Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Rugby league/Archive 25

When someone comes from Australia they are Australian…

Question… When someone comes from Australia they are Australian, when someone comes from England they are English, when someone comes from Fiji they are Fijian, when someone comes from France they are French, when someone comes from New Zealand they are…? I don't believe Kiwi should be used, as it'd likely be misconstrued as having played for the Kiwis, so is it not New Zealander? DynamoDegsy (talk) 18:45, 24 February 2018 (UTC)

In terms of biographies I thought just "New Zealand" was used. As in: ____ is a New Zealand league player.. Maybe I'm missing a point? Sirpottingmix (talk) 19:43, 24 February 2018 (UTC)

You're not. We just have a lot of WP:COMPETENCE issues over here at Wikiproject Rugby league.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 19:51, 24 February 2018 (UTC)

John Smith is an England rugby league footballer, infers John Smith has played for England, John Smith is an English rugby league footballer, only infers John Smith is English... similalry, John Smith is a New Zealand rugby league footballer, infers John Smith has played for New Zealand. John Smith is an New Zealander rugby league footballer maybe grammaticly correct, but could could be considered syntactically inelegant, so perhaps John Smith is a rugby league footballer from New Zealand, or John Smith is a New Zealander and a rugby league footballer are the way to go? 😩 DynamoDegsy (talk) 09:25, 26 February 2018 (UTC)

included e.g. … during the 1970–71 season

As Nthep has identified above, when I have initiated the many hundreds of rugby league biography articles over the last decade, I have included e.g. … during the 1970–71 season to appropriate sentences within these articles. The reason behind this was two-fold. №1 When I initiated these biography articles, the season/year specific Challenge Cup articles didn't exist, so I initiated these biography articles with a red-link for the season/year specific Challenge Cup, and a piped link to the Challenge Cup section of that specific season, e.g. Tony Fisher played hooker in Leeds' 7-24 defeat by Leigh in the 1971 Challenge Cup Final during the 1970–71 season at Wembley Stadium, London on Saturday 15 May 1971, in front of a crowd of 85,514. №2 I felt that the reader may want to understand the context of that Challenge Cup with the specific season it occurred. However, If the consensus is that, e.g. … during the 1970–71 season is now superfluous, then rather than removing these on an ad-hoc basis, and specifically because of the boiler-plate nature of these biography articles, they could be removed en masse using AutoWikiBrowser. Best regards. DynamoDegsy (talk) 09:39, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

Well, this is disappointing… I was led to believe that this was a massively important issue, and yet 2-weeks later, not a single person has responded… how odd. 😩 DynamoDegsy (talk) 07:59, 28 February 2018 (UTC)

Design by committee…

• Hull F.C. or Hull FC or Hull
• 'rugby league footballer of the 1980s and 1990s' or 'rugby league footballer who played in the 1980s and 1990s'
• 1993 Challenge Cup or 1992–93 Challenge Cup
• 'in the 1993–94 Challenge Cup Final' or 'in the final of the 1993–94 Challenge Cup'
• {{nowrap|[[Wakefield Trinity Wildcats]]}} or [[Wakefield Trinity]]

etc. etc. etc. …any chance you can pick one, and stick to it? 😩 DynamoDegsy (talk) 10:10, 20 February 2018 (UTC)

Is there a more dysfunctional WikiProject than WikiProject Rugby league? I hope not. 😩 DynamoDegsy (talk) 10:11, 26 February 2018 (UTC)

Not a single 'rugby league footballer who played in...' remains, it's all 'rugby league footballer of...' we're living the dream. 😩 DynamoDegsy (talk) 08:20, 28 February 2018 (UTC)

Template:Rugbyleaguebox and ..._collapsible

My proposal for {{Template:Rugbyleaguebox}} and {{Template:Rugbyleaguebox_collapsible}} is to list the try scoring methods in a central column, rather than for each team as it currently requires. The former is one of the common interpretations prior to changes, while the latter features my suggestion.

3 May 2015	Australia	12 – 26	New Zealand	Brisbane, Australia
16:00	Tries: Will Chambers, Sam Thaiday Goals: Johnathan Thurston (2/2)	Report	Tries: Manu Vatuvei (2), Shaun Johnson, Shaun Kenny-Dowall Goals: Shaun Johnson (5/6)	Stadium: Suncorp Stadium Attendance: 32,681 Referee: Gerard Sutton Man of the Match: Manu Vatuvei

3 May 2015	Australia	12 – 26	New Zealand	Brisbane, Australia
16:00	Will Chambers, Sam Thaiday	Tries	Manu Vatuvei (2), Shaun Johnson, Shaun Kenny-Dowall	Stadium: Suncorp Stadium Attendance: 32,681 Referee: Gerard Sutton Man of the Match: Manu Vatuvei
	Johnathan Thurston (2/2)	Goals	Shaun Johnson (5/6)

Narkova (talk) 12:43, 14 February 2018 (UTC)

Seems like an improvement to me.--Gibson Flying V (talk) 02:01, 22 March 2018 (UTC)

Consensus to replace all instances of "City" with "City F.C."?

Is there consensus for edits like this? They make the prose awkward and seem like overkill. The editor has made hundreds of similar changes. – Jonesey95 (talk) 06:15, 20 January 2018 (UTC)

It looks clumsy and awkward to me. Doctorhawkes (talk) 09:01, 20 January 2018 (UTC)

If this is problematic let me know; the editor in question has been warned about their AWB use and if they persist it will be removed. Primefac (talk) 16:08, 20 January 2018 (UTC)

Is this about Hull City AFC or Hull FC?Fleets (talk) 16:42, 20 January 2018 (UTC)

It's about DynamoDegsy using AWB to change Hull to Hull F.C. in bios when really no disambiguation as to whether it is the Airlie Birds, the Robins or the Tigers being referred to. I'd add I also find the global replacement of rugby league player with rugby league footballer unnecessary too. Nthep (talk) 17:49, 20 January 2018 (UTC)

There are a couple of issues here… №1 because Kingston upon Hull is generally piped to, or typed, as Hull it becomes difficult for the reader of an article to distinguish between Hull (the city), and Hull (the rugby league team), particularity when rugby league footballers for Hull F.C. are often from Hull, and obviously play in Hull, so consequently the word Hull appears frequently in their articles. №2 rugby league is a form of football, and hence its "players" are "footballers", if they played hockey, or tiddlywinks then they are just "players" of that sport, and from a consistency point-of-view choose either; player, or (or preferbaly) footballer… pick one, and stick to it. DynamoDegsy (talk) 19:09, 20 January 2018 (UTC)

In the vast majority of usages the context of whether it is the club or the city is obvious, it only needs distinguishing if there is an issue. As to player or footballer we can have that discussion as to whether consistency is needed and if so, which term. Personally I think consistency to that degree is unnecessary and either is acceptable. Nthep (talk) 19:17, 20 January 2018 (UTC)

I can't really object to any individual use of "footballer" rather than "player", but either term is fine. I see no value in making every article the same. It just makes it all look cookie-cutter.Doctorhawkes (talk) 23:09, 20 January 2018 (UTC)

The irony here is that when I initiated these hundreds of "cookie-cutter" articles, I didn't use the un-piped Hull F.C., I actually used the piped Hull so as to avoid confusion with Hull City A.F.C.. Then a couple of years ago, someone (I cant remember who) pointed-out the difficulty distinguishing between Hull (the city), and Hull (the rugby league team) within these articles, and so on-balance, I concluded that in the context of these rugby league footballer biographies, an un-piped Hull F.C. would be preferable. DynamoDegsy (talk) 09:56, 21 January 2018 (UTC)

I think on the basic rugby league level you put Hull down and people don't know whether that's Hull FC or Hull KR, never mind anything else.Fleets (talk) 10:21, 21 January 2018 (UTC)

We should not be having Hull with no F.C. in the infobox. It can be Hull on it's own later on in the article, but it is not appropriate to shorten a short club name to an even shorter version.Fleets (talk) 19:45, 23 January 2018 (UTC)

