Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Palestine/Archive 5

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Blood Libel at Deir Yassin

Just FYI. More here. Ceedjee (talk) 23:06, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

New featured picture

Newly featured: a woman from Ramallah, c. 1898-1914.

Dropping by with good news. Best wishes, Durova^Charge! 08:05, 17 August 2008 (UTC)

Yes, excellent job! We'll list in the hall of fame. --Al Ameer son (talk) 16:48, 17 August 2008 (UTC)

Unappropriate move

1948 Palestinian exodus to 1948 Migration of Arabs from the Region of Palestine
I took care of Shevashalosh last week. I would highly appreciate if this case could be dealt by others...
Thx. Ceedjee (talk) 17:38, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

Seems to be done by user:Gatoclass. Ceedjee (talk) 17:39, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

Jerusalem Arab aspect

Hi guys just wanted to inform you that we need to get cracking on one of our top-importance articles: Jerusalem. Part of the reason it was demoted was because it lacked enough mention on Arab culture and to an extent the Arab impact on the city. Bethlehem has its own culture (embroidery, costumes, foods, mother-of-pearl carvings, etc.), as does Hebron (glass, costumes), Nablus (desserts, costumes, soap) and I'm pretty sure Gaza, Jenin, Ramallah, Nazareth and other cities do as well. So doesn't a city larger and more prominent than all of the above have its own distinct culture? Don't they have special costumes, perhaps foods (I know ka'ak qudsiyyeh is one of them) or certain product(s) or practice(s) that Jerusalemites are known for? If we could make a subsection on Jerusalem's Palestinian culture, it would drastically improve the article and it would be on the way back to FA status. --Al Ameer son (talk) 23:23, 28 August 2008 (UTC)

That article is huge. I suggest starting more articles. --Timeshifter (talk) 23:32, 28 August 2008 (UTC)

If there's enough for a separate article, great, but even so there should be at least one or two solid paragraphs about Jerusalem arts, traditions, food, dress, scholarship, in the main entry. LamaLoLeshLa (talk) 01:11, 29 August 2008 (UTC)

Yes. I think there is enough material out there for several spinout articles. See WP:SPINOUT. --Timeshifter (talk) 05:48, 29 August 2008 (UTC)

That's a good idea, but I also agree with LamaLoLeshLa about adding one or two paragraphs on Jerusalem Arab (as well as Old Yishuv) culture. I haven't looked into it, but I know that Jerusalem ka'ak bread (See Ka'ak#Ka'ak bread) is a unique feature of Jerusalemite Arab culture. --Al Ameer son (talk) 21:35, 29 August 2008 (UTC)

After reading this section again I realize I wasn't clear. I think that there should be summaries in the main article, Jerusalem, and there should be "Further info" links to various spinout articles. --Timeshifter (talk) 05:47, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

New template for depopulated villages

User:Nick Finnsbury has made a new template. Just copy the text {{Villages depopulated during the Arab–Israeli conflict}} at the end of the page in question to add it to relevant articles and here it is for those who want to see it up close:

Cool, eh? Tiamut^talk 23:15, 10 September 2008 (UTC)

Yea, I just thanked him. We've been wanting one since May 2007. Looking at the template really makes you think: We need start a crap-load of more articles on these villages especially in the Safad District. --Al Ameer son (talk) 23:18, 10 September 2008 (UTC)

Yup. So many villages, so little time. Tiamut^talk 23:19, 10 September 2008 (UTC)

Wow. Thanks for posting this here. I just added it to my user page. --Timeshifter (talk) 05:43, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

{{Infobox Former Arab villages in Palestine
|name=Al-Zeeb
|image=Az-Zeeb remains.JPG
|imgsize=250
|caption=The remains of az-Zeeb; Currently used as a restroom/shower for beach visitors
|arname=الزيب
|meaning="Trickster"
|altSp=Achzib, Al-Zib, Az-Zeeb
|district=ac
|population=1,910
|popyear=1945
|area=12,440
|areakm=12.4
|date=[[May 14]], [[1948]]
|cause=M
|*=
|**=
|curlocl=[[Gesher HaZiv]], [[Sa'ar]], [[Leman]]
}}

Hello, I have started adding the template. It goes very quick. You just put it in, and when it is in, you use the template to navigate to the next page on the list.

