User talk:A Den Jentyl Ettien Avel Dysklyver/Archive 3

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21:05:03, 20 September 2017 review of submission by Nirajjvyas

• Nirajjvyas (talk · contribs)
  • Draft:Christine Merlin (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

I sincerely do not understand why this article was declined. The golden rule states "Many scientists, researchers, philosophers and other scholars (collectively referred to as "academics" for convenience) are notably influential in the world of ideas without their biographies being the subject of secondary sources." Christine Merlin has changed the field of chronobiology through the discovery of biological-clock based migration patterns. It has opened the field to further research on clock-based behaviors in insects. It is not her biography that is the subject of secondary sources; it's her research and her contributions to the field.

Secondly, the vast majority of references for the article are independent, secondary sources (collected from Wikipedia tools), like review studies, that discuss Merlin's research.

Third, there are other chronobiologists that have Wikipedia articles for similar contributions, similar review sources, and less information on the page. Examples:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amita_Sehgal

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maximilian_Renner

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeffrey_L._Price

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Millar_(scientist)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell_Foster

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martha_Merrow

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susan_Golden

There is absolutely no reason for this article to be declined, especially given all required components have been met, Merlin is indeed notable in her field, and other similar chronobiologists have been approved for a page.

• Your reading of WP:NPROF is inaccurate, "She is an assistant professor of biology..." tells me that she fails to be a notable professor, which normally requires a named chair or head of department status. and I see no indication that her impact on her field is groundbreaking, every PhD requires a new research, her contributions are not as significant as I feel they need to be to meet NPROF. The problem with the sources is what you think is a positive. All the sources are about her work, unless you want to make an article about biological-clock based migration patterns, then these are not going to help, you need to find WP:RS sources that are about her, detail about the person, not what she has done with butterflies. (don't remove the sources you have already, they are a start). Α Guy into Books™ § (Message) -  21:15, 20 September 2017 (UTC)

Her contribution has literally led to other large, notable research paper (many of which are cited in the article already as review articles). Yes, every PhD needs to do research, but if many people decide to do research following the contributions from Merlin, that is, inherently, making her notable. She has reached her assistant professor position at an early age because of her contributions.

WP:NPROF states "Academics/professors meeting any one of the following conditions, as substantiated through reliable sources, are notable. Academics/professors meeting none of these conditions may still be notable if they meet the conditions of WP:BIO or other notability criteria, and the merits of an article on the academic/professor will depend largely on the extent to which it is verifiable." Following that, the first point is "The person's research has had a significant impact in their scholarly discipline, broadly construed, as demonstrated by independent reliable sources," which I believe has been met. In addition, "The person's academic work has made a significant impact in the area of higher education, affecting a substantial number of academic institutions" is also applicable.

Chronobiology is a small field (really started existing about 7-10 years ago), but it is a growing area of research. If you truly believe that Merlin has not met these requirements, then every single article I indicated above must also be taken down because they don't meet the requirements either. College-level chronobiology classes mention all the scientists I mentioned above alongside Merlin because her contributions are that important to the field.

I ask you to reconsider. If you're not familiar with the subject, please consider consulting someone who is. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nirajjvyas (talk • contribs) 21:41, 20 September 2017 (UTC)

@Nirajjvyas: Ok, I will approve the article if you can find a source that supports this claim. However this person has a low number of academic citations and is unlikely to meet NPROF as citations are a classic indicator of a subjects importance. [1] Α Guy into Books™ § (Message) -  22:43, 20 September 2017 (UTC)

Merlin was a speaker at this year's Annual Circadian Biology Symposium. Here is a list of speakers.

• No, I mean a source from a reliable source which says something about her and calls her work 'significant with a big impact in her field', or something like that. Anyone judging her significance is doing so subjectively, but we can follow a reliable source. Α Guy into Books™ § (Message) -  08:08, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Review for Draft

Hi

This talk is regarding the publishing of an article about vision and mission of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centre_for_Public_Policy_Research. I have made a draft as you told me. I hope you remember and will help.

Thanks in advance — Preceding unsigned comment added by Amallalds (talk • contribs) 05:58, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

Amallalds (talk) 06:27, 26 September 2017 (UTC)

mistake as editor re AfC

G'day mate,

May I suggest that imho you did not review AfC page "Kurt Pudniks" in proper detail. eg. Did you read the wikipedia policy re "biography of living people" in any detail??

Yours Sincerely,

Kurt.

Skinduptruk (talk) 08:01, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

Indeed I have, methinks you have not. As other editors have pointed out, you have not demonstrated the importance of the subject. There is a consensus against using sources related to election campaigns to show notability unless the candidate meets the criteria of WP:NPOL, this is quite strict and based on the WP:ROUTINE guideline, as you were not elected you do not meet the basic criteria of NPOL. Thus to prove notability, you need to show that you are notable for something else, or in some other way under another guideline like WP:GNG. I hope this makes sense. Cheerio. Α Guy into Books™ § (Message) -  18:49, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

This link https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Teahouse/Questions/Archive_634#AfC_inaugural_editor_has_gone_dark_.28non-responsive_for_20.2B_days.29 seems to have been deleted from the page. Please read the policy in full re "unelected candidates". I will resist repeating my argument again here.

