complex, far reaching scandal. The British government may take direct control over the day to day affairs on the dependency again. Scanlan (talk) 12:39, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
OK how about something along the lines of: "Self government is suspended in the British Overseas Territory of Turks and Caicos after Premier Michael Misick resigns in the midst of a corruption investigation?" - Dumelow (talk) 16:35, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
Posting. --Tone 16:54, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
Oops, those two events should be the other way around. I have posted at main page errors - Dumelow (talk) 18:31, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

Kenya Bush Fires

Might be an idea to keep an eye in this [4]. I don't think anyone has been killed but it could have a profound effect on wildlife. Thoughts? --Daviessimo (talk) 15:47, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

France's compensation for victims of nuclear testing

French Defence Minister Herve Morin announces that France will compensate victims of past nuclear tests in Algeria and the South Pacific. [5] [6] --BorgQueen (talk) 16:54, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

Provisionally looks good: The logical place to update would be here for the first experiment and here for the second. Rambo's Revenge (How am I doing?) 17:34, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

Duffy's Cut

Very interesting discovery that people have been looking for since the 1800s and certainly within the last decade, and not usually something found everyday in that part of the world. Immaculata University researchers discover the mass graves of 57 Irish immigrants at Duffy's Cut, or something to that effect. Scanlan (talk) 12:39, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

With Duffy's Cut being the bolded article I ask after much searching? If it is it needs to look a bit tidier than it currently does. Some more citations perhaps as well. --candlewicke 19:17, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

March 23

ITN candidates for March 23

Plane crash at Tokyo airport

A FedEx cargo plane crashed in Tokyo's Narita airport landing on a flight from Guangzhou. Two confirmed killed. [7] TheFreeloader (talk) 01:36, 23 March 2009 (UTC)

17 people were killed in the other crash... but I suppose we combined Alabama and Winnenden... then there's the four police officers killed in California... --candlewicke 01:46, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
FedEx crash article: FedEx Express Flight 80 (talk) 05:13, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
Posted both. --BorgQueen (talk) 06:24, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
I don't think the fact that it's the first accident at the airport is worthy of an inclusion in the headline. It takes up four lines on my screen resolution. Jolly Ω Janner 16:32, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
It's not the first accident; it's the first fatal accident. And it takes up five lines on my screen, which balances Main Page rather nicely. --BorgQueen (talk) 16:43, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
On second thought, I followed your suggestion. I don't think it is worth arguing over... --BorgQueen (talk) 17:09, 23 March 2009 (UTC)

Tata Nano

What about this. There's a good quality article on it --Daviessimo (talk) 17:57, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

Support. --BorgQueen (talk) 19:21, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
We've already had this before, I'm not convinced it should go on again. Also the article may be 'good quality' but I'm not seeing any evidence it's ITN worthy. Were's the section with a significant update relating to it going on sale? Nil Einne (talk) 19:59, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
Oppose, Nil Einne's memory serves him well, we've had this before and I seem to recall enough flak then about advertising and marketing a commercial product. --Stephen 23:28, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
Support. Looks like a very important product introduction. it is "in the news" in many news media. Thue | talk 22:49, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
Oppose, we had it on ITN when it was introduced. This covers the fact that it is important achievement. Mentioning twice would be an advert and WP is advert-free ;-) --Tone 22:55, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
Oppose, for all the reasons covered. Once is more than enough. --candlewicke 19:23, 26 March 2009 (UTC)


I think its going to be worth keeping an eye on this [8], if as the article suggest he will resign on Monday --Daviessimo (talk) 13:01, 21 March 2009 (UTC)

So is anyone willing to put up results of the first round of presidential election in Slovakia and Macedonia? --Tone 22:55, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
I'm going to have to say no to first round results...the articles aren't fantastic, and I'd prefer to wait until the final round. However, if the articles were well-updated and such, it would be a weak support from me. SpencerT♦Nominate! 00:06, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
World Baseball Classic

The final will be played on the 23rd. It's Korea vs. either Japan or the U.S. We put up this event on 2006 and this is listed at WP:ITNR#Baseball. –Howard the Duck 03:56, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

What happened in 2007 and 2008? --candlewicke 04:39, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
It's a once-every-4-years tourney starting this year. They don't want to compete in the same year as the FIFA World Cup. –Howard the Duck 04:43, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
I wonder why. --candlewicke 05:00, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
They don't want to compete against the Rugby World Cup too. Heh. –Howard the Duck 05:01, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
I see... --candlewicke 14:43, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
Holding the WBC every year wouldn't be popular because it interferes with Spring training for the players involved. As to why there's a three year gap between the first two tournaments and four afterwards, I'm guessing they don't want to ride the coattails of the Winter Olympics again rather than concern about the upcoming World Cup (although that could have factored in). Unfortunately, the WBC will always have this to compete with as long as the tournament is held in March.--Boznia 17:09, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
I think there are no other world tournaments competed by national teams the year after the Summer Olympics that's why they picked 2009+4. And they're planning to make this baseball's equivalent of the World Cup (although the Baseball World Cup exists and is held more frequently) that's why they made it quadrennial. And almost all world tournaments competed by national teams (the FIFA, Rugby, Cricket World Cups, FIBA World Championship, etc.) occur quadrennially so that's probably the case. –Howard the Duck 18:55, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
I agree with you on the reason for holding the tournament quadrennially (as a standard for international tournaments), but...I still think moving the tournament year was to avoid the Winter Olympics. :) Turin 2006 ran from Feb. 10-26, and the first WBC ran from Mar. 3-20 of the same year. The Winter and Summer Olympics are by far the most followed international sporting events in the U.S. Now I know the WBC is meant to raise interest internationally in baseball and not focus on the U.S., but it needs support from the U.S. to succeed, and holding the WBC so soon after a major event like the Olympics reduces it's impact in a crowded U.S. sports market.--Boznia 20:19, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
Let's just say they avoided both the Olympics and the FIFA World Cup. Anyway, the page views of the article surely doesn't not come majority from the U.S. (which doesn't really care, and I'm referring to the fans at the team, at last the manager), the top two days it had the most page views was at the Japan-South Korea and Venezuela-US game, three thousand less than the last day of the Six Nations Championship. –Howard the Duck 03:31, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
With U.S. being eliminated by Japan, that increases its internationalness by twenty-fold. –Howard the Duck 04:17, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
Is it really all about "internationalness" or is it about the highest level of a particular sport? How did you come up with the twenty-fold figure? Korea and Japan are virtually next door neighbours(!) It's only international from a U.S. perspective... --candlewicke 21:15, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
The nations at the Six Nations Championship practically border each other, and on the 2006 World Cup, Italy and France bordered each other so... And when was the last time you heard K-Pop, and J-Pop anywhere outside Asia, and of all places, Dodger Stadium?–Howard the Duck 05:54, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
Suggested blurb: Japan defeats Korea 5–3 in 10 innings to win the 2009 World Baseball Classic at Dodger Stadium, Los Angeles, U.S.
I'd be adding prose a little later on the article. –Howard the Duck 05:54, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
Please be reminded to put the prose (with refs!) on the 2009 World Baseball Classic - Finals article, too. Thanks. --PFHLai (talk) 06:03, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
Working on it. But I placed it on the main 2009 World Baseball Classic article. Is that OK? –Howard the Duck 06:21, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
Done. The conditions as set for WP:ITNR are met so there should be no valid objections by now. –Howard the Duck 07:43, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
Posted. The Tom (talk) 18:41, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

March 22

ITN candidates for March 22

Mount Redoubt
Nice pic of Mount Redoubt, 2009-03-21.

Just so you guys know, I am the primary contributor. The article needs some cleanup with the references because people have been bursting in and not following proper referencing methods, or at least not ones consistent with other GAs I've seen :). Ceranthor 19:59, 23 March 2009 (UTC)

I like natural events on ITN, although for this to go up it will probably need more prose on the recent activity (22nd and 23rd March) --Daviessimo (talk) 15:40, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
If 2-3 more sentences can be provided, this one has my support. --Tone 18:26, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
I'm satisfied that even without a heck of a lot of prose on the recent prose it belongs on the (stale news-heavy) current ITN. Posted. The Tom (talk) 19:04, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
Montana explosion/crash/bang thingy that's just happened