(((Error discovered:al-Bira is near Ramallah, but is listet under Baysan district. I have finished the Baysan district))

I know you arabs like colours in shade of green, so perhaps you may like to add other colours? It is all your template now. Personally I like the yellow/orange colour in Palestinian People. I tell you were I fould the template. Namely on the page Chalk. I am not sure what it is doing there, but it is a nice template, and the very latest in code/ the most modern that Wikipedia has to offer. I would personally vote for a complete revamp of all the pages in the same design and colour. This yellow/orange I talked about, could that be an acceptable compromise? Or would you opt for the green? also the white stitches in on the Template:Islam is very nice. This is something the arabs are well known for, their beutiful ornamentation and art, and I have no doubt that you could make your pages some of the most beutiful on wikipedia. Yours sincerely Nick Finnsbury (talk) 21:10, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

Wikipedia 0.7 articles have been selected for Palestine-related

A collection of Wikipedia articles is being collected together as Wikipedia 0.7. This collection will be released on DVD later this year, and will be available for free download. The Wikipedia:Version 1.0 Editorial Team has made an automated selection of articles for Version 0.7.

We would like to ask you to review the articles selected from this project. These were chosen from the articles with this project's talk page tag, based on the rated importance and quality. If there are any specific articles that should be removed, please let us know at Wikipedia talk:Version 0.7. You can also nominate additional articles for release, following the procedure at Wikipedia:Release Version Nominations.

A list of selected articles with cleanup tags, sorted by project, is available. The list is automatically updated each hour when it is loaded. Please try to fix any urgent problems in the selected articles; a team of copyeditors has agreed to help improve the writing upon request.

We would also appreciate your help in identifying the version of each article that you think we should use, to help avoid vandalism or POV issues. These versions can be recorded at this project's subpage of User:SelectionBot/0.7. We are planning to release the selection for the holiday season, so we ask you to select the revisions before October 20. At that time, we will use an automatic process to identify which version of each article to release, if no version has been manually selected. Thanks! For the Wikipedia 1.0 Editorial team, SelectionBot 03:15, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

Beit Hanoun

The United Nations has just released its final report on the 2006 shelling of Beit Hanoun‎: [http://domino.un.org/unispal.nsf/22f431edb91c6f548525678a0051be1d/eaeae82c6c256519852574c5005427ce!OpenDocument HUMAN RIGHTS SITUATION IN PALESTINE AND OTHER OCCUPIED ARAB TERRITORIES], Report of the high-level fact-finding mission to Beit Hanoun established under Council resolution S-3/1, A/HRC/9/26, United Nations Human Rights Council, September 1, 2008.

I've added this to the articles Beit Hanoun and 2006 shelling of Beit Hanoun‎. The later is a rather crass example of blaming the victims. Could somebody spare some eyes and have a look at it?

Cheers and thanks, pedrito - talk - 16.09.2008 07:28

New design To go in all the depopulated village pages

This was a village that have no infobox before. The infobox now can display houses standing before and after, as well as the name of the operation and the brigade, all for the sake of giving an overview. It is very easy to put it in. On the edit page you simply type 'Infobox Arab villages depopulated' instead of the old name 'Infobox:Former.....' - and all the information comes in automatically, except for things as the following, where this code should be inserted:

• |crusn= Crusadername
• |oper = Operation
• |brig = Brigade
• |house = number of houses, usually in 1931. (I am unsure of the 1948 number)
• |year1 = that will mostly be 1931
• |housest = houses standing after israelis have taken over
• |year2 = often 1948, could be f. ex 1955
• |structst =structures standing. This is things like schools,mosques ans shrines.
• |year3=mostly left empty
• |rel=Different Religions.

I am almost done with Acre District, Baysan is quickly done, and then I will continue, and will at the same time put the above mentioned Template in.~Yours sincerely Nick Finnsbury (talk) 16:25, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

I love the structure of the infobox, but would it be possible if we restore the olive green color to the upper two sections of the infobox and remove the Israel logos from the lower half? --Al Ameer son (talk) 16:45, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

It is the same colourscheme ad in Palestinian People. These are warm and harmonic colours, also called 'earth-colours'- basic colours that appeal to most people. I know you like green very much, but what we have to keep in mind, is to create a page that appeal to as many people as possible. What is the idea of getting people to know about something, if the colours and the general design do not appeal to them? It is rule number one in any PR - ask Edward Bernais - that you do not start about antagonising potential klients and interested parties, and the fact is that it is mostly arabs that love these sharp green colours. As it is now - with this new colourscheme, that I have used hours to develop, the sharp green colour, tou talk about, would completely ruin the rest, and not at all be harmonic.

With regards to the 'Operation/Brigade'-section, I intentionally wanted a contrast, and I first looked at sharp blue that they have in their flag, but this was just too much of a contrast, so I opted - again after extensive trawling of different wikipedia pages - for the less obvious blue. Of cause one could discuss if the logos are too much, in your view it is, but in my view it tells to people surfing the web or wikipedia and suddenly lands on this page, who the opponent are, and what they have done. It is in my view necessary to identify the opponent. To you it is evident, and you hate that opponent --that is because you are part of the conflict. But again, to insure a wider appeal, I would opt for keeping the logos there as well. Yours sincerely Nick Finnsbury (talk) 17:23, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

Hi Nick. Speaking for myself, I don't hate anyone, though I do deeply distrust governments and militaries (all of them, without exception). In any case, it's probably better not to make speculative generalizations about what Arabs do and do not like, since it's very hard to get such statements right (and even if you mean it only to be empathetic or nice or whatever, it can be offensive to lots of different parties).