To address your new feedback comments: it is not my job to "demonstrate the importance of the subject". If you had read the policy in proper detail, you would know the primary criterion is rather to find reliable, detailed, independent third party sources (which I have done!). The other link deleted https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Articles_for_creation/Help_desk/Archives/2017_August_13#10:48:08.2C_13_August_2017_review_of_submission_by_Skinduptruk showed how, to date, the 4x wiki editors I have had the displeasure of dealing with so far have ignored this policy (including you). The consensus of editors that choose to ignore certain sources seems to also breach this policy (maybe they are the minor opposing side of the debate?). Skinduptruk (talk) 03:30, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Ok let me explain in detail. Below is your reference list:

• Bateman, Daniel (2016-05-12). "Healthier approach"Free registration required. The Cairns Post. Cairns. p. 11. Retrieved 2017-04-15.
• Bateman, Daniel (2014-06-04). "Hackers in Cairns gather to use their powers for good"Free registration required. The Cairns Post. Cairns. p. 10. Archived from the original on 2014-06-03. Retrieved 2017-04-15.
• Hume, Anika (2015-01-20). "Youth jobs, development will earn our tick"Free registration required. The Cairns Post. Cairns. p. 13. Retrieved 2017-04-15.
• Remeikis, Amy (2016-06-06). "Federal election 2016: Former Labor MP endorses Greens candidate in Leichhardt". The Sydney Morning Herald. Sydney. Archived from the original on 2016-09-02. Retrieved 2017-04-15.
• Campbell, Jim (2016-08-23). "Greens get rid of defiant runner"Free registration required. The Cairns Post. Cairns. p. 7. Retrieved 2017-04-15.
• Murty, Colin (1994-08-15). "Winners are grinners". The Cairns Post. Cairns. p. 7.
• Wex, Peter (2000-02-03). "School dux wins place at ANU". The Cairns Post. Cairns. p. 3.
• Electronic APS Employment Gazette (PDF). http://pandora.nla.gov.au/tep/75984: Commonwealth of Australia. 2011-07-07. p. 558. Retrieved 2017-04-15.
• Staley, Philip (2016-06-21). "Meet the Leichhardt candidates over a cuppa". ABC Far North (Interview). Cairns. Retrieved 2017-04-15.
• "Queensland Cairns Regional Group", Cairns, 2016-07-03. Retrieved on 2017-04-15
• "Digital Physics Pty Ltd homepage". Retrieved on 2017-04-15
• Tomason, Chloe; Moore, Katherine (2016-05-26). "Technology and Renewables Key to Growth". Uni Poll Watch (JCU). Cairns. Archived from the original on 2016-05-29. Retrieved 2017-04-15.
• Campbell, Jim (2016-06-08). "Green in on Labor function"Free registration required. The Cairns Post. Cairns. p. 8. Retrieved 2017-04-15.
• Voter, ALP (2016-06-08). "Texts"Free registration required. The Cairns Post. Cairns. p. 17. Retrieved 2017-04-15.
• Nally, Alicia (2016-06-15). "Marine Policy Pitch"Free registration required. The Cairns Post. Cairns. p. 10. Retrieved 2017-04-15.
• Vlasic, Kimberley (2016-06-25). "Reef jobs important, not coal". The Cairns Post. Cairns. p. 6. Retrieved 2017-04-15.
• Campbell, Jim (2016-07-01). "Sky's the limit for our smaller party pledges". The Cairns Post. Cairns. p. 5. Retrieved 2017-04-15.
• Meers, Daniel; Marszalek, Jessica (2016-07-02). "It's been a long and largely boring campaign, but it still had its moments". The Cairns Post. Cairns. p. 10. Retrieved 2017-04-15.
• Campbell, Jim (2016-07-04). "Greens say seat coming within decade". The Cairns Post. Cairns. p. 3. Retrieved 2017-04-15.
• MacKenzie, John (2016-05-19). "Talkback with John MacKenzie". 4CA 846 AM (Interview). Cairns. Retrieved 2017-04-15.

Almost all the sources are ones like this from the cairns post. All the other sources are primarily election 'bumf'. You do not have multiple reliable, detailed, independent third party sources that are about the subject and not the election. Also the comments you linked have been archived, this happens automatically due to the volume of comments we deal with.Α Guy into Books™ § (Message) -  08:03, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Thanks for your prompt reply. Firstly, please link to the wikipedia policy that says "multiple" sources? Even if you can find such a policy (since I cannot) then your logic seems self-defeating since you have proceeded to list a rather large list of "multiple" items from legitimate Aus media corporations across newsprint, TV, and radio. The radio interview was almost all personal story rather than political story. The SMH arricle was more about personal style than your phrase "bumf" (please link to the wikipedia "bumf" policy so I can understand what you mean?)... Skinduptruk (talk) 09:22, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

