Talk:India–Pakistan cricket rivalry

Untitled

India won the last test international, as long as I remember, it would be better if you give a source here.

Twenty20

we are missing details about the twenty20 matches. Both teams played each other twice and once in the finals. There is no information about this —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.150.44.160 (talk) 21:39, 30 September 2007 (UTC)

Unofficial T20I

In the warm up match of the 2012 ICC World Twenty20, Pakistan beat India by 5 wickets on 17 September 2012. However, warm up matches are not official T20I match. So the record has been removed from the article.[[1]] (talk) 26 September 2012 (UTC)

Bias and Lack of Quality

The entire article is biased, depending on the nationality of whoever wrote what bit. The article does not come anywhere near Wikipedia's quality standards. Grammatical mistakes, non-neutrality, hyperbole, and stupidity is replete in the article and equally distributed across contributions from both countries. Harish.alagappa (talk) 06:02, 30 March 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from Mohammadahadgul, 28 March 2011

{{edit semi-protected}} In the Memorable moments (Pakistan) please add this:

"At Kolkata in 1989, India breathed a sigh of relief when they dismissed Miandad cheaply during another Pakistan run-chase and Pakistan were left standing at 161/5 needing 77 runs of nearly 6 overs. But like a bolt from the blue came Salim Malik, who smashed 72 from 36 balls from No. 7 and shepherded the tailenders past the target."

Mohammadahadgul (talk) 18:12, 28 March 2011 (UTC)

 Not done Non-neutral wording. Please make more neutral, then submit another edit request. Also, please make sure to include a reliable source citation. Thank you. – Ajl^talk 20:31, 28 March 2011 (UTC)

Memorable moments

I'm moving the two section on 'memorable moments' to this talk page because it was largely unsourced, was poorly written, and looked to have POV issues. Nev1 (talk) 18:18, 27 November 2011 (UTC)

Memorable moments (India)

• In 1984, the Indian team led by Kapil Dev was bowled out for 125 in Sharjah. In reply, India bowled out Imran Khan's Pakistan team for a paltry 87. This was one of those rare matches in the sub-continent a low-scoring game that was a thriller all the way. It was India's fielding that won the day and leading the way was veteran opening batsman Sunil Gavaskar, who took four catches, a world record which would stand till 1993 when it was broken by South Africa's Jonty Rhodes.

• During 1996 World Cup Quarter Final, in Bangalore, Ajay Jadeja had hit Waqar Younis for 18 & 22 in 48th & 50th over. Though numerically insignificant, Ajay Jadeja smashing 45 swung the match away from Pak in this tension-packed knockout match. Coming in for the slog, Jadeja was particularly severe on Waqar whose first eight overs had cost 47 runs. The next two went for 18 and 22 with Jadeja smashing four 4s and two 6s off a mere 26 balls. That took India to a formidable 287 for 8 which proved too much for Pakistan.

• In the same 1996 World Cup Quarter Final, During Pakistan chase, Aamer Sohail clobbered Venkatesh Prasad a boundary to the offside, then he cockily pointed towards the offside area and warned Venkatesh Prasad to repeat the same. On the next ball Venkatesh Prasad clean bowled Aamer Sohail with a beauty of a leg cutter ball, uprooting his off stump.

• In Sahara Friendship series, Toronto, 1997 Sourav Ganguly dominated a series with both bat and ball. A total of 222 runs, 15 wickets and three catches in the six games (the third was abandoned after 31.5 overs) by Ganguly helped India to a 4–1 victory against Pakistan.

• In the final of the Independence Cup at the national stadium Dhaka, India pulled off a sensational three-wicket win with one ball to spare against Pakistan when Hrishikesh Kanitkar hit Saqlain Mushtaq for a crucial boundary off the second-last ball of the match in India's memorable victory over Pakistan. In this match Sourav Ganguly played a wonderful knock of 124 and was adjudged man of the match.

• It was a golden moment when Anil Kumble took 10 wickets in an innings against Pakistan to become one of the two bowlers in Test cricket history to achieve the feat. On 8 February 1999, History was created at d Feorzeshah Kotla Stadium in New Delhi when One of India's Greatest Spinners Anil Kumble became only the Second Bowler ever (the other being Jim Laker(England)) to have taken all 10 wickets in a Test innings. Anil Kumble achieved this feat against Pakistan in the second Test played at the Feroz Shah Kotla Stadium in New Delhi and leading India to Victory by very huge margin of 212 runs.