About the box, I like it. I don't like the logos, and don't really care about which colours are used (the ones you picked are nice, green is nice too). I think though, we need to make sure its features for optional listings and stuff like that are on par with the old table. I'll try to take a look at that soon myself. Thanks for your efforts. Tiamut^talk 16:32, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Could we have some consensus on the logos? It has nothing to do with "hating my enemies" but the coat of arms of Israel represents its government, national institutions, etc., and shouldn't symbolize or illustrate a military campaign since there is always at least two parties (Arabs and Israel) involved not just one (Israel). --Al Ameer son (talk) 22:23, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Old books and pictures

First, books: A lot of old books have come online these last 2-3 years, thatnks to google-books, gutenberg.org, U.of Michigan, etc. I have collected the ones I have found here: User:Huldra/Sources (scroll down). This file is being continously updated.. My interest was really started by the Khalidi and Weir-books: they use a lot of old sources, which earlier was often difficult to get hold of, but are now freely available on the net. If anybody know more relevant books available on the net: feel free to add. I also wondered if we perhaps could have a more permanent sub-page with books listed? (I´m going for the same over at the IP-project)

Also, I have gotten hold of a few old books, like:

• Tristram, H. B. (1865): The land of Israel: Travels in Palestine. List of illustrations

• William McClure Thomson, (1859): The Land and the Book: Or, Biblical Illustrations Drawn from the Manners and Customs, the Scenes and Scenery, of the Holy Land Vol II List of engravings in vol II

These books are illustrated. Now, they are on google, but I am not sure we can use those google-pictures on WP for copy-right-reason. Anyway, since I have the books I can easily scan them and I have already uploaded a few to commons, see here. So, if anybody find a picture they would like uploaded, (look at the two lists of illustrations) -then give me a word. Regards, Huldra (talk) 00:44, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

I was bold and started this subpage:

Wikipedia:WikiProject Palestine/Sources

I linked to it from the top box of the project page: Wikipedia:WikiProject Palestine.

The Commons has several places where one can ask about image copyrights, etc.. For example; commons:Commons:Help desk. Fair use rules would apply for some images uploaded to Wikipedia. --Timeshifter (talk) 17:04, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, Timeshifter! I will add to the list as I find the books. I have also added some which are not (yet) available, but which are often referred to. And since the copyright has expired, we can hope that they will become available on the net soon. I´m thinking of books like Canaan, T (1927): Mohammedan Saints and Sanctuaries in Palestine, and Guy le Strange (1890): "Palestine under the Moslems." In fact, I have a copy of that last book (extremely useful!) ..and I have started uploading some pages to the commons. (I am greatly tempted to donate the whole book to gutenberg.org. Well, we´ll see.) Regards, Huldra (talk) 04:54, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

What about getting some pictures from 'Palestine Remembered'?

Now, when the talk is about pictures. **Palestine remembered have some very good pictures, which would enhance any article of which they are a part. Those pictures about people visiting the villages, where they come from, are very moving, and I for one could well imagine how they could give a boost to one of the many articles , that I at the moment are editing with regard to infoboxes. More often than not, there is no pictures on these pages, so what would be more apprpriate tahn asking the editor of 'Palestine Remembered' if you could loan the pictures and upload them to wikipedia? I realy can't see why not;they and we all share the same goal: To make people aware abot what happened 3 score years ago, and it is a fact that a good picture probably account for more than 50 %, in the overall impression of an article, as well as the information value. A picture can say more than many words - it is the first you notice on a page.Nick Finnsbury (talk) 17:05, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

The depopulated village-pages could do with some maps

Zhejiang province

When reading about something for the fiorst time, you want to know: Where is it? Where was this baysan district situated exactly, and where in Baysan was this village exactly? That is what I did in the danish version of this page Xihoumen Bridge (see:http://da.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xihoumen-broen). Right at the beginning presenting two maps, first showing where the province is in China, and then another map over that province, with the offshore-islands - where the bridge is - marked. In this way the reader learns something about chinese geography as well. Remember that the human being very much orientates himself through vision and images, and will allways first look at the images before centering on the text. Therefore we need to do him a service, by quickly presenting him about information in a visual way, about where exactly the relevant village is situated.

Update: I have as of today introduced a new colour to the headline/villagename. This colour is similar to the colour-scheme in Palestinian people, which I think is very nice. Also today I have added a new (optional) field, about Public owned dunams. Only sometimes it is relevant to mention, like in the case of Jabbul, where people seing

• Area 15,127 dunums (15.1 km²)
• Arab owned 5,407 dunums
• Jewish owned 20 dunums

-will wonder, who owns the rest:

• Public owned 9,700 dunums

Yours sincerely Nick Finnsbury (talk) 05:53, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

Image needs replacement

Hello all...