I agree. Doctorhawkes (talk) 20:50, 23 January 2018 (UTC)

@Keith D: You may have a view on this. Best regards DynamoDegsy (talk) 18:21, 25 January 2018 (UTC)

For items relating to rugby league then there is no question that Hull should always be qualified with F.C. or KR/Kingston Rovers as it is not clear otherwise and often without a wikilink on every usage impossible to determine. It is even more confusing if the city is involved in the article as well, Hull without a qualifier would indicate the city itself. On football Hull City would be used piped to Hull City A.F.C. to avoid any confusion. Keith D (talk) 18:33, 25 January 2018 (UTC)

Nonsense, if the prose is so badly written that every usage needs linking to determine then the whole lot should be rewritten in a clearer way. With players who have played for both clubs and/or games involving both clubs or games taking place in the city there is a need for more care but that doesn't need a piped link every time a club name or place name is referred to. Nthep (talk) 20:39, 25 January 2018 (UTC)

Yep. If a paragraph starts by saying a player joined Hull KR, and two sentences later says Hull made the semis, who could possibly misconstrue the meaning? There are obviously some cases where there can be confusion and it is appropriate to spell it out, but rarely. I notice that articles for players from the Balmain Tigers or Brisbane Broncos aren't concerned about readers confusing the team with the location.Doctorhawkes (talk) 22:42, 25 January 2018 (UTC)

For Hull FC, a piped link on the first mention in the prose should be sufficient. If the club is being confused with the city, then I agree that the issue is that the prose needs to be made clearer; using an unpiped FC or RLFC every time a club is mentioned is complete overkill. Hull KR are never referred to as just "Hull", so confusing the two clubs should never be an issue. J Mo 101 (talk) 23:04, 25 January 2018 (UTC)

I agree from our point of view. But from the casual reader, if they are reading a section that is not broken down by club, they may well be confused. I'm not saying I don't agree, I'm just saying that at times we need to think about more than those who are familiar with the subject.Fleets (talk) 09:12, 27 January 2018 (UTC)

That brings me back to the prose point and the way articles are structured; overlinking is not a substitute for poor drafting of the text. Nthep (talk) 15:29, 2 February 2018 (UTC)

I notice that the Hull Daily Mail refer to Hull F.C. as Hull FC, i.e. no full-stops, and even occasionally refer to the club as just FC. Best regards DynamoDegsy (talk) 19:25, 9 February 2018 (UTC)

I'm glad we all agree that Hull F.C. doesn't need piping. 😩 DynamoDegsy (talk) 15:53, 25 March 2018 (UTC)

RfC

An RfC has been opened that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Please see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_(policy)#RfC:_Specifying_the_code_of_football_at_first_reference_in_team_articles --Trovatore (talk) 19:46, 11 April 2018 (UTC)

Moved to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_(policy)#Specifying_the_code_of_football_at_first_reference_in_team_articles. Apparently it's "not an RFC"; I haven't followed up the link to find out why it's not. --Trovatore (talk) 20:42, 11 April 2018 (UTC)

The englandrl.co.uk website is now defunct, and it has been replaced by rugby-league.com/england…

Hi WikiProject Rugby league… The englandrl.co.uk website is now defunct, and it has been replaced by rugby-league.com/england. The England, and Great Britain statistics that are referenced on over 1,000 wikipedia articles, that were previously available on www.englandrl.co.uk, are not currently available on rugby-league.com/england, and so it appears that the statistics will have to accessed via the likes of web.archive.org. Best regards DynamoDegsy (talk) 03:05, 26 April 2018 (UTC)

According to the RFL's web developer... "I’m not aware of any plans to delivery England stats on rugby-league.com. I will however mention your email to the relevant person at the RFL." Best regards. DynamoDegsy (talk) 20:24, 26 April 2018 (UTC)

The RFL have a web developer?? It's one of the most badly laid out sites I've ever had to navigate. Anyway good spot by you and good effort in getting through the relinking to archive.org. Nthep (talk) 20:36, 26 April 2018 (UTC)

Infobox fix

Richard Webster (rugby) had some mistakes in the infobox. I tried to clean it up today. If someone could take a look and verify it is now correct. MB 23:05, 10 May 2018 (UTC)

Done. Should be fine now. J Mo 101 (talk) 17:32, 11 May 2018 (UTC)

References that utilised highbeam.com…

I've been performing some reference-rot remedial work over the last few weeks… one issue I've repeatedly noticed is that references that have utilised highbeam.com no longer appear to be valid, e.g. Switching Mann puts Bears in Fox hunt returns 'The page you requested was not found.', and entering "Switching Mann puts Bears in Fox hunt" (with/without double quotation marks) returns 'Sorry, we found no matching articles for the keyword you entered.' Does anyone know whether this information ever existed, and if so, can it be recovered? Best regards DynamoDegsy (talk) 12:12, 18 May 2018 (UTC)

I wonder if the publication, in this case the Sunday Star-Times according to the reference on Ben Lythe, are no longer using Highbeam. The page in question was archived by Wayback Machine last August but that again was a "this page doesn't exist" page. Nthep (talk) 15:03, 18 May 2018 (UTC)

References that utilised findarticles.com…

Whilst performing the reference-rot remedial work… another issue I've repeatedly noticed is that references that have utilised findarticles.com no longer appear to be valid, e.g. Offiah kicks off on winning note; New Broncos star fails to score but shows glimpse of his magic, as with highbeam.com, entering the text returns no viable reference. Does anyone know if this information ever existed, and if so, can it be recovered? Best regards DynamoDegsy (talk) 18:17, 19 May 2018 (UTC)

Rugby League Position template parameters…

The template parameters; five-eighth/stand-off and stand-off/five-eighth, halfback/scrum-half and scrum-half/halfback, lock/loose forward and loose forward/lock, exist in both lower and upper-case variants, and in the spirit of global harmony, I have initiated several thousand player articles with these templates to enable the reader's understanding of both Northern and Southern Hemisphere player position naming conventions. Is this preferred or not? If not, then should these parameters be be removed from the template, and the articles modified? DynamoDegsy (talk) 11:52, 19 May 2018 (UTC)

I see these templates as analogous with WP:ENGVAR and choose to only use the version consistent with where a player spent their career. If they played extensively in both hemispheres then the use of the dual template is consistent. The dual templates are also very useful in articles about inter-hemisphere matches where teams are often listed in tables. Nthep (talk) 14:26, 19 May 2018 (UTC)

Thanks, that sounds like best practice. DynamoDegsy (talk) 18:17, 19 May 2018 (UTC)

The dual template seems at odds with other sports such as rugby union, seems unnecessary to those familiar with the game, and would very likely be confusing to the unitiated. Given that they link to the page that details the description in Australia and the Northern Hemisphere, would it not make sense to create a rationale for individual usage of the "correct' term, rather than hedging bets trying to please everyone, but end up pleasing no-one. Wholly unnecessary in my opinion, but the justified usage of the "correct" term is a better way forward.Theanonymousentry (talk) 07:35, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

Template:Infobox rugby league biography

There's an as yet undocumented change to the template relating to the number of goals a player kicked. Instead of using |goalsN= and |fieldgoalsN= if there is uncertainty as to how many of each were kicked there is now an alternative parameter called |allgoalsN= where N is the team number in the players history. Obviously it only works for the period where all kicks were worth 2 points but it may save blank or aggregated totals with explanatory notes in biogs. Nthep (talk) 13:56, 20 May 2018 (UTC)

I don't mind the idea, but I think the note at the bottom of the infobox could be worded better. Something like "Drop goals were not recorded seperately during this period, and are included in the total goals scored". J Mo 101 (talk) 08:53, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

@J Mo 101: Can you point to an example of what you're currently seeing? Nthep (talk) 11:05, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

I think they're referring to the note left when |allgoalsN= is used, like in this test case. I wasn't sure the best way to word it, so I'm fine with it being changed. Primefac (talk) 13:08, 21 May 2018 (UTC) (talk page stalker)

WikiProject collaboration notice from the Portals WikiProject

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Articles created on the francophone wikipedia, which might be interesting for anglophone contributors

Hi,

Usually there is far more article on the anglophone RL than on the francophone's one. Nevertheless, you might like to know that the following RL articles have been created on the francophone wiki; you may us them as translation , if you like:

- Hong Kong rugby league championship - Jamaica rugby league championship - The Netherlands rugby league championship etc....