This is a very major development and though the decision was made just an hour ago, it has already created headlines across several media outlets across the world: Top News at BBC Sport [9] [10] [11] -- (talk) 08:17, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
Regarding sports, we usually include only the results of the biggest events, not shifts. However, we'll include election. --Tone 13:23, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
This is not only about sports, it has major political and diplomatic implications too. -- (talk) 21:32, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
I'm still not able to understand your argument against posting this item which has created headlines in many parts of the world apart from India (UAE's Khaleej Times, Qatar's al-Jazeera, and BBC). -- (talk) 22:01, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
Had National Football League been shifted out of the United States, would you have used the same argument? The only thing at stake here Wikipedia's neutrality, global representation and credibility. -- (talk) 22:03, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
IPL we will post the final results. no need to post the date shifts yet. (unless it gets canceled or something, which i doubt) Ashishg55 (talk) 19:36, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
Ah.. it is not about date shift, it is about the shift in venue. -- (talk) 21:32, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
I get your justification but the only time we had something similar was when Rally Dakar was canceled and moved to South America next year. But this one is international. Still, hard to compare. --Tone 22:05, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
Oh yes! Indian Premier League (IPL) is very much an international event. Every major cricketer from every part of the world takes part in it. The league is organized by India's cricket board, but that does not mean it is not an international event. Please go through the list of players participating in the event. Even Dakar Rally is organized by a French group, not an international organization. -- (talk) 03:02, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
I thought only the first month will be played outside India? –Howard the Duck 04:19, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
Nope, all the 59 matches of the tournament will be played outside. BCCI is going to name the new host nation later today. Most probably, it would be England. I see absolutely no logic in not posting this item. IPL is one of the largest cricket tournaments in the world, played by all major cricketers, organized by India's Cricket Board and is being hosted in England. How is this not an international event? -- (talk) 09:00, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
If that's the case this may be posted. The IPL is top-level competition in club cricket. Once a new host has been determined this can be added. –Howard the Duck 14:07, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
My personal opinion would be (as others have suggested) that simply a shift in venue does not warrant inclusion on ITN. It is a news story and nothing more. Despite its name ITN is not a 'news ticker', it is a place for encylopaedic articles relating to current events to be showcased. Regarding the other issue brought up on here, claiming that that the IPL is 'international' because it has foreign players participating is frankly a silly statement. Virtually every modern league of the major sports has an international make-up in terms of participants. As it is named the Indian Premier League it is very much a domestic competition. --Daviessimo (talk) 14:44, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
I dunno but this situation is rather novel; I haven't heard a sports league that is based in a country playing an entire season in another. Even if the league was small I think it could've merited a mention. –Howard the Duck 16:11, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
Firstly, as Tone pointed out, an item on the Dakar Rally being shifted from Europe-Africa to South America was posted on the ITN. Secondly, it is rather silly to generalize cricket leagues with virtually every modern league of other major sports. When it comes to cricket, there are barely any leagues which attract players from all over the world. It is a well known fact in cricketing world that IPL is the first and currently the only domestic league of its kind. Other cricket leagues, namely Stanford 20/20, KFC Twenty20 Big Bash, Twenty20 Cup and Pakistan Super League, barely attract any players from other countries. Leagues which have attracted international players are either now canceled (Stanford Super Series) or are not recognized by the International Cricket Council (Indian Cricket League). Thirdly, how often does it happen in any sport that an entire domestic league, that too the most popular domestic league of that sport by far, is being held in a foreign nation? And lastly, by international event, I didn't mean to say that the Indian Premier League was an international league. I meant that the decision to shift the league out of India was an event of international significance. Sorry if I wasn't clear but still, isn't this a matter of common-sense? -- (talk) 17:31, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
I think this might be worthy of inclusion. It does seem unfair to generalise each sport if perhaps cricket is operated in a different way than some other more popular sports. I am not overly familiar with the sport but, reading into it, it does seem interesting, unusual, significant and covered internationally within a small number of hours. India is no small country either by my estimation... I also like Howard's point – we don't hear or see this every day... --candlewicke 21:11, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
Plus this is a nice balance to the baseball blurb. Cricket and baseball at the same time in ITN. w00t. –Howard the Duck 07:51, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
(back indent) i still think the news is not yet big enough to be on ITN. if this were to be posted we should minimum wait till its decided which country IPL is moving to. and for Daviessimo's comment on IPL being domestic. IPL is not even close to being domestic. just because the name starts off with "INDIAN" does not mean its literally indian league. its just the name. Worldwide players participate in it and it is now recognized as one of the most prestigious events in cricket (behind world cup). I would still prefer posting only the final results though. Ashishg55 (talk) 21:37, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
As I have said before, the decision to move out the IPL is significant in many ways since it has political implications too. That said, I'm of the opinion that we should include an item on the BCCI's final decision on the new host. -- (talk) 02:35, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
I'm not going to argue with people who refuse to accept the generic definitions of domestic and international in terms of sport. The IPL is run by the BCCI who are the governing body of cricket in India (not the world, not Asia.. only India), it is open only to Indian teams (not English, not Australian.. only Indian). Therefore it follows that is a domestic league. The comparison with Dakar is silly - it may be organised by a French body but it is open to competitors from anywhere in the world (hence its international status). An abundance of foreign players or overseas popularity does not make it an international league. The Premier League is the most popular sporting league in the world and has players from over 50 countries, but that does not make it international and we can't view other leagues or sports any differently. When we start to do that then we are no longer neutral --Daviessimo (talk) 15:35, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
Cricket unlike soccer/hockey/rugby/whatever sport does not work in league system where every country got their own leagues going on. Cricket is mainly international and is played between international teams. IPL is the pretty much only league out there for cricket so players from around the world play in it. Governing body or fact its called Indian Premiere League does not make it domestic because Cricket is not same as most sports out there. Think of it this way if soccer only had the world cup internationally and other than that all players competed in a single league that was governed by lets say england would u consider it domestic? NO. You have to look at these things per sport basis. Now if in coming years there is a league for cricket in every country out there then i will agree with you. but as it stands right now IPL in no way can be considered a domestic league. Ashishg55 (talk) 15:55, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
This is totally false. There are many domestic cricket competitions, such as the County Championship, Ranji Trophy, Sheffield Shield and SuperSport Series. Algebraist 15:59, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
And to further Algebraist's point the IPL is a 20Twenty league competition of which there are equivilants in over ten other countries (see List of domestic Twenty20 cricket competitions). Thus returning to what I said above, spin it any way you want, you can't change the fact that the IPL is domestic league. Heck it's even listed in the wikipedia article 'list of domestic twenty20 cricket competition' --Daviessimo (talk) 16:10, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
In any case only IPL gets to be reported elsewhere.
This was has been "plaguing" North American sports here anyway, people insist they are "domestic leagues" despite them being the top competition of their respective sports; we can't use the standard for mainly European sports since either world competitions in which intercontinental champions qualify don't exist, or most of the best players are concentrated on one "domestic league" rendering these "domestic league" champions the audacity to call themselves "world champions."
If ever the "top competition"/"domestic league" argument won't cut, I'll ask: when was the last time an entire season of the top-level domestic league of a country gets to be hosted in another?
However, it seems there has been sporadic updates on article, and it has been confirmed that South Africa will host the IPL so there has to be some updates done there before this goes up. –Howard the Duck 16:21, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
If anything, this is of the same magnitude as when Serie A relegated Juventus, et. al. to Serie B. That made it to the ITN in 2006, and even extended 2006 FIFA World Cup's link staying at the Main Page for a few more days. Well of course, that's football so... I also know there is no precedent on ITN except probably for WP:ITNR, elections and plane crashes, but still... –Howard the Duck 16:28, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
There is a very massive difference between "domestic cricket competitions" and IPL. and if you can not see that then there is no point in arguing. Just because it is listed in the category does not make it "domestic league" where anything important shouldnt make it to ITN since it wont be international... Its just a very dumb way of looking at sport leagues in my opinion. It totally depends on sport and league's reputation in its respective sport. Ashishg55 (talk) 18:48, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
Do you have an argument that the IPL does not constitute a domestic league, or do we just have to take the word of someone who has already shown that they know nothing whatsoever about cricket? Algebraist 17:59, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
I find it hard to see how a league with only Indian clubs is not a domestic competition. The English Premier league is also domestic although many top-level players participate. --Tone 18:26, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
Algebraist, u would be surprised how much i know about cricket (u should read up on wiki's personal attack policies too). my argument is not whether IPL is domestic or not. it is that for cricket IPL is a big deal. Cricket in general that is. and to classify IPL with ur so called "domestic" keyword is unfair since around here it seems to mean "not worthy for ITN". Daviessimo used the same domestic league argument for NHL for Brodeur's all time record. And all i am saying is not every league for every sport is considered "domestic". It has to be looked by per sport basis. Ashishg55 (talk) 18:45, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
Well, I don't know what is this entire argument about. Some people here are purposely manipulating comments made by me to serve their own viewpoint. It is quite obvious that the IPL is a domestic league. Who said it isn't? The point is, that though IPL is a domestic league, the decision to shift IPL to South Africa is an event of international significance because A) IPL is the only major domestic league in the cricketing world in which almost all major cricketers from every country with Test-status play. B) Never have I heard of a major domestic league being shifted abroad due to security concerns. Lastly, according to Daviessimo, the Dakar Rally, though organized by a French group, is an international sporting event because it is open to competitors from anywhere in the world and therefore, it cannot be compared to IPL. That is a flawed logic because the IPL is also open to international players, unlike other domestic tournaments like the Ranji Trophy. To put matters into perspective, let me ask a simple question: If the English Premier League had been shifted from England to France because of security concerns, how many of you would have opposed posting a blurb on that in the ITN? Even then, the IPL holds a special case because in cricket, there is no other domestic league in which every major cricketer from across the world have taken part in. That is not the case with the English Premier League because there are other soccer leagues which rival it in popularity and also attract a large number of high-profile players from across the world. So drawing comparisons between various soccer leagues and IPL is absolutely ridiculous and beats common-sense. And comparing IPL with other domestic T20 cricket competitions is even sillier and speaks volumes about the ignorance of the people involved in this entire argument. Sorry if I was a bit rude but c'mon.. -- (talk) 05:17, 25 March 2009 (UTC)

March 21

ITN candidates for March 21

Yemeni tourist slaughter
Venezuelan takeover

How often does that happen... --candlewicke 02:48, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

Support. Care to create an article? --BorgQueen (talk) 07:07, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

Six Nations
Since it probably won't be seen in the mess below. Five minutes until it's over. --candlewicke 19:20, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
Here is a matchtracker with two minutes left. --candlewicke 19:24, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
Ireland wins its first Six Nations Championship in rugby union since 1948. When ready. --candlewicke 19:28, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
I'd like to see a little more prose in the article before this goes up. SpencerT♦Nominate! 19:39, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
And it's wrong! It is their first 6 Nations Grand Slam since 1948 (their last championship win was in 1985 I think). Rambo's Revenge (How am I doing?) 19:46, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
You're right actually. They did win something in 1985 as far as I'm aware. So "Grand Slam" then. --candlewicke 19:55, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
Done. See here for BBC report to confirm achievement. --candlewicke 20:02, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
The article is nice but what is the final wording then? --Tone 20:25, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
Post as: Ireland wins its first Six Nations Grand Slam in rugby union since 1948. --candlewicke 20:28, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
Posting. --Tone 20:35, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
  • The current headline makes it same as though the Six Nations is a knock-out style competition and that Ireland and Wales were playing in the final, which it wasn't. Even if Wales won the game, Ireland would've still won it. Please remove the individual game details. Jolly Ω Janner 16:49, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
Slovakia presidential election
Ivan Gašparovič and Iveta Radičová will meet in the second round. Can you suggest a good wording? The article is not really long but contains the vital info. --Tone 13:21, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
Six Nations Championship, rugby union, superbowl, Gaelic football, international rules football, BBC, CNN, the Philippines, basketball, baseball, Champions League football, lots of other football, Olympic games, Irish ITNs, Eurovision, Commonwealth, NHL, American Idol, water on Mars, April fool
  • Just thought I'd point out the 2009 six nations finishes next weekend. Ireland are still on for the grand slam although both Wales and France still have a chance of winning the tournament (as of today). I think thats normally an annual ITN item. --Daviessimo (talk) 20:00, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
Ah yes, another potential ITN for Ireland... ;) --Candlewicke ST # :) 20:36, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
Note: There are currently 4 rugby union items that will appear for this year, that's equal with the most popular sport football/soccer. This is potentially an over-representation of union's popularity but that's just me. –Howard the Duck 10:33, 15 March 2009 (UTC)
Well events like the Superbowl are irrelevant to me but that's because of where I am. No way would that be removed. --Candlewicke ST # :) 18:41, 15 March 2009 (UTC)
But that's just 1. Union has four. And I dunno if this is the top-level considering there's the Tri Nations and the Rugby World Cup. –Howard the Duck 04:39, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

Note: To the best of my knowledge, the Tri Nations is the Six Nations of the southern hemisphere. It simply would not make sense to include one without the other. Six is also more than three, i.e. more nations. --Candlewicke ST # :) 00:19, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

