User talk:Drmies/Archive 6

"CoM, stop POV pushing!"

Chinchillas, South American rodents prized for their soft fur, like to celebrate Jack de Gier's birthday on Drmies talk page

Biased loser

Don't send me messages as if you have any intelligence whatsoever. All you do is revert pages to whatever bs leftist editors write. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.109.157.5 (talk) 14:32, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

Bonbons

Thank you for your kind note and, of course, the chocolates. They're very much appreciated. — Malik Shabazz (talk · contribs) 02:40, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

• Sure, and thank you. I'm happy you walked in here on what is Jack de Gier's birthday--the cake looks delicious. Drmies (talk) 02:43, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

Am I allowed to edit this page?

Thanks for this [1]. It's about time someone helped clean up after me. That's the kind of team spirit we need here on Wikipedia. Of course doing that kind of sweeping up after me would be a full-time job, but you get the idea. ChildofMidnight (talk) 09:14, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

• Ha, you're welcome. Still, I'd prefer to do good work quietly, as Olivier B. Bommel used to say. Drmies (talk) 13:26, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

When have you done good work? ChildofMidnight (talk) 17:04, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

[2] Drmies (talk) 17:26, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

They're trying to delete an article about your nephew Christoffel van wijk. ChildofMidnight (talk) 07:50, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

I see now that certain issues of race and colonialism are involved, so let me make clear that I was calling him your nephew only because the name was obviously Dutch. Believe it or not there are some people on Wikipedia who don't assume good faith and try to read negative intent into my comments! But what y'all did as far as colonizing and what-not is another matter entirely from my sophomoric humor. ChildofMidnight (talk) 07:54, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

• Hey! You talkin' bout my nephew, boy? Drmies (talk) 14:22, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
  • I mean 'boy' in the sense of 'young whippersnapper', of course. Drmies (talk) 14:22, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
  • Ha, this was in reference to the South-African family branch! Interesting topic, very interesting, but the article has to go. Drmies (talk) 14:34, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

Cavalera Conspiracy

Hi, you can do a copy-edit in this article?--Cannibaloki 17:49, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

I think you're very busy with something, but helped me. Thanks!--Cannibaloki 19:09, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

Hehe I was--I gave up lunch to give it a read. Nice article. Great picture of that bass player. BTW, sounds like a good album--is it? If Chaos AD is my all-time no. 1 metal album? Drmies (talk) 19:54, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

Cleanup on the Dothan, Alabama article's "famous residents" section

Thanks so much for your cleanup on the "famous residents section of the Dothan, Alabama article. Nicely done. -- Ecjmartin (talk) 01:00, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

• Thanks, but that article looked pretty good already, thanks in no small part to you, judging from the history. We can do some more--the references need a scrubbing, too much linkrot. Shall we apply some templates, one of these days? Drmies (talk) 06:11, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

Great idea, though I admit I know nothing about templates, really. I'm bogged down presently in some work on articles related to minor Latter Day Saint factions in and around my (now, and for the last 20 years) home town of Independence, Missouri, but when I'm through there, I'll definitely be interested in helping out as you suggest. Thanks again for your work on the Dothan article, your clean-up looked really nice! And thanks for your compliment! - Ecjmartin (talk) 10:15, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

Regarding two reversions

I don't think these are link spam [3], and [4], they're the official government pages on the subjects and some of the only english links in article. In fact the current Hi seoul links are 404 and on the bus page the link is in fact not an official link and a 3rd party site. As such I'm going to change those links to reflect official links on the subjects.--Crossmr (talk) 04:44, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

• Sure thing. Drmies (talk) 04:59, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

Charles Winchester

The reference to Boston Mercy Hospital is not a hole it is the use of hyperbole. In order to understand the comment you need to understand what a Mercy Hospital is. Whereas before Charles would only work for the most prestigious hospital in Boston the Massachusetts General Hospital where my sister was an intern he would feel most at home coming back from MASH to the hospital which is most egalitarian and does not screen for the ability to pay.

• The issues here are twofold: grammar and original research. If you have to explain to me what the comment means, there is something wrong with the comment. Besides, I still don't understand it. But really, you are arguing here how a fictional character from a TV show, if he were real, would pick the hostpical where your sister was an intern? Drmies (talk) 04:58, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

MGH exists and is and used to be even more the most prestigious in Boston while the Mercy Hospital system as of the end of the Korean War included patients who were poor and was run as more of a charity. It indicates a values change in the character. 72.93.82.245 (talk) 05:15, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

• ? So you are hypothetically putting a fictional character in the real world. Drmies (talk) 05:16, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

Thomas Jefferson and slavery

I agree that the new section is a mess, but there seemed to be some references, so I decided against deleting it as a block. I think it is worth revisited with fact tags or more excisions to bring it up to WP standards, low as they are. Regards, Ground Zero | t 17:28, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

• Taking a look at your changes, I see thatt you are doing just this. Good work. Ground Zero | t 17:33, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

Drmies time!

1850s fashion bloomers

Break it down. Please Drmies, don't hurt 'em. Hey are you wearing your harem pants/ hammer pants? You are too legit; too legit to quit. ChildofMidnight (talk) 17:52, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

• Love those pants. You know, I was the biggest Hammer fan in the world for a couple of days. Drmies (talk) 18:18, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

Unfortunately I was unable to catch the MC Hammer/Vanilla Ice show at the MGM Grand in Las Vegas when I was there on Fourth of July...sad times.--kelapstick (talk) 18:23, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

There is an MC Hammer doll? I'm shaking my head. LadyofShalott 21:05, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

Can you touch this [5]? What about this [6]? That's what I thought. "Sound the bell. School's in sucka." ChildofMidnight (talk) 22:03, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

File:MC Hammer doll.jpg

MC Hammer doll says, "Drmies, stop adding commas and semicolons where they don't belong."

