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Welcome to the 2020 WikiCup!Edit
Happy New Year, Happy New Decade and Happy New WikiCup! The competition begins today and all article creators, expanders and improvers are welcome to take part. If you have already signed up, your submissions page can be found here. If you have not yet signed up, you can add your name here and the judges will set up your submissions page. We are relaxing the rule that only content on which you have completed significant work during 2020 will count; now to be eligible for points in the competition, you must have completed significant work on the content at some time! Any questions on the rules or on anything else connected to the Cup should be directed to one of the judges, or posted to the WikiCup talk page. Signups will close at the end of January, and the first round will end on 26 February; the 64 highest scorers at that time will move on to round 2. Good luck! The judges for the WikiCup are Sturmvogel 66 (talk · contribs · email), Godot13 (talk · contribs · email), Vanamonde93 (talk · contribs · email) and Cwmhiraeth (talk) 11:43, 1 January 2020 (UTC)
DYK for 2020 MLS All-Star GameEdit
Icicle Station, Icicle CreekEdit
Re: Your reversions of my edits to "Bellevue, Kennewick, Kirkland, Spokane, Spokane Valley, Walla Walla, Yakima, Washington"Edit
Cities that have an infobox and indicate a Council-Manager form of government and then note the Mayor and Deputy Mayor seem ignorant of the difference between Council-Manager and Council-Mayor. Washington's a bit unique in that it has a lot more Council-Mayor cities than say California or Texas. I'm putting effort into getting the correct form of government city by city and you're reverting it wholesale because you claim the elected officials are not notable. Some are and some are not. Where a mayor is the chair of the council but other than that no different than the other six, the mayor is not notable. Where the mayor is a strong mayor, in the Council-Mayor form of government the mayor is much more significant. But if that's true then City Manager is significant for the Council-Manager form of government. If you're intent on just reverting my work and Wikipedia doesn't care about this stuff then I'll abandon my effort to work on Washington cities. I've contributed to many cities in California and Texas. Take a look at Anaheim, California that someone has added a need show/hide toggle to the council members, whereas Riverside, California, Sacramento, California, Burbank, California, Visalia, California, Beverly Hills, California, Camarillo, California, Culver City, California, Richmond, California, Long Beach, California and scores of others list council members. Bakersfield, California has a separate page for Bakersfield City Council (?!). And have flag icons, which you've also been systematically reverting. In Texas, take a look at Abilene, Texas, Waco, Texas, Tyler, Texas, Corpus Christi, Texas, Denton, Texas, Keller, Texas, Fort Worth, Texas, McKinney, Texas, Amarillo, Texas, Midland, Texas, Addison, Texas, Round Rock, Texas, College Station, Texas - scores of cities with the Council-City Manager form of government, council members listed and maintained. Click on any city you can think of (and granted, Texas has more state pride in their flag so their flag icon matters, whereas in Washington the Seahawks flag seems to dominate). Still, elected officials are a whole lot more relevant to the governance of a city than the lists of celebrity-wannabe notable people. We're a representative democracy, and city elected representatives are more important in some respects to that city than state or national elected representatives. I can understand the non-notability of really small cities, but let's at least get the forms of government right. Also, in terms of building up the encyclopedic references in the government sections, State House and Senate and US House and Senate representatives are a lot harder to check because of the gerrymandering of districts, each city requires checking the maps to see which district they're in. Once that is figured out updating encumbants is a whole lot easier and most have their own Wikipedia page (whether they are all that notable is not my concern but someone seems to care and create so linking is simple and notability is apparently established]] I'm not a good enough editor to know how to get into an undo contest and I won't bother. I'd appreciate if you'd undo the reversions and edit the names you don't think are notable. The forms of government matter. Mayors aren't significant for a Council-Manager city but City Managers are. This is an area I have decades of experience in and I can put in a little time here or there but not if it's just reverted throwing out the good with the bad. Your call. 1958publius (talk) 05:59, 11 January 2020 (UTC)
- @1958publius: Wikipedia has policies that cover everything here: Wikipedia is not a directory – a list of city councilmembers with no other merits (like full-fledged biographies, which are only possible for larger cities with more coverage) is less useful than a link to the city's website. The notability guidelines for politicians and common deletion outcomes also show that city councilmembers are not inheritly notable even for some large cities, let alone smaller ones. This largely applies to separate articles, but is also relevant in listing them on the city articles. Much like how we do not list every individual business in a city article, we mustn't list every city councilmember.
- I suggest you look at city articles that have passed through our peer review process (Good articles and Featured articles), including a few of my own that I have written: Arlington, Washington, Marysville, Washington, Edmonds, Washington, Mill Creek, Washington. All of them don't need to list out the individual city councilmembers; the last example is a council–manager city and has the manager listed with a reliable source backing it, which is the ideal scenario for all of the examples I "reverted" (which entailed cleaning up the infoboxes as well).
- On the subject of infoboxes, they are not supposed to be filled with rich detail, but rather provide a short summary while reflecting the content present in the body of the article. A list of city councilmembers for a larger city like Tacoma would be perfectly fine if it was a small section of the "Government and politics" section of the body, rather than taking up valuable real estate in the infobox. Readers get bored quickly when they have to scroll to read the introduction.
- And finally, please read the essay Wikipedia:Other stuff exists, which outlines your use of examples to justify city councilmember listings and the use of flags (which still violate MOS:FLAG, which supersedes anything else in the project). Wikipedia is not able to be fully consistent because of the nature of dispersed editing, so some articles may lag behind in reaching acceptable standards, like those examples you linked. SounderBruce 06:18, 11 January 2020 (UTC)