'Bumf' is my incredibly technical way of referring to related and primary sources (WP:PRIMARY), including interviews which are related to the election he didn't win. Multiple sources, while an established consensus, is not really reflected in policy and is mostly based mostly on the communities assumption that 'sources' being a plural means there should be more than one, in practice seems to mean different things to different types of biography. The issue you have is explained reasonably well in WP:BLP1E and WP:ROUTINE. The fact most people cannot read your links may put some people off reviewing, but is not in itself an issue. You say above that it is "not my job to "demonstrate the importance of the subject"", that is the whole point of the notability guideline, it is simply a test to establish the subjects importance objectively. The subject is not 'important' as a failed politician, so you should focus the article on something else he has done, which is in itself notable. Α Guy into Books™ § (Message) -  09:55, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Again thanks for the prompt reply. With due respect, you have a different view of wikipedia wrt the wikipedia stated policy. It is meant to be a collection of primary, secondary, and tertiary sources. There is no need to judge importance, that has been done by virtue of the sources as they stand. I really would like you to read the policy at paragraph #66 here User_talk:Primefac/Archive_10#query_re_national_coverage.2C_reliable.2C_independent... (sorry the URL is not working via my phone) and tell me what is wrong with the sources being reliable, not mere mentions, and independent of the subject! Regards the broken links, I have asked the URL editor here User_talk:Curb_Safe_Charmer#URL_edits_to_require_registration why they added the URL registration code as this rendered the links padlocked.Skinduptruk (talk) 10:40, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

That would explain why I was able to find the articles freely available via Google.

Primefac, who is a respected expert on Wikipedia, has already given an opinion as "Skinduptruk, the issue is not that the sources aren't independent, the issue is that the sources are all pertaining to an election that he did not win. Per WP:POLITICIAN and WP:POLOUTCOMES people who unsuccessfully run for office are not generally considered notable. The "significant independent coverage" that is required for these individuals must be from outside the political sphere to show that they are independently notable from the campaign.".

My personal take on this, is that you need at least 3 sources which do not date from the time of the election, and do not mention the subject as a 'candidate'. This is a consensus formed simply to avoid every politician being notable, I am sorry if it seems unfair. Even if you satisfy me of the quality of the article, I should warn you that the standards of notability needed for anyone involved in politics are very stringent, others have higher standards on this than me. You may be wise to remove any mention of his political activity from the article entirely, along with all references that mention politics, to get an idea of what I see when looking at this.Α Guy into Books™ § (Message) -  10:55, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Please read my previous link in full. I will now quote the sentence I wish you would acknowledge: Just being an elected local official, or an unelected candidate for political office, does not guarantee notability, although such people can still be notable if they meet the primary notability criterion of "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject of the article". Why are wikipedia editors so intent to judge the content of sources. Just check for the above qualities (only) please!! Skinduptruk (talk) 11:37, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

@Primefac: has already pointed out the issue, "The "significant independent coverage" that is required for these individuals must be from outside the political sphere to show that they are independently notable from the campaign." Α Guy into Books™ § (Message) -  11:44, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

I am getting clarification on Wikipedia:Village pump (policy). You can follow the reasoning there.Α Guy into Books™ § (Message) -  12:21, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

My sincere thanks for listening & seeking some broader wiki community guidance here Wikipedia:Village_pump_(policy)#Adding_a_consensus_to_NPOL Skinduptruk (talk) 13:24, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

BNQT article

I am really a bit mystified why you have suggested that the BNQT article be deleted. There is no question about the notability about this musical act in that its members are established musicians, including the lead singers from Franz Ferdinand and Travis, both bands which have sold millions of records all over the world. The latter band headlined the Pyramid Stage at Glastonbury. It is true that BNQT have only released one album, but this has received a five star review from The Guardian (referenced in the article), as well as reviews from all major serious popular music publications and websites. As part of their forthcoming tour to promote the album they are headlining a concert at Le Bataclan, a very well-known Parisian venue which you may have heard of, even if you are not a music fan. I will add some more references to the article but the notability of this band is quite beyond question according to the requirements of wikipedia. Kont Dracula (talk) 10:42, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

The article has now only got 4 references, all of which mainly comment on their album. I do not mind you removing the PROD tag if you want to add more references first, you have 7 days to do this. No notability is inherited by the fame of the front-men, the former bands or the music venue (which i have heard of, mostly for this), If this group has more reviews than are in the article that would be great, but consider converting the article into an article about the album rather than the band. There is no chance this would survive being sent to AfD right now, so do improve this. Α Guy into Books™ § (Message) -  11:02, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Wizard

I moved your Wizard to your user subpages because it's under construction. Please check with the AFC crew before moving it back to the WP: space. Primefac (talk) 21:06, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Ok thats cool. Α Guy into Books™ § (Message) -  21:22, 23 September 2017 (UTC) (you might want to cleanup the prefix/Article wizard 2 space, there are ton of redirects there, partly from some previous work not by me). Α Guy into Books™ § (Message) -  21:22, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

New page reviewer granted

Hello Aguyintobooks. Your account has been added to the "New page reviewers" user group, allowing you to review new pages and mark them as patrolled, tag them for maintenance issues, or in some cases, tag them for deletion. The list of articles awaiting review is located at the New Pages Feed. New page reviewing is a vital function for policing the quality of the encylopedia, if you have not already done so, you must read the new tutorial at New Pages Review, the linked guides and essays, and fully understand the various deletion criteria. If you need more help or wish to discuss the process, please join or start a thread at page reviewer talk.

