Talk:Perpetual count

Title

User:Borsoka, don't you think that this article should be renamed to the title "perpetual count", per google books results [1]? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.117.169.57 (talk) 18:46, 21 September 2013 (UTC)

You may be right. My only concern is that the google books result do not refer to the institution of perpetual ispáns, but to the title of Hunyadi (which is, of course, connected to the institution). Borsoka (talk) 03:06, 22 September 2013 (UTC)

@User:Borsoka - The title perpetual count of Beszterce is not the only one that appears in sources. I also found Perpetual count of Zagorje, perpetual count of Teocak and Perpetual Count of the Gefpanchaft of Gran (this source is a little old, but still) 79.117.176.6 (talk) 06:37, 22 September 2013 (UTC)

I still maintain that all the referred sources make mention of a title, not of the institution. However, I agree that the usage should be checqued. Borsoka (talk) 06:41, 22 September 2013 (UTC)

I don't understand the difference 79.117.176.6 (talk) 06:47, 22 September 2013 (UTC)

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page moved. Armbrust ^{The Homunculus} 06:19, 5 October 2013 (UTC)

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Perpetual ispán → Perpetual count – The current title was fabricated by User:Borsoka and isn't used by any authors (0 Google Books results). The word ispán is just the Hungarian word for count is ([2]). There are 43 Google Books sources that use this formula 79.117.175.101 (talk) 06:24, 28 September 2013 (UTC)

• Support. Although it is not so evident, as the anonymous user suggests (many of the sources mentioned above use the title "ispán" instead of "count" when referring to the non-hereditary heads of counties in the Kingdom of Hungary, and in Hungarian the title is the same for hereditary and non-hereditary holders of this office), but for the time being there is no reliable source substantiating the use of the expression "perpetual ispán" in English sources. Borsoka (talk) 06:50, 28 September 2013 (UTC)
• Support, per GB results. However, Borsoka has right, "ispán" (comes) was not a hereditary title for aristocracy, the latter (count; gróf) appeared in Hungary for the first time in the Late Middle Ages (see e. g. Szentgyörgyi family, Counts of Szentgyörgy and Bazin)--Norden1990 (talk) 00:29, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
• Support per GB results and user Borsoka. In ictu oculi (talk) 02:32, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
• Support. No reason to use foreign language words if they can be translated in a straightforward manner. Ich weiß dass nicht (talk) 14:13, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.