That was amazing. Drmies (talk) 22:08, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

While we are on such an important subject. Have either of you seen Hammertime (not to be confused with WP:HAMMERTIME)? I got through about the first five minutes of one episode (not my selection) and sections of my brain started to implode. It was rather painful. In other news I am hoping that Hurricane Felicia lets up by the time I leave for Maui on Friday...eeek!--kelapstick (talk) 22:37, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

I'm confident that you and Lady of Shallots are the only ones who regularly watch that show. I trust your copy of the Please Hammer Don't Hurt 'Em movie is in a safe place. And I think it's cool that you still wear your gold pants. They will never go out of style. ChildofMidnight (talk) 00:21, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

So that was K-stick in that YouTube video? K, you looked great. Going to Maui... As we say in Dutch, er zijn werkpaarden en er zijn luxepaarden... Drmies (talk) 00:23, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

Maybe something got lost in the translation, but are you calling me a horse?--kelapstick (talk) 21:23, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

"There are work horses and there are luxury horses." Hint: I'm a work horse. Drmies (talk) 22:12, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

That's what I thought that you meant...I still find it an odd saying...what's a luxury horse (other than me apparently), is it anything like luxury tax?--kelapstick (talk) 22:16, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

It points at one of the unfortunate realities of life. We're all created equal, all horses, but some horses just lie on the couch all day watching Footlight Parade on AMC or go to Maui, while others have to work work work work. I would love a luxury tax, by the way. Wouldn't bother me; 25% of our income goes to daycare, and that's not a luxury. Drmies (talk) 22:39, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

I hate to be picky, but it was TCM, and personally I spend my free time watching Mission: Impossible reruns on ALN.--kelapstick (talk) 22:45, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

Artificial break for layout purposes

File:Jibberjabber.jpg

CoM promoting violence by advertising a Jibba Jabber doll that makes 'choking' or 'strangling' noises when you shake it

Listen slackers, while you two have been jibber jabbering, I've been hard at work on fruit hat. I think you'll find it is another masterpiece. The world's knowledge base has just been enormously expanded by this content introduction to Wikipedia. Only by covering these critical subjects can we stamp out ignorance once and for all. Feel free to translate it to Dutch. Although it is sourced, so they might object. ChildofMidnight (talk) 00:01, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

Well, that's great, but the UFO album articles are still unreferenced. Fruit hat? Where in the hell do you get that from? Oh, wait...ladies' matinee on TCM? Drmies (talk) 00:08, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

I've taken the liberty of refactoring your refactoring. The choreographer in Carmen Miranda's fruit hat wearing movie is the same choreographer from Footlight Parade. So it all ties together. I would give you a clip, but here's a fancy remake you might enjoy [7] and here's the full version if you find yourself needing more [8]. And if you still want more here's the original [9] and more, but it's somewhat painful [10], although it does include the exchange "plenty of pepper, huh?" "And a nice shaker too" from Groucho Marx.ChildofMidnight (talk) 00:46, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

I also came across some of Kelapstick's vacation videos from his last trip to Hawaii [11]. ChildofMidnight (talk) 00:55, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

Unfortunately this is my first trip to Hawaii, and I wish I could sing like that...--kelapstick (talk) 01:29, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

Awww K-stick that is so romantic...and in a suit, no less... Oh, that reminds me--I was at my doctor the other day, and she's Filippino, so I could impress her with useless but interesting knowledge: "Dahil Sa Iyo." She was charmed, haha. Drmies (talk) 01:59, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

Ill Nino

Thank you for your helping proving the existence of latin metal on the Ill Nino page. I was getting sick of battling that moron. -hsxeric(talk) 12:42, August 11th, 2009

• Thanks. You haven't weighed in yet on the AfD, I think. Please do so--but keep it objective, no ad hominem arguments please! Drmies (talk) 17:16, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

Latin Metal

I like what you have done with the article. Thanks, the article needed an experienced editor like you. I'm not into heavy metal, so I rely in the Spanish Wiki article and none of the bands here are mention in the es.wiki article, but it doesn't mean we have to rely only on es.wiki. --Jmundo (talk) 19:52, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

• Thanks. When I first saw the link I thought Revolver (which is a reliable source) had some kind of feature on Latin metal--unfortunately it was just an ad. I looked at the Spanish Wiki but it's not much use since it totally lacks reliable sources. But I think it's looking good enough now, thanks also to you. Drmies (talk) 20:38, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

Public education

How is it that it's after noon east coast time and you're only now headed into work? I'm very concerned. Enjoy the B.S. pasta salad. I had bacon and eggs for breakfast. Atkins. :) ChildofMidnight (talk) 16:44, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

• Oh, I was bumming around this morning. And this pasta salad is, unfortunately, totally dried out and saltier than a <insert name of very salty thing herean anchovy working in a salt mine Bongomatic 00:48, 13 August 2009 (UTC)>--combination of bacon, feta, and a couple of days in the fridge. Not good. Ha, I almost bought a gallon of hot sauce this morning--they had both Texas Pete and Frank's--but I don't think our fridge, or my daughter, can handle that. Drmies (talk) 17:44, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

Hey Bongo, I have been in a salt mine, WOW, do you ever taste it when you walk through. --kelapstick (talk) 17:11, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

Green tabasco is also pretty good and quite mild. But I think it has xantham gum in it.