An image used in the Elias Chacour article, specifically Image:Abuna small.jpg, has a little bit of a licensing issue. The image was uploaded back when the rules around image uploading were less restrictive. It is presumed that the uploader was willing to license the picture under the GFDL license but was not clear in that regard. As such, the image, while not at risk of deletion, is likely not clearly licensed to allow for free use in any future use of this article. If anyone has an image that can replace this, or can go take one and upload it, it would be best.

You have your mission, take your camera and start clicking.--Jordan 1972 (talk) 00:53, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Christian Zionism in the United Kingdom

Can someone tell me who gave this a B (rather than start) rating as part of your project? Slrubenstein | Talk 15:30, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

The article appears to have been created and edited solely by User:Arthur Warrington Thomas, who also put the B rating tag on the Talk page. I don't think he is a member of this project, though he states on his user page that he is a member of WikiProject Islam. I agree that this is an inappropriate rating for this page. The fact that it listed Eric Moonman, the president of the Zionist Federation of Great Britain and Ireland, as a "Prominent British Christian Zionist", suggests that the research behind the article is unreliable; and the style is certainly unsuitable for an encyclopaedia. RolandR (talk) 15:57, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

I asked because I would have thought that there would be some kind of collective process or discussion before a Wikiproject assigned a rating. I too am not part of WikiProject Palestine, so it isn't really any of my business, and I am not familiar with the topic - but I take your word for it about Eric Moonman. I too have concerns about the quality of the article and its "encyclopediality." If it is part of WikiProject Palestine perhaps people who are active in this project can either fix it, or help identify the areas of concern, or propose an appropriate course of action. Slrubenstein | Talk 17:36, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

The article is not even with our project's scope. It should be removed. I trust no one could disagree on this, correct? --Al Ameer son (talk) 21:41, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

Well, like I said I am not part of this project so it is not for me to say, but if you are right that the article is not within your project's scope ... well, I would think then the template should not have been added. Slrubenstein | Talk 23:42, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

assistance request

Hello friends. I have just created the article Abdul Latif Tibawi. I leave this note in case anyone would like to add it to Wikiproject Palestine because I don't know how to do it myself! Also someone may wish to check whether Taybeh is indeed near Tulkerm as I myself do not know. Thanks. Langdell (talk) 02:20, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

Its near Ramallah and I did some minor copyeditting. Oh and I added a project tag. --Al Ameer son (talk) 04:17, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

Article on Bedouins of the territories

Like Negev Bedouins, I think we should create an article on Bedouins in the Palestinian territories or Palestinian Bedouins. There are six main tribes: Jahalin, Ka'abina, Ibn Ubeid, Rashayida, Sawahira and Ta'amira. Sami Hadawi gives some info on their 1945 populations and the amount of land they controlled or lived on here and [1].

There's some info on them here also [2]. There are articles on the villages of 'Arab al-Jahalin and 'Arab al-Rashayida. Also, Tuqu', Za'atara, Khirbet al-Deir, al-Asakra, Beit Ta'mir and 12 other hamlets make-up the holdings of the 'Arab al-Ta'amira. --Al Ameer son (talk) 23:22, 4 November 2008 (UTC)

Message

First Crusade has been nominated for a featured article review. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. Please leave your comments and help us to return the article to featured quality. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, articles are moved onto the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Remove" the article from featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Reviewers' concerns are here. OpenSeven (talk) 17:12, 9 November 2008 (UTC)

Foreign relations template

can someone create a template along the lines of:

But for Palestine specifically. Much to the effect of other states on here. (I am creating on for India-Palestine at the moment, there must be on with israel, jordan, saudi, iraq, usa, uk, etc) Lihaas (talk) 00:36, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

POV cleanup

I just cleaned this article Israeli Apartheid Week and removed the POV tag. someone can now check it's article status.

Map needed

Also a map is needed for Indo-Palestinian relations. Would be nice if someone can do those. Lihaas (talk) 22:05, 20 November 2008 (UTC)

Rashid Khalidi and the PLO

I have made what I believe to be is a fair, accurate, well sourced description of both sides of the controversy here Rashid Khalidi#Controversy regarding relationships with militant organizations. I would appreciate your input here Talk:Rashid Khalidi#New section on militant organizations. Thank you. -- Avi (talk) 20:53, 23 November 2008 (UTC)

Articles needing geographical coordinates

Category:West Bank articles missing geocoordinate data and Category:Gaza Strip articles missing geocoordinate data contain lists of articles about places that curently lack geographic coordinates.

Adding coordinates to these articles will allow users of Google Maps and other location-aware services to find these articles on maps, as well as putting them into Wikipedia's own internal atlas.