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Stubs

Hello, I noticed that on Amit V Masurkar you tagged the page with {{stub}}. Usually only bots use that, as there are many different stub options, which can be found on WP:Stubs. Please, when you tag a page as a stub, use one of these more specific ones. --Nerd1a4i (talk) 14:38, 24 September 2017 (UTC)

@Nerd1a4i: Can I use the page curation toolbar for this, or will I have to put stubs in manually? Α Guy into Books™ § (Message) -  14:48, 24 September 2017 (UTC)

Nope, you can't use the page curation toolbar for it as far as I know (it's kind of a pain; as I've said before in the IRC channel, it'd be nice to have a hotcat for stubs). However, I would highly recommend the script User:Ais523/stubtagtab2.js. When imported into your common.js page, go to the page you wish to review, then the "More" tab, then click on "stubs". Pick the area it probably is in, look for it, click on the specific stub to add. There are other scripts out there that I haven't tried, of course. --Nerd1a4i (talk) 14:52, 24 September 2017 (UTC)

Ok thanks. Α Guy into Books™ § (Message) -  15:10, 24 September 2017 (UTC)

A cup of tea for you!

Hello... Thank you for the review on the draft. Manuone (talk) 00:05, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

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September 2017

Thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia. It appears that you copied or moved text from Guneshli waterfall into another page. While you are welcome to re-use Wikipedia's content, here or elsewhere, Wikipedia's licensing does require that you provide attribution to the original contributor(s). When copying within Wikipedia, this is supplied at minimum in an edit summary at the page into which you've copied content, disclosing the copying and linking to the copied page, e.g., copied content from [[page name]]; see that page's history for attribution. It is good practice, especially if copying is extensive, to also place a properly formatted {{copied}} template on the talk pages of the source and destination. The attribution has been provided for this situation, but if you have copied material between pages before, even if it was a long time ago, please provide attribution for that duplication. You can read more about the procedure and the reasons at Wikipedia:Copying within Wikipedia. Thank you. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 09:49, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

• Please correct your copy/paste by providing proper attribution. At the bare minimum, this can be done using edit summaries in both articles. For example, you can post wp:dummy edits in the Waterfall and Günəşli, Lerik article stating that a copy has occurred, linking the articles respectively. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 09:52, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

I have done a null edit with edit summary and put a copied tag on the talk page. I have missed out some parameters on that template, I haven’t figured out they work yet. Α Guy into Books™ § (Message) -  09:57, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Thanks for following up. I added the diff to the template (my diff) and added the template to Talk:Guneshli waterfall. Cheers, North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 10:05, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Brilliant Idea Barnstar
	For your help at #wikimedia-otrs Web IRC ✝iѵɛɳ२२४०†ลℓк †๏ мэ 11:30, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Please check for copyvio

Hi Aguyintobooks and thanks for your work reviewing new articles. Please remember to check for copyright violations. The particular one I saw was Newland House, which had extensive copying from http://ochistorical.blogspot.com/2008/06/newland-house-1898-huntington-beach.html. Thank you, — Diannaa 🍁 (talk) 14:03, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Indeed I will have to be more vigilant, this did not strike me as an obvious copy/paste job, I will probably be safer if I put every page I review through Earwig. Α Guy into Books™ § (Message) -  14:17, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

AfD Closures

Hi Aguyintobooks!

I noticed you've been closing a few AfD's which is awesome - AfD frequently needs help and it's much appreciated! I did want to comment though because you closed The AfD for Parallel force without any closing comments, just simply "closed as keep". I would say this AfD is one that should've received some additional comments and rationale as to why you evaluated consensus as keep as it could be perceived to be a close call. I am not saying it was closed incorrectly, just that it probably could use some more feedback than the standard close. (Here is an example of one that I closed and provided additional rationale on)

I hope this is helpful and feel free to ping me on my talk page or IRC if you have any questions! -- Dane ^talk 23:27, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

MfD nomination of Draft:Bob Bergen Foundation

Draft:Bob Bergen Foundation, a page which you created or substantially contributed to, has been nominated for deletion. Your opinions on the matter are welcome; you may participate in the discussion by adding your comments at Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Draft:Bob Bergen Foundation and please be sure to sign your comments with four tildes (~~~~). You are free to edit the content of Draft:Bob Bergen Foundation during the discussion but should not remove the miscellany for deletion template from the top of the page; such a removal will not end the deletion discussion. Thank you. Drewmutt (^ᴥ^) talk 23:49, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

hello sir

	somebody deleted my page
	do you understand hindi sir some body https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaurav_Kotli my page ThakurSaabji (talk) 07:41, 26 September 2017 (UTC)

• I do not understand Hindi, but I use do use Google translate. I would appear your page has suffered somewhat from a lack of detail and basic formatting, I will fix it.  --- Α Guy Into Books™ § (Message) -  07:44, 26 September 2017 (UTC)

There was also alot of detail which could not be easily verified like the song list, I have omitted these and made it more compact.  --- Α Guy Into Books™ § (Message) -  08:01, 26 September 2017 (UTC)

hello sir

	hello sir
	Gaurav kotli got 4 resional awarad no national award please correct ThakurSaabji (talk) 08:19, 26 September 2017 (UTC)

September 2017

Your recent editing history at Bert Biscoe shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war. To resolve the content dispute, please do not revert or change the edits of others when you are reverted. Instead of reverting, please use the talk page to work toward making a version that represents consensus among editors. The best practice at this stage is to discuss, not edit-war. See BRD for how this is done. If discussions reach an impasse, you can then post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection.