• In a group game of the 2003 Cricket World Cup, at Centurion, India were chasing 273 against a legendary Pakistani attack (Wasim, Waqar, Akhtar, Razzaq, Afridi) on a lively pitch. In response, Sachin Tendulkar and Virender Sehwag got of to a stunning flyer scoring 53 in 5 overs by demoralizing Pakistan's bowlers hitting heavily with sixes & fours to Shoaib Akhtar. India eventually won the game with 4 overs to spare. Thus, India maintained always a "winning consistency" or "never lose" against Pakistan in world cup cricket history. Sachin Tendulkar scored 98 in that Centurion, World Cup, 2003 match. It is one of the ironies of cricket that despite his tons of centuries in ODIs, Tendulkar's most momentous innings was one that fell two short of the mark. From the very start of India's reply to Pakistan's 273, the full house were treated to a dazzling exhibition. Fast bowler Shoaib Akhtar had been talking up a storm and Tendulkar went about his bowling with a vengeance. In his very first over he was carted for a six and two fours and the fight went out of the Pakistan camp as Tendulkar and the rest raced to victory.

• Virender Sehwag's blazing knock of 309 (375 balls, 531 minutes, 39 fours, 6 sixes) had come against Pakistan in 1st Test match-India's tour of Pakistan-2004 played at Multan Cricket Stadium, Pakistan. Virender Sehwag became the first Indian to hit a Test triple century. This test match was memorable because India clinched an historic win i.e. India's first-ever Test victory in Pakistan. At the stroke of 1 Six, Sehwag launched Saqlain Mushtaq into the stands over midwicket to become the first Indian to reach 300 in style with a fearless six. In this match Anil Kumble (6/30 in the second innings) and Sachin Tendulkar (194 not out in the first inning) played sterling roles in the win.

• At the Vishakhapatnam Ground in 2005, Mahendra Singh Dhoni celebrated his maiden ODI century against Pakistan with a cracking 148, the highest score by an Indian against Pakistan, off just 123 balls, with 15 bounadries and four sixes, batting at number three, Dhoni hit a breezy ton of 148 as India posted their highest total against Pakistan i.e. 356 for 9. Thus Dhoni arrived to international cricket by this marvellous inning and he was always remembered for this killing innings that destroyed Pakistan bowling attack completely. There were two magic moments in course of Dhoni's innings, and neither had anything to do with the free-flowing player's shot-making. The first was when he completed his century; the second, when he was finally out. On both occasions, the cameras panned to the team dressing room—and there, up on his feet, a smile as wide as all outdoors, stood Virender Sehwag, furiously applauding. Virender Sehwag clapped right through as Dhoni walked into the pavilion. And as the young wicket-keeper walked up to him, Viru grabbed his hand and slapped him on the back, his smile getting even wider. The signal was clear: Sehwag, who increasingly has become the go-to guy every time India needs quick runs, was recognizing the emergence of a kindred spirit, a young lad without a shadow of fear in his heart or doubt in his mind.

• India won the 5 match ODI series 4–1 in India's 2005 tour to Pakistan in which Indian batsmen demonstrated a pressure handling run chase throughout the series by Yuvraj Singh (who scored 344 runs in 5 matches) and Mahendra Singh Dhoni(who scored 219 runs in four innings at a strike rate of 137). Dhoni's performance in that tour of Pakistan propelled him to number three in ICC 2005 ranking among ODI batsmen.

• Irfan Pathan claimed a first over hat-trick against Pakistan, becoming the second person , after Nuwan Zoysa, to achieve this feat in a test match in the first over. In a sensational start to the third Test of India's tour to Pakistan Jan 2006 played at National Stadium Karachi, Irfan Pathan took the wickets of Pakistan's top order batsmen – Salman Butt (caught by Rahul Dravid at slip), Younis Khan (LBW) and Mohammand Yousuf (bowled) of the last three deliveries of the first over. This feat made Pathan the second Indian to achieve a test hat trick (the other being Harbhajan Singh).

