Talk:Osa Maliki

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Theleekycauldron (talk) 22:05, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

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• Article history

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• ... that former Communist Party of Indonesia member Osa Maliki later followed an anti-communist policy at the Indonesian National Party? Source for PKI membership: "Anggota PKI. Pernah dihukum pendjara 4 tahun 2 bulan" - "PKI member, imprisoned for 4 years and 2 months" (p76); Source for anti-communist (or anti-PKI) policy: "...like-minded men as Hardi and Osa Maliki, who had felt it necessary to phrase their opposition to the PKI..." (p188)

• Reviewed: Eifuku

Moved to mainspace by Juxlos (talk). Self-nominated at 09:59, 15 July 2021 (UTC).

• Length, date, sourcing, qpq checks out. However, I find that the wording of the hook doesn't catch the essence here. I'd suggest ALT1: "... that Osa Maliki, a former Communist Party of Indonesia member, cooperated with army commander and religious groups in an anti-communist purge inside the Indonesian National Party?" --Soman (talk) 18:30, 17 July 2021 (UTC)

• @Soman: Sure, that’d be fine too. Juxlos (talk) 01:12, 21 July 2021 (UTC)

• New reviewer needed to complete the review including checking proposed ALT1 hook by first reviewer (original hook has been struck). BlueMoonset (talk) 16:17, 2 August 2021 (UTC)

@Juxlos and Soman: Hmmm.. the hook depends of him being a member of the communist party (but the ref won't load) and anti-communist moves which are in the (very long) referenced document (I think) but I cannot (quickly) see where it says anything like "cooperated with army commander and religious groups in an anti-communist purge" in the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Victuallers (talk • contribs)

• @Victuallers: @Soman: Maybe use the original “anti-communist policy” instead? Juxlos (talk) 03:42, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

I'm bowing out (or at least I did some time ago). I cannot equate the PKI with communism and I don't know why Maliki objected to the PKI (it may be because they were communist). Too complex. I cannot check the first ref as its in Indonesian. Victuallers (talk) 13:30, 10 September 2021 (UTC)

The wording in the article is "By mid-October, army commanders and religious groups have backed and cooperated with Osa's faction in eliminating supposed pro-PKI elements from PNI". I'd say that is very close to ALT1. --Soman (talk) 22:02, 12 September 2021 (UTC)

@Soman: would you say it's acceptable? If so, it's best to just push it into DYKA. Juxlos (talk) 04:24, 29 September 2021 (UTC)

I didn't object to ALT1, I presented it. The objection came from other editors. I'd say that the distinction communism/PKI is secondary, in contemporary Indonesian context anti-communist/anti-PKI is basically the same (with the possible exception for Murba Party, but that's a more marginal phenomenon). --Soman (talk) 14:30, 29 September 2021 (UTC)

new reviewer needed to check ALT1 and finish the review. theleekycauldron (talk • contribs) (they/them) 01:51, 12 October 2021 (UTC)

• I think the objections raised by Soman invalidate the original hook, and the objections raised by Victuallers invalidate the alt hook. The issue here is that both hooks have analyzed the sources being used (perhaps accurately) with what could be perceived as an original analysis or synthesis of the sources. So, we need a usable hook that uses the language found in the sources and not something that extends beyond the language of the sources (i.e. original synthesis/ analysis). Given that this nomination has languished here since July for this very reason, I am putting a time clock of 72 hours to respond with a usable hook or I will recommend that we reject the nomination. I would suggest trying to craft a hook from a single source which can be easily verified to that source that doesn't require a complex analysis to verify.4meter4 (talk) 19:08, 27 October 2021 (UTC)

• I suggest ALT2: "...that Osa Maliki opposed the introduction of the Guided Democracy, and as a result was removed from his position?" Source: Within PNI, however, as Osa was a supporter of the previous parliamentary system abolished and replaced by the new Guided Democracy, he was removed from his position as second chairman of PNI along with first chairman Hardi by Ali Sastroamidjojo. YttriumShrew (talk) 00:05, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

• I would be fine with that. Juxlos (talk) 00:08, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

• As per Soman, length, date, sourcing (foreign-language sources accepted in good faith), and QPQ checks out. Thanks to an ALT2 proposed by YttriumShrew, this looks good to go. Please note that I am a new reviewer, and would like a second opinion on this. Thanks, Heythereimaguy (talk) 20:54, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

ALT2 to T:DYK/P1, finally

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Osa Maliki/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Kavyansh.Singh (talk · contribs) 10:12, 2 January 2022 (UTC)
Nominator The man from Gianyar (talk · contribs) at 14:28, 12 December 2021 (UTC)

GA criteria

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)
It is reasonably well written. a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists): It is factually accurate and verifiable. a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism): It is broad in its coverage. a (major aspects): b (focused): It follows the neutral point of view policy. Fair representation without bias: It is stable. No edit wars, etc.: It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate. a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales): WP:AGF that you'll fix minor errors later b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
Overall: Pass/Fail:
· · ·