Drmies please don't misunderestimate what our children is learning. As Whitney Houston said: Teach them well and let them lead the way. Show them all the beauty they possess inside. Give them a sense of pride. Can you do all that when you don't get started until after 1 p.m.? If you don't shape up I'm going to have to call Glenn Beck so he can expose what you're getting away with in our educational system... ChildofMidnight (talk) 04:46, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

My bad . . .

. . . but I don't know what "doi ce" means (from an edit summary referred to at but then refactored out of another user's talk page). Bongomatic 16:47, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

• No, not your fault, just my laziness: I was copyediting a Digital object identifier in a reference template. Later! Drmies (talk) 17:42, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Saint-Gilles-Croix-de-Vie

Hello! Your submission of Saint-Gilles-Croix-de-Vie at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and there still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Dabomb87 (talk) 20:35, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

Depiction of Priapus, Greek god and devotional image in the St. Priapus Church

I got this same message on my talkpage, but I can't find the submission to see what the issues are. Where is it? (I had seen that you had made the submission, but now I can't find it again.) LadyofShalott 01:59, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

I made a small edit (along the lines of the edit to the article) and shortly afterward it got moved to the queue. So we're on our way to fame! Drmies (talk) 02:36, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

Cool!

BTW, I can't believe you've got me on this other article and to what it led me... LadyofShalott 02:53, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, I looked at that article too. I'm deeply sorry. Drmies (talk) 02:57, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

The former is certainly worse than the latter. Bongomatic 04:59, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

• I'd rather worship from a distance than swallow. Drmies (talk) 14:27, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

And I thought blueberries and kale were healthful. That stuff is practically a cure all. I was going to say who wants some, but that seems a little too riskee. Hmmm. Where can I get some? Why can't I get it at whole foods with the raw foods and raw milk? Have any bacon pairings been developed? Should I keep going with these, I think I'm bound to hit on one that's funny eventually... ChildofMidnight (talk) 05:29, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

(back on the subject of towns that start with "Saint" and have a lot of hyphens) There is much work to be done to get Saint-Louis-du-Ha! Ha! (I have been there, it isn't very Ha! Ha!) up to DYK, considering it as a project for when I get back. Thoughts?--kelapstick (talk) 15:20, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for letting me know about the IP that vandalized again right after its block expired. I have blocked for a week. Academic Challenger (talk) 06:20, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

• Sure thing. Thanks for taking such swift action. Drmies (talk) 16:56, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

Working

I'm happy to see you off to a bright and early start. You'll get a short break for lunch and I think it would be good if you put in a few extra hours this evening. ChildofMidnight (talk) 16:16, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

• I am actually working, on something a little unsavory: The Myth of the Twentieth Century (and I don't mean work on WP). Lunch will be microwaved and had at the desk. You, I hope, are enjoying maybe an old RKO flick. Drmies (talk) 17:06, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

The farmers market was lovely. I got some grapefruit, tomatoes, lettuce, red peppers and white peaches. I also sampled some delicious nectarines and regular peaches (delicious and in season, but I already have some ripe ones in the fridge). I also had a bite of some delicious figs (YUMM!) and plums. When I got home I sauteed up some red pepper, hamburger and tomato and served it over some salad for a fine meal. We're going to play some flag football on the beach tonight and get some brewskis at the Hermosa Beach Yacht Club (a bar) and maybe a bite to eat at Mikey's. Let me know if you're going to be around! ChildofMidnight (talk) 20:00, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

I'm looking forward to persimmons, but I'm not sure when that season starts. Maybe a few more weeks or even a couple of months yet. I have Cat on a Hot Tin Roof queued up. Have you seen it? ChildofMidnight (talk) 20:10, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

I thought it was awful. Full of stereotypes and sappy melodrama without much depth. I just watched the newer Batman. It was okay. I didn't love it. But it was interesting in parts. :) ChildofMidnight (talk) 22:46, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

I'm puttin on a Hawaiian shirt in Kelapstick's honor. ChildofMidnight (talk) 20:12, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

DYK for Saint-Gilles-Croix-de-Vie

On August 14, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Saint-Gilles-Croix-de-Vie, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page (here's how) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Orlady (talk) 14:15, 14 August 2009 (UTC)

A question and a diff

Hey Drmies. Are you going to sign up for this?--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 00:30, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

By the way, you just got to love an edit summary like this--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 04:08, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

• Yeah, that was kind of shocking. I have done some work on articles where you continuously run into crap like this. Oh, I'm not signing up for anything right now--got too much 'real' work, haha. Keep it up, Sky! Drmies (talk) 15:21, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

Kingdom of Galicia

Thanks for your message Drmies, I´m trying to traslate the French/Portuguese article about Kingdom of Galicia, but like you can see, my English is basic-intermediate. If you have time, I´d be very thanked for you if you could correct the mistakes in my English, I´d like to get a good article for this kingdom.

Thanks for your attention.--Nuninho Martins (talk) 23:54, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

Regineibcalen

But you removed the entire section. I'm just new to Wikipedia and I'm just trying to keep people from vandalizing. I haven't added anything to that article, I was just maintaining what was previously there. Thanks, I will find sources starting today.

Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Regineibcalen" —Preceding unsigned comment added by Regineibcalen (talk • contribs) 04:17, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

Drmies, I did notice that the previous entry was biased. I am really sorry, I apologize in behalf of the other people who edit the Regine Velasquez page. I have already added several citations and am still finding new ones. Thanks again. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Regineibcalen (talk • contribs) 05:01, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

• No apology necessary. I am glad you are contributing to the project, and let me know if there's anything I can do to help. As with a lot of entries, one of the most important things is to find reliable sources that verify the information. Pep.ph, for instance, is a kind of portal, and while I don't necessarily doubt their info, there are better sources--newspapers, for starters. So, the platinum and gold albums, for instance, would have been reported on in the major newspapers, I imagine--adding those kinds of references would be really helpful. Thanks again for your note and your contributions! Drmies (talk) 15:16, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

DYK for Live! Go for What You Know

On August 17, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Live! Go for What You Know, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page (here's how) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

King of ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ 14:14, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

DYK & Sources

It seems that another editor has questioned the Molendatabase and De Hollandsche Molens websties as not being reliable. I realise that with both websites you are invited to add to the database, but I would think that it's a waste of time trying to add false information as the publishers would check out any submissions before adding them to the database - in other words it is moderated. Anyway, as I've name you in my reply to the objection to the De Heidebloem, Erica article, it's only fair to inform you I've done so. Your comments would be appreciated at T:TDYK. Mjroots (talk) 10:32, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

• Thanks, I weighed in. You won't be surprised to find that I agree with you on notability and on the status of De Hollandsche Molen. Drmies (talk) 14:35, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

Milk

I thought what must be coming now, some really stupid edit from my past lol What you highlighted was only a revert and a fix of a bad caption and I thought it was better to include a cropped image anyway, which I did now. So anyway, thanks! Hekerui (talk) 15:50, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

That is so cool! Thank you very much :) Hekerui (talk) 16:00, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

Tales of Dark

Notable? I've been working on some Jamaican cuisine. Yah mon. ChildofMidnight (talk) 20:14, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

• Well, two albums on a moderately notable label (I assume it's at least moderately notable...) should do the trick. Reliable sources are always hard to come by in this genre. For future reference, I always turn to User:Blackmetalbaz, who sometimes has the audacity to disagree with me just because he knows shit and I don't, elitist limey that he is. Yeah, I saw your...goat soup? fried penis? something. Looked pretty tasty! Drmies (talk) 20:19, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

What about Daggerspawn? ChildofMidnight (talk) 21:57, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

I hear you're going to double the size of Wikipedia by adding articles on all Dutch windmills. I hope there are enough servers. ChildofMidnight (talk) 15:38, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

William March

Hi, if you check the article you will see that it has been de-listed. You can work on it and when you feel that it is ready for examination against the GA criteria, renominate at WP:GAN. Cheers. BTW you didn't sign your message on my talk page. Jezhotwells (talk) 09:12, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Sandbox

I think that looks good, but predict a certain amount of opposition from other editors (who love their little flag icons). I left a comment of the talk page for the article outlining what I thought should be done with the list, and nobody has replied to me... Blackmetalbaz (talk) 14:35, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Dale Bozzio

On June 23, you deleted much of Dale Bozzio's Personal Life information, but left the references. Shortly thereafter, the editor who had originally entered the information that you deleted reinserted the same information in a shortened write-up. At the point that the editor reentered the information, it was public knowledge that Ms. Bozzio had filed an appeal in the U.S. court system. Since this is an encyclopedia, and since entries are not obviously dated as are newspaper articles, the provided information has been misleading, and in my opinion, has given Ms. Bozzio's page the status of that of a tabloid.

I am a new editor, and I am still learning how to edit. I do agree with your June 23 comment in the history tab of Ms. Bozzio's page.

Possibly an item by item edit with consensus gained along the way could result in her page being brought, in my opinion, into conformance with Wikipedia guidelines in general, and in particular, for biographies of living persons?

As a start, the result of a search engine search for Dale Bozzio's Wikipedia page results in the following:

"Dale Bozzio - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Career|Solo album|New album|Personal life Dale Bozzio's life is so strange The Boston Phoenix April 24, 2009 ... Dale Bozzio sentenced to jail The Boston Phoenix May 27, 2009 ... en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dale Bozzio - Cached"

That information is outdated, and I believe, inappropriate for an artist whose career has spanned 30 some-odd years. I think that it should be revised to the following:

"Dale Bozzio - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Career|Solo album|New album|Personal life Dale Bozzio is an American musician and former Playboy Bunny. She became famous as the lead singer for the '80s pop/new wave band Missing Persons. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dale Bozzio - Cached"

Do you know how to revise that information? Doc2234 (talk) 20:26, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

• Thanks for your note. I didn't know that some of that miscellaneous detail had been reinstated, but fortunately the IP was somewhat conservative. According to WP:BLP, the relevant guideline for the biography of a living person, tells me the following: "Biographies of living persons must be written conservatively, with regard for the subject's privacy. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a tabloid paper; it is not our job to be sensationalist, or to be the primary vehicle for the spread of titillating claims about people's lives." I take that to mean that an arrest (see the history of Alex Da Silva (dancer), for instance) or a criminal charge is NOT notable; a conviction probably is--though if it were up to me, a singer being convicted of animal cruelty has no encyclopedic value. But I realize I'm probably fighting a losing battle, as Da Silva's history makes clear. Bozzio's article right now is OK, I guess, and most editors here would probably revert cutting what's still there.