The articles are all marked with {{coord missing}} tags, which need replacing with {{coord}} tags that contain their latitude/longitude coordinates -- alternatively, you might want to enter the coordinates into an infobox, before removing the {{coord missing}} tag. You can find out how to do this at the Wikipedia:Geocoding how-to for WikiProject members. Please let me know if this is useful! -- The Anome (talk) 14:22, 25 November 2008 (UTC)

RfC on Rashid Khalidi

Comments would be appreciated after reviewing the evidence here: Talk:Rashid Khalidi. Thank you. -- Avi (talk) 20:53, 30 November 2008 (UTC)

Rachel Corrie

Help needed on Rachel Corrie Page important links constantly being deleted

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rachel_Corrie

Rachel’s Letters http://www.ifamericansknew.org/download/rachels_letters.pdf

Rachel Corrie: Myths and Facts "...to dispel some common myths that have often crept into media coverage regarding Rachel’s death ... with the cooperation of Rachel’s family, we have prepared this fact sheet along with clearly referenced sources" http://www.rachelswords.org/multimedia/Myths_and_Facts_Final.pdf —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kasaalan (talk • contribs) 09:27, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

Of all things ... Hummus

WikiProject Israel has already been informed by another editor [3], and I just posted about this at the I-P collaboration page too.

There's a problem at Hummus, as some of may know. Two main issues: 1) Whether or not the word Palestine can be used in the article 2) How much space should be accorded to the controversy over how Hummus became a part of Israeli cuisine, and the way to phrase it etc.

Anyway, thought you should all know that discussion at Talk:Hummus is actively underway to find solutions to these issues before the page is unprotected. I should caution any who wish to be involved that an admin has threatened to unilaterally block anyone who edits outside of consensus after article protection is lifted. Welcome to the wonderful world of Israel-Palestine collaboration! Tiamut^talk 20:47, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

Merging of Arab villages to current locality

Please let your views be known about this. See: Talk:Arab al-Samniyya, Talk:Kafr Lam, etc. Chesdovi (talk) 14:03, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

Against as most are actually in different locations and consequently have absolutely no connection with the modern Israeli equivalent...Ashley kennedy3 (talk) 10:22, 23 December 2008 (UTC)

Several Palestinian Arab towns/villages, of the exodus, previously incorporated within Israeli towns/villages should have the Palestinian exodus info box and template included within the present location as a standard..As in Ein Kerem.Ashley kennedy3 (talk) 14:16, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

If the info box and template are found to be onerous for inclusion in the merge articles then the articles should be de-merged...Ashley kennedy3 (talk) 16:23, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

I don't see what the problem is anymore. This has been discussed in the talk pages of Kafr Lam, Salama, Amqa, Bayt Naqquba, and several other destroyed/depopulated village articles. They are not in the same exact location. Also, many villages like al-Jib have had Biblical pasts and so the article on al-Jib has a "See also" link for Gibeon. Same with 'Atara and Ataroth, Lajjun and Legio and Maximianpolis and Kibbutz Megiddo (Actually the latter is located to the north of Lajjun). --Al Ameer son (talk) 19:07, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

This is becoming the WP equivalent of "Kilroy was here"...you see it lots of places, but you don´t really see the point. Hardly ever (anytime??) was the "full" 1948-village -land taken over by one settlement... as has been pointed out before. If Chesdovi so strongly feel like merging articles, why doesn´t he take a look at Nitzanim (1943-49), Nitzanim Youth Village (1949-90) and Nitzan (end-1990s-present)...Now, there is work for him! Regards, Huldra (talk) 09:43, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

Moving Gaza to "Gaza City"

There is currently a poll and discussion in the Gaza article about whether or not Gaza should be moved to Gaza City to avoid confusion. Please post your opinion on the talk page at Talk:Gaza#Requested move. Thank you. --Al Ameer son (talk) 02:52, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Siege of Jerusalem (1948)

Seems to be a developing dispute on this page. Ceedjee has tagged it for neutrality on the basis that he thinks the title is POV. A very brief discussion of the issues a few months ago resulted in "no consensus". Maybe a few people with some familiarity with this period could take a look? Thanks, Gatoclass (talk) 13:46, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

I don't think it is important to be familiar with this period.

My point is that we must follow what wp:rs secondary sources (of academic level) use as title to describe the events.

I provided numerous of these and given the title has not been moved, I just wanted to use the pov-tag...