• The First T20 World cup was played in South Africa, 2007 & the First T20 match between India & Pakistan ended in Tie and then the bowl-out took place, India won the bowl-out by 3–0. Twenty20 doesn’t allow a result to end in a tie and now it was time for the ‘Bowl Out’ as scores are levelled. Each team has to nominate five bowlers to bowl a ball each with both sides alternating. The team that hits the stumps most times would be the winners with overstepping the crease not counted. Shoaib Malik won the toss and he asked India to have first go. The crowd didn’t leave the stadium at all, they were praying for their respective teams to prevail in this unique contest on a cricket ground. India’s five bowlers were Virender Sehwag, Robin Uthappa, Harbhajan Singh, Sreesanth and Irfan Pathan while Pakistan’s were Mohammad Asif, Umar Gul, Shahid Afridi, Yasir Arafat and Tanvir Ahmed. Sehwag started the Bowl Out and bang he was on the target and in response Yasir Arafat nervously bowled it outside the offstump! Next Harbhajan bowled an off break that went straight onto the stumps and in reply, Umar Gul bowled with cross seam which nicely swung away outside the offstump. Pakistan under all sorts of pressure, they now needed to fire in three out of three to just tie the Bowl Out and start it all over. Robin Uthappa came in next, hit the stumps and took a bow. His competitor Shahid Afridi drifted his leg break down the legstump leaving India victorious with a score of 3–0. The only consolation for Pakistan was the Man of the Match award which went to Mohammad Asif.

• India beat Pakistan in 2010 Asia Cup by 3 wickets to book a place in the final thus taking revenge for the loss in 2009 Champions Trophy . India subsequently went on to win the tournament by defeating Sri Lanka in the final.
• India beat Pakistan in the semifinal of the ICC Cricket World Cup 2011 held at Mohali on 30 March 2011 and confirmed its place in the Finals against Sri Lanka. The match has created a great deal of hype because of the ongoing tensions between the two nations and was equated to war.

References

India have won all WORLD CUP MATCHES AGAINST PAKISTAN

Memorable moments (Pakistan)

• In the 1986 Australasia cup final in Sharjah, Chetan Sharma, famous for getting a hat-trick in a 1987 World-Cup, was about to bowl the last ball of the match with Pakistan needing four runs to win. He bowled a low full-toss outside the leg-stump, which was hit for six by Javed Miandad. This made Sharma a villain in the eyes of Indian fans, while Miandad was hailed as a hero.

• In the first test match of the Pakistan-India test series in 1999 India needed 271 runs to win in the fourth innings. With only Tendulkar putting up resistance, with his dismissal and the score on 254, Pakistan tightened the screws and forced an Indian collapse winning the test match by 12 runs.

• In a test match at Niaz Stadium, Hyderabad (Pakistan) on 14 January 1983. Javed Miandad scored an unbeaten 280* for Pakistan against 83' World Cup wining side of India and as a result Pakistan beat India.

• The 1999 tri series in Australia was a famous one for Pakistan. Although Pakistan did not win the series they were able to beat rivals India in 3 out of the 4 matches they played against India.

• A sledging incident involving Javed Miandad and Kiran More where Miandad famously imitated More during a match by jumping up and down on the pitch. A scene questionable, but equally hilarious.

• Saeed Anwar struck a superb 194 against India in Chennai, India in 1997. The match was won by Pakistan. It is one of the greatest innings played by a batsman in an ODI breaking Sir Viv Richards previous record of 189*.

• Opening batsmen Saeed Anwar struck a match winning 188* against India in the Asian Test Championship in 1999 in India. Pakistan went on to win the match due to this knock.

• In the Wills trophy final played in Sharjah, Aaqib Javed claimed a hat-trick against India with his best bowling figures of 7/37 off 10 overs. It's the only hat-trick in Cricket in which all three batsmen were out lbw. Aaqib, only 19 years and 81 days at the time, remains the youngest cricketer to accomplish this feat.

• During the third and final match of the 1997 ODI series between India and Pakistan, which was level at 1–1, Ijaz Ahmed completely dominated the Indian attack smashing 139 not out off only 84 balls. His brutal onslaught which included 9 sixes and 10 fours helped Pakistan chase down a target of 216 in a mere 26.2 overs with 9 wickets remaining.

