Talk:Gorilla (song)

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: not moved. Favonian (talk) 15:40, 28 August 2013 (UTC)

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Gorilla (Bruno Mars song) → Gorilla (song) – That page redirects to Unorthodox Jukebox. 68.44.51.49 (talk) 00:00, 21 August 2013 (UTC)

• Weak support - there seems to no other song "covered by" wikipedia, eg. in an album article. But in Google Books "the gorilla song" refers to the American cabaret song If You Could See Her (The Gorilla Song) which begins "Gorilla my dreams..." In ictu oculi (talk) 01:10, 21 August 2013 (UTC)
• Comment there are four songs on the dab page that could be referred to as this, so "Gorilla (song)" should redirect to Gorilla (disambiguation) -- 76.65.128.222 (talk) 04:24, 21 August 2013 (UTC)

How did I miss that, Oppose In ictu oculi (talk) 06:12, 21 August 2013 (UTC)

• Oppose. Bruno Mars maybe the most notable or WP:RECENT Gorilla, but not for all time. And, per WP:Disambiguation, Disambiguation in Wikipedia is the process of resolving the conflicts that arise when a single term is ambiguous—when it refers to more than one topic covered by Wikipedia articles. In this case the single term is ambiguous and the guidelines clear. --Richhoncho (talk) 19:13, 21 August 2013 (UTC) Added to...--Richhoncho (talk) 18:18, 22 August 2013 (UTC)
  • Support – None of them have articles besides this song! Billboard Man (talk) 00:15, 22 August 2013 (UTC)
• Support per Billboard Man. No other article with this title. --BDD (talk) 16:12, 22 August 2013 (UTC)
• Oppose: We should really try to avoid the incessant mess that will be created by attempting to place song articles at ambiguous titles of the form "My Favorite (song)". There are four other songs identified at Gorilla (disambiguation). As discussed elsewhere, my interpretation is that if a song is identified in an article and referenced by a dablink, the topic of song is covered on Wikipedia. At least a couple of the songs on the dab page in this case seem especially noteworthy. This proposal has a WP:PDAB problem. It also has a WP:RECENTISM problem. The song "Gorilla" on the James Taylor album named Gorilla seems like particularly noteworthy alternative destination. So does the song from Cabaret known as "The Gorilla Song". Please see also the ongoing discussions at Wikipedia:Move review/Log/2013 August#On My Way (song) and Wikipedia talk:Disambiguation#"Covered by". Gorilla (song) should redirect to Gorilla (disambiguation). —BarrelProof (talk) 18:56, 22 August 2013 (UTC)
• Oppose - Invalid rationale, now that I change its target to dab page. --George Ho (talk) 06:41, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

And I've reverted per WP:BRD. Let the RM play out. --BDD (talk) 17:17, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

All right. I believe that the current title is precise enough, and there is more than one song of the same name. And why must "Gorilla (song)" be associated with the most recent singer in history? --George Ho (talk) 17:20, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

Simply because his is the only one with an article! You know, I've opposed moves like this, per PDAB no less, when there are multiple articles involved. I believe in commonsense sub-primary topics like Thriller (album) or Kiss (band). But if the choice is between several songs, there's often no clear primacy. And in this case, certainly the Bruno Mars song is too recent to call primary over one of these other songs if it comes to that.

I'm serious. Make a sourced article on one of those other songs and I'll switch to an oppose. My challenge to you, and to all the other PDAB believers, is to improve the encyclopedia by creating articles. I think we can all agree it's a better use of time than arguing for longer titles because of a few DABMENTIONs. --BDD (talk) 17:33, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

let me see if I understand what you are saying here. If I create an article for Gorilla (James Taylor song) with just one reference you will change your vote, yet you will support the renaming of this article even though nobody will change the incoming links, thereby, effectively, making the move a waste of time and effort. Also, you are prepared for us waste our time trying to explain why these moves are so pointless, inefficient. FWIW I am not arguing for longer titles, I am arguing against unnecessary moves. Gorilla (Bruno Mars song) is what it says it is, it is not misleading - there is no pressing reason to move and your arguments above have confirmed my position. You mention commonsense above, looks like we can't even agree what commonsense is! Cheers. --Richhoncho (talk) 13:34, 24 August 2013 (UTC)