Yes, but Rugby Union is a far more popular global sport than American Football and has four 'major' tournaments that involve a variety of nations (as opposed to just one) --Daviessimo (talk) 14:52, 16 March 2009 (UTC)
I agree. I can only assume that it's the fact that it is American football which helps it maintain such privileged status at ITN that, for example, the live televised All-Ireland Finals in hurling and Gaelic football which are held each September by the Gaelic Athletic Association (an organisation which has significant influence across the world, according to my viewing of the article on Gaelic football) hold each year in the 80,000+ full-to-capacity Croke Park and which are in effect to Ireland what the Superbowl is to the U.S. and, I suppose, the FA Cup is to England in terms of cultural significance and popularity, do not enjoy. Not even the international rules games which take place between Ireland and Australia (two countries in opposite corners of the world and located in separate hemispheres) feature on ITN, although I've previously attempted to change all that somewhere or other as it doesn't really make very much sense to me... and, even so, it's not as if ITN is about to cave in under the heavy weight of contributions/nominations that it can't feature the occasional sporting event beyond the major ones such as the Olympics or the FIFA World Cup (not elitism on my part but the most widely-viewed sporting event in the world for the benefit of those who might protest at its mention)... the last sporting ITN I can recall is the tennis in Australia which was neither today nor yesterday... --Candlewicke ST # :) 21:58, 16 March 2009 (UTC)
My point is that the Six Nations and Tri Nations are not the top levels of competition for rugby union competitions contested by national teams; it's the Rugby World Cup. Ergo, I propose neither of them appear at the ITN unless something really awesome happens like the championship gets to be decided in 6 extra periods.
As for the Super Bowl and Irish games, the Super Bowl had 100 million viewers in the U.S., that's against even all of the people of Ireland and Northern Ireland, it won't cut it (dunno the "international" extent of those, though; if those competitions reached 100 million I dunno why the BBC and CNN International didn't cover them). The main argument for the inclusion of the Super Bowl was I guess it is the top competition of the sport, in any level, even higher than the IFAF World Cup (American football's equivalent of the FIFA World Cup). As for the FA Cup, I'm willing to support it if the final competitors finish 1st and 2nd at the Premier League, like what happened several years ago when Chelsea and ManUtd played.
P.S.: FIBA claimed the U.S.-China basketball preliminary round game at the Olympics had the most viewers ever.
P.P.S.: It's arguments such as "international rules" makes me cringe. Like a assoc. football game between San Marino and Luxembourg is more international than say, the NBA Finals, or even the World Baseball Classic (which will end this month). –Howard the Duck 02:31, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
It is referred to as "international rules", I didn't make it up. To be honest, if I may have a cringe, it is arguments over television coverage that make me do so. When it is the highest level of a particular sport which has some form of global coverage, I see no reason why it shouldn't be included on ITN. It oughtn't to be determined by the fact that the BBC or CNN cover them. To give some context, if a country the size of Lithuania (sorry for picking on it) had its own specific sport (with perhaps some form of recognition abroad) and which had its own specific day where basically the country came to a standstill and sat down together to cheer on its team competing in that sport's highest level, then surely there is something significant in that? The trouble is I can't think of another small country with such a circumstance which speaks English on a daily basis that I could use to balance the point, other than Ireland. When I say English-speaking I don't mean to be biased against other languages, rather that it is more likely that inhabitants of a country will visit their "home" Wikipedia. I would not seek to remove baseball or the Superbowl as, apart from the fact that it would be futile, I understand the arguments for inclusion. What I cannot understand is why anyone would remove the Six Nations for reasons relating to its alleged lack of top level of competition. If there is no rugby union world cup, these championships are the highest level of that sport taking place this year. And, on that note, the games I referred to previously are in fact the top level of their particular (internationally-recognised) sport. Now why am I defending rugby union of all sports? --Candlewicke ST # :) 03:54, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
The reason why I brought the Beeb and CNN at the discussion was that there is no easy way to determine "international-ness," hence if it is covered by the BBC and CNN it has a chance to be added here. Plus, for the its size, Ireland has too many ITN entries already, notwithstanding the Six Nations one since it affects six nations and is probably followed by many other nations elsewhere.
Yes, there is a sporting event that "stops" every country in the world; the thing is not all of them gets in here. The Philippines, a country with a lot more people than Ireland, had one last December but it was not added. Euro-bias? Maybe the next event this coming May would do the trick, since a Brit is involved.
The thing with Six Nations and the Tri Nations is that they are not the top level competitions of the sport, and that was one of the point of contentions in adding U.S. sports.
If it contributes anything to this discussion this page has more page views that the Six Nations tournament page, at least for March 2009. I was even more surprised when this page got more than the Six Nations considering the Americans don't take the tournament that seriously. –Howard the Duck 04:25, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
The 6 nations and tri-nations are equivilants of the European championships, African Cup of Nations or Copa America in football. Are they no longer ITN worthy? What about the Commonwealth games or the Pan American games? I mean they not on the same levels as the Olympics are they? The simple fact is that they are all major sporting events and deserve a mention on the main page. As for your logic that there is an over-representation of Irish stories is silly, they haven't even won it yet, and if they do win it they deserve the recognition (particularly if it is as a grand slam). The reason is they will be champions of the Northern Hemisphere --Daviessimo (talk) 16:06, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
Daviessimo's point above makes perfect sense. Otherwise anything continental would have to be removed and we would be left with just the Olympics and one or two other world events. And what of non-sporting items on the list, such as the Eurovision Song Contest for example? They too would have to be removed. And then it would surely be somewhat contradictory to even include the Superbowl? How can a tournament that produces the champions of an entire hemisphere not be notable enough for inclusion? The basketball page views point makes me cringe further – I have nothing against basketball and have enjoyed it in the past but, if page views are exclusively what determines an ITN, the section would probably be dominated by sports which are popular only in the United States with every baseball, basketball and American football final included to the detriment of many other sports which enjoy success in other countries! On the point about the Philippines, if that point is true, I should think it is because it wasn't nominated or discussed in any detail at the time. However, to prevent accusations of recentism at the time, perhaps it would better to sort it out now before May? If such an event occurs and it is at a high level in its field and enjoys such popularity as described then perhaps there is no other reason to exclude it other than "Euro-bias" – or certainly a bias against Asia? However, as I do not have any further detail on this event to go on, I do not know how to further comment upon it. --Candlewicke ST # :) 17:56, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
And with regards to Irish ITNs, my apologies for the fact that the country is falling apart, i.e. a bank being nationalised, the economy slumping quicker than anywhere but Iceland and the pork recall, not to mention the numerous records relating to drugs hauls and bank robberies over the past few months. No apology for the weather, the UK can take the blame for that one(!) But of course it is my own fault for being one of the main researchers for ITN candidates for a period earlier in the year, a period which coincided with many of these incidents and records. However, it must be pointed out that they went through the ITN process like everything else and were deemed notable enough to be included by other users. I'm afraid the only way to rectify this is to sabotage the rugby union team on Saturday, for which Wales will have to take full responsibility. ;) --Candlewicke ST # :) 18:13, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
Fair enough, but IMHO still, it's not fair rugby union gets to have 4 items this year. I think football will also have 4 so that's not quite right. –Howard the Duck 14:47, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
I saw my favorite topic aka Eurovision Song Contest once again and again I wonder if American Idol (season 8) will now make it. It is shown in a lot of places it has to have international interest, despite being having solely American (and Puerto Rican) residents as contestants. This has been a point of contention among American items since only Americans participate thus it is not "international" enough which is frankly silly. –Howard the Duck 14:52, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
I'm not sure that TV show is anywhere near Eurovision in terms of its history and format. As far as I'm aware, the winner of Eurovision represents one country against about fifty others. I'm also assuming American Idol is a series and not something that is essentially an annual once-off final with one or two qualifying rounds? Not to mention that every other country would want their favourite talent shows included as well. And I don't think it's fair. But removing one will unbalance everything. I was trying to balance it further by including a wider range of sports. I don't think you can have the Superbowl without something like the Six Nations. And there's absolutely no way the Superbowl will be defeated... --Candlewicke ST # :) 20:56, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
I do want the Super Bowl to be stricken off WP:ITNR though, or add it only when something really awesome happens. Like an OT game (I think that never happened before). –Howard the Duck 02:02, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
(back indent) If nothing else, this is an international event with several countries participating. And the lack of sport ITN material recently would be an additional reason, though don't count it as a precedent. By the way, I thought it was pretty clear that we do include Eurovision and Superbowl and not American Idol (after all, it's one of the commercial shows on one commercial television in one country, regardless of all the fuss about it.)--Tone 21:09, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
I could list off numerous TV shows from America that make it elsewhere but we don't put season premieres or finales on ITN. So I really don't understand where American Idol is coming from. --Candlewicke ST # :) 21:15, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
Are there any other season finales aired live in real-time elsewhere? Unless you're watching on internet TV you won't see real-time 24 with the same scenes as seen by Americans. And we had two channels (free TV and cable) doing that in our place. –Howard the Duck 02:00, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
Howard if you can't see the glaring difference between the Eurovision Song Contest and American Idol then the arguments is going to go on forever. As for your assumption about the international interest in American Idol read the article on the idol series. Most countries have only an interest in their national version. Its a blanket assumption to make suggesting that other countries are transfixed by American television. --Daviessimo (talk) 13:11, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
I dunno, my cousins in Malaysia were hooked last season. Maybe it's just... them. About the Idol series, I think only American Idol gets to be aired on countries outside its franchise area. Maybe Pop Idol and Australian Idol were also aired elsewhere.
I'm not even asking the removal of Eurovision considering its a big deal for Europeans and is aired internationally. And if I can see the "glaring difference", I also don't understand why NHL gets to be classified as a "domestic league" either, considering it sends representatives to a world competition, something an intercontinental league does. –Howard the Duck 17:44, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
  • How about water on Mars? Something like: Scientists from NASA photograph liquid water on Mars for the first time? --Ouro (blah blah) 19:34, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
    • I think you're probably looking for this link? This is a rather drawn out discussion on sport. --Candlewicke ST # :) 20:52, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
      • Huh? --Ouro (blah blah) 06:21, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
        • I have to say this is one of the most bizarre discussions I've ever been involved in on Wikipedia. How did we go from rugby union to water on Mars? --candlewicke 18:49, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
via Eurovision and American Idol --Daviessimo (talk) 19:12, 21 March 2009 (UTC)