Being involved in an edit war can result in your being blocked from editing—especially if you violate the three-revert rule, which states that an editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Also keep in mind that while violating the three-revert rule often leads to a block, you can still be blocked for edit warring—even if you don't violate the three-revert rule—should your behavior indicate that you intend to continue reverting repeatedly. CHRISSYMAD ❯❯❯¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 19:44, 26 September 2017 (UTC)

00:01:29, 27 September 2017 review of submission by Cig1776

• Cig1776 (talk · contribs)
  • Draft:Ray Martinez (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Why was the page denied? The "Ray Martinez" article that is created has 1/30th the amount of support. Ray Martinez from Colorado is clearly a notable person. Congressional records, Denver Post, Coloradoan, National Public Radio. The other Ray Martinez article has one reference. Cig1776 (talk) 00:01, 27 September 2017 (UTC)

• The article is written in an overtly promotional style not in keeping with Wikipedia's requirement for a neutral point of view.  --- Α Guy Into Books™ § (Message) -  00:04, 27 September 2017 (UTC)

Francisco Calvo Serraller

I removed the PROD you placed here because there was a potential PROF claim. I was about to place {{oldprodfull}} on the talk page, when I noticed it had been part of a mass AfD that was speedy kept because of the potential for notability under PROF. Since this is a controversial deletion that has been to AfD before, it wouldn't be eligible for PROD. DGG will be able to give us a better idea as to if the subject is actually notable. TonyBallioni (talk) 00:47, 27 September 2017 (UTC)

Director of the Prado Museum is certainly notable. It's one of the most famous museums in the world. He'd be notably in any case because of the books, under both WP:PROF and WP:AUTHOR. What the article needs is expansion with further information about his career and details of his books. DGG ( talk ) 03:57, 27 September 2017 (UTC)

Also if you search specifically for the museum there is this which is a good start.  --- Α Guy Into Books™ § (Message) -  07:26, 27 September 2017 (UTC)

AfC, NPR

Hi. I'm just letting you know that I have just temporarily suspended your access to New Page Reviewer and the Articles for Creation Helper Script. This is just while we investigate some possible issues with the subjects of BLP articles you may have reviewed. There is nothing to worry about, this does not affect your ability to edit the encyclopedia, and your access to these user groups will be reactivated as soon as the issues have been resolved. Thanks for your comprehension. Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 03:48, 27 September 2017 (UTC)

Ok no worries, I hope its not too serious.  --- Α Guy Into Books™ § (Message) -  07:22, 27 September 2017 (UTC)

@Kudpung: - Quick question, we are only talking about a few articles (I have listed for convenience), roughly how long will this take?  --- Α Guy Into Books™ § (Message) -  20:24, 27 September 2017 (UTC)

I'm sorry, but I have no idea. I'm one of four or five admins who regularly accord user group permission. Investigations of this kind are generally carried out by users who specialise in WP:COIN. Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 09:39, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

Ok that's fine, I have plenty of stuff to do in the meantime. I have discussed it with some other editors on IRC, and dealt with the main issues there, so it should have got some attention.  --- Α Guy Into Books™ § (Message) -  09:44, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

Tobago Jazz Festival

I have added Plymouth to the heading, thanks for the tip! (Australianblackbelt (talk) 03:57, 27 September 2017 (UTC))

09:34:32, 27 September 2017 review of submission by Flickyard

• Flickyard (talk · contribs)
  • Draft:Go away! Trinity has arrived in Eldorado (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

I've added a few more sources. Will it help that the film is already covered in two other wikipedias? https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arriva_Eldorado https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scansati..._a_Trinit%C3%A0_arriva_Eldorado Thanks for guidance & rechecking!