You may check all the articles below. Some anglophone articles have also been used and completed with sources (francophones ones but also in English) or sometimes jersey design etc....

https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Projet:Rugby_%C3%A0_XIII

Hope it helps

Cheers --WIKITRIPAU (talk) 12:23, 13 June 2018 (UTC)

Would anyone know where the default value of 'Infobox rugby league biography' "imagesize" parameter is defined?

Would anyone know where the default value of 'Infobox rugby league biography' "imagesize" parameter is defined? DynamoDegsy (talk) 19:41, 20 July 2018 (UTC)

@DynamoDegsy: I think it's 220px. Nthep (talk) 13:36, 30 July 2018 (UTC)

Anyone with a camera in Bradford on Saturday 11 August?

On 11 August a number of RL trophies are on display at Bradford City Hall, I don't know if photography is going to be allowed but if it is then this is a change to get some CC photos of trophies that haven't seen light for years. Details here; I'd go myself but I'm away that weekend. Nthep (talk) 13:40, 30 July 2018 (UTC)

Shelton Dube

I believe the Shelton Dube article should be deleted, as I can find no evidence to support that any such player has ever existed. DynamoDegsy (talk) 23:27, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

PROD'd. Nthep (talk) 13:50, 30 July 2018 (UTC)

Bert Holcroft

Hi all, I've been talking to a user who is a friend of Bert Holcroft and is keen to improve that article. I've linked him to some stuff on COI and talked about references but am hoping someone with some knowledge of Rugby League can chip in. Many thanks, Tacyarg (talk) 21:38, 2 October 2018 (UTC)

Million Pound Game Formatting

There is currently a discussion at [1] that involves this Wikiproject. RhinosF1 (talk) 15:52, 3 October 2018 (UTC)

Page merge?

West Wales Raiders Rugby League and West Wales Raiders contain information about the same club. I propose a merge, with West Wales Raiders reverting to South Wales Ironmen and containing just information about that (former) club and the merger Cavie78 (talk) 12:20, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

I support this suggestion! 2A02:C7D:89A3:F400:B1A8:B163:717:9365 (talk) 01:33, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

Automatic removal of the '|nickname = ' field from 'rugby league biography' infobox

@Jevansen:, et al… whilst I have no strong objection to the removal of the '|nickname = ' field from 'rugby league biography' infobox, I believe it would be useful if only empty fields were automatically removed, and that if possible a list of articles with an entry in the '|nickname = ' field was produced, so that the nicknames are not lost, and that an attempt to find references for, e.g. Michael Beattie's nickname of "Pigskin", etc. can be made. Best regards. DynamoDegsy (talk) 11:33, 19 October 2018 (UTC)

Hi. I'm not yet removing the field if it is currently referenced, because we can move that information into the article. Otherwise I don't see an issue removing the rest, unreferenced nicknames certainly shouldn't be on BLPs like Michael Beattie. Anyway I won't do any further edits tonight pending further comments. Jevansen (talk) 12:13, 19 October 2018 (UTC)

If they have to go, probably best that the empty fields are selected first, then the unreferenced, etc so to allow those to work them into the article or see a return to the infobox template.Fleets (talk) 18:55, 19 October 2018 (UTC)

For reference, there are 1537 pages that use |nickname=. Unfortunately because there are 50+ uses there isn't a list of which pages have no data, but if desired a bot run can be submitted; if it is, we should probably get a list of all parameters that need removing outright just to increase the likelihood of a successful BRFA. Primefac (talk) 19:20, 19 October 2018 (UTC)

Is there any possibility of looking back at the previous revisions of the 'rugby league biography' infobox to determine those fields that were, but no longer are, legitimate? I occasionally come across; |current_club=, |club_number=, and |club_colours=, and occasionally; |country=, |occupation=, and |relatives=, though I'm not sure whether these were ever legitimate fields, or just random fields added by users. DynamoDegsy (talk) 12:16, 23 October 2018 (UTC)

Yes, you should be able to use WikiBlame to find when/if something was added/removed. Primefac (talk) 16:55, 28 October 2018 (UTC)

It appears that; |nickname=, and |country= were already present in the oldest revision searched dating from 09:53, 16 August 2006, and all the other fields I noted above were/are not. DynamoDegsy (talk)

Category "Rot"

I have recently been looking at Leigh Centurions player articles… when I began my little project there were 253 players linked to; [[Category:Leigh Centurions players]], that number has now been increased by seventy-seven articles (+30%) to 330, and whilst I have "discovered" some "new" Leigh Centurions players, e.g. Candy Evans, the vast majority of these "discoveries" were actually players for whom a played-for link to [[Leigh Centurions|Leigh]]/[[Leigh Centurions]] already existed in the 'Infobox' and/or body text of the article. There's no reason to believe that [[Category:Leigh Centurions players]] is an especially bad case, and I suspect that all (with the possible exception of those clubs having recently created/revised lists of players; Category:Lists of rugby league footballers) are poorly maintained, devaluing the worth of these categories… remedying this issue would be a godsend for anybody needing a worthwhile vocation… @Theanonymousentry:. DynamoDegsy (talk) 11:23, 8 November 2018 (UTC)

Nationality

Article ledes such as, e.g. "Apirana Pewhairangi (born 19 March 1992) is an Irish international rugby league footballer…" reads as though Apirana Pewhairangi is Irish, he is not, he was born in New Zealand, and whilst he may have gone to Ireland on a couple of occasions (possibly on a stag-do), he is not Irish, whilst "Irish international" may link to "Ireland men's national rugby league team", this is not obvious to the casual reader, who if glancing over to the 'Infobox' will see he was born in "Palmerston North, New Zealand". I believe that this is confusing for the casual reader, and that the lede would better as either; № 1. "Apirana Pewhairangi (born 19 March 1992) is an international rugby league footballer for Ireland…", № 2. "Apirana Pewhairangi (born 19 March 1992) is an New Zealand-born international rugby league footballer for Ireland…", or № 3. "Apirana Pewhairangi (born 19 March 1992) is an New Zealand-born rugby league footballer.", or assert no nationality at all, e.g. № 4. "Apirana Pewhairangi (born 19 March 1992) is a rugby league footballer.", and leave whoever he plays for at representative and club level until the following sentence, and his country of birth for the 'Infobox', and background section. DynamoDegsy (talk) 13:44, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

Only if you take out the link that says he is an Irish international. If the changing of the language is necessary to protect people not familiar with international sport, then it could be argued that Api Pehwairangi is an international rugby league footballer who plays for Ireland. To mention his heritage or place of both goes against wider MOS, and would be covered in the background. ie was born in NZ, grew up in, went to school in, played his junior rugby league for, etc To introduce a NZ born Irish international as your first sentence would be confusing to the casual reader and is a pretty bad way to speak, read and write. I'm sure Brexiteers and Trump fans may have different opinions, but they are rugby league footballers and they are uniformally referred to as ...internationals in the press, to go against that would be attempting to create our own facts.Theanonymousentry (talk) 15:22, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

You'd best get busy then; Albert Einstein, et al. DynamoDegsy (talk) 17:30, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

Didn't know he played the greatest game tbh. He is at least famously German-born, although that might not have been the case if the Nazis had not come into existence.Theanonymousentry (talk) 14:31, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

It's "a pretty bad way to speak, read and write" to introduce, e.g 'German-born', in "your first sentence"… as it's "confusing to the casual reader". DynamoDegsy (talk) 16:08, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

All Stars matches

Whilst doing some NPP, I found the 2019 All Stars match, which lead me to all the other All Stars match articles. Shouldn't these all be moved to Rugby Leach All Stars match or similar? The titles as they currently stand are very ambiguous, as they could refer to many different all stars matches around the world. I checked a few of the talk pages, and it doesn't seem to have been discussed previously. The-Pope (talk) 03:43, 17 November 2018 (UTC)

Would it be possible to delete the redirects; David Jones (rugby born c. 1901), David Jones (rugby born circa-1901), and David Jones (rugby, born c. 1901)?