• The first test match of the Asian Test Championship played at Eden Gardens, Calcutta from 16–20 February 1999 is arguably the most controversial test encounter the two nations have ever played. The match was and has remained the best-attended cricket match in history with total attendance of around 465,000 people. The game is particularly remembered due to the extraordinary performances by Pakistan's Shoaib Akhtar for 4/71 and 4/47, Saeed Anwar for 188 not out for batting throughout the second innings. Controversy ensued when Tendulkar was run out in the second innings to which the Indian crowd reacted angrily to. It resulted in them causing a riot and the police and officials having to remove most of the crowd and the remainder of the test having to be watched with the stadium near empty, Pakistan eventually won the test by 46 runs.

• Pakistan defeated India in the second match of the Carlton and United Series on 10 January 2000, with Waqar Younis and Saqlain Mushtaq making a 43 run partnership and scoring the winning runs off the last ball of the match.

• Pakistan won their first ever win in an ICC event against India in the 2004 Champions Trophy in England. With Mohammad Yousuf (Yousaf Youhanna at that time) struck a beautiful knock of 81* and took Pakistan to the winning line.

• In the 2003 Videocon Cup, in Amsterdam, Shahid Afridi before the start of the match claimed that Irfan Patan was no match for him and he would hit a 6 off the first ball. Shahid Afridi came with Yasir Hameed as the opening pair to the match, and Irfan Patan was the opening bowler. Yasir Hameed made 1 run and rotated the strike to Shahid Afridi, in which he smashed a 6 off Irfan Patan. The ball landed outside of the stadium and was lost in the nearby stream and a new ball had be brought in....

• Salman Butt scored five out of seven centuries of his career against the arch-rivals India. He scored his debut century against India at BCCI's Platinum Jubilee Celebration in 2005 at Eden Garden Calcutta which Pakistan won by six wickets.

• In the fifth ODI in Kanpur, 15 April 2005 Shahid Afridi smashed a 45 ball century making him first and third on the list of fastest centuries in ODI cricket (moved down to fourth after Mark Boucher's 44 ball century in 2006).

• In the 2006 Karachi test, Pakistan came back from 39/6 in the first innings to win the match convincingly by 341 runs. Thanks to Kamran Akmal's knock of 113 in the first innings and Mohammad Asif's figures of 7/126.

• Pakistan won a memorable 2006 series in India. After losing the first two ODI's, Pakistan went on to win the next 4 ODI's clinically claiming the series 4–2. It was a famous win for Pakistan as they were hinted as the weakest Pakistani team to tour India.

• Pakistan beat India in 2009 edition of Champions Trophy by 54 runs.}}

Pakistan beat India by 180 runs in 2017 ICC CHAMPIONS TROPHY FINAL — Preceding unsigned comment added by 39.37.142.176 (talk) 17:26, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

Ridiculous

Enigma05 (talk) 22:49, 18 March 2012 (UTC)Why do Pakistanis show the example of themselves being ostentatious, thus bringing contempt to their own cricketers! The column "List of ODI Series" reflected a non-existent Pakistani player named Humas Rehman in the tables "Most career runs", "Highest individual score" and "Highest partnerships" with him holding the stats for maximum in these tables; now corrected.

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Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:India–Pakistan cricket rivalry/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

India versus Pakistan cricket rivalry

Last edited at 02:12, 2 December 2011 (UTC). Substituted at 18:53, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 18 June 2017

Anuragrana18 (talk) 15:12, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

Someone please undo the above user's last edit to the article. Thank you. 117.192.5.135 (talk) 15:17, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

They can't edit the page, so how could it be undone? —MRD2014 ( T / C ) 22:44, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 24 September 2018

Please update the ODI record with result of the 2 latest matches played as part of the ongoing Asia cup.

Result summary Team Mat Won Lost Tied NR India 131 54 73 0 4

Sandykop (talk) 08:46, 24 September 2018 (UTC)

References

 Not done: The page's protection level has changed since this request was placed. You should now be able to edit the page yourself. If you still seem to be unable to, please reopen the request with further details.--B dash (talk) 02:44, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

Over-use of statistics

This article very clearly falls foul of WP:NOTSTATS, WP:NOTMIRROR and WP:CRICSTYLE in its overuse of statistics without adequate context. The page is essentially a quite interesting introduction and history section, a tonne of boring and repetitive and, quote often simply non-notable, statistics and then a quite interesting short section lost at the bottom of the article. The inclusion of scorecards is particularly ridiculous where a summary paragraph or two with links to the relevant World Cup or tour article, would massively improve the quality of the article as an actual article.