  Your question is really about how the article shows up, and I don't think I can be of much use there. I don't know which search engine you use. Her article shows up in Google as follows: "Dale also divorced Terry Bozzio at that time, but retained the name. Dale Bozzio has continued to record and perform since the breakup of Missing Persons. ..." That, it seems to me, is alright--I gather you use a different search engine? Drmies (talk) 21:01, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Thank you for your response. I use Yahoo. I do not have any idea as to what triggers the display of that information.

The referenced articles are from the Boston Phoenix. The written content of the articles generally covers both sides of the case. However, and that is a big however in my opinion, one article includes State's evidence photos and the others easily link to State's evidence photographs that are not presented from a neutral point of view. Readers are left to interpret for themselves what they are seeing with no explanation provided as would be afforded in the courtroom setting where the photos will be reviewed. The result from the availability of the articles and evidence has been overwhelmingly one-sided web commentary that is heavily based upon the photos, not the articles. The photos are sensationalistic.

The case is on-going with an anticipated jury trial, where jurors who will be tasked with determining guilt have to be selected, coming up in October. Is there an issue with Wikipedia being the vehicle for worldwide availability of information that should be confined to a U.S. courtroom?

Evidence is not shown or linked in the Alex Da Silva article. The article merely reports the arrest, that he is being charged, and is being held on bail.

In this particular situation with Dale Bozzio's page, with the specifics as they are, does this merit discussion? Doc2234 (talk) 21:59, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Well, I am not sure what to tell you. I know nothing about how and why certain things show up a certain way in various search engines. Yahoo indeed presents nothing like a decent selection from the lead, but I can't tell you why that is. I did look yesterday at the Boston Globe website and searched for her; their site provides the hits from the Boston Phoenix but first lists a few from the Globe--I didn't have the time to look at them, but you might could do that and see if you can replace some of the sensationalist Phoenix articles (with their stupid drawings) by more respectable entries from the Globe. Good luck, Drmies (talk) 14:21, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Thank you for your help. I will look into the Globe articles.Doc2234 (talk) 14:34, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

The Globe has severed the links to their articles concerning the case. Doc2234 (talk) 16:56, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

RfA question

Hey Drmies. I've spent a lot of time looking over your contributions and I believe you would make a fine admin if you were given the tools. I would be willing to support you if you are interested. Would you be interested in the mop?--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 01:54, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

• Ha Legend--thanks! But no thanks, really. I don't think I have the temperament (that is, the calm demeanor) or the policy knowledge and skills. I should just be a proofreader, a comma f***er, and thorn in the side of POV-pushers and troublemakers. Really, thanks again--it's nice of you to say so, and I appreciate the offer of your time and your effort. Who knows, when I grow up a bit more, I might consider this again... Drmies (talk) 02:24, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Don't lie! You know you covet the power! ^Bongo_matic 02:43, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Did I say I don't covet power??? I LOVE power. Hey, that's a greatlooking signature, Bongo! How do you always come up with cool stuff like that? Drmies (talk) 03:08, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Thanks—it's easy: I steal from my betters! ^Bongo_matic 03:24, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Well, I don't you who your "betters" are but they sure must be something for you to get a signature like that. The good thing about your signature is that it is blue and green. Two colors that seem to suit you for some reason.--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 04:25, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Hehe, John Hyatt said it very well a long time ago: if it ain't nailed down, take it. Drmies (talk) 03:31, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

I see. But you know if you ever do decide to take the mop, you should have my support.--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 04:18, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

• Thanks Legend! Drmies (talk) 14:22, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

I also think you should go ahead with an adminship nomination. It would be a great deal of fun for me to watch and participate in the action. ChildofMidnight (talk) 05:30, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Weren't you going to dive back into a drama-out or something, CoM? ^Bongo_matic 06:19, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Not until next year. ChildofMidnight (talk) 06:37, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Curse all of you admin-nominator-wannabees! I was already to offer! :) -WarthogDemon 16:07, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

How did I miss this thread, I must have been away from the office or something (or on the beach). I was considering nominating the good doctor myself, after all, what is they say about payback :D --kelapstick (talk) 16:18, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

Haha, thanks, but no thanks. Not until I hit 20,000, and folks have all forgotten about a recent screw-up (a 6RR issue?). K-stick, welcome back to the mainland, I hope you had a good time! Warthog, you should occupy your time with fighting genre wars! Drmies (talk) 17:15, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

Too bad they are after Long Wong's heyday, they could have had their start at the same place as Dead Hot Workshop, The Refreshments and what was that other less famous band?--kelapstick (talk) 17:43, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

Epics

I see you've chased Law away. Tsk tsk tsk. Did you see that the epic article is already being expanded [12]? ChildofMidnight (talk) 16:39, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

• I'm going to stay quiet on that topic--story vs. genre, dictionary definition vs. encyclopedic topic, relative importance of Big Brown vs. that of Achilles and Aeneid--since I like you as a person--I think. Just imagine if I had a supermop, a delete button (there is no baby in this bathwater). Drmies (talk) 16:47, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Adminship is the first step. Go for it! :) ChildofMidnight (talk) 17:01, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Not that anyone asked, but I'd like to second that motion! Based on your contributions, edit history, and sense of humor you are clearly suited to the task. The project could really use more admins with those qualifications and I'd happily support your nom at an RfA. Please consider the option, even if it first came from such a blatantly unreliable source as CoM  : ) Doc Tropics 21:24, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