March 20

ITN candidates for March 20

The volcano eruption looks nice. No article here yet, I presume... --Tone 09:04, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
Agree, particularly as it appears a new island has been created --Daviessimo (talk) 09:15, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
I found this article - 2009 Tonga earthquake - for the earthquake that has just occured. I've expanded a little and added a section for the eruption although I'm not sure if it wants its own article (my inclination would be that it doesn't) --Daviessimo (talk) 10:11, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
I've expanded a bit more. How about: "A 7.9 magnitude earthquake occurs off the coast of Tongatapu, Tonga, shortly after a large scale undersea volcanic eruption begins in the region" --Daviessimo (talk) 10:34, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
Ok, but is the eruption the cause of the earthquake? If yes, no problem, if no, the articles should be separated. --Tone 12:10, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
Well there is a quote from someone from the USGS: "The association with the volcanic activity seems to be an interesting added dimension to this. It's not clear at this point that there is a direct association, but it seems suggestive at this point." --Daviessimo (talk) 13:05, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
I've created a new article for the eruption to play it safe. If in future there is a confirmed link then the two articles can be mereged. I think "A 7.9 Mw earthquake occurs off the coast of Tongatapu, Tonga, shortly after a large scale undersea volcanic eruption begins in the region" should be ok now --Daviessimo (talk) 15:22, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
Posting. SpencerT♦Nominate! 15:57, 21 March 2009 (UTC)

Robotic fish
  • After a long Dark Age, I've finally come across a non-satellite science-related item: [12] If consensus supports its ITN-worthiness, I can create a relevant article. --BorgQueen (talk) 15:58, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
Cool! Though I think this is a perfect candidate for April 1 since is it really something unusual. --Tone 16:53, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
Hmm, yes, I agree - April fool's sounds good. --BorgQueen (talk) 17:01, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
Agreed. Moved to here. --candlewicke 19:04, 21 March 2009 (UTC)


The Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory announces the discovery of Y(4140), a new subatomic particle. --BorgQueen (talk) 07:36, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

The article is really short at this point, and a tad too technical. SpencerT♦Nominate! 01:40, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

March 19

ITN candidates for March 19

AIG bonus payments controversy
Nom: The U.S. House of Representatives votes to levy a 90% tax on bonuses awarded by corporations receiving more than $5 billion in Treasury aid. --Hapsala (talk) 04:13, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
2009 extinct fossil octopus discoveries

I'd like to nominate the article 2009 extinct fossil octopus discoveries for in the news. Grundle2600 (talk) 14:13, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

Nice one. Actually, if you look above, there is an idea for April 1 Main page to have unusual but accurate events and this is a perfect candidate in my opinion. If you agree, of course. --Tone 16:05, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
Yeah - that sounds awesome! Thanks for telling me. Grundle2600 (talk) 21:13, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

Joseph Fritzl

Joseph Fritzl being sentenced to life under the blurb "Joseph Fritzl pleads guilty to charges of incest and murder and is sentenced to life imprisonment" BigHairRef | Talk 18:17, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

Already nominated in the section below. And no, I don't think it is ITN-worthy. --BorgQueen (talk) 18:23, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
No. --Candlewicke ST # :) 21:04, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
This case has generated huge international interest. I strongly support its inclusion on ITN. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 22:17, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
But is ITN really for stories that are overly sensationalised by the tabloids (although I realise it's not just the tabloids)? Or is it about incidents of notability or real significance? There doesn't appear to have been any new records set here. I heard a mention on television last night as to why this story is getting so much coverage when thousands of similar cases are occurring all the time; there are thousands of court cases involving rape and incest; in fact there was one in Ireland recently that didn't quite register on the same level of news coverage but had many similar elements, including the rape and incest of multiple children by their mother in this case and she was given a lengthy spell in prison. We could of course always post the imminent death of Jade Goody as well since we're going down this line – as far as I can see this is getting great coverage in Europe and some internationally too. --Candlewicke ST # :) 13:46, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
For some reason this has been widely covered not only by the trashy news media so I guess it meets "international interest". The Irish one wasn't that covered elsewhere as this one. As for records, I don't think anyone keeps records for things such as this. If it had "similar elements" but wasn't covered extensively then it won't cut it. I dunno what's with this case that makes it such a media magnet. –Howard the Duck 14:22, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
I did hear someone point out somewhere that it might have been due to Austria having produced Hitler which seems a bit of a crude comparison but nonetheless may have had some impact on the case. Throw in a sense of voyeurism and the fact that sex sells and it becomes perfect tabloid fodder which in turn would feed public interest. But the point is, while it may have a high public profile, ITN doesn't necessarily follow media trends. The floods we've just posted aren't really getting the coverage they deserve but they are definitely notable from the few reports we have. --Candlewicke ST # :) 15:55, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
Our criteria is pretty loose anyway: "international importance or interest", not "international importance and interest". If it passes one out of two it can be considered. –Howard the Duck 16:17, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
It is ok to consider but the decision whether to post it or not is up to a consensus. Some stories may even not be of wide international interest, like some new fossils discovered, but those are of encyclopaedic interest so that's why we put them on ITN. This particular story is just one sad story made big by the media. --Tone 16:24, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
I prefer the stories involving fossils, archaelogical discoveries and events like the floods that tend to be ignored by the media. This is after all an encyclopedia, readers might expect more stories relating to science, history and geography or else they might as well go to Wikinews. --Candlewicke ST # :) 20:58, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
If we're going to focus on things ignored by the media, we should call it something other than "In the News." -- Mwalcoff (talk) 22:16, 20 March 2009 (UTC)

(outdent) I basically concur with Tone's latest assesment. I was originally the one who nom'd this, but after the two objections I came round to the fact that this story had been spun by the media, and that although it is sad, it is not particularly notable. Rambo's Revenge (How am I doing?) 22:55, 20 March 2009 (UTC)

Well they're still in the news if they've happened recently, the trouble is they may not be making headlines across the world. Why follow the order of the headlines? ITN might as well be a news service in that case. --Candlewicke ST # :) 23:19, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
In response to Mwalcoff, well I've been saying all along, together with others, we shouldn't call it ITN Nil Einne (talk) 00:43, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

The Pope returns with a vengeance. Today he celebrates a first in front of 60,000 people. There are lots of sources available for this whole event. Any thoughts? --Candlewicke ST # :) 21:21, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

I think we had an ITN post when he visited Australia. On the other hand, when another religious leader or head of state (well, the pope is both) makes a visit, we usually don't put it on. --Tone 21:24, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
Ah, but the Pope is both. Anyway I have one which I think is far better. --Candlewicke ST # :) 21:25, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

Namibia floods

Floods in Namibia kill 90 people. --Candlewicke ST # :) 21:26, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

  • 2009 Namibia floods, I presume. Pretty bad thing. When the article is ready, it has my support. --Tone 21:52, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
    • It also seems to have affected Angola. --Candlewicke ST # :) 22:07, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
      • Most certainly for this one. Definately newsworthy BigHairRef | Talk 22:10, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
        • I have updated the article and it is hopefully comprehensive enough to go on the main page - Dumelow (talk) 12:54, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
          • That looks ready for posting. Well done! --Candlewicke ST # :) 13:50, 20 March 2009 (UTC)

March 18

ITN candidates for March 18

Natasha Richardson

Nom: British actress Natasha Richardson (pictured) dies of head injuries following a skiing accident at Mont Tremblant Resort north of Montreal. --Hapsala (talk) 11:56, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
We didn't put on Heath Ledger, this seems a precedent in this case. --Tone 12:44, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
True, we'd better not put this on. --Hapsala (talk) 12:50, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
You actually did put Heath Ledger up; it's how I first heard of it(!) I just checked the archive and it's in there. Even so, Ledger had probably achieved a bit more and was more widely recognised for his individual work across many continents. He was also younger, his death was more sudden, etc, whereas this went on for some hours and days. I don't think Richardson had not yet risen to his level and seems to be more widely recognised for her family background, maybe one or two roles at most. --Candlewicke ST # :) 21:03, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

(reduce indent) If I recall correctly, Wikipedia didn't have a free use image at the time. So, I had to ask a photographer to change his licensing from copyrighted to CC-BY-SA. That probably is a factor as to why his picture wasn't immediately shown on the front page at the time of his death. miranda 01:13, 20 March 2009 (UTC)

