Talk:Supernatural (British TV series)

Move discussion in progress

There is a move discussion in progress which affects this page. Please participate at Talk:Supernatural (TV series) - Requested move and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RM bot 12:41, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

Wrong series! 81.129.175.158 (talk) 19:15, 20 August 2014 (UTC)

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Requested move 24 April 2016

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: No move. There's no support for this after 7 days, and 70.51.46.195 makes a compelling point that there are other "UK TV series" with the same name, meaning it's WP:INCOMPLETEDAB. — Cúchullain ^t/c 13:53, 2 May 2016 (UTC)

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Supernatural (1977 TV series) → Supernatural (UK TV series) – This has apparently been a contentious area, between this and Supernatural (U.S. TV series) (with several contentious Requested moves at the latter over the years...). Now that the latter has settled at a "(U.S. TV series)" disambiguator, it makes sense to move this one to Supernatural (UK TV series) (as per WP:NCTVUK). In other words, the two articles should both be at "(U.S. TV series)" & "(UK TV series)", or they should both be at "(2005 TV series)" and "(1977 TV series)". --IJBall (contribs • talk) 15:59, 24 April 2016 (UTC)

Survey

Feel free to state your position on the renaming proposal by beginning a new line in this section with *'''Support''' or *'''Oppose''', then sign your comment with ~~~~. Since polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account Wikipedia's policy on article titles.

• Oppose there are two BBC TV programmes by this name, There is also Supernatural: The Unseen Powers of Animals, the 1999 series Supernatural (1999 TV series). The proposed title is ambiguous, and ambiguous disambiguation is a bad idea WP:PRECISE -- 70.51.46.195 (talk) 12:16, 26 April 2016 (UTC)

Discussion

Any additional comments:

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Requested move 10 July 2018

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Not moved. There is a clear absence of consensus for the proposed move after extended discussion. bd2412 T 18:19, 26 July 2018 (UTC)

Supernatural (1977 TV series) → Supernatural (UK TV series) – Per Wikipedia:Naming conventions (television), the two shows should be disambiguated by country, not year. The current US show is correct, this show is not. JE98 (talk) 00:02, 10 July 2018 (UTC) --Relisting. GeoffreyT2000 (talk) 17:59, 18 July 2018 (UTC)

• Procedural objection to speedy move This was requested previously on the talk page in 2016 talk: Supernatural (1977 TV series) and in 2012 at Talk:Supernatural (U.S. TV series)/Archive 2#Requested move (November 2012). There being a second TV show from the UK, from the BBC; Supernatural: The Unseen Powers of Animals; This needs a full discussion. The requested title currently points to the disambiguation page, where both TV shows are listed. -- 65.94.42.168 (talk) 03:35, 10 July 2018 (UTC)

This is a contested technical request (permalink). Anthony Appleyard (talk) 05:20, 10 July 2018 (UTC)

• @JE98 and 65.94.42.168: queried move request Anthony Appleyard (talk) 05:20, 10 July 2018 (UTC)

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@65.94.42.168: I can put a hatnote on Supernatural: The Unseen Powers of Animals referring to this show, as the two shows are clearly different, to solve this issue. JE98 (talk) 16:23, 10 July 2018 (UTC)

• WP:NAMINGCRITERIA The title unambiguously identifies the article's subject and distinguishes it from other subjects. The other TV show carries WP:NATURALDAB at "Supernatural: The Unseen Powers of Animals". This TV show should be should distinct without needing the hatnote, since it isn't a primary topic. The move would imply that this article is a primary topic for a disambiguated title (UK TV series), which fails both WP:AT primary topic and precision. The hatnote serves to to help primary topic otherness and confusion on non-primary topics, not to make non-primary topics into primary topics. -- 65.94.42.168 (talk) 04:35, 11 July 2018 (UTC)
• Support – per WP:NCTVUK. There's certainly no reason that the other series with the subtitle should prevent this as it is clearly a different title. —Joeyconnick (talk) 05:49, 11 July 2018 (UTC)