FYI

Rijksmonument. A DYK nom, but not long enough. ChildofMidnight (talk) 20:19, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

• [13] :) An interesting clarification. ChildofMidnight (talk) 20:46, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
  • Did you like my edit? I did! Hey, thanks for the Rijksmonument link--I appreciate it. I'm on it. Drmies (talk) 21:14, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

Freedom ride

I think you're right. Freedom Riders is probably the better name. — Malik Shabazz (talk · contribs) 05:11, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

Speaking of Freedom Riders, has anyone seen this movie?--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 01:53, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

No, I didn't--I was too busy inviting you to an edit war! ;) Drmies (talk) 01:58, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

I actually like your revision more than mine, but if you ever need to edit war with someone to get yourself (and the other person) blocked just let me know. ;)--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 02:08, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

For whatever it's worth, Africana uses the phrase "freedom ride" without any capitalization. However the Wikipedia article is retitled, I agree it should be in the plural.

Also, nice job with James Peck. I added a little tidbit of information. — Malik Shabazz (talk · contribs) 03:09, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

Fist (UK band)

Do a cleanup in this article please.--Cannibaloki 02:09, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

• Sure! Drmies (talk) 02:21, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

Well done, thanks!--Cannibaloki 02:36, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

Illegal immigrants

What do you make of this [14]? ChildofMidnight (talk) 03:46, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

• Oh, I didn't know that! Probably an attempt by our neighbors to the East to use the Stelling van Amsterdam against us... Drmies (talk) 04:24, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

No worries

I saw that you're also in agreement to just delete the article despite it's edit history. No worries for me, I'll always remember it--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 04:42, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

• Did you see my edit summary? We did cross, haha. Drmies (talk) 04:47, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

John Parker Wilson

Is looking good to make the team. DJ Shockey may stay ahead of him for the time being, but he's not having a good preseason. I think Matt Ryan with Wilson in relief is a good line up. The Jets are the new Bungles. ChildofMidnight (talk) 06:17, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

• Ha, water under the bridge. I'm ready for 5 September and Virginia Tech. BTW, it is absolutely beautiful here now--not too hot, even cool in the mornings: football weather! Drmies (talk) 19:07, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

RE: DAB Pages

You were asking about my trip? I did come across a couple of these signs...friendly.

There is a V word and an S word, so I'll just remove the deletion tags. Thanks. XxTimberlakexx (talk) 21:05, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

• Only because you made them up. Next stop, AfD. Drmies (talk) 21:06, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
  • I'm rather curious about Wrecked 'Em? Damn Near Killed 'Em! and Heroes Get Remembered, Legends Never Die. Since when do we take lines from movies and redirect them to the article. In particular when they don't have the line actually in the article. --kelapstick (talk) 21:41, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
    • Wow, good point. And those are not, as you say, notable at all. Say, the rules for deleting a redirect--that's just like proposing deleting an article, right? Thanks K, Drmies (talk) 23:32, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
    • Then there's song titles--I Kiss My Sweetie With My Fist/Hell Is For Heroes, Prepare to Be Digitally Manipulated, One Time Too Many, besides word permutations etc. like Build bear, Building a bear, Bear building, Building bears, Building the bear, Build the bear... Drmies (talk) 23:38, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
      • Ironically, there's some lines from movies that not only have pages created for them, but they also have their own article (not just a redirect) Take Go ahead, make my day for example. It's funny how things like this work on Wikipedia, isn't it?--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 02:06, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Some are nn songs that redirect to artist, sometimes we redirect the song to the album, so that isn't so wrong. The bears, I think it is overkill. I think there is redirects for deletion if prod or sd doesn't work. kelapstick (talk) 00:30, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

• Yeah, if the song is notable one way or another--but these are random (the first one is a "hidden track"). I'll ask a friendly admin. Hey, how was your vacation? Oh, I'll go check out your talk page. Drmies (talk) 01:39, 27 August 2009 (UTC)
  • Vacation was great, haven't been updating much, been pretty busy around the office lately.--kelapstick (talk) 19:47, 27 August 2009 (UTC)
    • Progress on the redirects? WP:RFD is Redirects for Discussion, may want to bring some up there...--kelapstick (talk) 22:39, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

My defense

See you there next time they play Feyenoord

Hi there DRMIES, VASCO from Portugal here,

Regarding your reprimand, i'll only say the following: yes, i know i need to tone down on my summaries, no problem admitting that. However, there are two things i can't stand in WP: vandalism (have reported, will report, and...well am not reporting any at the moment :) ) and stuff being removed in articles just because other users feel it does not look good there. And, albeit a bit hysterical, i have never insulted anyone at the site, safe vandals.

That said, i promise to try my utmost best from now on, for the site's sake. Your input was a bit on the aggressive too i reckon, but i won't hold any grudge, sometimes some words need to be said.

Have a good weekend, keep up the good work,

VASCO AMARAL - --NothingButAGoodNothing (talk) 02:11, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

• Hey, I don't think I said anything too harsh--although I did repeat your words. It's hard to play nice, I know that quite well. As for vandals, consider using some of the user warning templates, if only so other editors can quickly see what's going on. Thanks for your response, and take care, Drmies (talk) 02:25, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

• Hey man, sorry for any incovenience on my part, there you go...