I propose to cull the majority of the statistical sections and either replace them with prose sections, possibly with the odd statistical summary, or simply remove them if they aren't actually that notable. Comments here first of course. Blue Square Thing (talk) 06:08, 20 June 2019 (UTC)

As you have shown across cricket Wikipedia, you have no idea of the importance of statistics to the game, especially so given you consider scorecards to be removeable "statistics". Marplesmustgo (talk) 20:51, 20 June 2019 (UTC)

Oh no, I understand the importance of statistics to cricket. I also understand what wikipedia is supposed to be doing - which is not simply mirroring a bunch of stats we can all find on CricInfo - and the importance of prose in that. Blue Square Thing (talk) 21:48, 20 June 2019 (UTC)

A cricket match is meaningless without a scorecard. Indeed, under the Laws, the only people in a cricket match who are indispensable are the scorers; we can do without any number of players and indeed without an umpire, and certainly without a press box.

An article on Wikipedia about a bilateral series (such as is the norm in Tests and is usual in ODIs) can just about do without scorecards, but without them is reduced only to “England won the series 2-1”. You need scorecards to work out what has happened.

In those cases, the scorecard is far more important than the prose you’ve been trying to inject into these articles. Look for example at the 1968 Ashes. One could wax lyrical (and the 1969 Wisden did) of that fifth day at the Oval, the crowd mopping up, ‘Deadly’ Underwood bowling in the last hour with the fielders round the bat… but no-one has the time to write that up on Wikipedia, and just copying the 1969 Wisden no doubt is plagiarism. More important that the scorecards are there to provide a clear account of what happened in the match than leave it to someone to write prose.

How much could be written about Mike Gatting shaking his finger at Shakoor Rana on the England tour of Pakistan in 1987-88? Lots, but no-one has the time, and there isn’t a breath of it on that article. Instead there are scorecards. If we wait for the prose before the scorecards, we will wait forever. In the mean time there are scorecards to be uploaded.

Look at the prose in New Zealand cricket team in Sri Lanka in 1992–93 – there is none. That article is legitimate because it sets out the scores of the cricket matches of the series. It would not be legitimate if it had a load of prose but no scores. Cricket matches rest on scores and scores alone.

I don't know where you get this idea Wikipedia is the anti-Cricinfo, with Cricinfo the place of stats and WIkipedia the place of anti-stats. This is a distinction you have drawn for yourself, with no Wikipedia contributor agreeing with you, It is a contemptible idea I spit upon.

Another important thing is consistency. On the articles for Australian cricket team in South Africa in 1993–94 and New Zealand cricket team in South Africa in 1994–95, you have gone for (a seemingly endless amount of) prose, while hiding scorecards. In edits you have called this “a style specifically adopted” and also stated that this style was the reason “this article was accepted as one that could be published - it has prose rather than relying on statistics”. The problem with this is that there are literally hundreds of articles on Test series going back to 1877, none of which have this style at all, most of which have scorecards (which you count as statistics) and no prose at all.

I tried to make this clear about 15 months ago and was banned for my trouble, so I’m not going to make further edits to make these articles consistent, but I will make clear to you that what you are doing is utterly wrong. Take your ludicrous prose fixation elsewhere. These articles need scorecards and statistics, which are the very base of cricket, the meat and drink of cricket, long before they need someone pretending to be the Cardus of Wikipedia. Marplesmustgo (talk) 23:14, 20 June 2019 (UTC)

Very little of this belongs on this talk page. It's clearly much more personal than this and effectively hijacked any chance of discussion. Feel free to reduce it and this response if you'd like to actually work to improve the article.