Ceedjee (talk) 18:16, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Gaza image licence requires translation

Apologies if this is not the appropriate place for this request. There is an image of casualties which is used in the article 2008–2009 Israel–Gaza conflict which comes from Arabic Wikipedia. The copyright on the picture is unclear, because the original licence is in Arabic. Can somebody who can read the original licence please transfer it to English Wikipedia, or, alternatively, delete the image if it is a copyright violation? The image on Arabic and English wikipedia are here:

• http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Gaza_2008.jpg
• http://ar.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D9%85%D9%84%D9%81:Gaza_criminal_Dec_2008_-2.jpg

Thank you. cojoco (talk) 22:53, 11 January 2009 (UTC)

I've seen the image on news sites so I assume it was taken by an AP or Reuters photographer, rendering it a copyright violation. So, I don't think it's going to last and it's a damn shame we have nothing to illustrate the suffering in Gaza. Nonetheless, I think someone who could read Arabic should translate what its says on the image description on Arabic wikipedia. --Al Ameer son (talk) 01:53, 12 January 2009 (UTC)

Gaza Devotion period

We are all aware of the recent attacks against the Gaza Strip by the Israelis and I'm sure we are deeply affected by the horrendous amount of death and destruction being wrought there. There is not much that we as Wiki editors could do about the conflict except make sure the article on the events and its sub-articles are written in detail and with NPOV. I commend the editors of this project for keeping their emotions out of the articles, as hard as that may be. Frankly, the bare facts are horrific enough. This conflict must end sometime (right now it seems like there's no end in sight). But when it finally does end I call for a period of collaborative and independent devotion to all and any articles related to Gaza, the destroyed villages of the District of Gaza and the surviving cities and villages of the Gaza Strip, as well as its refugee camps, historical sites, mosques, churches, neighborhoods, infrastructure, and notable and/or historic people from the area. Let's bring facts, quality and neutrality to all the violent incidents perpetrated against the cities of the Strip from those that occurred decades ago to the ongoing one. Create new quality articles, and expand, reference and copyedit the present ones. The Great Mosque of Gaza has passed its GA review today, and I've noticed recent expansion of articles on destroyed Gazan villages (Barbara and Yasur). Just hours ago, I began expanding the history of Gaza (article could use a lot of work). It's a great start.

Unfortunately, our efforts will not protect Gaza's women and children, but they should be our way of showing solidarity with Gaza, the largest Palestinian city, the glory of Palestine, making sure that readers from all over the planet get a delightful insight of Gaza's astonishing history and the prosperity it once had. God bless. --Al Ameer son (talk) 04:33, 12 January 2009 (UTC)

Very good suggestion Al Ameer son, I do agree on what you said. And I'll initiate this very same project on Ar-Wp, and of course I'll put reference to your name thereof. As a member of Wikiproject Palestine (with very minimal contribtions) I am proud of working with you.Yamanam (talk) 07:37, 12 January 2009 (UTC)

Great idea Al Ameer son. Just before Christmas, I was going to start working on villages in Gaza (I think I had a premonition of the destruction to come). The latest massacre hit before I got started. I've been working on the main article on the conflict, but you are right to suggest that a broader focus on all Gaza-related articles would be a good tribute. My solidarity and prayers go out to our people. Tiamut^talk 14:25, 12 January 2009 (UTC)

Yes, good idea, Al Ameer son...I will continue to work on the 1948 Gaza-villages, Take care, everybody, Huldra (talk) 04:02, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

Al-Fakhura school incident

Unfortunately, this page has no pictures. Another editor is considering contacting the UN adminstration itself about this. We would appricate anyone's advice.

As well, the page needs to be rated in terms of importance and in terms of quality. Could anyone here take a look at that? Thanks. The Squicks (talk) 20:06, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

Is there a war on Wikipedia

Israel Lobby Watch EI exclusive: a pro-Israel group's plan to rewrite history on Wikipedia Report, The Electronic Intifada, 21 April 2008

A pro-Israel pressure group is orchestrating a secret, long-term campaign to infiltrate the popular online encyclopedia Wikipedia to rewrite Palestinian history, pass off crude propaganda as fact, and take over Wikipedia administrative structures to ensure these changes go either undetected or unchallenged. A series of emails by members and associates of the pro-Israel group CAMERA (Committee for Accuracy in Middle East Reporting in America), provided to The Electronic Intifada (EI), indicate the group is engaged in what one activist termed a "war" on Wikipedia.

"We will go to war"

Zeq, however, counsels CAMERA operatives to be patient and lie low until they build up their strength. "We will go to war after we have build our army, equiped it trained [sic]," he wrote on 9 April. "So please if you want to win this war help us build ou[r] army. let's not just rush in and achieve nothing, or abit more than nothing [sic]."