  

VASCO - --NothingButAGoodNothing (talk) 02:28, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

• • Thanks Vasco. Take it easy, Drmies (talk) 02:44, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

• Thanks for the pic man. Beers in Portugal? Nothing special i tell you (SAGRES, SUPER BOCK are the two top brands), but when it's cold, a beer is a beer right? Happy editing!!

VASCO - --NothingButAGoodNothing (talk) 05:05, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

• Sorry, and where are my manners? Where are you from mate? Judging from the pic you sent me and your (cool) userpage, i would say the Netherlands...Is that so? Take care, until some other wiki-time!!

VASCO AMARAL - --NothingButAGoodNothing (talk) 16:57, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Your Recent Edits

Thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia. When using certain templates on talk pages, as you did to User talk:59.167.232.197, don't forget to substitute with text by adding subst: to the template tag. For example, use {{subst:uw-test1}} instead of {{uw-test1}}. This reduces server load and prevents accidental blanking of the template. Thank you. (I'm pretty sure you already know this but just in case...) -FASTILY ^(TALK) 02:58, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

• The whole subst thing has been explained to me once or twice but I'm just not smart enough for it; I didn't know it was necessary in these vandalism warnings. You know, I've dropped hundreds, if not thousands of them all over the place... I'll do my best. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 03:04, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Use Twinkle and Friendly for tagging. Seriously. Under the Gadgets pane at Special:Preferences. ^Bongo_matic 03:08, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

WHY??? I don't want to be like the rest! Drmies (talk) 03:15, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

I used to be the same Drmies, but as soon as you start adding the "subst" for vandalism warnings, you get used to it. Trust me. I spent about eight weeks just doing the {{uw-vandalism1}} tag without the "subst"./ i'm sure you'd get the hang of it--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 03:59, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Well, I got this Twinkle thing now, and it feels strangely empowering. It's almost too easy! Drmies (talk) 04:01, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

You may soon reconsider declining adminship nomination. ^Bongo_matic 04:06, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Yeah man, don't be a wuss. I'll consider supporting depending on how you respond to various interogatives. ChildofMidnight (talk) 04:30, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

You know, I've looked at a bunch of them (RfAs, with their questions), and a lot of these questions I couldn't possibly answer. What would my mop do? Block the occasional vandal, maybe. Much of what goes on at ANI I could hack, but as soon as issues get their own page (some of you may be familiar with this one it quickly goes over my head. Drmies (talk) 04:36, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

As far as I can tell the main job of admins is to block content contributors they disagree with, so I think you'll be a perfect fit. :) ChildofMidnight (talk) 05:18, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

The thing I really get annoyed with about admins? If an admin POV-pushes it is okay but if a regular user does it, they get blocked without delay.--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 05:34, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Hey, I just noticed I rhymed just then.--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 05:35, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Well, I'd happily block you for that. But listen, Sky, don't listen to Child. He, I'm sure, blamed the teacher for every bad grade he ever got. Or the liberal media, no doubt. Drmies (talk) 15:41, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Don't forget onions. ChildofMidnight (talk) 16:16, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Huh? Drmies (talk) 16:22, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

It's the liberal elite media, thank you very much.--kelapstick (talk) 16:55, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Right you are. But ONIONS? Drmies (talk) 16:57, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Well they have started picking the onions here, maybe I will ask them.--kelapstick (talk) 17:03, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

DYK for 99 Fables

On August 27, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article 99 Fables, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page (here's how) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

NW (Talk) 05:07, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Vermeer Dutch Chocolate Cream Liqueur

What do you think? And why are you still awake? I'm glad the weather is good down there. :) I guess I should come down soon? ChildofMidnight (talk) 05:16, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

• I think that that's a really tasty drink, though too sweet for my taste, for a drink with only 17%. I've done a little work to the article. Thanks for pointing it out!

  And yes, by all means, come on down. The weather is still great (last night we had a spectacular thunder storm) and football is about to start. We had bacon for breakfast and I'm still munching on the leftovers. Drmies (talk) 15:32, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

I missed you at the farmer's market. I got a honey chicken sandwich and then a rib sandwich. I also bought some fruit and veggies. :) Sunny and nice here by the beach. But I'm hoping to make it out there in the next couple months. ChildofMidnight (talk) 20:40, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

DYK for Rijksmonument

On August 27, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Rijksmonument, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page (here's how) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

NW (Talk) 17:07, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

FYI update

You guys came in at #34. [15]. ChildofMidnight (talk) 20:27, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

Military jargon

"I am The Last of the Famous International Playboys..."

Hi MIES, VASCO here,

Do you mean this soccer match? Man, that was very tough and rough! Players were at it with their nerves on the edge (both teams), and with that opener from Khalid Boulahrouz on Cristiano Ronaldo (i am not criticizing the defender in any way, he's a very physical guy) all "hell broke loose", the players lost control, and the ref did the best he could. All in all, the match was very ugly man, makes you miss those AFC Ajax matches in the 90's, with the Louis van Gaal-led side, even Winston Bogarde looked like a good player (just kidding, he was...in his position that is, no one asked him to dribble and score)!