Martin Brodeur

Martin Brodeur sets NHL record for most career wins at 552... If someone can turn that into proper headline that would be great. ahh even though he is playing for devils he is still a canadian :) Ashishg55 (talk) 02:25, 18 March 2009 (UTC)
Domestic sporting records aren't really notable enough for ITN in my opinion --Daviessimo (talk) 13:24, 18 March 2009 (UTC)
First of all there are 2 countries involved so it is not domestic. Secondly NHL isnt something that small and i believe an all time record deserves to go up on ITN. (talk) 17:46, 18 March 2009 (UTC)
The NHL is classified as a domestic league. It is comparible with the Football league, which also has participants from two countries. If this were an international record (i.e. most wins in Ice Hockey World Championships) then fine but as a domestic achievement it is no more noteworthy than say Alan Shearer's record as the top goalscorer in Premiership history. If either went up you have a precedent for hundreds more records to go up in all manner of sports. In my eyes Raul's achievement as the record holder for appearances and goals in the Champions League is more internationally significant, but that didn't go up onto ITN. --Daviessimo (talk) 18:42, 18 March 2009 (UTC)
Note: The IIHF does not classify the NHL as a domestic league, although they're working out on the Victoria Cup, a tournament involving Champions Hockey League and the NHL; hence if the UEFA CL had a North American hockey counterpart, it's the NHL. –Howard the Duck 14:38, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
I agree with Daviessimo. The sports thing is already complicated enough as it is without opening it up to potentially dozens or even hundreds of more ITNs by altering the criteria ever so slightly to include this achievement. --Candlewicke ST # :) 20:22, 18 March 2009 (UTC)
The NHL is definitely not comparable to the Football League, which is just one of many quality soccer leagues in Europe. The NHL is the sole major hockey league on the continent of North America and is universally recognized by people who know hockey as far and away the top level of the sport in the world. It is like the English, Spanish, Italian and German soccer leagues put together. I see nothing wrong with having sports records of extreme notability, like Barry Bonds breaking the career home run record (which I believe was on ITN). Whether Brodeur's achievement is in that class is something for a Canadian to determine. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 03:16, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
Its comparable in as much as it is a domestic league with competitors from more than one country. Saying its like the English, Spanish, Italian and German football leagues put together is silly because it is nowhere near as big as the Champions League, which is arguably the biggest international club competition in the world. Actually thats were your argument falls flat. Both the winners of the NHL and Champions league go up on ITN - record holders don't. Thus as I pointed out above in order to maintain neutrality if Raul's achievements are not ITN worthy, then neither is this.--Daviessimo (talk) 07:56, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
I knew it! The Euroleague is bigger than the NBA. Ditch the NBA Finals and replace it with the Euroleague Final Four. –Howard the Duck 14:33, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
On a more serious note we should probably add the event when Wayne Gretzky's the career regular season goals record is broken. It's like the home run and Barry Bonds for hockey. This one should not go up. But I'll support the Stanley Cup Final which will occur in June. Hey, it's Canada so... –Howard the Duck 14:38, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
From what Daviessimo says winners, not record-holders of these events go on ITN, don't they? --Candlewicke ST # :) 21:10, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
Some records go on ITN. We had Usain Bolt on 100m. And this weekend, we may have a new world record in Planica in ski jumping (that would have my support). --Tone 21:12, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
I specifically remember Barry Bonds' record-breaking game being added, although I'm not sure. –Howard the Duck 02:07, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
The Champions League is bigger than the NHL because soccer is bigger than hockey. But the NHL is as big in its sport as the Champions League is in its sport. Anyway, the key variable should not be the importance of the league necessarily but rather the cultural significance of the record event. The career home run record has huge cultural significance in the United States, more than any American football or basketball record. In Canada, the equivalent would be someone breaking Wayne Gretzky's career goals record. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 22:16, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
I don't think the NFL and NBA all-time career scoring records would go up, though since it is not as closely followed by the rest of the populace (I think this is the same case for the Premier League career goals record). The Gretzky record is safe until the lifetimes of our grandchildren so we won't be seeing that in ITN for a long time. –Howard the Duck 02:07, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
Bolt's was fine I think as not only was it widely recognised in his particular sport but it occurred during the Olympics and as far as I can see it would be that and Michael Phelps's record that those Olympics will be remembered for. These are very much individual records in sports that don't involve teams. But what I meant was that Daviessimo was indicating that records for team sports such as football don't seem to generally get posted as of course there would be so many more of these in individual leagues in different countries and this would very difficult to maintain. --Candlewicke ST # :) 14:03, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
I think Bolt's 100m record was broken in a competition outside the Olympics, unless he broke it again anew on the Olympics.
For team sports, there are only a very handful of records that are widely followed: for North America its the MLB home run record, the NHL career goals record. I think those are the only records worth adding as for the moment in North American sports. The MLB is within reach within a few years but the NHL one is safe for a really long time. I dunno European ones but as for the Alan Shearer's Premier League all-time goals record, the EPL has been in existence only for the last 15 years so it hasn't caught upon the rest of the populace as unlike on the MLB and NHL examples (I think the all-time English top flight goals record is not that widely known anyway). I remembered one case when one football player surpassed 1,000 goals in a career but I don't think FIFA certified it and the records are murky on that case. –Howard the Duck 14:31, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
Bolt's record was set in the Olympics, see Athletics at the 2008 Summer Olympics – Men's 100 metres. I think the problem here is distinguishing between actual records and records in statistics. I think statistical highlights don't belong to ITN because they are many and hard to maintain, as shown above. In team sports, it's the victory that matters, in other sports, it's the time/distance/other quantity. --Tone 14:40, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
Agree with Tone. In teams sports winners are the ITN story not records. Howard as for your bizarre comments regarding the premier league the following comes from the wikipaedia article on it "the Premier League is the world's most popular and most watched sporting league, followed worldwide by over half a billion people in 202 countries" --Daviessimo (talk) 15:04, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
I was referring to the top flight, all-time. Premier League and the old First Division. Does anyone know who is all-time goal scorer for its entire history? Shearer's record is strictly for the Premier League (1992-present) only, it doesn't include previous incarnations of the top flight. –Howard the Duck 15:23, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
As far as I'm aware its Jimmy Greaves, but thats beside the point. The concensus seems to be that in team sports it is team achievements that are more noteworthy (e.g. Team X wins competition Y or Team X set a new record for wins in Competition Y) as long as the competition is internationally noteworthy. In certain instances there are cases where an individuals records can be noteworthy, however my opinion would be that they would have to relate to an international competition (e.g. Player A sets record for appearance/goals in World Cup). This particular item fails on that criteria because no matter how you like to play it the NHL is a domestic league and is on a par with the Premier League (those who suggest that just because Canada is included makes it international are clutching at straws - a good comparison would be the Australian A-League in which teams from New Zealand are eligible - that does not make that an international competition). --Daviessimo (talk) 15:48, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
These events happen very, very rarely anyway, and there are only a very few valid choices for individual achievements in a team. In the NFL it seems that there are records broken in every game no one cares anymore. It only becomes notable if someone approaches the record close enough. I also remember another ITN blurb for a cricket player for appearing in the most test matches, that was notable.
The Jimmy Greaves article doesn't mention this very important achievement so it's probably not him. Which proves my point no one really cares about this since no one knows who owns the record.
(You may want to see the IIHF link above on how they classify things.) –Howard the Duck 16:11, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
I think it would be wiser to come up with a strategy to what should be included and what not. If a record that gets broken every now and then, then i dont think it should go up. But something that took many years to achieve may be wroth adding. In terms of what league, i think it has to do with what sport it is. For hockey NHL is widely recognized, just like someone mentioned skiing earlier which people may not care too much about over at the west. I think in some way all leagues are domestic but it really depends on the sport and how they are recognized around the world. Disputes like this will happen everytime otherwise. people can always say well u did not post Martin Brodeur then why this guy or why that. If we have a more clear definition on what to post maybe that will help Ashishg55 (talk) 18:12, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
If there was an NHL record worth adding at ITN, it's the career scoring record by Gretzky, not this one. –Howard the Duck 01:58, 21 March 2009 (UTC)

"Joseph Fritzl has pleaded guilty on all charges."[13] A guilty plea was enough for the Madoff ITN, but according to the BBC the sentencing will take place tomorrow, so I can wait if people think we should. Rambo's Revenge (How am I doing?) 14:20, 18 March 2009 (UTC)

I'm not big on posting smaller-level stories like this; if this was an important politician being sentenced for war crimes, I'd think its noteworthy. However, the media frenzy about the Fritzl case has made it seem way more important than it acutally is, so I'm going to have to oppose. SpencerT♦Nominate! 15:10, 18 March 2009 (UTC)
(ec) Strong no. Madoff case affected lots of people while this case only affected his family and was made huge by the media. We didn't have it on ITN when it was discovered so I oppose putting it up now. --Tone 15:11, 18 March 2009 (UTC)
Wasn't the Madoff incident a record? I'm sure this would be more significant if it was some sort of record but it doesn't appear to be. --Candlewicke ST # :) 20:24, 18 March 2009 (UTC)


Here. Any thoughts? --Candlewicke ST # :) 20:59, 18 March 2009 (UTC)

There are two stories. The prison one is too unclear what actually happened and I don't think it's ITN material. The other one with chlorine is quite small in comparison with standard ITN posts. --Tone 21:34, 18 March 2009 (UTC)


What about this? --Candlewicke ST # :) 21:57, 18 March 2009 (UTC)

To me its not the case itself that is noteworthy, but rather the linked story [14] that could be. Hundreds, if not thousands of cases could be re-opened and subsequent convictions quashed. --Daviessimo (talk) 22:19, 18 March 2009 (UTC)
Too much news story for me. --Tone 22:29, 18 March 2009 (UTC)

Federal Reserve

Ok, what about this. We've had plenty of $ billion stories so why not a $ trillion dollar one? --Daviessimo (talk) 22:40, 18 March 2009 (UTC)

We put up a similar story with the BoE. Is there an updated article? SpencerT♦Nominate! 00:27, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

March 17

ITN candidates for March 17

Madagascar should be mentioned probably with a link to 2009_Malagasy_protests#Mutiny_and_military_leadership_change.Geni 17:31, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

It has been discussed under yesterday's date. There appear to be updates required which may be delaying it. --Candlewicke ST # :) 18:15, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
The Malagasy Army has forced out Ravalomanana and put up Andry Rajoelina in his place. Rajoelina's power grab is finally a success. Source: BBC. Someone word that NPOV and make an article for the coup. ----Kitch (Talk : Contrib) 20:14, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
What is taking this one so long to go up? --Candlewicke ST # :) 01:52, 18 March 2009 (UTC)
Bit of waiting for the situation to clarify, bit of waiting for editors to adequately update the article, probably some other reasons. Anyway, posted. - BanyanTree 03:03, 18 March 2009 (UTC)
see 2009_Malagasy_protests#16_March_capture_of_palace.2C_Ravalomanana.27s_resignation.Geni 22:59, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
Arctic sea monster fossil
Might just be what ITN needs in terms of non-space related scientific discoveries. Any thoughts? Or anyone willing to work on it? --Candlewicke ST # :) 19:39, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
I'll start an article - you'll have to look it over though :P  GARDEN  19:59, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
Got one at Predator X.  GARDEN  20:15, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
I like this kind of stories but the article is very short in this case and full of speculations. Besides, the fossil was discovered half a year ago and doesn't have a scientific name yet. So I am more inclined to no here. --Tone 20:29, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
It's only a start for now, I've not had time to improve it as of yet.  GARDEN  20:37, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
Sure, the article can be expanded but I am sceptic regarding the other issues I mention. But never say never ;-) --Tone 20:39, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

March 16

ITN candidates for March 16

El Savador election

That was yesterday. Pls see #ITN candidates for March 15 below. -- (talk) 21:38, 16 March 2009 (UTC)


  • Esa's Goce to fly on monday. Its about as important as Kepler. Ashishg55 (talk) 13:13, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
Article is at Gravity Field and Steady-State Ocean Circulation Explorer. SpencerT♦Nominate! 23:35, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
Support this per Tone's point below --Daviessimo (talk) 14:53, 16 March 2009 (UTC)
well it got delayed at 7 seconds to go. another attempt on 17th. Ashishg55 (talk) 19:55, 16 March 2009 (UTC)
Posted. Two launches in one ITN box, nice. Let's go to Mars ;-) --Tone 16:41, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
What, before those two come down? :-) --Candlewicke ST # :) 01:55, 18 March 2009 (UTC)


  • If you don't mind, I'll put on STS-119 in an hour or so. Spaceflights are standard ITN material. --Tone 08:33, 16 March 2009 (UTC)


  • Further to the discussion below it now looks like there is an attempted coup ongoing in Madagascar now [15]. Should we wait for conformation of a change of power or is this notable as it is --Daviessimo (talk) 18:12, 16 March 2009 (UTC)
  • Posting. The wording isn't the best, I'll post as: Soldiers seize Antananarivo, the capital of Madagascar, and storm a palace of President Marc Ravalomanana. The president has more than one residence. SpencerT♦Nominate! 01:00, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
    • Wait, not posting quite yet. The section could have a few more refs and use a little more expansion before this is posted. SpencerT♦Nominate! 01:02, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
      • Sorry for the wording, I was trying to spread the links out... --Candlewicke ST # :) 03:56, 17 March 2009 (UTC)


