Talk:Mind over Matter (The Outer Limits)

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: No consensus for move. Bbb23 (talk) 16:47, 13 July 2013 (UTC)

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Mind over Matter (The Outer Limits) → Mind Over Matter (The Outer Limits) – the show list the episode name as this, with the O capitalized. Click the Hulu link I added to the episode in the article to see. Dream Focus 06:50, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

• Oppose per MOS:CT. We don't capitalize four-letter prepositions. Deor (talk) 14:35, 1 July 2013 (UTC)
• The rule says Prepositions containing four letters or fewer (of, to, in, for, on, with, etc.; but see below for instances where these words are not used as prepositions)
• Then in the section below titled "The following words should be capitalized:" it says Every verb, including forms of to be (Be, Am, Is, Are, Was, Were, Been). It isn't being used as a preposition but instead a verb. It isn't talking about a roof being over a house, or someone living over a river. Instead it is a verb meaning overcome. Dream Focus 15:39, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

You've outdone yourself, DF, if you think over is a verb in that title. Perhaps it's time for a refresher course in elemenary-school grammar. Deor (talk) 19:06, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

• Support. "Over" in this case could be interpreted as a verbal noun - the equivalent of "Mind Governing Matter" or "Mind Ruling Matter", where it is clear that the word in the middle is not a preposition. bd2412 T 19:58, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

If you replace over with some other word that isn't a preposition, of course the other word isn't a preposition. But in the expression "mind over matter", over is a preposition. (One might refer to "the man occupying the car" rather than "the man in the car", but the fact that occupying isn't a preposition doesn't mean that in isn't one.) What on earth are they teaching kids in school these days? Deor (talk) 22:16, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Stop the immature personal attacks against everyone who disagrees with you. Over is clearly a verb here, as I have stated. Its in "overcome". Mind defeats/overcomes/dominates matter. Dream Focus 23:11, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Hey, don't try to over me, man! Deor (talk) 01:13, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

• Oppose; the idea that "Mind over matter" is a complete sentence (subject verb object) is absurd. "Over" is clearly a preposition. Powers ^T 14:57, 2 July 2013 (UTC)
• Oppose per MOS:CT. Dicklyon (talk) 00:47, 10 July 2013 (UTC)
• I'm not really a fan of MOS:CT and its ambiguity regarding four-letter words, but "over" is certainly not a verb here. If it were, "Mind over matter" would be a complete sentence. --BDD (talk) 20:54, 10 July 2013 (UTC)
  • I don't think it necessarily needs to be a complete sentence to merit capitalization. Consider Rise Up (film). Should "Up" be lowercase there? bd2412 T 21:59, 11 July 2013 (UTC)
    • Up is capitalized in Rise Up for either of two reasons: It's the last word in the title (see MOS:CT, "The first and last words in a title are always capitalized"), and it's part of a phrasal verb (see MOS:CT, "Words that have the same form as prepositions, but are not being used specifically as prepositions"). Neither has anything to do with the use of over in this title. Deor (talk) 22:06, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.