• It won't help unless you can use sources from the other articles on it, as it is the article on this Wikipedia that counts, and different language Wikipedia's have different policies for inclusion. The additional references have greatly helped, I would recommend to resubmit it.  --- Α Guy Into Books™ § (Message) -  09:38, 27 September 2017 (UTC)

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AGIB 10:04, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

A den jentyl ettien avel dysklyver 10:10, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

Nomination of Tamar Foods for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Tamar Foods is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Tamar Foods until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article. Drewmutt (^ᴥ^) talk 00:39, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

Nomination of Marina de Omura for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Marina de Omura is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Marina de Omura until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article. Primefac (talk) 01:29, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

Wilhelmina van Idsinga

Sorry, Aguyintobooks, but a one-line stub taken from a foreign language Wikipedia is not acceptable. Such pages are of no encyclopediac value and no one will bother to expand them. Please consider translating it yourself or doing a Google translation then cleaning it up. Remember to include the attribution to the original article (See: WP:Translation). Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 16:02, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

Especially when that one-line stub has zero references. Primefac (talk) 23:23, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

I have been told that one line stubs don't violate policy, another asked for this to be created and I created it from the WIR lists, I stand by it, obviously I will add to it when I have time. A den jentyl ettien avel dysklyver 07:43, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

I would genuinely like to know who (or where, if it's not on-wiki) told you that a one-line unsourced stub is acceptable. All articles must have at least one reference. Primefac (talk) 12:48, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

I was told on IRC that it was not a valid rationale for deletion to remove a single sentence article. It is currently connected to the (Dutch?) Wikipedia, which has some sources that I will use to expand it a bit, so would pass a WP:BEFORE, (we have over 1000 other unsourced BLP's in a similar situation, but don't worry I will deal with it). I have been rather busy trying to save Gisela, daughter of Charlemagne‎ from being deleted. A den jentyl ettien avel dysklyver 14:20, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

Your new signature

Hey there, this might be a nit-picky, but I feel your new signature (A den jentyl ettien avel dysklyver) goes against the signature guideline. Namely..

A customized signature should make it easy to identify the username, to visit the user's talk-page, and preferably user page.

Again, I'll admit it's a small thing, but I literally thought you were a different person in a discussion, which could be misleading. Just a thought. Drewmutt (^ᴥ^) talk 23:24, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

Well obviously I have been careful not mix my old and new signatures, It links to my talk-page, which is also my user-page, and is my name, so perfectly descriptive. I appreciate the thoughts though. A den jentyl ettien avel dysklyver 07:38, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

Ditto, I thought you were someone else. It both confused and intrigued me. Regards Widefox; talk 11:34, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

It is deliberate that the signature is different by the way. It is the closest thing to a 'fresh start' i am going to do. coupled with not doing npp or afc or nominating AfD's. A den jentyl ettien avel dysklyver 12:05, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

I didn't know what the guideline says, but Drewmutt is right WP:SIG#CustomSig WP:SIGPROB, the sig has to identify the username. This may have the opposite effect of a fresh start IMHO. Widefox; talk 13:16, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

Well I went for translating my username, very simple way of altering it. The guide I took inspiration from is here: Wikipedia:Clean start.

Otherwise say I ye this.

Bro goth agan tasow, dha fleghes a'th kar,

Gwlas ker an howlsedhes, pan vro yw dha bar?

War oll an norvys 'th on ni skollys a-les,

Mes agan kerensa yw dhis.

Kernow, Kernow y keryn Kernow;

An mor hedre vo yn fos dhis a-dro

Th on onan hag oll rag Kernow!

A den jentyl ettien avel dysklyver 13:49, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

A (old) local pub of mine -- There'sNoTime ^{(to explain)} 13:55, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

Proper stuff. A den jentyl ettien avel dysklyver 14:04, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

• I hate to keep nitpicking, but going by [2] (with the colour set to the equivalent of "orange") your sig colour doesn't meet any of the guidelines for accessibility. At the very least it should be AA compliant. See WP:SIGAPP and WP:COLOR. Primefac (talk) 01:13, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

And here we are again

This edit summary is 100% wrong. People are allowed to edit during an AFD, and "0RR" doesn't exist. If anything, you are the one being disruptive. Please knock it off. I'm tired of having to come to your page every third day regarding your edits. Primefac (talk) 23:48, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

And I'd like to know if you used rollback in this diff. If so, explain yourself. Katie^talk 23:58, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

(twinkle katie) Actually I would like you to explain how this was not disruptive? Are you seriously saying I can nominate an article for AfD and then remove all the references, most the content, and stick CN and Multiple issue tags on it? Then go to the discussion and claim it is fabricated on self published sources? Because if that’s allowed then there are some articles I could totally destroy like this, I was under the impression this is not allowed. please clarify. A den jentyl ettien avel dysklyver 07:30, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

Aguyintobooks (and KrakatoaKatie), I want to AGF, but I don't believe this is truthful. Your twinkle options (found at User:Aguyintobooks/twinkleoptions.js) have the line "summaryAd": " (TWINKLE)",, which explicitly marks the ones done by twinkle. – Nihlus (talk) 07:38, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

Well I don't remember doing it manually? but you have a point it doesn't seem to have been twinkle. Still I would like some clarification on the substantial improvements of an article at AfD being effectively destroyed by the nominator. A den jentyl ettien avel dysklyver 08:43, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

Okay, I'll clarify, though you should have understood this before being granted rollback.

Vandalism is a malicious attempt to harm the encyclopedia. Vandalism is not disruption. It is not making a bold edit. It is not the good faith removal of sources one editor does not believe pass WP:RS. It is not the addition of tags. You have a legitimate beef with this edit, and that's fine, but it is definitely not vandalism. Rollback is for clear cases of vandalism only.