  • Nominating the Pakistan situation. This could open the way for an islamist overthrow of the Zardari regime. Nuclear arms in the hands of jihadists, etc. etc. The world trembles at this development. __meco (talk) 18:29, 16 March 2009 (UTC)
Comment to both: It depends. If you come up with a good wording while the article is updated, I'm fine with it. In any case, the text should focus on something big -> change of power, really big protests etc. --Tone 20:16, 16 March 2009 (UTC)
Howzabout: "Before planned demonstrations by Pakistan's Lawyers' Movement, the prime minister announces the restoration of Chief Justice Iftikhar Muhammad Chaudhry, who had been removed from office in the 2007 state of emergency."
I'm not much impressed Sharif's claim to be in charge of this, since Pakistani lawyers were ruining their profession's bad name by taking to the streets to protest Chaudhry's removal due to his refusal to rubberstamp former president Musharraf's attempt to stay in power well before the political opposition realized that they could get mileage by jumping on board. Classic example of "There go my people, I must find out where they are going so I can lead them." Fortunately our articles tend to emphasize the popular nature of the protests rather than Sharif's claim to be in charge of it. - BanyanTree 23:55, 16 March 2009 (UTC)
What we need is a text which elaborates on the realpolitik of the situation. Zardari has warded off a popular protest that could threaten to grow out of control. The irony being that unleashing Chaudry may itself turn out to be just as dangerous if Chaudry should pick up the thread where he left off when he was ousted and go after the leadership using legal means. This too could cause the volatile political situation in Pakistan to ignite. It appears to be classic Catch-22 with nuclear buttons on both sides of the Indian-Pakistan border in the stakes. This is being commented on all over, but we have so far not presented the actual core of the dilemma. Nawaz is basically a parenthesis here and I agree wholeheartedly with BanyanTree's estimation of his role in this. __meco (talk) 08:41, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

March 15

ITN candidates for March 15

Support, I'll see if I can expand a little more. SpencerT♦Nominate! 20:44, 16 March 2009 (UTC)
I would like to have this on ITN but the election article needs expansion. I can't do it myself now, anyone has time? --Tone 22:50, 16 March 2009 (UTC)]
I added a results section, and I feel this is ready to go up. I'd prefer one more opinion before I post. SpencerT♦Nominate! 01:26, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
Posted. - BanyanTree 02:16, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
  • Comment: Could I have some comments on the meningitis epidemic (March 11), please? Thanks, SpencerT♦Nominate! 00:54, 16 March 2009 (UTC)
I'd support if there was an article --Daviessimo (talk) 14:54, 16 March 2009 (UTC)
Well, actually there is an article and I've put it on MP already. --BorgQueen (talk) 15:31, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

March 14

ITN candidates for March 14

Is there an article on the situation in Madagascar? The BBC has reported that some elements of the army are refusing to follow orders, some are openly supporting the opposition and that the President has employed mercenaries to try to control the situation.- Dumelow (talk) 14:30, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

More: The series of protests since January has resulted in 100 deaths so far. The prime minister's offices have been taken over by the opposition and the army's chief of staff has been ousted by the military and the military police as a unit have stated that they will no longer follow the President's orders. I am tempted to create an article if one does not exist, any title suggestions? - Dumelow (talk) 14:35, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
We already have an article at 2009 Malagasy protests. It's been put up twice after major developements, and if/when someone resigns that should probably go up. SpencerT♦Nominate! 16:35, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
Agreed. It hasn't been lacking in ITN coverage. But resignations (or assassinations) are usually posted. --Candlewicke ST # :) 17:45, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
Apologies, must have missed that completely - Dumelow (talk) 18:44, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
No problem. If there's a new development in the issue, however, feel free to update the article. SpencerT♦Nominate! 19:56, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

March 13

ITN candidates for March 13

  • What about the fire at Bashundhara City in Bangledesh? It's killed seven and injured over 50. There's also an updated article --Daviessimo (talk) 19:55, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
Support. The article is in good shape, and there's a good picture, File:BlazeAtBashundhuraCityTower.jpg, as well. Do you have a suggested wording? SpencerT♦Nominate! 19:59, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
(ec) I think I'm going to straight out support this (also we can then have an image that isn't just the coast of Australia) Rambo's Revenge (talk) 20:03, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
A fire at Bashundhara City in Dhaka, Bangledesh kills seven people and injures fifty --Daviessimo (talk) 20:05, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
Posting. Does someone want to upload the image? SpencerT♦Nominate! 20:32, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
Looking at the image closer, I have a feeling it may be a copyvio...can check this out? SpencerT♦Nominate! 20:42, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
More specifically, the image says the source is "Share by the Author" and the author is "Edward Apurba Singha" (hinting that the author is not the uploader, and yet the license is {{self|cc-by-3.0}}. SpencerT♦Nominate! 20:49, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
How about this? --Candlewicke ST # :) 20:53, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
I found another that didn't need uploading, and used it. SpencerT♦Nominate! 21:20, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
We had the discussion about Guantanamo at ITN before, I think we agreed to put it on when it actually closes. --Tone 15:43, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
Does this have international or historical significance? The term didn't stand out for me before now... --Candlewicke ST # :) 18:14, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

For this one, I'd prefer to wait until more than one person is confirmed dead. SpencerT♦Nominate! 20:35, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
Cruel but probably correct. Cannot recall Canada's last ITN... --Candlewicke ST # :) 21:58, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
Now confirmed. Wording: Cougar Helicopters Flight 91, a Sikorsky S-92A helicopter, makes an makes an emergency water landing in the Atlantic Ocean near Newfoundland, Canada, killing 17 people. SpencerT♦Nominate! 23:29, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
In addition, we need a new image for ITN. SpencerT♦Nominate! 23:32, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
Not any more. --Candlewicke ST # :) 04:55, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
By the way that would be yes from me if it needs approval. Good to see all these neglected neighbours of the U.S. get some recognition... :) --Candlewicke ST # :) 04:57, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
Suggested shortened alternative (someone would probably do it anyway sooner or later) – 17 people are killed when Cougar Helicopters Flight 91 ditches in the Atlantic Ocean near Newfoundland, Canada. --Candlewicke ST # :) 05:03, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
Posted. - BanyanTree 05:46, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

I think this is the best of today's suggestions. Can you propose a wording? --Tone 12:18, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
Things moving really slowly today – where is everyone? Since we're now in the red – An oil spill in Australia's Coral Sea is reported as Queensland's worst environmental disaster and the worst oil spill in the country's history. --Candlewicke ST # :) 19:19, 13 March 2009 (UTC)
Posted. --BorgQueen (talk) 19:32, 13 March 2009 (UTC)

Did anything major occur at the congress? SpencerT♦Nominate! 20:38, 13 March 2009 (UTC)


How about "At the close of the 2009 National People's Congress, Premier Wen Jiabao of China expresses concern about United States Treasury Department securities."? - BanyanTree 05:36, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
The wording sounds good, and I support. I'm going to leave this discussion going a little longer for other opinions. SpencerT♦Nominate! 16:38, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
Posting. SpencerT♦Nominate! 21:14, 15 March 2009 (UTC)
I can't say I find this particularly notable. SpencerT♦Nominate! 16:38, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
I really didn't know what to say to this yesterday. It doesn't seem controversial in any way. --Candlewicke ST # :) 18:02, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

March 12

ITN candidates for March 12

  • Muntadhar al-Zaidi
This is my first time nominating one of these, so let me know if I did anything wrong. --Hunter Kahn (talk) 13:30, 12 March 2009 (UTC)
Well you haven't done anything wrong at all by nominating something. Every contribution is valued. --Candlewicke ST # :) 14:46, 12 March 2009 (UTC)
Any comments in support or opposition on this one? - BanyanTree 05:38, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
  • Bernard Madoff - Plead guilty this afternoon (UTC). I feel given the gravity of the crime he's supposed to have committed it's worth being on the main page. BigHairRef | Talk 16:35, 12 March 2009 (UTC)
This is only his plea though. The verdict and sentencing is going to be far more important --Daviessimo (talk) 16:42, 12 March 2009 (UTC)
That's a fair view, but the verdict's been given for most of them as he pleaded. The only thing he hasn't is to conspiracy which could be included. Given that he's been convicted I would say that fact is the story, the sentencing is only a minor point in terms of the news as the conviction menas he'd admitted the fraud took place and there's no longer any libel issues. BigHairRef | Talk 16:47, 12 March 2009 (UTC)
To put it another way if I was to go to a US or international news website and this wasn't the top story I'd be somewhat surprised at least. BigHairRef | Talk 16:49, 12 March 2009 (UTC)
Suppose. Plus I've just looked at BBC website and he isn't going to be sentenced till June for some reason. In that case best to see what others think to it going up now --Daviessimo (talk) 16:54, 12 March 2009 (UTC)
I am leaning toward support. --BorgQueen (talk) 17:00, 12 March 2009 (UTC)
When I first saw this a couple of hours ago I didn't nominate it because it was only a plea. I stand by that view and think it should only go up when he is convicted. We shouldn't break this precident, despite the length of time until conviction, as someone will probably (correctly) nominate effectively the same story then and it shouldn't go up twice. Rambo's Revenge (talk) 17:11, 12 March 2009 (UTC)
That's the thing, if you've pleaded then you have been convicted. If what you're saying is we should wait until he's sentenced then I can't really argue with you. ON the other hand detention of suspects remanding someone in prison prior to sentence is fairly common practise when they've pleaded guilty to a crime until they're sentenced (usually assuming the judge is going to impos a custodial one). BigHairRef | Talk 17:14, 12 March 2009 (UTC)
Sorry should clarify I mean pleaded in the plea bargain sense, i.e. pleaded guilty. BigHairRef | Talk

Papal admission

Anyone think the Pope's admission is significant? He usually doesn't admit any wrongdoing whatsoever (I think it's called Papal infallibility) and it's not every day the Catholic Church admits it made a mistake. Here we have such language as "unusual public acknowledgment of Vatican mistakes", "one of the most serious crises of his papacy" and "the Vatican took the rare step of releasing the German-born pope's personal account of the incident addressed to Catholic bishops around the world" plus the suggestion that the last time such an event occurred was 1950 (which, according to Wikipedia, is Pope Pius XII, a whole five Popes ago). --Candlewicke ST # :) 19:39, 12 March 2009 (UTC)