Would it be possible to delete the redirects; David Jones (rugby born c. 1901), David Jones (rugby born circa-1901), and David Jones (rugby, born c. 1901)? DynamoDegsy (talk) 15:07, 23 November 2018 (UTC)

 Done Nthep (talk) 17:20, 23 November 2018 (UTC)

New items on Wikidata

Hello, just to warn you that two new items have been created on Wikidata that can be used as "instances of":

• national rugby league team (Q59239320)
• rugby league coach (Q59239421)

Greetings, -- SERGIO aka the Black Cat 10:10, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

I believe that the 'List of Wakefield Trinity internationals article' is unnecessary, and can be deleted

I believe that the 'List of Wakefield Trinity internationals' article is unnecessary, and can be deleted. I suspect it was created to transfer the information off the 'Wakefield Trinity' article, but it's contents are partially duplicated on the 'List of Wakefield Trinity players' article (in the "Cap(s)" column), and the full details are now included on each of the individual player articles. DynamoDegsy (talk) 11:00, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Either WP:PROD it for deletion or start an WP:AFD for it. Nthep (talk) 14:32, 12 December 2018 (UTC)

Can it not be contextualised, as it seems a decent enough list.Fleets (talk) 07:27, 24 December 2018 (UTC)

Alternative sources for Argentinian National Rugby League Team Article

I've just added some more up to date info on the Argentina_national_rugby_league_team using the Asian Pacific Rugby League Confederation site but it would be good to have some other independent sources. Unfortunately I can't find anything outside the established Rugby League media. Does anyone know of anything? Rtande (talk

Hi, on the Francophone wiki, I used two extra sources : an article from rugby league world and a book written by a French author, but still linked with RL . I understand you're looking for sources in mainstream media ? --WIKITRIPAU (talk) 23:49, 24 December 2018 (UTC)

Creation of a page about Amateur rugby league on the francophone wikipedia

Hi there,

I created a page on the francophone wikipedia with the wikidata number (Q60401954). This piece of info, just in case, you would create one in this Wiki, and have it associated with that number.

Cheers --WIKITRIPAU (talk) 08:47, 4 January 2019 (UTC)

Position names

Are position names meant to be stand-off, scrum-half, loose-forward for Northern hemisphere players playing in the NRL, or do they adopt the local terms? Same and similar question for Australians playing in the Northern hemisphere; do they adopt the local terms or retain five-eighth, half-back and lock. Just want to see which way round it is, as it is clearly one way or the other for consistency.Fleets (talk) 08:00, 24 December 2018 (UTC)

Mmm… interesting… @Theanonymousentry: has an aversion to the combo-links of; stand-off/five-eighth, scrum-half/halfback, loose forward/lock, and their reciprocals of; five-eighth/stand-off, halfback/scrum-half, lock/loose forward, and will change them on-sight, I can see the advantage of them, but I have recently come down on the side of not using them, and I am now using stand-off, scrum-half, loose forward in the lede of European footballers' articles, while in the main-body using; five-eighth, halfback, lock only if they happen to have played any notable club (but not international) matches Australasia (should that be Oceania?), and vice-versa for Australasia footballers' articles. However, there is an issue in that some Australasian footballers have not played first-grade (creeping Australian terminology?) rugby league in Australasia, but have played first-grade in Europe, so do we use the Australasian or European (and by that I mean English) terminology in the lede. Also, would anyone know if the terminology used in, e.g. Cook Islands, Fiji, New Zealand, Papua New Guinea, Samoa, Tonga, etc. is the same as in Australia? DynamoDegsy (talk) 14:13, 24 December 2018 (UTC)

I have an aversion to the combo-links too in biographies and I'd go with where a player predominantly spent their career but with a bias towards their native country if that is there their top-flight career started. Hence I have no problem with Greg Bird being described as a lock-forward or five-eighth. But in any article about Catalans where he is mentioned then the European terms loose-forward and stand-off should be used. The place for combo-links, imo, is in articles on international matches etc where there are team lists. In the text I have no compulsion, for example in an article about an Ashes test match, in using five-eighth when describing the Australian number 7 and stand-off for their English counterpart in the same article. As for terminology in other countries, I know NZ used the English terms until the 1980s so it might be a question of not only "where are we talking about" but also "when". Nthep (talk) 16:03, 24 December 2018 (UTC)

Is there a rule for current players playing from England in the NRL, and Australians in the Super League? Obviously this can revert back to their national usage after they return or retire. Not sure about rules for a player who is English and spends his whole domestic career in Aus, or an Aussie who only features in a UK competition. Just wondering if there was an MOS we should have consistency within the infobox across a competition IMO.Fleets (talk) 08:10, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

For consistency could we please agree a naming convention, whilst there appears to be some agreement for the differing Australian/British names for the positions of; five-eighth/stand-off, halfback/scrum-half and lock/loose forward, the name halfback does not all appear to match the description used by the National Rugby League/Australian Rugby League Commission, Rugby Football League and the Rugby League International Federation. I am unsure whether Australian names are true for all of the southern-hemisphere. I am unsure whether British names are acceptable for all of the northern-hemisphere, specifically in articles refering to non-British footballers. As @Nthep: points out above; it might be a question of not only "where are we talking about" but also "when", e.g. perhaps prior to the advent of the Super League/NRL era, New Zealand used British terms (possibly even terms more associated with rugby union, e.g. fly-half for stand-off/five-eighth).

№	Template positions	should the position be named…	Notes
1	fullback	fullback, full-back or full back	should the terms "sweeper" or "custodian" be confined to the Fullback article?
2	right wing	wing, winger or wing three-quarter	if used should "three-quarter" be hyphenated? As it's not here
3	centre	centre or centre three-quarter	if used should "three-quarter" be hyphenated? As it's not here
4	centre	centre or centre three-quarter	if used should "three-quarter" be hyphenated? As it's not here
5	left wing	wing, winger or wing three-quarter	if used should "three-quarter" be hyphenated? As it's not here
6	five-eighth and stand-off		is five-eighth Australian only, or all of the southern-hemisphere? should stand-off be suffixed with half?
7	halfback and scrum-half		is halfback Australian only, or all of the southern-hemisphere? should the term "first receiver" be confined to the Scrum Half / Half back section?
8	prop	front-row forward, prop or prop forward	should one of these be prefixed with left, loose-head or loosehead? Should the term "bookends" be confined to the Prop section?
9	hooker		should the term "rake" be confined to the Hooker article?
10	prop	front-row forward, prop or prop forward	should one of these be prefixed with right, tight-head or tighthead? Should the term "bookends" be confined to the Prop section?
11	second-row		should this be suffixed with forward?
12	second-row		should this be suffixed with forward?
13	lock and loose forward	lock or lock forward	is lock Australian only, or all of the southern-hemisphere?

It appears that since at least c. 2001, according to the National Rugby League/Australian Rugby League Commission, Rugby Football League and the Rugby League International Federation, e.g here №1, here №2 and here №3... Number and Naming of Players - 3. For ease of identification, players’ clothing must bear the numbers 1 to 13 with additional numbers for the substitutes. The numbers relate to the positions of the players in their respective teams, these positions being referred to by name and number as set out hereunder.

• Backs Forwards
• (1) Full Back (8) Prop
• (2) Right Wing Threequarter (9) Hooker
• (3) Right Centre Threequarter (10) Front Row Forward
• (4) Left Centre Threequarter (11) Second Row Forward
• (5) Left Wing Threequarter (12) Second Row Forward
• (6) Stand-off Half or Five-eighth (13) Lock Forward
• (7) Scrum Half

Points of note; №1 "Full Back" has a space not concatenated or hyphenated. №2, 3, 4 and 5; Wings and Centres suffixed with Threequarter (I believe that Three-quarter is semantically correct, but there you go). №6 Stand-off Half (suffixed with "half"). №7 Scrum Half ("halfback" not used). №8 Only one prop (but not a prop forward). №10 the other "prop" is actually named "Front Row Forward". №13 Lock Forward (suffixed with "forward", "Loose Forward" used by RFL).