Pinging Alex Shih as he granted rollback, because I do not think you should have access to this tool until and unless you understand what is and isn't vandalism, and until the many concerns of other editors and administrators have been addressed. Katie^talk 14:27, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

Mentor comment Wait a min... I'm mentoring him can we if i can get him back on track hold of on removing any further userrights? Ⓩⓟⓟⓘⓧ _Talk 14:33, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

I'm not going to remove it until Alex weighs in. Katie^talk 14:36, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

(edit conflict) @KrakatoaKatie: (Looks like I am a bit late and it has already been done, sorry) Thanks for the ping Katie. I read through some of the removal done by Agricolae and I thought they were legitimate removal (all three sources in this removal for instance did not address the claim that is being made from my reading). The subsequent ill-advised warning is enough for me to support (temporarily, at least) removing the rollback tool. Alex Shih^Talk 14:49, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

Katie removed it at my request before you got here, but basically I never got into anti-vandal stuff. 14:53, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

And per our conversation on IRC, I've removed rollback. Katie^talk 14:41, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

Thanks. A den jentyl ettien avel dysklyver 14:43, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

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Wilhelmina van Idsinga moved to draftspace

An article you recently created, Wilhelmina van Idsinga, does not have enough sources and citations as written to remain published. It needs more citations from reliable, independent sources. (?) Information that can't be referenced should be removed (verifiability is of central importance on Wikipedia). I've moved your draft to draftspace (with a prefix of "Draft:" before the article title) where you can incubate the article with minimal disruption. When you feel the article meets Wikipedia's general notability guideline and thus is ready for mainspace, please follow the prompts on the Articles for Creation template atop the page. TonyBallioni (talk) 05:22, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

You obviously don't have to use the AfC process on this, but a poorly formatted stub with zero references is best incubated in draft space, where you can grow it and add citations to make it comply with WP:V TonyBallioni (talk) 05:26, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Wilhelmina van Idsinga (September 30)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by Zppix was: Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved.

• If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:Wilhelmina van Idsinga and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
• If you need any assistance, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk or on the reviewer's talk page.
• You can also use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors.

Ⓩⓟⓟⓘⓧ _Talk 15:01, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

AfC notification: Draft:Wilhelmina van Idsinga has a new comment

I've left a comment on your Articles for Creation submission, which can be viewed at Draft:Wilhelmina van Idsinga. Thanks! Ⓩⓟⓟⓘⓧ _Talk 15:38, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

Request

Per the close of this AFD, I kindly ask that you read WP:BEFORE and not nominate any more pages for deletion until you have thoroughly read and understood it. If you have questions please feel free to ask someone; there are many people who are interested in seeing you turn into a productive Wikipedian. Primefac (talk) 20:43, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

Yes thanks, there are some others I would tell this to btw, not naming names, but not everyone is gracious in accepting when they ought to close a nomination. Dysklyver 20:48, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

I discussed this with Zppix and he said you might misunderstand what I wrote, I am making a serious comment about the quality of some nominations at AfD, which you might what to look into if you have the time/want to do so. I am not saying that it doesn't matter or that I don't have too! Dysklyver 21:42, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Wilhelmina van Idsinga has been accepted

Wilhelmina van Idsinga, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.
The article has been assessed as Start-Class, which is recorded on the article's talk page. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article.

You are more than welcome to continue making quality contributions to Wikipedia. Note that because you are a logged-in user, you can create articles yourself, and don't have to post a request. However, you may continue submitting work to Articles for Creation if you prefer.

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Thank you for helping improve Wikipedia!

SwisterTwister talk 21:25, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

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Welcome to Women in Red

I see you have just joined WiR. From the articles you have recently created, it looks as if you will be a productive participant. I see your Marina de Omura is up for deletion. I have recommended it should be kept. Perhaps you can build on the sources listed for the other language versions. If you run into any other difficulties, let me know or post something on the WiR talk page.--Ipigott (talk) 10:19, 2 October 2017 (UTC)

Dirk Coetsee

Good day Dysklyver Thank you for reviewing my draft article Dirk Coetsee (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Dirk_Coetsee). I am new to Wikipedia editing, so please excuse my failure to make the subject's notability clear. I have since compiled a list of sources comprising books, journals, academic research papers and the like which I have not yet inserted in the article, but I am pasting them below for your perusal. Could you please accept my article? Very briefly, Dirk Coetsee (often misspelled Coetzee) was an influential figure in the history of South Africa, particularly the Cape Colony, in that he was one of the first European settlers, establishing one of the oldest South African wine estates Coetsenburg (often misspelled Coetzenburg) and most significantly as captain of the Stellenbosch Infantry and Heemraad (mayor) led a rebellion against the Dutch Governor Willem Adriaan van der Stel which led the Dutch East India Company to remove the Governor and several other colonial authorities due to their involvement in alleged corruption (he led the rebellion with the help of Adam Tas and Henning Husing; there is a diary by the former which is much sought-after in South Africa, called the Diary of Adam Tas/Dagboek of Adam Tas which details this major historic episode). Dirk Coetsee was also deacon of the Dutch Reformed Church (Moederkerk).