This is not a serious re-assessment of the doctrine of infallibility: that is very much restricted to essential matters of relief and morals, and not to application of canonical discipline in individual cases. Nor does the suggestion that it is the most serious crisis of his papacy carry great import: it has not really been that tumultuous a 4 years in Church history. Williamson has not been "re-instated" to any meaningful role: he has no episcopal authority in the Catholic Church, and never has had, and he is suspended from acting in anyway on behalf of the Church: he is no longer excommunicated, which means that if he wanted to attend an everyday parish (which he would probably not want to do, as he has no interest in the 1970 rite of celebration of Mass) he could present himself for communion. Kevin McE (talk) 20:26, 12 March 2009 (UTC)
I see. --Candlewicke ST # :) 20:29, 12 March 2009 (UTC)

March 11

ITN candidates for March 11

  • How about the Meningitis epidemic in West Africa, killing 931? Is there an article anywhere about this? SpencerT♦Nominate! 16:39, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
Seemingly not... :-( I'd support if created or located. --Candlewicke ST # :) 00:33, 15 March 2009 (UTC)
I've created an article at 2009 West African meningitis outbreak, and the updating is done? Any other comments? SpencerT♦Nominate! 21:12, 15 March 2009 (UTC)
Wording: An outbreak of meningitis in several West African nations kills at least 930 people and infects 13,500. SpencerT♦Nominate! 01:27, 16 March 2009 (UTC)
Posted. --BorgQueen (talk) 10:33, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

  • Winnenden Update
A new source is now stating that the number killed in Germany is now at least 16 BBC
Although they've changed their mind again. BigHairRef | Talk 17:06, 11 March 2009 (UTC)
That's why we don't update for each number. 16 is still at least 15. No need to hurry as long as the blurb is accurate. --Tone 17:26, 11 March 2009 (UTC)
Support. What are the chances are two major shooting incidents occuring within 24hrs!! --Daviessimo (talk) 12:25, 11 March 2009 (UTC)
You almost sound happy. :-D Posted. --BorgQueen (talk) 12:47, 11 March 2009 (UTC)
Well it's just typical that we can go days without any ITN-worthy items and then we have two very similar incidents on top of one another --Daviessimo (talk) 13:32, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

  • Alabama Shootings It's already been mentioned for yesterday, as the source was new (i.e. today (11th)) I was uncertain as to whether to include this in yesterday or today, but I think in either event it should be on the main page in the news, with either blurb or any other. BigHairRef | Talk 06:18, 11 March 2009 (UTC)
I think this is good to go --Daviessimo (talk) 08:19, 11 March 2009 (UTC)
even if this particular item isn't deemed notable enough (and I can't see why it wouldn't be) would it be possible for an admin to make any change ASAP, for something as important as the ITN section on the main page to be out of date by almost two days twice in one week isn't something that should be happening. Especially when there's dedicated turnaround for the main page Featured article, on this day, featured picture etc etc. BigHairRef | Talk 08:33, 11 March 2009 (UTC)
This isn't meant to be a bitch and moan at the people who do actually do this by the way, I'm sure you'll agree it dosen't look good that we can have DYK update once every 24 hours on (for example) something like the Pixiv but we're more than a day out of date on the latest news which we choose to feature as well. I would do something rather than whine at people but the template is admin protected with good reason. BigHairRef | Talk 08:39, 11 March 2009 (UTC)
Problem is there are only a 3 or 4 of patrolling admins on ITN (notably User:Spencer, User:BorgQueen and User:Tone). They do a very good job but can't be around all the time. One should be on soon I would expect. --Daviessimo (talk) 08:46, 11 March 2009 (UTC)
Posted. --BorgQueen (talk) 09:11, 11 March 2009 (UTC)
Actually for a period recently it was largely myself and BorgQueen who seemed to be hovering around ITN and during February there were 52 ITNs in 28 days... so numbers really aren't the issue (it is perfectly possible for two to maintain ITN – although with some difficulty – during months of severe drought) it is the lack of anyone regularly working on the articles in the background. Numerous crashes and sinkings are slipping by unnoticed without nominations/updates from m/any users... and science/history has virtually vanished off ITN (and even Portal:Current events) this month... also – perhaps it was unintended or phrased wrongly – but Wikipedia isn't meant to be a news service which provides up-to-the-minute coverage of a story. Unless a quick reaction is possible, i.e. in the event of a President being assassinated, it may take some hours to confirm that deaths have actually occurred or that the event is significant. There is also the recently added "future events" section which anticipates stories ahead of time, stories such as spaceflights which generally go on ITN; this ought to give some advance notice that an update will be required on a certain day. Now I really shouldn't be here... I'm almost threatening to return... :) --Candlewicke ST # :) 00:33, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

  • France rejoining NATO's military command should be added. --bender235 (talk) 19:48, 11 March 2009 (UTC)
I agree, when they actually do it and not only intend. --Tone 20:38, 11 March 2009 (UTC)
Plus there would need to be an update at Nato#NATO Military Committee or is there an update in another article?--Daviessimo (talk) 07:52, 12 March 2009 (UTC)

March 10

ITN candidates for March 10

  • I think we should remove the North Korean "election". It's not as if anybody was expecting any surprises in it. Its claims that attempts to shoot down its "satellite launch" attempt would be regarded as an act of war is far more newsworthy. --Kitch (Talk : Contrib) 14:13, 10 March 2009 (UTC)
I don't have a strong opinion on the inclusion/exclusion of the election item but you should know that ITN is not a news service so claims do not qualify here. On the other hand, election actually happened. --Tone 14:39, 10 March 2009 (UTC)
I think it should stay - at least I find it interesting. There is precedence for having news items ITN, even if they were expected; for example the inauguration of Obama or a solar eclipse. Thue | talk 23:28, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

Global Recession

  • What about this [17]. I know over recent months we've had overkill of this type of stuff, but as far as I'm aware this is the first time a global recession (with negative global growth) has been talked of. A section could be added to Financial crisis of 2007–2010. Any thoughts? --Daviessimo (talk) 16:08, 10 March 2009 (UTC)
Lots of depressing news from all over the world but I think this is the first official one regarding the world as a whole. I think we can put it on in some form. --Tone 19:52, 10 March 2009 (UTC)
I read that link through all the depression and got some words like "expects", "will be", "prediction" and "likely". In fact the headline includes the word "predicts". Just thought I'd point that out since ITN usually isn't a fortune teller, no? It would usually wait for the outcome/verdict/occurrence rather than report on possibilities? In fact this appears not to even be the "official forecast" (whatever exactly that may be) if I'm reading correctly. It can't just be posted that the world is in decline based upon this source, can it? It just doesn't seem as ITNish as all those recent crashes and sinkings. But then I shall leave that for others to decide... --Candlewicke ST # :) 22:04, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

2009 Alabama shooting

March 9

ITN candidates for March 9

Stem cell research policy

Spirit of Mystery

Spirit of Mystery arrives in Melbourne after a five month journey from the United Kingdom. See above for details. Mjroots (talk) 13:37, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

Spirit of Mystery is due to arrive in Williamstown, Melbourne on 11 March. The boat is recreating the 1854-55 voyage of the lugger Mystery. It would be nice if the achievement could be recognised with a feature on ITN. Mjroots (talk) 20:02, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

I am unsure of the notability on this one, because I wouldn't call the original ship's voyage overly notable. For example, if this was the first recreation of Magellan's voyage, that would be different. (Btw, when I say notability, I mean as an ITN item, not an article). Personally, I think Spirit of Mystery is more suited as a DYK candidate. SpencerT♦Nominate! 20:22, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
Both articles have already been DYK'd. Does this exclude them from ITN? Mjroots (talk) 21:46, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
It does not exclude them by default but I think this is more DYK than ITN material. --Tone 21:52, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
Items are only excluded from ITN based on 2 main things: ITN notability, and lack of update to the article. SpencerT♦Nominate! 21:55, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
I'll keep the article updated, as I have been recently with Mark Maidment's broken leg. Guess notability (ITN-wise) will have to be left to the ITN regulars. Mjroots (talk) 11:39, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

NOTE Spirit of Mystery arrived at Melbourne on 9 March. Mjroots (talk) 13:35, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

Still, not my type of ITN item. I think a DYK was enough. --Tone 07:46, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

Lots of ITN material

Sri Lanka, Uganda and Egypt look ITNy... maybe even Tibet... and a record Japanese slump... what a potential embarrassment of riches for Africa and Asia today... or has it been like this all week? --Candlewicke ST # :) 21:58, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

Sri Lanka is a claim, the other two don't even have articles. Of those, I would prefer Uganda item since it is a bit clearer. --Tone 07:46, 10 March 2009 (UTC)
The key word for that item, however, is "claim." Do we have a reliable third party source confirming this (not a third party sources saying that the Sri Lankan army says that 180 such have been killed)? SpencerT♦Nominate! 20:28, 10 March 2009 (UTC)
Are the Chinese government to be trusted more than Sri Lanka's? They recently claimed to be undergoing a HIV/Aids epidemic and that was posted. But I do see the point and I sense a connection with the IMF candidate above which is no more than a news report disguised as a lot of predictions and claims as well. --Candlewicke ST # :) 22:10, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

March 8

ITN candidates for March 8

Northern Ireland Shooting

Iraq police recruitment centre bombing

...surely the suicide bombing in Baghdad, which killed far more people is worthy of a mention and an article. Seems a shame. Jolly Ω Janner 20:28, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

Feel free to create one. I'd be happy to post. SpencerT♦Nominate! 20:41, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
Article located at Baghdad police recruitment centre bombing for the moment. Currently proposed for deletion though :\ can't see any logic in that in comparison with other articles. Oh well, I'll try to expand it. Jolly Ω Janner 21:04, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
Support, adequately updated and it seems that Iraq war items are proportionally underrepresented on ITN. - BanyanTree 05:11, 9 March 2009 (UTC)
Posted. --BorgQueen (talk) 08:24, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

March 7

ITN candidates for March 7

I think I've suitably updated the article now; do we want to post tomorrow when official results come out, or is the fact that one candidate ran in every constituency good enough to post now? SpencerT♦Nominate! 18:30, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
I'd say probably yes. As for notability even though candidates are un-opposed we put up other countries elections so why not North Korea?--Daviessimo (talk) 18:33, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
Yes for which option, post now or later? SpencerT♦Nominate! 18:34, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
Yes for now.--Daviessimo (talk) 18:36, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
Okay. Wording: In North Korea, members of the Democratic Front for the Reunification of the Fatherland party are elected to all 687 seats in the Supreme People’s Assembly.
Is this good? Can is be reduced any? SpencerT♦Nominate! 18:44, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
Posting as such. SpencerT♦Nominate! 19:06, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
Also this spacey thing on Saturday 7 March. --Candlewicke ST # :) 11:46, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
We need some system to discuss future events that are certain to happen. Is it acceptable to have it above the current days, as in this case? I think it is ok but we should limit ourselves to events that will happen within next week (otherwise items could stay here for a looong time). And when the day comes, the discussion is simply moved in the corresponding paragraph. Everyone fine with that proposal? --Tone 11:52, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
Yes. I mentioned that only because a research scientist on the mission is being interviewed on Irish national radio about it at this very second. It is not certain to happen, but if it explodes again or gets cancelled, I guess that would be notable too. --Candlewicke ST # :) 11:59, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
Posting. --Tone 11:13, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
Could you please replace "planets" with "extrasolar planets"? --bender235 (talk) 14:42, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
Palestinian PM