Who says nobody will work on incoming links? There's either an army that works on {{incoming links}} dab pages or a very dedicated task force—either way, these are often dealt with very quickly. We could also call this Gorilla (2013 Bruno Mars song) (after all, he could record a new song with the same name in the future). That's also "what it says it is... not misleading." There's no end to the sort of information we could put into titles, but conciseness is important. Indeed, it's one of the five WP:CRITERIA. It's desirable in titles, and I'm not willing to jettison that over hypotheticals. --BDD (talk) 04:54, 26 August 2013 (UTC)

You have already jettisoned "The title is no longer than necessary to identify the article's subject and distinguish it from other subjects (my bold) because there are reasons to confuse the reader already. There is no hypothetical here. --Richhoncho (talk) 08:40, 26 August 2013 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Lyrical "Controversy"

This section doesn't really seem relevant. There is only a single person who claims to have a problem with it. There didn't seem to be any response from Bruno or any radio station. It wouldn't really be considered a "controversy" when there is only one person actually talking about it. TBWarrior720 (talk) 22:57, 8 January 2014 (UTC)

I am not fussed either way, it certainly seems like puffery from Dannielle Miller of "Enlighten Education" (not GIRLS), but it does say something about the lyrics which is always good to add. Cheers. --Richhoncho (talk) 11:26, 20 January 2016 (UTC)

I have addressed this issue as you can see in the article. MarioSoulTruthFan (talk) 22:03, 20 January 2016 (UTC)

External links modified

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New archive page with the official release of the single. The previous didn't had it. MarioSoulTruthFan (talk) 20:33, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Requested move 22 September 2017

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Move. Cúchullain ^t/c 15:13, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

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Gorilla (Bruno Mars song) → Gorilla (song) – Four years ago, this move request failed. But now, I see that there are no other songs on the dab page with this title. I would like to reopen this discussion. 2601:8C:4001:DCB9:F1DE:D1D5:AB03:D0C1 (talk) 13:08, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

• Not enthused The gorilla song still seems more notable in books. In ictu oculi (talk) 13:51, 22 September 2017 (UTC)
  • @In ictu oculi: Well, the gorilla song does not even have an article on Wikipedia. A hatnote can be added for Cabaret (musical) if needed. JE98 (talk) 16:40, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

But we don't make standalone articles about notable songs from musicals. This is a craziness we are only applying to pop songs, producing thousands of worthless articles typically giving no information about a song's lyrics or tune and purely giving catalogue type info and charts ($$$$$$$$$$ generated). The Cabaret Gorilla song is in books more notable than the Bruno Mars song. Hence, my lack of enthusiasm. Although removing "Bruno Mars" would help to make the article more difficult to find if that is the objective. In ictu oculi (talk) 17:33, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

There are already three stand-alone articles about Cabaret songs. Is there an obscure Wikipedia rule or guideline which say these should not exist (amongst the dozens or hundreds of pages where editors declare new guidelines)? Songs from musicals are songs, and should all stay. That said, if someone writes a page on Cabaret's "Gorilla" song then, if this RM passes, it can be revisited, but I share In ictu oculi's concerns. Randy Kryn (talk) 07:04, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

• Support It only needs such a detailed disambiguation if other articles exist about other songs entitled Gorilla._{ZXCVBNM (TALK)} 05:56, 24 September 2017 (UTC)
• Support agreed with the previous statement and the cabaret song is ""If You Could See Her (The Gorilla Song)", quite different from "Gorilla (song)". Sure a hatnote could be added if the article is created. MarioSoulTruthFan (talk) 12:07, 24 September 2017 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.