Talk:Southern Ukraine campaign

RFC in progress

There is an RFC in progress on Talk:2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. HappyWith (talk) 21:40, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Is this really ongoing?

There has been little to no activity since the liberation of Kherson on 11 November 2022. Should this be considered a stalemate? Starship 24 (talk) 22:03, 9 March 2023 (UTC)

No. Curbon7 (talk) 03:06, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

So should it be changed @Curbon7 Starship 24 (talk) 10:14, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

I meant yes this is still ongoing, no it should not be changed. Curbon7 (talk) 12:40, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

Okay. Why do you think that. No battles or real territorial gains since liberation of Kherson. @Curbon7 Starship 24 (talk) 14:27, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

For one. Curbon7 (talk) 14:33, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

They are fortifing areas sure but there is no actual military offensives on either side. To think that UKraine will soon reopeon it is pretty much WP:CRYSTAL @Curbon7 Starship 24 (talk) 17:01, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

Does this article include Dnieper campaign (2022–present) in its scope? Ukraine has been gradually cementing a bridgehead on the Left Bank since October.  —Michael Z. 03:19, 18 December 2023 (UTC)

I would presume yes, especially considering the initial invasion from Crimea direction is covered here. Curbon7 (talk) 06:09, 18 December 2023 (UTC)

Syria

Per the result of an RFC, Syria should be removed from the infobox of this article, and probably also the order of battle section. If I have time, I'll do it myself, but in the meantime, I'm leaving the message here. HappyWith (talk) 15:03, 16 March 2023 (UTC)

Hi @HappyWithWhatYouHaveToBeHappyWith, I've removed the Syrian Army from the order of battle per the RfC. The article retains a dubious 10 June 2022 claim that Syrian fighters were killed in Chkalove, noting that if true, this would mark the first report of Syrian fighters in Ukraine. I'll defer to you on whether or not that should be removed. SaintPaulOfTarsus (talk) 05:46, 16 January 2024 (UTC)

Good call. Not sure about the 10 June claim myself, it's been a while since I've looked at this article and that part specifically. HappyWith (talk) 19:52, 16 January 2024 (UTC)

Infobox Map choice?

I feel the map used for this region in the infobox may be somewhat misleading, as rather than showing the current state of the conflict, it shows Russia's maximum territorial extent from over 1 1/2 years ago. It would probably be a better idea to have a map showing what the current situation is, as with the main "Russian invasion of Ukraine" page.

I wouldn't recommend outright removing the maximum Russian extent map; it might work better if put further down the page, where it'd chronologically line up with the Timeline section. 98.252.78.138 (talk) 23:31, 17 December 2023 (UTC)

Agreed. The other map does show the maximum extent, just in blue as liberated: File:2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine.svg.  —Michael Z. 07:20, 18 December 2023 (UTC)

Looking back through the edit history, it seems that the map before the current one was one of the entirety of Ukraine, so the current map was probably just chosen because it covered this region in particular. There's seemingly no significance to it outside that, so I don't think switching it out would be an issue. 98.252.78.138 (talk) 08:09, 18 December 2023 (UTC)

As discussed here, I have replaced the map in question with one that shows the current front line in Southern Ukraine and is automatically updated. This map also incorporates the maximum extent of the Russian advance in blue, as noted by Michael Z. I am currently in discussions with the primary editor of this map on Wikimedia Commons to make the blue area more precise, specifically in the Mykolaiv Oblast.

I tend towards not reintroducing the earlier map, because there is no way of verifying it. Every edit to the current map has to be supported by a reliable source, so it's more appropriate for use on Wikipedia.

SaintPaulOfTarsus (talk) 21:48, 27 February 2024 (UTC)

Background?

A lot of the stuff in Background is duplicated in the Timeline section, mainly the Mariupol coverage. I'm not sure what exactly the scope of that section is supposed to be? HappyWith (talk) 20:11, 27 December 2023 (UTC)

@HappyWithWhatYouHaveToBeHappyWith The current structure of the article suggests that the Background section should be limited to pre-February 24 events. In its current state, implementing this would reduce the section by several orders of magnitude, but it's probably for the best. SaintPaulOfTarsus (talk) 06:43, 16 January 2024 (UTC)

Disputed map

The map in the infobox is not verifiable.

WP:NOR tells us:

Original images created by a Wikipedian are not considered original research, so long as they do not illustrate or introduce unpublished ideas or arguments

No credits or captions are found on the article page or the file page on Commons, so there is a possibility it may be original research.

Some of its very specific claims regarding particular settlements are not reflected in the body of this article, which really begs the question where the information regarding "maximum extent of Russian advance" comes from.

SaintPaulOfTarsus (talk) 07:35, 17 January 2024 (UTC)

Resolved above SaintPaulOfTarsus (talk) 21:50, 27 February 2024 (UTC)