The other TV series used to be at Supernatural (1999 TV series) until it was moved because of NATURALDAB. Your statement seems to indicate that NATURALDAB does not represent disambiguation, but rather, a completely different topic. Further, if you look at the DVD cover for that TV show, you will notice that the "subtitle" is clearly deemphasised, showing the series is mainly "Supernatural". Indeed that series was created at Supernatural (BBC TV series) yet this TV series is a BBC TV series. -- 65.94.42.168 (talk) 04:28, 12 July 2018 (UTC)

• Neutral – I'd weakly suppotr per WP:NCTVUK (etc.) per reasoning above... However, would "UK TV series" not apply to the British documentary "Supernatural: The Unseen Powers of Animals"? Paintspot Infez (talk) 23:30, 11 July 2018 (UTC)
• Oppose since, obviously, Supernatural: The Unseen Powers of Animals, a BBC series listed at Supernatural (TV series) disambiguation, is also British. Wikiproject-created preferences like WP:NCTV do not trump site-wide basic disambiguation rules.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  02:07, 12 July 2018 (UTC)
• Strong support – disambiguate by country in situations like these, when it is most likely that is how readers will be looking for it, whenever possible. Supernatural: The Unseen Powers of Animals is already WP:NATURALDIS'ed from the rest of these. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 18:30, 14 July 2018 (UTC)
• Oppose. Readers could reasonably expect to find the much more recent series Supernatural: The Unseen Powers of Animals under the title Supernatural (UK TV series), which makes it incomplete disambiguation. It should continue pointing to the dab page.--Cúchullain ^t/c 14:12, 26 July 2018 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Requested move 6 August 2020

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Moved  — Amakuru (talk) 15:32, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

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Supernatural (1977 TV series) → Supernatural (British TV series) – Again bringing it to discussion, as per WP:NCTVUS, trying to disambiguate the article with the country (adjective) is preferable to come first. The other British series doesn't need its year to disambiguate as WP:NATURALDAB. So, a hatnote on New Name page suggesting it (Supernatural: The Unseen Powers of Animals) should solve. What we have now is an (American TV series) article when there is no (Another coutry TV series) article and a (1977 TV series) article when there is no (Another year TV series) article and this problem has to be solved. Cvhcsee (talk) 19:09, 6 August 2020 (UTC)—Relisting. —usernamekiran (talk) 14:03, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

• Oppose - using the year makes it immediately clear to anyone looking for this series that they are at the right location (or inversely, that anyone looking for one of the two more recent series is definitely in the wrong place). -- Netoholic @ 19:58, 6 August 2020 (UTC)
• Strong support – whenever possible we should disambiguate "by country" (this is even "preferred" under WP:NCTV). As the American series is already disambiguated "by country", it makes zero sense not to move this one to "by country" disambiguation as per WP:CONSISTENCY. The other British TV show (and it's properly a "TV programme" not a "TV series" anyway) has a unique title, and so doesn't need further disambig. from the 1977 series, and may not be notable enough for an article in any case. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 20:20, 8 August 2020 (UTC)

  It says "generally preferred", and that addition to the guideline was not done uncontroversially. Its also an option which is rare among other online resources, which more often present the release year(s) prominently as a way to "disambiguate" titles. Nonetheless, since both year and country are supported options, we always look at situations on a case-by-case basis. In this case, there is more to be gained by disambiguating by the year because its the way that this show is most widely-separated from others. Country can be ambiguous because popular shows are shown across the globe in many countries and unpopular shows are only known locally - both good reasons why readers might be not immediately aware of the country of origin of a show. -- Netoholic @ 02:33, 9 August 2020 (UTC)

And readers are even less likely to know a TV show's debut year than they are to know its country of origin. Which is why "by country" disambig. is preferred – more WP:RECOGNIZABLE. And here, there is additionally a WP:CONSISTENCY argument to be made as well. There is zero reason not to move this as proposed. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:01, 9 August 2020 (UTC)

Its not so much about them knowing the country or year (I assume they come here to learn about the shows rather than having foreknowledge) - its about distinguishing the titles enough that the reader can more confidently find the one they are looking for. -- Netoholic @ 16:56, 9 August 2020 (UTC)

• Support. "British TV series" is more recognizable than a year, and more consistent with the American series. A hatnote to the less-viewed British animal series should be sufficient. Station1 (talk) 18:08, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

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The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.