Take care, send me your views on the match today if you want, i'll be "wiki-here". VASCO AMARAL - --NothingButAGoodNothing (talk) 23:37, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

• Shoot, I didn't know it had a nickname. Yeah, that was terrible (and that foul certainly was--I figured already that that might lose us the match). BTW, I really like Figo--I even like his hair (jealousy). I didn't even know he had retired--it's not easy to keep up in the US. Listen, I remember an Ajax match from back then, with Kluivert sliding it in to beat AC Milan. That was nice. Oh, and I would never claim Bogarde was a good player, but he sure was big. Later! Drmies (talk) 00:32, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

Think it's worth submitting?

HELL YES This user headbangs

Soxwon (talk) 06:12, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

• Haha, you are SO old school, banging to Zep! Go for it--though the dark green is a little too dark for me, I have to look carefully. Oh, I'd put "this" in lowercase:

HELL YES this user headbangs.

Drmies (talk) 16:26, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

• • I've always been old school man, Led Zep, Def Leppard, Pink Floyd. I'll try it then, thnx. Soxwon (talk) 18:43, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

• • • I actually had to select the text in order to read "headbangs"...Rock on!--kelapstick (talk) 18:49, 28 August 2009 (UTC)
      • Hmm, I'll change the color then. Soxwon (talk) 18:51, 28 August 2009 (UTC)
        • The green and blue is showing up for me now, it was the black and blue...although they were both black a minute ago...--kelapstick (talk) 18:55, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

Submitted, now with easier to use link:

HELL YES this user headbangs

{{User:Soxwon/Userboxes}}Soxwon (talk) 19:21, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

• Nice--but I still think you need to lowercase 'this'--it is the third word in a sentence. Drmies (talk) 20:30, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

Riiiight, I meant to do that, hold on... Soxwon (talk) 21:39, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

I've personally never considered Led Zeppelin to be metal, but that might just be my opinion. Metal is my favorite genre so I can listen to just about anything. I can headbang to old school bands like Black Sabbath, Death, Iron Maiden, Judas Priest, Metallica, Motorhead, Scorpions, Slayer , Soundgarden and others as well as new school bands like Alice In Chains, Bullet For My Valentine, Cathedral, Dark Tranquillity, Dimmu Borgir, Disturbed, DragonForce, Dream Theatre, Faith No More, Fear Factory, Godsmack, Machine Head, Rage Against The Machine, Slipknot, Tool and others. I also like solo acts a lot too like Ozzy Osborne and Rob Zombie.--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 22:00, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

Alright, now you can prove your allegiance with a box. I only listen to blackened death metal, so y'all a bit too weak for me. BTW, K-stick, ever listen to Paul Weller? Drmies (talk) 23:08, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

You have me wrong, I listen to just about everything, even have death metal, thrash metal and some things you've probably never heard of on my IPOD ;). Soxwon (talk) 23:22, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

Soxwon your userbox encouraged me to create a userbox of my own that I've added to my userpage. I worked with your template but made a few adjustments on mine, replacing the Led Zeppelin with the single cover of A Looking In View, one of the latest singles by Alice In Chains and adjusted the info to include Grunge music with metal.

This user listens to Grunge and Heavy Metal music.

--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 02:00, 29 August 2009 (UTC)

HAPPY WIKIBIRTHDAY DRMIES!!!!

Balloons for the big celebration.

It just wouldn't be a Wikibirthday without a Wikipresent, would it?

Mmmm yummy. Cake! Blow out all the candles!

It's been exactly two years from this very day since your first ever edit to this Wikipedia on August 30 2007. You know what that means, don't you?

...It's your second WikiBirthday!

Three cheers for Drmies!

Hip Hip Hooray!

Congratulations and enjoy your day! Let's hope your future years on Wikipedia are as good as the first two were...--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 05:02, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

• WOW...I had no idea...thanks Sky! This is quite a surprise, as I'm in the middle of gutting Surf culture and was expecting all kinds of commentary! Thanks again man. Drmies (talk) 05:04, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

Wow, two years, Happy WPB-Day! kelapstick (talk) 05:21, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

Thanks K! Kid asleep? I just sang the little one to sleep, oh yeah, I'm good. Later! Drmies (talk) 05:26, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

He's been down for three hours, been a rough week though, he isn't reacting well to the time change, and started cutting the last of his teeth. kelapstick (talk) 05:34, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

You've been here that long? No wonder you're so ummm... unique. :) Hey what do you think of Lame Ducks. Norwegian Ska-Punk is automatically notable I would think, right? But some references probably wouldn't hurt. ChildofMidnight (talk) 19:26, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

• Hey, I was on Conservapedia the other day but you need special permission to edit. I was merely going to add that the breast cancer rate has gone up since Nixon came into office. So I think I'm going to stick it out here, where I can mess around some. Yes, Norwegian ska-punk is highly notable, and you should try and expand that article. Drmies (talk) 20:41, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

Question

Have you been watching CoM's recent situation?--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 02:15, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

Whoa, no, but I am now, I guess. I'm somewhat at a loss. Drmies (talk) 02:37, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

Everything beginning [[16]] has put CoM in somewhat of a bad position here.--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 02:43, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

Yup. Drmies (talk) 02:44, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

If you are following this situation, also this--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 02:55, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

←Sky, I think Drmies and all others who interact on a regular basis with CoM are capable of discerning the sequence of events once they see where to start. Not sure that pointing out specific milestones on the path to the current situation will do anyone benefit. Editors make conscious whether to comment or not to comment, so continuing this discussion where the preference seems to have been expressed seems counterproductive. ^Bongo_matic 05:10, 31 August 2009 (UTC)