DynamoDegsy (talk) 10:58, 14 January 2019 (UTC)

Talking about positions , I created a few Wikidata files for stand off , half scrum, prop, scrum, all linked with articles in French . I also used the other designiations (Australian ones) in the description, feel free to use it...or not if you create such articles on the anglophone wiki --WIKITRIPAU (talk) 22:58, 14 January 2019 (UTC)

Consensus is not important, call the positions what you will. DynamoDegsy (talk)

Brian Smith

Would someone please fix Brian Smith (rugby league, born 1954). It was displaying an error due to a module problem. I fixed the module but there is a bad parameter in the infobox (which triggered the error) and someone who understands the topic is needed. The problem is that the infobox includes

|coachwin%2         = 64

That was added by a bot in August 2008. The infobox already has

|coachwins2         = 32

Johnuniq (talk) 10:10, 26 January 2019 (UTC)

"rugby league footballer", "rugby league football player", or "rugby league player"

I believe I've previously raised the question of whether someone who plays the sport of rugby league football is a; "rugby league footballer", "rugby league football player", or "rugby league player", and it garnered little, or no, interest (I suspect that this may change on this occasion). I believe that the definition should be consistent through out all rugby league articles, as consistency is the foundation of good quality. As rugby league is one of the codes of football I believe that football player, or for brevity footballer, is a more accurate description than player which can refer to any game or sport, not just the codes of football. The 2000 or so rugby league articles I have initiated, have been initiated article using the term "rugby league footballer", but if "rugby league player" is now preferred then I suggest someone with access to AWB will need to implement it. DynamoDegsy (talk) 12:28, 23 December 2018 (UTC)

Hello From my foreign point of view ( for what it's worth) rugby leaguer player is the expression I read the most in the publications written in your language.... Could rugby leaguer be possible in English ? the problem with footballer is that it can lead to a confusion in the anglophone world;There is the American gridiron the Australian football etc... not to mention soccer, known as Football everywhere except in USA imho--WIKITRIPAU (talk) 18:27, 23 December 2018 (UTC)

Hi @WIKITRIPAU: I've not heard the term 'rugby leaguer' to describe an individual rugby league footballer, but interestingly, 'Rugby Leaguer' was the name of a rugby league newspaper until it was merged with the League Express in 2002 to become; Rugby Leaguer & League Express. DynamoDegsy (talk) 18:59, 11 January 2019 (UTC)

Personally from my point of view (English Rugby League fan) I think Rugby League Player is the most unique to Rugby League of the options. Football meaning soccer is almost the defacto meaning in everywhere except the USA and Australia but I agree that consistency is good and would be happy with any of the three proposed options. Rtande (talk)

From an accuracy and encyclopaedic point of view it would be rugby league footballer, but from a common usage in the media it may be rugby league player. Just depends what angle we want to take. Rugby League football, Rugby Union football, association football; all are correctly described as footballers alone, it's just association football is the most prevalent and people drop the association bit. It has no greater claim. Union people say rugby player without the union bit, and say great footballer when there is a good bit of skill in their game. We as a sport the footballer bit alot, it may sound old fashioned, but it also may stem from the influence of the NRL which has grown over recent decades. (rugby league) footballer is probably the best bet for the rugby league.Fleets (talk) 07:26, 24 December 2018 (UTC)

Ah yes, are you saying that because in Australia, I believe "Footie" means Australian rules football, "Rugby" means "rugby union", and "League" means "rugby league", that since the advent of "Super League" in Europe and Super League (now National Rugby League) in Australia and New Zealand from the mid-1990s, the media in the United Kingdom has edged towards using Australian terminology, and adopted the term "player" rather than the (perhaps old-fashioned?) term "footballer". It is interesting as rugby football was codified in 1845, I believe before Australian rules football (1859), Association football (1863), American football (1880), Gaelic football (1884), and Canadian football (1903), so if anyone has the rights (they don't) to the term footballer it is rugby (and by that I mean "rugby union", and not necessarily the "New Kid in Town" (1895) "rugby league"). DynamoDegsy (talk) 13:51, 24 December 2018 (UTC)

Sort of. Footy is both league and aussie rules in Australia. Rugby is both league and union in the UK, but union has claimed that term. A move towards simplified English and an Australian-English in terms of positions (ie half-back to describe a scrum-half) has not seen us shift wholly to the term footballer, although we do use .Fleets (talk) 08:44, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

No preference for either footballer or player and I don't agree that every article has to be consistent as both indicate what the person did or does. Nthep (talk) 15:47, 24 December 2018 (UTC)

I prefer player but don't mind either although consistency is better.RhinosF1 (talk) 16:30, 24 December 2018 (UTC)

Consistency within an article is to be desired; consistency across a project is cloud-cuckoo land. You'll never achieve it and you'll get into a lot of irritating and time-wasting spats trying to do so. It really doesn't matter which of the many variants are deployed within an article because the context will be clear to the reader anyway. We have far more ambiguous situations knocking around elsewhere on Wikipedia that survive despite there being no diktat from a project, eg: in my specialist area I'm sure you can imagine why calling someone an Indian might confuse the less politically correct amongst us (and our readership) - but the context always makes it obvious whether we are referring to someone connected with what is now the Republic of India or a "native American" (or whatever the current buzzword may be). Trying to micromanage phrasing to the degree suggested by the OP is neither necessary nor particularly productive. - Sitush (talk) 19:20, 28 January 2019 (UTC)

Oh, but I do think football player would be considered pretentious and point-y, given the predominance of association football internationally and the historic league/union issue - it's analogous with someone trying to push a nationalist point of view in another topic area. And I also suspect that in almost all cases, after the first explanatory usage in an article, the simple player will suffice. - Sitush (talk) 19:29, 28 January 2019 (UTC)

All Hail The Glow Cloud… I have initiated 2000 or so articles with the term “rugby league footballer”, if consensus is not important, then I will continue to do so. DynamoDegsy (talk) 13:35, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Eh? Are you trying to piss me off again? If not, what do you mean? There is a reason I don't get more involved in this project and you're it. - Sitush (talk) 13:44, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

If consensus is not important, then I will continue to use the term “rugby league footballer” is all. DynamoDegsy (talk)

Nationality removed

For reasons best known to themselves, and not for the first time, @Theanonymousentry: has removed the nationality of, e.g. English, Tongan, for;

• Graeme Horne; born in England, plays in England, played for England

• Louie McCarthy-Scarsbrook; born in England, plays in England, played for England

• Fuifui Moimoi; born in Tonga, plays globally, played for Tonga

@Nthep: @Fleets: @RhinosF1: @Rtande: @WIKITRIPAU:

DynamoDegsy (talk) 12:55, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

Hi there! Well, in the three cases , we have the situation of players who played for different nations. @Theanonymousentry: should be asked about it , but could it be because the fact that the players played for two different nations bring confusion about their nationality ? --WIKITRIPAU (talk) 12:41, 31 January 2019 (UTC)

My point is Graeme Horne and Louie McCarthy-Scarsbrook are English (born, play, represent), they are only allowed to play for Scotland and Ireland respectively due to the grandparent rule, and not through residency. Just listen to Graeme Horne's Scottish lilt at youtube.com… "Graeme Horne on Hull KR's trip to Catalans Dragons"… or Louie McCarthy-Scarsbrook's rich Irish Brogue at youtube.com "Saints' Louie McCarthy-Scarsbrook on Soccer AM"… Louie McCarthy-Scarsbrook matches for Ireland were played in; Cairns, Port Moresby and Perth, so he may never have even visited Ireland (except possibly on a stag do)… Playing for Scotland or Ireland does not make you Scottish or Irish, and neither does it mean that you're not English. DynamoDegsy (talk) 13:31, 31 January 2019 (UTC)