Electronic Intifada Israel Lobby Watch Download CAMERA's emails [PDF - 2.7 MB] Download additional CAMERA emails [PDF - 1 MB]

I didn't make a research on this issue yet so I am not sure how serious the act is, or how well organised, but you may concern for these acts more than I do. Kasaalan (talk) 14:16, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

We have been over this numerous times. Those editors were ostracized, sealed off, and/or banned with extreme predjuice in a Stalinist style purge of Wikipedia. In the aftermath, numerous Jewish non-Israeli and Isreali internet users are now dissauded from editing Wikipedia in fear of falling victim to a future purge. The Squicks (talk) 15:38, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

See Committee_for_Accuracy_in_Middle_East_Reporting_in_America#Wikipedia_campaign. Frankly, the idea that "more Israeli editiors" -> "we should forcibly reduce the number of Israeli editors for balance" seems completely silly to me. Why not "more Israeli editors" -> "We need to get more Palestinians involved for balance, the more editors total the better"?

There was no "Stalinist style purge". The decision to ban and block users involved in this POV campaign is here: Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents/Statement re Wikilobby campaign. No Jewish, Israeli or any others should feel dissuaded from editing. Everyone is welcome as long as they abide by Wiki guidelines and policies. Tiamut^talk 15:53, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

To call the indefinite blocking of User:Zeq (the only significant sanction undertaken) from the project a "Stalinist purge" is a breath-taking misunderstanding of the case. Zeq had been on a damaging rampage through articles for years (pulled up for removing well-sourced information and tendention by ArbCom in 2006[4], [5], banned from Palestinian exodus and placed on probation.) He turned to disruption of Palestinian right of return (closely related to the Palestinian exodus) where he move-warred it to dubious titles[6], edit-warred argumentative language into the lede[7], [8], [9] and edit-warred a distinction between real "refugees" and descendants of refugees, despite the results of an RfC with mountain of sources (see Talk:Palestinian_right_of_return#RfC:_Descendants) showing that this distinction is not widely adopted, and is specifically disclaimed by scholars of international law[10], [11], [12]. Zeq drove off numerous good editors and broke the patience of at least one good administrator[13] with his tendentious conduct - and, despite the obvious nature of what he was doing, admins and others protected him eg here. This despite the fact that he flaunted his illiteracy[14] and inserted essays such as this. Which he reinserted once and then again. Not only did it appear to be aimed inciting hatred and fear but some of the references (eg this, the last one) were utterly worthless, denying the very allegations they claimed to be supporting.

So what's actually going on here and now? In several different places, there are editors attempting to whitewash CAMERA (with whom Zeq conspired to subvert the workings of the project) and put the blame on EI, who played a vital part in protecting our work! The fact is, the project needs a Stalinist purge - it needs to target those elements who are again proving their total lack of integrity. PR^talk 12:32, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

The fact is, the project needs a Stalinist purge Хорошего Дня The Squicks (talk) 19:00, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

WikiNews or WeakNews on Gaza Invasion

Lately I read some of the breaking news, and reports about Gaza invasion in Wikipedia In The News Section and in Wikinews. And I can say some of the reports are clearly off-balance one sided arguments in report style. I helped balacing some of them but not have much time for news reporting. Might there be any volunteers that can help wikinews publish more neutral articles. But being neutral as a real journalist should be the first priority, than being a sided view like IDF based sources apparently do. Kasaalan (talk) 14:16, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Photograph request - British consulate in East Jerusalem

Hi! Would anyone mind photographing the British Consulate in East Jerusalem?

It is at 19 Nashashibi Street, Sheikh Jarrah Quarter in Jerusalem - http://ukinjerusalem.fco.gov.uk/en/

As security is tight around there, please be careful if you choose to photograph the mission - thanks :) WhisperToMe (talk) 07:22, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Palestine's President is doing a great job...

Whoever he is. :P I kid, I kid. But, seriously, our article on disputed President Abdel Aziz Duwaik rely could use some work, if anyone out there has good refs. Right now it has two refs only. Unfortunately, there are about as many ways to spell his name as there are names for God, and I'm not feeling too up to the task. Good luck. -- Kendrick7^talk 05:06, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

2008 Israel–Gaza conflict

Timeline of the 2008–2009 Israel–Gaza conflict does not provide background info for the war article: 2008–2009 Israel–Gaza conflict.

2008 Israel–Gaza conflict is the background article to 2008–2009 Israel–Gaza conflict.

See also: 2004 Israel–Gaza conflict, 2006 Israel-Gaza conflict, 2007–2008 Israel–Gaza conflict, and 2008 Israel–Gaza conflict

Without warning or consensus someone tried to delete 2008 Israel–Gaza conflict by merging it into 2007–2008 Israel–Gaza conflict. He redirected 2008 Israel–Gaza conflict to 2007–2008 Israel–Gaza conflict. This is not a good idea and has been changed back to separate articles.

2007–2008 Israel–Gaza conflict is too long in my opinion, and needs to have the 2008 material moved out. There are several other articles with 2008 info. The info from those articles can be summarized and added to 2008 Israel–Gaza conflict. The other articles can be kept since they provide more info.

For more info on those other articles and more please see:

• Talk:2007–2008 Israel–Gaza conflict#2008 material for 2008 Israel–Gaza conflict

Additional input and editing is requested.