• http://www.dbnl.org/tekst/tas_003dagb02_01/tas_003dagb02_01_0004.php
• http://www.academia.edu/31217292/Sodomy_race_and_respectability
• https://repository.up.ac.za/handle/2263/9290
• https://digital.lib.sun.ac.za/bitstream/handle/10019.2/5912/van%20der%20Bijl_Grondeienaars_1979_2.pdf?sequence=2
• https://journals.co.za/content/culture/14/1
• http://www.afrikanergeskiedenis.co.za/die-simon-van-der-stel-fees/
• http://www.stellenboschheritage.co.za/wp-content/uploads/033_Assegaaibosch_Part1.pdf
• http://www.stellenboschheritage.co.za/wp-content/uploads/Jonkershoek-Timeline.pdf
• http://docplayer.net/40815770-Coetzenburg-die-hart-van-stellenbosch-se-sportkultuur.html
• https://readtiger.com/wkp/en/List_of_heritage_sites_in_Stellenbosch,_Somerset_West,_and_Strand

Thanks once again. Philemon Matilda (talk) 17:33, 2 October 2017 (UTC)Philemon Matilda

 Comment: That is good, certainly you are getting somewhere with the notability aspect. Part of the problem with the article is that you are writing it as part of a genealogical/family history project, and it shows in the style (and your odd choice of references). You need to write the article as if it was just about him, what made him important then, think what would you write if he was still alive. writing: "Dirk Coetsee (1655 – 1725) was the progenitor (Afrikaans: stamvader) of the influential French Huguenot-Cape Dutch Coetsee / Coetzee family in South Africa, a branch of which became Anglicized through intermarriage with British settlers after the British conquest in 1795". Just seems slightly odd, there is nothing notable about being the progenitor of anything, you need to assert importance. (or else write an article on the Coetsee family instead). it seems he was a captian of sorts and established a town/city, consider these aspects. Dysklyver 19:50, 2 October 2017 (UTC)

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Speedy deletion nomination of Deanie Parish

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You may want to consider using the Article Wizard to help you create articles.

Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia. This is a notice to inform you that a tag has been placed on Deanie Parish requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section A3 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because it is an article with no content whatsoever, or whose contents consist only of external links, a "See also" section, book references, category tags, template tags, interwiki links, images, a rephrasing of the title, a question that should have been asked at the help or reference desks, or an attempt to contact the subject of the article. Please see Wikipedia:Stub for our minimum information standards for short articles. Also please note that articles must be on notable subjects and should provide references to reliable sources that verify their content.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason, you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. However, be aware that once a page is tagged for speedy deletion, it may be removed without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself, but do not hesitate to add information in line with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. If the page is deleted, and you wish to retrieve the deleted material for future reference or improvement, then please contact the deleting administrator, or if you have already done so, you can place a request here. reddogsix (talk) 20:00, 3 October 2017 (UTC)

Request for input in identifying more appropriate source types for declined article

Dear Dysklyver,

Thank you so much for taking the time to review my first article for creation. Your reason for declining: "This submission is not adequately supported by reliable sources." Music press is comprised of pieces which are wholly positive, or utterly condemning and sources treading a middle ground (while more desirable than those either end of the field) are extremely rare. I've thoroughly read through the guidelines, about two hundred wikipedia articles on other musicians of more or less note, and I don't know what to do next. Would you be so kind as to take another look and point me in the right direction to eliminate unnecessary sources in this article and to find more of what is actually required?

Yours, Jessica

Article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:La_Fleur

Jessicabrown (talk) 16:47, 4 October 2017 (UTC)

• The problem is partly notability, partly verifiability.

The song list is part of the problem, there is normally little reason to include a list of songs. if you do, it should be supported by independent sources (not supported by youtube or itunes).

You should consider that Wikipedia is not a collection of indiscriminate information. If you compare what you wrote with a relevant popular musician like Zara Larsson or Calvin Harris or even John Lennon, you will realize this is not a musician with extensive coverage, you will need to do the best you can, however even if you just randomly chose an article from Category:Swedish musicians you will see that most articles (the ones not in the process of being deleted or tagged with issues) have a number of reliable independent sources from newspapers which are not music press.

It does not matter if the sources are positive/negative/neutral, any reliable source is fine, but beware that tabloid journalism is not reliable (even the Daily Mail is not reliable) so stick to established reputable publications.

The sources you need are books about her, news article about her, any reputable music press article on her. A couple of independent reviews for each song and for each album would be a good way of justifying the inclusion of the song list. Try for 2-3 mid sized biographies (more than 2 or 3 paragraphs) to show notability.

Try to avoid anything which just says where she will perform, tour dates etc do not count as references due to WP:ROUTINE. You may benefit from reading the WP:NMUSIC and WP:RS guidelines as well.

Beware the WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS approach, other articles on the encyclopedia may only be there because they haven't been reviewed yet, the review backlog is ~15,000 pages right now, a significant amount of musicians add pages here for the publicity, and not because they are of any note at all. Dysklyver 17:10, 4 October 2017 (UTC)