It would be because first off it is uncited, secondly because they have played for multiple nationalities, thirdly their country of birth is covered in two other prominent places near the start of the article, fourthly being born somewhere does not automatically grant you that nationality, fifthly the we would be going against what we would expect to hear in commentary and read in the press were we to assign Jason Cayless as an Australian and not the New Zealand international, sixthly the potential for confusion with as highlighted with the above.Theanonymousentry (talk) 10:11, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

1. Their nationalities are not uncited, they are contained within the rugbyleagueproject.org references; 2. Playing for, e.g. Ireland does not make you Irish; 3. Their nationality is of sufficient importance that it should be included in the opening sentence, and not just in the infobox and/or background sections (and not all articles have and infobox and/or background section); 4. It is acceptable to assert that being born somewhere does give you that nationality, unless you have other referenced information otherwise; 5. Wikipedia is not TV, neither is it a newspaper, and for Jason Cayless either; 'Australian' or 'Australia-born' would be perfectly acceptable, and as there is no evidence of New Zealand residency (actually a specific Residency rule article may be required, or perhaps amendments could be made to the Residency (domicile) article, and does it effect only cricket/rugby union/rugby league, or other sports/occupations?), it is likely that Jason Cayless only qualified for the New Zealand team as he is of Māori descent via the grandparent rule, so to make him out to be a New Zealander is confusing, and more importantly incorrect; 6. I see no confusion, and if you were correct then the nationality would have to be removed from not just all rugby league footballers biographies on Wikipedia, but from all biographies on Wikipedia. DynamoDegsy (talk) 11:49, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

…I would revise the opening paragraph and background of the Jason Cayless article as (or near similar to)…

Introductory paragraph

Jason Paul Cayless (born 15 January 1980) is an Australian-born former rugby league footballer who played in the 1990s and 2000s. He played at representative level for New Zealand and City New South Wales, and at club level in the National Rugby League (NRL) for the Parramatta Eels, the Sydney Roosters and the Wests Tigers, and in the Super League for St. Helens, as a prop.

Background

Cayless was born in Sydney, New South Wales, Australia, he is the younger brother of the rugby league fooballer; Nathan Cayless, he has Māori ancestors, and eligible to play for New Zealand due to the grandparent rule.

WP 1.0 Bot Beta

Hello! Your WikiProject has been selected to participate in the WP 1.0 Bot rewrite beta. This means that, starting in the next few days or weeks, your assessment tables will be updated using code in the new bot, codenamed Lucky. You can read more about this change on the Wikipedia 1.0 Editorial team page. Thanks! audiodude (talk) 06:48, 27 February 2019 (UTC)

Professional

It is likely that most rugby league footballers considered notable for Wikipedia will be professional, i.e. paid. There are exceptions, e.g. Wilf Auty who maintained his (unpaid) amateur status while playing for Batley from 1898 to 1904, and so managed to go onto coach rugby union for Headingley RFC. When I have initiated the mainly pre-Super League/Super League (Australia) rugby league articles, I have generally used the word professional to help differentiate between professional rugby league and amateur rugby union that existed prior to August 1995. There was some debate in the late-1800s as to whether broken-time payments were actually professionalism, the Rugby Football Union thought yes, and hence the Northern Union was formed. There is also an issue with the term semi-professional, I am not keen on its use, as although clubs may occasionally be defined as 'semi-professional', I don't think it is possible to know whether an individual rugby league footballer relies solely on his payments from rugby league, or has an additional income, and what if a current footballer also works as a TV pundit, is he a 'semi-professional rugby league footballer' because he has other journalistic employment… minefield. Whilst appreciating that consensus is not the strong suit within the WikiProject Rugby league… My questions is… should we use the word 'professional' for all rugby league footballers to which it applies, i.e. virtually every footballer, only those that played prior to August 1995, or not at all? DynamoDegsy (talk) 14:57, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

Hi, actually it seems that they have always been amateur rugby league players in history. In France, I can confirm that and for England, I know that amateur rugby league already existed AT LEAST in the early seventies ( my landmark is the creation of BARLA at that time). So the specification 'professionnal', added to a player's description should be incicated in an article only if the piece of information is sure or sourced. Given that for first division ( Super league or NRL), probably 100 % of the players are professionnal. Things get complicated in lower divisions, especially out of UK IMHO.--WIKITRIPAU (talk) 16:08, 2 March 2019 (UTC)

Creation of a Partizan Belgrade rugby league section's page on the francophone wikipedia

Hi there;

You might like to know that I created this page on the francophone wikipedia : Partizan Belgrade (rugby à XIII). Actually, it's based upon an article of the march Rugby League World magazin about the club.

If you wish to use it here's the wikidata number (Q61963279)

cheers --WIKITRIPAU (talk) 14:35, 4 March 2019 (UTC)

Alan Rhodes

I think we have 2/possibly 3 articles about the same person.

• Person 1 - Alan Rhodes (rugby league, born in Bradford) has a rugby league career (including for Bradford Northern) from c. 1965–1968;
• Person 2 - Alan Rhodes (rugby league) then hada rugby league career (including for Featherstone) from 1968 to 1984;
• This source suggests that the 'Alan Rhodes' who played for Bradford Northern (person 1) and the one who played for Featherstone (person 2) are the same;
• Then we have person 3 (Alan Rhodes (footballer)) who like person 1 was born in Bradford and active in the mid to late 1960s.

It could be a coincidence, but wider input is welcome... GiantSnowman 18:18, 30 April 2019 (UTC)

@GiantSnowman: this verifies nothing, but at least suggests the first two articles should be merged, as it implies Rhodes played for both Bradford Bulls (then Bradford Northern) and Featherstone. Best I can do, but certainly someone must know something! SportingFlyer T·C 18:47, 30 April 2019 (UTC)

(edit conflict)Discount the soccer player altogether - that one is a coincidence and I'm not aware of any dual code players from this late on. As for the two RL players the one who played for Featherstone, Castleford etc is still very much alive and I know from social media that he is not the same person who played in the backs for Bradford N as he has been asked about it more than once. Nthep (talk) 19:02, 30 April 2019 (UTC)

PS none of them are the table tennis player!

When Alan Rhodes played for Bradford City's first team in October/November 1964, Alan Rhodes played Rugby League for Halifax (he went to Bradford Northern late December 1964, exchange deal with Bryan Todd). They can't be the same person. Cattivi (talk) 20:04, 30 April 2019 (UTC)

Looks to be a big coincidence, thanks everybody, must have been a popular name for children in the 1940s :) GiantSnowman 20:09, 30 April 2019 (UTC)

8th most popular boy's name in the UK in 1944 according to this........... -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 08:56, 1 May 2019 (UTC)

Assessment of Pages

I'd like to help out by working through the unassessed articles especially the Challenge Cup ones. I've left a note on the talk page of the 1900 Challenge Cup to justify my ratings but before I go any further I wanted to give folks the chance to provide feedback. Have I been too harsh by assessing it as Start quality and Low importance? Rtande (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 04:09, 24 April 2019 (UTC) Rtande (talk) 02:21, 15 May 2019 (UTC) As there hasn't been any feedback I'll stick with Start quality and Low importance

Nicknames

I see that Theanonymousentry has been adding nicknames to infoboxes. By putting them in the subject's name, this looks like an attempt to circumvent previous consensus. As I've said before, I'm not opposed to the inclusion of nicknames, but surely this is not the intention of the infobox. Why would people agree to remove part of the infobox, only to have the same info wedged in elsewhere? Doctorhawkes (talk) 12:13, 28 May 2019 (UTC)

I thought it was okay as they now appear outside the infobox and not inside the infobox. Not trying to circumvent, but can see where you are coming from, so have halted immediately.Theanonymousentry (talk) 12:31, 28 May 2019 (UTC)

Creation of several articles about African Rugby League on the francophone wikipedia

On the francophone wikipedia, it was the "African Month" in may 2019. It was a contest for all contributors willing to create or improve articles about Africa.