The problem is that this is Wikipedia, not Wisden - and, tbf, Wisden doesn't even do what you're suggesting we should do here - neither does The Cricketer. Wikipedia doesn't just present statistics: we do prose. It's not my fault if people haven't gotten round to improving articles yet: people can only do one at a time. But WP:NOTSTATS is very clear about what we're not in the business of doing. Blue Square Thing (talk) 05:19, 21 June 2019 (UTC)

I notice that the level of vandalism on the article has risen massively over the world cup. Is there any chance this will calm down enough to enable someone to actually sort the article out or is it a hopeless task? Blue Square Thing (talk) 15:34, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

The page has now been protected due to the recent vandalism. I'll start to bring in better formatted tables and the like first with some prose sections. I'm going to remove the results at the bottom of the page as these really are just throwing even more statistics at it. Blue Square Thing (talk) 05:59, 13 July 2019 (UTC)

Can I remind editors that prose is preferred. The entire Test and ODI stats sections could justifiably be removed right now on WP:OR and WP:NOTSTATS grounds. The only reason they remain is to encourage someone to write some prose to introduce them at least. The recent removal of the prose for the T20I section is clearly entirely ignorant of the need to use prose. I am quite happy to remove the whole stats section if that continues to occur. Blue Square Thing (talk) 19:36, 25 October 2021 (UTC)

Flags and colour

Per MOS:FLAGS I've removed flags again from the article. They aren't needed here - if we had lots of different countries then perhaps; we don't.

Colour is a bar to web accessibility - it stops users with accessibility issues being able to read the page, especially tables, effectively. Please don't re-add it. Blue Square Thing (talk) 06:37, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

^this needs to be read. It's important. Blue Square Thing (talk) 19:32, 25 October 2021 (UTC)

Tournaments

Hi, I added two major tournaments won by india beating pakistan in FInal of these 2. (Silver Jubilee Independence Cup) & ( 1985-86 benson World series final) why they are not included.??https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/silver-jubilee-independence-cup-1997-98-61018/match-results</ref> Ref - > https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/silver-jubilee-independence-cup-1997-98-61018/match-results Ref- > https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/benson-hedges-world-championship-of-cricket-1984-85-60849/india-vs-pakistan-final-65731/full-scorecard

Can I take a look at these when I get the chance? I've removed them for now because the refs were added in the wrong place and the article was becoming an accessibility nightmare - see above. I will come back to them. Blue Square Thing (talk) 19:33, 25 October 2021 (UTC)

Are either of these, along with the Austral-Asia thing and, even, the Asia Cup major tournaments? They strike me regional at best - but perhaps the section needs to be removed or replaced with prose anyway. Wouldn't a focus on actual world cups be more effective? i.e the official ICC ones?

If we are going to include these other tournaments, are there women's versions of them as well? Because those are missing in any form from the article as it stands. Blue Square Thing (talk) 19:41, 25 October 2021 (UTC)

This is interesting. I agree that the Asia Cup & Asian Test Championship don't really count as "major" tournaments, they are more like regional tournaments. The Silver Jubilee Independence Cup was again just a regional cup and only featured Ind, Pak & BD. Also, I was wondering, since the World Championship is included, which featured Aus, Eng, Ind, NZ, Pak, SL & WI, then why isn't the Nehru Cup included when it featured Aus, Eng, Ind, Pak, SL & WI? The only difference is that NZ is missing from the Nehru Cup. Though in all honesty, I'd only keep the WTC, WC, T20 WC & CT as the major ICC tournaments, as they are a level above the rest. In that case it is 5-3 to India at the moment. A Fantasy (talk) 05:21, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Sounds reasonable. Lets leave this open for a few days (well, at least until India are knocked out <j>), and see if any other views are made. But I'll probably forget myself... Blue Square Thing (talk) 09:07, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Done - can you check this is OK for me A Fantasy? I've included the two women's teams - we need to bring women's cricket much more into this page anyway as it seems to have been completely ignored. It's rather more difficult to find details about matches between the two countries though - so if anyone can help? Blue Square Thing (talk) 19:03, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Yeah, thanks, it looks much better now. Tbf Cricket teams are only known by the major ICC tournaments that they have won and not the regional ones, so it makes much more sense now. I will also add a row for the WTC in a bit and put zeros for both atm. I also like your idea about including Women's Cricket in this article, though I'm not sure if the rivalry extends to Women's Cricket? As Pakistan's Women's team are pretty much minnows and I've not seen Indians & Pakistans get as excited about the matches between the Women's teams as they are when the Men's teams play each other. Though you can find stats about their head to head record in ODIs & T20Is from here https://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/records/index.html?class=9 & here https://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/records/index.html?class=10. The two teams have never played each other in a Test match. A Fantasy (talk) 21:23, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Thank you - that's exactly what I was looking for. I'm able to trawl by hand for the tournament meetings - I was surprised that Pakistan have won some.