Comments

General

• Following terms are wiki-linked multiple times in the article. Suggesting to import this script. They should be linked only twice——once in the lead section, and once in the prose:
  • In the lead:
    • West Java
    • People's Representative Counci
    • President
    • Sukarno
    • fall from power
  • In the prose:
    • Taman Siswa
    • Indonesian Communist Party
    • Bandung
    • Sukarno
    • proclamation of independence
    • National Revolution
    • West Java
    • mass communication
    • Central Java
    • Hardi
    • Suharto

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 14:58, 2 January 2022 (UTC)

Detailed

• President Sukarno's fall from power — avoid linking two or more adjacent words

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 16:32, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

• During the Japanese occupation (both in the lead and the "Early life" section) — specify "Japanese occupation of of the Dutch East Indies"

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 16:32, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

• Italicize Kenpeitai

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 15:01, 2 January 2022 (UTC)

• In an independent Indonesia, he remained active in politics — should be "In an independent Indonesia, he remained an active politician"

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 16:32, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

• President Sukarno's Guided Democracy — WP:SOB

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 13:34, 22 January 2022 (UTC)

• The "Early life" section should be split in "Early life" and "Early career".

 Half done – The early life section is a bit too short to be split up, imo. I've changed the section's heading to Early life and career to compensate. Cheers, The man from Gianyar (talk) 03:17, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

• Little is known of his early life, but he was educated in a — should be "Little is known of his early life; he was educated in a"

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 03:17, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

• The article writes it as "Indonesian Communist Party", but our wiki-article states the common/formal name to be "Communist Party of Indonesia".

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 13:34, 22 January 2022 (UTC)

• in the failed — "in the unsuccessful"

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 03:17, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

• In the aftermath, Osa was — "Subsequently, Osa was"

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 13:34, 22 January 2022 (UTC)

• and sentenced to jail — would "imprisoned" work?

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 13:34, 22 January 2022 (UTC)

• During his time in Boven-Digoel, Osa spent his free time — repetition of "time"

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 02:43, 30 January 2022 (UTC)

• earning a salary of 17,5 Gulden — the comma should be decimal. And suggesting to use Template:inflation.

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 02:43, 30 January 2022 (UTC)

• BPI — is never again used in the article. Do we need to define the abbreviation?

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 15:01, 2 January 2022 (UTC)

• he studied mass communication abroad — in which country? do the sources discuss this?

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 02:43, 30 January 2022 (UTC)

• Following the proclamation of independence and the beginning of the Indonesian National Revolution, he served in the newly formed provincial government of the province of West Java. — this is repeated information. Already mentioned in the immediately previous section

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 02:51, 30 January 2022 (UTC)

• and later the Indonesian National Party (PNI), after the Kediri Congress in 1946. — "and after the Kediri Congress in 1946, he joined the Indonesian National Party (PNI)."

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 02:51, 30 January 2022 (UTC)

• he studied mass communication abroad. — Repeated information.

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 15:56, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

• between 28 August and 1 September 1963 — 'between' or 'from'?

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 15:56, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

• President Sukarno gave a speech. In the speech, Sukarno chided party — "President Sukarno gave a speech; he chided party"

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 15:56, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

• 6 members — "six members"

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 15:56, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

• Suharto then arranged — "Subsequently, Suharto arranged"

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 15:56, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

• In the third meeting, which took place on 24 March — " In the third meeting, which took place on 24 March"

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 15:37, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

• "reforming" itself. — can remove the quotes

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 15:37, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

• a Heart attack — lowercase

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 15:37, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

• on 3:00 p. m. — Add a non-breaking-space (Template:nbsp) between '3:00' and 'p.m.'. Also, no space between 'p.' and 'm.'

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 02:51, 30 January 2022 (UTC)

• Cikutra Heroes Cemetery, Bandung — replace the comma with 'in'.

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 15:37, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

Images

• Images can take ALT text.

 Done – Sorry for the late reply, but finished adding the alt text. Cheers, The man from Gianyar (talk) 09:51, 24 February 2022 (UTC)

• Images need PD US tags as well. For example, File:Ali Sastroamidjojo Nasional 28 Jul 1960 p3.jpg has both the tags.

 Done – Didn't realize I haven't added the {{done}} on this one. The man from Gianyar (talk) 09:50, 30 March 2022 (UTC)

References

• Ref#24 should be cite-news, not cite-web.

 Done – The man from Gianyar (talk) 15:01, 2 January 2022 (UTC)

Another nice work! Putting on hold. – Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 14:02, 2 January 2022 (UTC)

@The man from Gianyar, any updates? No issues if you are too busy, I am willing to keep this nomination open as long as you wish, assuring that changes would be made. – Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 15:21, 18 January 2022 (UTC)

Oh yeah, this nomination. Sorry, I completely forgot (busy with IRL stuff), but I'll start updating it now. Cheers, The man from Gianyar (talk) 16:30, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

Looking forward to image changes, but as a vast majority of the changes are made, I'll promote. – Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 14:17, 3 February 2022 (UTC)