I took part in it, and used this opportunity to create several articles about RL. Here is the list, it might be useful for you, because I used several Anglophone sources to write them. Sorry it's in French, but I'm sure some words are very close to their English counterparts, so it should be quite easy to undestand them

Rugby à XIII au Kenya ; Rugby à XIII au Maroc ; Championnat du Moyen-Orient et d'Afrique de rugby à XIII 2019 ; Championnat du Moyen-Orient et d'Afrique de rugby à XIII 2015 ; Rugby à XIII au Burundi ; Rugby à XIII en République démocratique du Congo ; Rugby à XIII en Éthiopie ; Judah Mazive ; Ade Adebisi ; Masimbaashe Matongo ; Championnat du Moyen-Orient et d'Afrique de rugby à XIII ;  ; Rugby à XIII au Ghana ; Rugby à XIII au Cameroun

--WIKITRIPAU (talk) 17:29, 2 June 2019 (UTC)

RL infobox

Would someone with a bit more knowledge than myself be able to add some extra fields to the coaching section of the RL infobox template? I think it currently allows you to put up to ten different teams, but the late Maurice Bamford coached at so many different clubs that it breaks the infobox! J Mo 101 (talk) 10:43, 9 June 2019 (UTC)

Article about Mike Rylance on the Francophone wikipedia

Hi,

a few weeks ago, I created this article about this British writer and journalist on the Francophone wikipedia.

https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Rylance

It might be useful for you, especially, if you wish to create an article in English ( I used francophone and anglophone sources)

--WIKITRIPAU (talk) 11:12, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

Two month virtual editathon on Women in Sports

WikiProject Women in Red is devoting the next two months (July and August) to a virtual editathon on Women in Sports. Please take this opportunity to write more articles about women in rugby who lag far behind men on Wikipedia.--Ipigott (talk) 07:25, 26 June 2019 (UTC)

Thanks for the info. Will try to take part in it --WIKITRIPAU (talk) 11:12, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

What do we have to do to create a wikidata list like Wikipedia:WikiProject_Women_in_Red/Missing_articles_by_occupation/Athletics. I'm happy to help Rtande (talk) 01:18, 1 July 2019 (UTC)

Creation of a new palette about RL Medias on the francophone wikipedia

Hi There,

I've just created this : Modèle:Palette Médias en rugby à XIII (medias in Rugby League)

I thought you might like to know it as , may be, an inspiration

Cheers

--WIKITRIPAU (talk) 08:53, 6 August 2019 (UTC)

The Cap Numbers of this article appear to out-of-sync with thessralmanac.com list...

Hi @Hugh 3476: and @Jevansen:; the Cap Numbers of this article (List of South Sydney Rabbitohs players) appear to out-of-sync with thessralmanac.com list (List of South Sydney Rabbitohs Premiership First Grade Players), e.g. Paul O'Brien is 613 in the artcile, but 628 ssralmanac.com list. Your thoughts? Best regards. DynamoDegsy (talk) 15:06, 29 August 2019 (UTC)

Hey Dynamo, thanks for your interest. This is part of a bigger issue as I'll explain.

I agree they should match (and they did when I originally compiled the list directly from that website). Hugh then completely changed the number/order of players when he added stats to the list. I am unsure what source was used and this is the case for many of the NRL lists, where the cap numbers added by Hugh seem arbitrary. I've found missing players from the 50s etc (even of 100 gamers) who get added to such lists, which obviously then changes the cap numbers, so I have little faith in their authenticity.

He would be the best one to respond to your question, although from my experience it is hard to get an answer out of him. I have my suspicions as well over the IPs that keep reverting your messages and there is an ongoing SPI regarding this.

I'd recommend we remove cap numbers from all lists which aren't clearly sourced. In the case of the Rabbitohs, I'd be in favour of the list being edited to match ssralmanac.

Cheers. Jevansen (talk) 11:11, 2 September 2019 (UTC)

Thanks Jevansen, I was beginning to question my sanity, I thought I was becoming a victim of "Gaslighting". Best regards. DynamoDegsy (talk) 14:32, 2 September 2019 (UTC)

Nomination of Portal:Rugby league for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether Portal:Rugby league is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The page will be discussed at Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Rugby league until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the page during the discussion, including to improve the page to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the deletion notice from the top of the page. Certes (talk) 07:33, 16 October 2019 (UTC)

Spliting discussion for 2021 Rugby League World Cup

An article that you have been involved with ( 2021 Rugby League World Cup ) has content that is proposed to be removed and move to another article ( Legacy of the 2021 Rugby League World Cup ). If you are interested, please visit the discussion at talk:2021 Rugby League World Cup#Split proposal. Thank you. Nthep (talk) 14:28, 26 August 2019 (UTC)

Now split. Nthep (talk) 20:30, 16 October 2019 (UTC)

Nines

Is there a policy for how Nines should be recorded? For example, should there be separate sections on team pages for the Nines team which records the players that have played and their appearances, points scored etc?

This was brought to mind while I was editing Laura_Mariu's article and looking to find sources for the number of appearances she's made for the Kiwi Ferns. She's made appearances for both the full side and the nines side and it would be good to be able to record them separately and acknowledge nines more, especially with the nines world cup on the horizon.

Thoughts? Rtande (talk) 02:08, 3 September 2019 (UTC)

It would need a bit of work to {{Infobox rugby league biography}} but should be possible. With the World 9s starting soon and probably more competitions in the future, I think it's something we need to do. Nthep (talk) 09:40, 17 October 2019 (UTC)

Not really be all that much work, {{Infobox rugby league biography/PLAYER}} is set up to handle the inputs so we just have to add a new |dataX= value to the main template. Primefac (talk) 10:46, 19 October 2019 (UTC)

@Primefac: it needs a new section (to insert at the end of {{Infobox rugby league biography/PLAYER}}?) to add section of "Representative 9s" with parameters

ninesAstart

• ninesAend
• ninesteamA
• ninesappearancesA
• ninestriesA
• ninesgoalsA
• ninesfieldgoalsA
• ninespointsA

I don't think it would need more than a few sets e.g. A-E or if it does we worry about that later. There is another factor; the World 9s, for example, a try can be worth 4 or 5 (bonus tries) points depending on where it is scored. I don't know if this is going to become common in 9s tournaments but we might want to add in another parameter ninesbonustriesA to accommodate this? Nthep (talk) 16:13, 19 October 2019 (UTC)

No. PLAYER is for any code, RL or RU. In the main template, you'd have a call to {{Infobox rugby league biography/PLAYER}} with (for example) |club1={{{ninesTeamA|}}} or |points1={{{ninespointsA|}}}. I don't know how to deal with the points differences but I'll be honest the template is already huge and I don't know if adding in another column is going to help. Primefac (talk) 19:12, 19 October 2019 (UTC)

9s is a separate but related game so it's not as simple as adding 9s as more clubs. The template needs the ability to carry a separate section on 9s like it can already do for players with history in both RU & RL. That said I agree the template is already getting too large and there needs to be discussion between editors of both codes on devising a modular infobox that suits both codes and their derivatives (RU7s and RL9s). Nthep (talk) 19:29, 19 October 2019 (UTC)

Okay, a few things to comment on.

First, I got swapped around for the templates; {{infobox rugby biography}} contains parameters for Rugby sevens but {{infobox rugby league biography}} does not.

Second, yes we could very easily add params as you suggest above, much like we did for Australian Rules (see |header23= and |data27=).

Third, I've been trying to either "split" League and Union infoboxes into their own individual IBs (or alternatively, merge them together into one Rugby infobox) for about four years and I have always come up against heavy opposition from the League WikiProject. I've got a major overhaul in the works in an attempt to prove that it's possible, but it's a little low on my priority list given how many other pies I generally have my fingers in. Primefac (talk) 21:08, 19 October 2019 (UTC)

Justin Collins

This RL player, apparently better known as Steve, seems to have been mixed up with Justin Collins (rugby union) (also known as Gus). If anyone has reliable biographical info sources, please help out. It seems unlikely that they share a birth date, but both are given the same in various sources, eg union club site and league club site. The article probably needs to be moved to Steve Collins (rugby league) eventually but should not be moved while an AfD is open.