I sort of think it's important to mention the women's teams at least. It is the 2020s after all! Blue Square Thing (talk) 21:46, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 29 October 2021

THIS IS WRONG AND FACK NEWS. 2405:205:C8E7:74AD:A502:A159:B4C9:212 (talk) 03:50, 29 October 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Cannolis (talk) 05:20, 29 October 2021 (UTC)

Correction and a suggestion on "9 Wider public reaction to the rivalry"

The main summary article box is showing T20I wins for Pakistan 6 and India 2 whereas it should be the reverse with "India 6 and Pakistan 2". This is obviously not an unintentional error. I am not sure how but this article will likely need an higher locking tier in the future. Changing the statistics here wont change the actual record for whoever keeps making this changes.

Thanks. That was someone being an idiot. I've reverted it. Blue Square Thing (talk) 16:39, 12 November 2021 (UTC)

Or thought I had, but failed dismally and reverted someone who'd made the change. This is half the problem with stats based articles imo... Blue Square Thing (talk) 16:41, 12 November 2021 (UTC)

Section "9 Wider public reaction to the rivalry"

Should be removed completely as has no relevance to the article in it's current biased form and inaccurate information. This is again a case of vandalism to portray India in a negative light. Firstly, needless to point that if written by Indian's this section would become bigger than the article itself. Some examples that could be added would be the case of 1996 WC quarterfinal where the Pakistani team faced serious abuses and could not even return directly to Pakistan. I mean I do not even want to waste time highlighting all the negativity around this unnecessary addition by someone on the other side.

Well, as I wrote it, I doubt that'll be an issue. I think the section probably needs more historical context and some balance - did one of the old Pakistani bowlers (don't recall which one) also do something stupid on social media recently? The whole cricket diplomacy bit probably needs stuff added about as well - it's in the lead so we should have it in the article body as well. Given the importance of the sport in southern Asia and the way in which the two countries have interacted through it beyond the cricket pitch, I think this is probably important to have in the article. Blue Square Thing (talk) 16:39, 12 November 2021 (UTC)

Further more abuses against our Hero Mohammad Shami originated on twitter with around 8 tweets from Pakistan. This is under serious investigation. While something is being investigated, how can this be added to encyclopedic article with some citations from news? Here is a link on how the issue was spread like fake news by being picked up by negative elements in the Pakistan media and online social media circles. Again a citation which is not backed by official investigations. One can find non reliable citations or even create one to add here. Some parts are accurate but again not proven or verifiable at this point. This is why a section like this section is not warranted at this time in it's current state. In my personal opinion, all the hooliganism is mostly created by media and people on both sides, though disappointed do not venture out to harm or hurt their respective players in most cases.

https://theprint.in/opinion/hate-against-shami-bangladesh-violence-kashmir-targeting-disinformation-our-greatest-threat/759880/ — Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|Jimmyoneway (talk) 15:18, 12 November 2021 (UTC)]] comment added by Jimmyoneway (talk • contribs) 13:39, 12 November 2021 (UTC)

I'm not quite sure that I follow the argument here. How would you rewrite the section? Blue Square Thing (talk) 16:39, 12 November 2021 (UTC)

Tournament Missing

Under summary of results, where the tournament wins by each side are listed, the World Championship of Cricket is not listed. India had won the tournament, Pakistan has not. I also think adding test maces would be a positive change to the article. India has 6 to their name, Pakistan has 1.

World Championship of Cricket - https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/benson-hedges-world-championship-of-cricket-1984-85-60849/india-vs-pakistan-final-65731/full-scorecard Stright16 (talk) 20:27, 31 December 2022 (UTC)

Violation of WP:NPOV and WP:DUE as well as WP:COATRACK.

The article is about sports and the there is a line in the lede "After each terrorist attack in India, it was revealed that these terrorist attacks were planned by Pakistan, ISI, and Pakistan-based terrorist organisations."

It completely fails WP:NPOV and WP:UNDUE. Also the sources appended are mostly from Indian websites and content of the sources in question appears to contain extremely biased or inflammatory language, and does not meet the standard for reliable and neutral sources. The line has to be removed from the lede in the very least. 39.41.180.160 (talk) 19:05, 16 June 2023 (UTC)