The 2007-2008 article can be renamed to 2007 Israel–Gaza conflict. --Timeshifter (talk) 16:20, 27 January 2009 (UTC)

THe Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine

I was trying to create a stand-alone article about The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine, but the page got deleted and then merged with Ilan Pappe's book The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine. I think that this issue is of high importance as most of us, Palestinian people, heard such stories from our parents, grandparents, and relatives who did literally lived this ethnic cleansing that resulted in the Palestinian Catastrophe. Is there any suggestion on how to retrieve the said article? Yamanam (talk) 13:54, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

Yamanam,

Ilan Pappé is the only one new historian who considers that the whole 1948 Palestinian exodus was an ethnic cleansing.

Benny Morris openly (and I think some other but indirectly) considers the second half was an ethnic cleansing but that the first part resulted of the cumulative effects of the civil war.

Given what says wp:rs secondary sources about these events, the move you suggest is not possible.

There is the article 1948 Palestinian exodus that deals with the event and there is the book of Ilan Pappé to report his particular (and a little bit extreme in comparison with most other mainstream historians write) pov on the events.

Note that I doubt very much that Palestinians that lived the events talk about ethnic cleansing, which is a relatively new concept; they should rather talk about an expulsion, eventually criminal or illegal or brutal etc. Ceedjee (talk) 21:13, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

Comment on I doubt very much that Palestinians that lived the events talk about ethnic cleansing You can visit this site and watch some of the videos that capture Nakba's Oral History. Even if the ethnic cleansing is a new concept this doesn't mean that it was not exercised on certain people before it was coined. Yamanam (talk) 21:34, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

Please, check wp:rs.

It is not because a concept didn't exist in 1948 that the events of 1948 could not today be labelled as such.

But I am sure that the 1948 refugees didn't claim to have been victims of an ethnic cleansing. I didn't mean more.

Ceedjee (talk) 21:39, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

I know what is wp:rs and I didn't mean to argue u about it nor about what u've mentioned, I only wanted to show u that ethnic cleansing was performed on Palestinian people, once again go to Palestine Rememebered and watch how those people say that they were victims of ethnic cleansing. Yamanam (talk) 21:50, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

Rachel Corrie

Could I ask for outside perspective at that page? After a long absence, IronDuke came back and demonstrated his unhappiness with the changes by reverting several edits that had been thoroughly discussed, with only a token attempt at discussion on one point. arimareiji (talk) 19:30, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

The Skies are Weeping

Philip Munger

Phil Goldvarg

Talk:Phil Goldvarg

Artistic Tributes to Rachel Corrie

Linda McCarriston

Can I have any help for impoving the articles related to Rachel Corrie. I created the articles, and found proper sources, yet the information is still needs to be edited and improved. Kasaalan (talk) 21:14, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

Milestone Announcements

All WikiProjects are invited to have their "milestone-reached" announcements automatically placed onto Wikipedia's announcements page. Milestones could include the number of FAs, GAs or articles covered by the project. No work need be done by the project themselves; they just need to provide some details when they sign up. A bot will do all of the hard work. Click here for more information or to sign your project up.

I thought this WikiProject might be interested. Ping me with any specific queries or leave them on the page linked to above. Thanks! - Jarry1250 ^{(t, c)} 22:12, 1 February 2009 (UTC)

Arabian Peninsula Article

This is the main Wikipedia article for Arabia and the Arabian subcontinent. There has been a continual edit war over the inclusion of historical or geographical material about Syria and Palestine being part of Arabia or Ottoman Arabistan. A Request for comment is currently open on the talk page. harlan (talk) 14:13, 6 February 2009 (UTC)

GA Reassessment of Israeli West Bank barrier

Israeli West Bank barrier has been nominated for a good article reassessment. Articles are typically reviewed for one week. Please leave your comments and help us to return the article to good article quality. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status will be removed from the article. Reviewers' concerns are here. --Malleus Fatuorum 19:55, 13 February 2009 (UTC)

Antisemitic incidents - Participation required

• Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Antisemitic incidents during the 2008–2009 Israel–Gaza conflict (2nd nomination)

Ceedjee (talk) 21:21, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

Coordinators' working group

Hi! I'd like to draw your attention to the new WikiProject coordinators' working group, an effort to bring both official and unofficial WikiProject coordinators together so that the projects can more easily develop consensus and collaborate. This group has been created after discussion regarding possible changes to the A-Class review system, and that may be one of the first things discussed by interested coordinators.

All designated project coordinators are invited to join this working group. If your project hasn't formally designated any editors as coordinators, but you are someone who regularly deals with coordination tasks in the project, please feel free to join as well. — Delievered by §hepBot (Disable) on behalf of the WikiProject coordinators' working group at 06:14, 28 February 2009 (UTC)