"Salam Fayyad, has resigned as Prime Minister of the Palestinian National Authority." -Rambo's Revenge (talk) 11:33, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

If I understand this correctly, the resignation will take effect when the new government is formed. Maybe we should post it then. --Tone 12:26, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
In addition, the article needs a bit longer update. SpencerT♦C 16:47, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

Morocco severs diplomatic ties with Iran

March 6

ITN candidates for March 6

Maybe. But the article would need a really good update. --Tone 14:19, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
(ec) I have updated the key info, and the developments of this year. Rambo's Revenge (talk) 14:20, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
That was quick, thanks. Any supports? --BorgQueen (talk) 14:50, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
I added a tad more to the article; I think it's in good shape. Support, is there a suggested wording? SpencerT♦C 16:55, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
Difficult one to word. How about somethin like "Members of the Israeli embassy in Mauritania are expelled from the country." Rambo's Revenge (talk) 20:11, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
Not to be pedantic but don't they normally expel diplomats rather than evict them :)--Daviessimo (talk) 20:17, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
Yes, thanks I have changed the above. It also makes it sound less like a rubbish reality TV show. Rambo's Revenge (talk) 20:20, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
I'm going to post, and if it's not good enough, someone at WP:ERRORS will be sure to have a better wording. SpencerT♦Nominate! 20:26, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
Adding the reason would make sense. --Tone 20:36, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
As with other similar items, I wasn't sure if we were going to leave it out in favor of people clicking on the article. SpencerT♦Nominate! 21:05, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

I don't think that this is noteworthy. When Venezuela expelled the Israeli ambassador or when Serbia expelled the Malaysian ambassador we didn't put it on the main page.--Avala (talk) 19:03, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

We didn't because no one nominated it. --BorgQueen (talk) 08:56, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

March 5

ITN candidates for March 5

  • If something notable occurs at the 2009 National People's Congress, China's annual legislative session, which will most likely happen. Wen Jiabao is delivering the government work report right now, analogous to State of Union address in the United States. (Currently top story on CNN as well). There's been a rise in the military budget, a stimulus package planned, and a new landmark law for officials to declare their assets. BBC Colipon+(T) 02:32, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

Quantitive Easing

  • I think the BoE's decision to begin printing money to kick start the British Economy is quite noteworthy. The last westernised country to do it was Japan I think back in the early 2000s --Daviessimo (talk) 19:11, 5 March 2009 (UTC)
It seems like a good item. Is there an article, or does one need to be created. SpencerT♦C 02:06, 6 March 2009 (UTC)
Don't think it needs its own article but I wasn't sure where to start a section. There's Bank of England, Economy of the United Kingdom, Economic history of the United Kingdom or more international articles such as 2008–2009 Keynesian resurgence or Global financial crisis of 2008–2009 --Daviessimo (talk) 08:03, 6 March 2009 (UTC)
I've added a section to Economic history of the United Kingdom as it seemed a fairly decent place to do it. --Daviessimo (talk) 09:07, 6 March 2009 (UTC)
The section looks good. Do you have a suggested wording? SpencerT♦C 21:46, 6 March 2009 (UTC)
Something along the lines of "The Bank of England announces plans to create £75 billion through quantitative easing, in an attempt to boost the British economy" --Daviessimo (talk) 22:04, 6 March 2009 (UTC)
Posting. SpencerT♦C 16:55, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

March 4

ITN candidates for March 4

Just about to come here for that very story. I support. --Daviessimo (talk) 13:57, 4 March 2009 (UTC)
Posting soon. --BorgQueen (talk) 14:24, 4 March 2009 (UTC)
Possible images:  ,  . Pruneautalk 14:31, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

  • The Pirate Bay trial is scheduled to finish on this date and we will have a verdict. --BorgQueen (talk) 17:10, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
    • According to the article, the verdict will be announced on 17 April... --BorgQueen (talk) 10:35, 4 March 2009 (UTC)
  • Does anyone think the Ciudad Juárez prison riots are notable? SpencerT♦C 11:38, 5 March 2009 (UTC)
    • I do, and ITN does suffer Mexico deficiency. --BorgQueen (talk) 11:55, 5 March 2009 (UTC)
I think when twenty people are killed it any 'uncommon' way it is notable. Is there an article? --Daviessimo (talk) 16:40, 5 March 2009 (UTC)
Creating at 2009 Mexico prison riot. SpencerT♦C 00:26, 6 March 2009 (UTC)
I'm done: Posting as: At least 20 people are killed after a riot at a prison in Ciudad Juárez, Chihuahua, Mexico. If someone wants to give me my little recognition, it's much appreciated. SpencerT♦C 01:44, 6 March 2009 (UTC)

March 3

ITN candidates for March 3

Okay, a good item, but the article needs some prose. SpencerT♦C 23:33, 1 March 2009 (UTC)
Is this an international conference? Its hard to tell from the article --Daviessimo (talk) 14:30, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
I think this is the annual opening of their legislature if I'm not mistaken. –Howard the Duck 01:11, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
I edited the article somewhat. Hope that clears things up a bit. It is the legislature, and the Premier makes a huge speech outlining policy, and then holds a press conference for media. Colipon+(T) 03:00, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
So its a national conference? In that case surely it should only go up if something significant is decided (rather than for the event itself, which is not noteworthy outside China). My opinion would be to wait until it has finished and the outcomes are known. --Daviessimo (talk) 07:19, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
Think of it as Barack Obama's State of the Union Address. –Howard the Duck 08:44, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
  • I am missing the discussion about the shootings in Pakistan but this would probably have a quick consensus to post anyway. --Tone 08:41, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
I've added a picture of the Gadaffi stadium, following a quick chat at WT:CRIC. It would be hard to post a photo of a specific player without NPOV issues, so the location seemed a good idea. --Dweller (talk) 11:54, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
  • i really think headline should mention the 6 cops that died. the injured are mentioned but even though they were the target ppl did die trying to save them. Ashishg55 (talk) 03:35, 4 March 2009 (UTC)
nevermind (talk) 05:44, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

Space Rock

Far too short. And probably not notable enough. We have a better space item scheduled at the end of the week. --Tone 17:14, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
I agree with Tone. The size of the asteroid makes it much less notable. SpencerT♦C 21:12, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

Raimundo Pereira

The article is still a bit stubby, but could be added in an amended wording of hte current item. SpencerT♦C 02:30, 4 March 2009 (UTC)
What about Raimundo Pereira is sworn in as the President of Guinea-Bissau, following the assassination of João Bernardo Vieira. Or reverse order. --Tone 15:38, 4 March 2009 (UTC)
Anyone here? New head of state is usually posted, someone just check the wording first. --Tone 22:09, 4 March 2009 (UTC)
I like the given wording, but the article needs to be longer. SpencerT♦C 22:57, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

March 2

ITN candidates for March 2

  • We have an ongoing crisis with a President dead... and nobody to update?
The President of Guinea-Bissau, João Bernardo Vieira (pictured), is shot dead (by renegade soldiers – remove that term if it's plagiarised) as gunfire resounds around the capital Bissau. --Candlewicke ST # :) 10:12, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
Here is his picture... scrap the BoI one I left below... --Candlewicke ST # :) 10:13, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
Oddly, this is actually a more useful reference than the current BBC one... I imagine they are working on it... --Candlewicke ST # :) 10:20, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
Note: BBC updated now... --Candlewicke ST # :) 10:36, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
Perhaps this entire incident needs an article which I am not going to involve myself in... suggest, perhaps, 2009 Guinea-Bissau coup d'etat? Piped and bolded at "gunfire"? --Candlewicke ST # :) 10:30, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
Why does the BBC article say "killed"? Maybe we should wait a couple of hours before posting this so that the things become clearer. Also, with more sources, it will be easier to decide if the article Coup d'etat is to be created. But then, this item has my support. --Tone 10:44, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
They're quoting AFP (and doing what all good people should do – inserting quotations for directly copied words...) But military and government officials say he is dead... so what else can we go on? --Candlewicke ST # :) 10:51, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
Here. NYT Guardian Reuters SMH Boston Globe + BBC & RTÉ above... --Candlewicke ST # :) 10:55, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
The Irish Times seems to indicate a coup is unclear – however it is a bit slow on updating... --Candlewicke ST # :) 10:58, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
  • Updated ITN, without the indication that it was a coup or that it was done by Army soldiers, as the sources are skittish about saying that outright. Titoxd(?!? - cool stuff) 11:01, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
  • OK, RTÉ says "attempted coup" under its image though... but it is definitely very unclear... --Candlewicke ST # :) 11:03, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
President of Guinea-Bissau redirects to List of heads of state of Guinea-Bissau... --Candlewicke ST # :) 12:00, 2 March 2009 (UTC)


Posting. --Tone 17:14, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
Dow Jones below 7,000
  • The Dow Jones Industrial Average falls under 7,000 for the first time since October 28, 1997. __meco (talk) 22:23, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
    • It's been falling for a while. Besides, it's just a number. And there are bigger crisis-related stories, like the one above (and it's apparently one of the reasons for the big drop of the index). So I prefer not to include this one. --Tone 22:31, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
      • It's an 11 year low and it's round number. The Dow is the world's most prominent stock exchange after all. __meco (talk) 23:10, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
    • (ec) Comment. I'm not sure where we would draw the line. The FTSE also appears to be at a 5 or 6 year low. Depressing as it is I don't think it merits inclusion. Also it could be main page bias as I guess lots of world indicies are down a lot right now. Rambo's Revenge (talk) 22:32, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
      • Try at 6,000. The Dow approached near 7,000 during 2002. –Howard the Duck 01:43, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
  • Also late last year the Nikkei hit a 26 year low and wasn't on ITN --Daviessimo (talk) 07:41, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
  • The Japanese market has been on the downturn ever since the previous emperor died so no surprises there, if anything the financial crisis made it fall faster, unlike other indexes that fell only after the bubble burst. –Howard the Duck 08:46, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

March 1

ITN candidates for March 1