I'm not interested in RL (or sport of any kind really) but came across the other Justin while stub-sorting and fell down this rabbit hole. PamD 07:28, 24 October 2019 (UTC)

Request for information on WP1.0 web tool

Hello and greetings from the maintainers of the WP 1.0 Bot! As you may or may not know, we are currently involved in an overhaul of the bot, in order to make it more modern and maintainable. As part of this process, we will be rewriting the web tool that is part of the project. You might have noticed this tool if you click through the links on the project assessment summary tables.

We'd like to collect information on how the current tool is used by....you! How do you yourself and the other maintainers of your project use the web tool? Which of its features do you need? How frequently do you use these features? And what features is the tool missing that would be useful to you? We have collected all of these questions at this Google form where you can leave your response. Walkerma (talk) 04:24, 27 October 2019 (UTC)

Question about Squads

I've just started filling in the Great Britain squad for the 2019 tour and I have a question about points and caps. Should they be recorded as the caps and points achieved at the start of the tour or at the end? I lean towards at the start but wanted to check with others Rtande (talk) 06:20, 14 November 2019 (UTC)

I would also lean towards the start. It makes more sense. Far be it for me to suggest the greatest game of all taking cues from soccer, but that it also how the soccer people do it. In 2018 FIFA World Cup squads there is the statement that: "The numbers of caps and goals listed for each player do not include any matches played after the start of tournament." --Mkativerata (talk) 07:57, 14 November 2019 (UTC)

Thanks, as you say it sounds right and it's sensible to follow soccer's example Rtande (talk) 16:18, 14 November 2019 (UTC)

Question about Community Teams and Notable Players

Just looking at Wigan St Patricks and the list of notable ex-players. Is there a standard format for this for community teams? If not, I think a notable players section with lists of players who have gone to play professionally (or in the case of the women the Super League or NRLW or an international side) would be good. Rtande (talk) 05:53, 20 November 2019 (UTC)

I believe notable rugby league footballers who have played for Wigan St Patricks include;

• Alex Davidson
• Andy Gregory
• Bob Beswick
• George Williams
• James Coyle
• John Fieldhouse
• Karl Fitzpatrick
• Kris Radlinski
• Malcolm Alker
• Owen Farrell
• Sam Tomkins
• Sean O'Loughlin
• Shaun Wane
• Stefan Marsh
• Stephen Wild
• Thomas Coyle
• Tom Davies

The above rugby league footballers meet the rugby league notability guidelines (hence they have an article, and I've also just initaiated a [[Category:Wigan St Patricks players]]), but there could be people who are notable only within the context of Wigan St Patricks, but who do not meet the rugby league notability guidelines. DynamoDegsy (talk)

New bot to remove completed infobox requests

Hello! I have recently created a bot to remove completed infobox requests and am sending this message to WikiProject Rugby league since the project currently has a backlogged infobox request category. Details about the task can be found at Wikipedia:Bots/Requests for approval/PearBOT 2, but in short it removes all infobox requests from articles with an infobox, once a week. To sign up, reply with {{ping|Trialpears}} and tell me if any special considerations are required for the Wikiproject. For example: if only a specific infobox should be detected, such as {{infobox journal}} for WikiProject Academic Journals; or if an irregularly named infobox such as {{starbox begin}} should be detected. Feel free to ask if you have any questions!

Sent on behalf of Trialpears (talk) via MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 02:34, 12 December 2019 (UTC)

NRL Stats at http://203.166.101.37

There are 250+ articles, e.g. Graeme Bradley, that have references named NRL Stats that have the URL of, e.g. 'http://203.166.101.37/NRL08/playercareer.asp?lplayer=1193', about ⅓ are marked as being [permanent dead link], but all are dead links. I've tried using web.archive.org, archive.is and webcitation.org, but I've been unable to recover them. I believe this may be because the URL includes an IP address of; 203.166.101.37 rather than an actual website. I've tried replacing 203.166.101.37 with, e.g. www.nrlstats.com or www.nrlstats.com.au, but this doesn't appear to help. Would anyone know of a way to recover these references? Best regards. DynamoDegsy (talk) 17:02, 14 January 2020 (UTC)

Earlwood Saints

Can somebody please delete the redirect for the Earlwood Saints (it currently redirects to Sydney Combined Competition) as I want to create an article for it? WDM10 (talk) 20:25, 13 January 2020 (UTC)

As it's only a redirect, I believe you could just overwrite it, as there's no history to lose, and there's no talk page either. DynamoDegsy (talk) 17:17, 14 January 2020 (UTC)

Thanks, I overwrote it. WDM10 (talk) 20:31, 14 January 2020 (UTC)

Question about the Sharks

Should they be referred to as the Cronulla Sharks or the Cronulla-Sutherland Sharks? WDM10 (talk) 08:46, 25 December 2019 (UTC)

IMHO, the full title is correct, but the shorter title is also fine to use in an article, just as Souths is used for South Sydney Rabbitohs. Doctorhawkes (talk) 21:11, 25 December 2019 (UTC)

Thanks. WDM10 (talk) 20:18, 13 January 2020 (UTC)

Were the Cronulla-Sutherland Sharks ever just known as the Cronulla Sharks, e.g. prior to; a merger, Super League or the National Rugby League (NRL)? DynamoDegsy (talk)

They have been formally known as the Cronulla-Sutherland Sharks since their admission into the competition, even throughout the Super League years. However Cronulla Sharks has also always been used as a shorter form for the name as far as I'm aware. WDM10 (talk) 06:23, 16 January 2020 (UTC)

Valencia Huracanes

What leagueicon should this team use? I've used the Spanish one however due to their blue and orange colours, it seems the Central Queensland icon would be better. WDM10 (talk) 01:02, 24 January 2020 (UTC)

Club Player lists

I believe that there should be a section of players that have not made their debut for their clubs yet but are in the 30 man roster MSS15 (talk) 09:26, 25 January 2020 (UTC)

Player Notability

What does a player have to do to be deemed worthy of a page? WDM10 (talk) 07:23, 8 February 2020 (UTC)
You can ignore this question. I found the notability guideline. WDM10 (talk) 07:36, 8 February 2020 (UTC)

Club Notability

What determines a club's notability? WDM10 (talk) 05:50, 14 February 2020 (UTC)

I'm not aware of a specific guideline other than WP:GNG. All professional or semi-pro clubs should easily meet this criteria. Amateur clubs can also be notable if the team is competing in a top national/regional league which receives a lot of coverage. J Mo 101 (talk) 19:02, 16 February 2020 (UTC)

Ok thank you. WDM10 (talk) 19:04, 16 February 2020 (UTC)

Stanley Gene

If a few more editors could add this page to their watchlist it would be much appreciated, as someone keeps re-adding silly claims about his age. It's already semi-protected, but the edits usually get approved anyway as they look fairly competent at first glance. J Mo 101 (talk) 19:14, 16 February 2020 (UTC)

2019 Queensland Cup

There are two pages about the same tournament (2019 Queensland Cup & 2019 Intrust Super Cup QLD). How should they be merged? WDM10 (talk) 04:57, 26 February 2020 (UTC)

@WDM10: if you merge 2019 Intrust Super Cup QLD into 2019 Queensland Cup (consistency of naming) I'll take care of a WP:history merge afterwards. I'm not sure how much material there is too merge. Nthep (talk) 15:23, 26 February 2020 (UTC)

@Nthep: To be honest the 2019 Intrust Super Cup QLD page can just be deleted. It has no information the 2019 Queensland Cup page doesn't have. WDM10 (talk) 19:05, 26 February 2020 (UTC)

Is it worth keeping as a redirect? If so, you can just blank and redirect it. Nthep (talk) 19:18, 26 February 2020 (UTC)

That sounds like a good idea. WDM10 (talk) 19:20, 26 February 2020 (UTC)

Done. WDM10 (talk) 19:46, 26 February 2020 (UTC)