Talk:Josip Šimunić

comment by 115.70.164.238

22/11/2013 I believe that the paragraph about his actions during the Croatia-Iceland game are worthy of being included in the article. I note that 93.138.50.215 has removed this paragraph twice and has not cited the reason for doing so. The paragraph includes his own justification of his actions and therefore is as objective as is possible in these circumstances. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 115.70.164.238 (talk) 21:58, 21 November 2013 (UTC)

comment by 217.78.228.9

i am fun of olympiacos. I know my team is intersting for Crocian player, i hope he come to my team because he will help to improve our image to champion league. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.78.228.9 (talk • contribs) 12:20, 15 February 2006

Australian stuff

On 12:28, 13 June 2006, User:211.28.139.22 wrote:

Josip "Joe" Šimunić ... is an Australian-born traitor who chose to be a Croatian football (soccer) player

This is a consequence of Australia national football team#Player drain by other countries :) Perhaps it should be explained in more detail here, too. --Joy [shallot] 17:45, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

Given the extremely poor sportsmanship exhibited by this player in last night's game I say croatia can keep him. I don't want this fool representing my country. Jebus Kriste 09:24, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia is not the place to communicate general thoughts about topics, please restrict your comments to the content of the encyclopedia articles. --Joy [shallot]

Joy, it is a statement of fact that following the game against Australia, he is the only man ever to accumulate three yellow cards in a match, therefore proving to be hishonest and unsporting. Paul

Disregarding the mere fact that this incident is recorded properly in the article...

The fact that he (almost) accumulated three yellow cards only goes to show that the referee made an error in judgement in that 90th minute of the game. If he had really wanted to remove Šimunić, he would have shown him the yellow card and then shown him the red card. The play would then stop until the ejected player left the pitch. Those are the FIFA rules, that's what happens normally, and that's what happened for the other two red-carded players in the same game even. Instead, Graham Poll apparently only reached for the yellow card, then changed his mind and let the play continue. It's not Šimunić's fault that he wasn't shown the red card - had he been shown the red card, and had he not complied at that point, that would have been illegal.

And besides, that was actually a minor error compared to the others Poll did during the game. The situations where Tomas played a (second!) hand ball in the penalty box, and when Kewell was off-side for the second goal, those were more important for the outcome of the game than the leniency towards Šimunić when it was practically all over anyway. --Joy [shallot] 16:19, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

User:Ansell wrote in the commit log: remove change to "showing" him the yellow card, find a reference to back it up

The reference is simply the game - I don't recall seeing Poll show him the yellow card, he just arrived at the site of the foul, took it out of his pocket, took out the pencil to start writing onto it, but then apparently changed his mind, and Šimunić just walked away and did not get shown neither the yellow or the red card. Does someone else recall differently? I could have remembered it wrongly, it was pretty late in the game. --Joy [shallot] 13:46, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

Also, to remind of the FIFA/UEFA rules (I heard this on TV from Croatian referees Mateo Beusan and Goran Marić as they comment on refereeing) - for the card to be effective, the referee needs to come to the player who caused the foul, stand reasonably close to him (but not too close), and show him the card with his hand raised (at ca 45 degrees) while the player is watching, so that they are perfectly aware. That's why we always say that they players are shown these cards. If a player is not actually shown the card, then it's a referee error. --Joy [shallot] 16:06, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

The showing of the card was, in my memory reasonably clear, I remember seeing the referee in front of the player with a yellow card up. I also remember Simunic walking towards the players box for a second before stopping and keeping on playing.

You are the only person that I have heard who actually said they thought he didn't show the second card. Even a FIFA official commented that it was the first time in World Cup history that an official had shown a player three yellow cards.

Yes, I've now seen the press conference where they state that he was booked (but only as #3, and confusion ensued, and whatnot). I guess I must have just missed the showing of the card in the TV transmission. --Joy [shallot] 15:08, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Putting my certainty, and the fact that others have not stated your opinion together with my belief in the "no original research" policy. I would ask you still to provide a reference for your view. I do not doubt the official rules, what I doubt is your memory of how the card was produced and shown. If it was that way some journalist would have commented on it. Ansell 04:49, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

The current description in the article is fine, then. --Joy [shallot] 15:08, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

I not confident with wiki programing to go and edit this into the wiki article but this is what happened according to Reuters, Sat Jun 24, 2006 12:18 PM BST http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=worldFootballNews&storyID=2006-06-24T111830Z_01_L24400509_RTRIDST_0_SPORT-SOCCER-WORLD-REFEREE.XML&pageNumber=1&imageid=&cap=&sz=13&WTModLoc=NewsArt-C1-ArticlePage1 From the Reuters article- "Poll met the committee on Friday and in the statement, FIFA say he explained that he wrote down the name of Australian defender Craig Moore when booking Simunic for the second time and failed to realise his error.

Both Moore and Simunic were wearing the No.3 shirt for their respective teams.

The statement continued: "The experienced official is disappointed at having committed the error, the first such mistake in his 26-year career.

"The FIFA referees committee also recognised the oversight and the fact that none of the match officials at the stadium picked up on the error."

Blatter had told reporters on Friday: "I cannot understand how the four people in the team refereeing the match, the referee, the assistants and the fourth official could have allowed this to happen. It is like they had a blackout."

Poll's linesmen were Philip Sharp and Glenn Turner of England while the fourth official was Kevin Stott of the United States." Paul —Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.230.6.199 (talk • contribs) 12:51, 26 June 2006

How can he be a traitor? He is a Croat, born to Croatian parents in Australia.

If anyway is a traitor than that is is MARK VIDUKA. What an ass... He started his European football career with a Croatian team, lived in Croatia for 4 years, his wife is born and bread Croatian, his father is Croatian, his son is a 3/4 Croatian, he has a Villa in Croatia, goes to Croatia for holidays every year....and still he says: " I am Australian mate, through and through". I mean, what a hell? That's a TRAITOR!!!!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.180.108.210 (talk • contribs) 11:49, 27 June 2006

He received early football training at the Australian Institute of Sport which is funded by Australian taxpayers. As such, Simunic's later decision to turn his back on the country of his birth and training was a particularly two-faced one

He expressed on The World Game on SBS television that he wishes to return to Australia to live after concluding his career in Europe, proving what many Australians had long suspected about the man known to them as "Judas" Simunic. Rumours have surfaced that Simunic will be subject to harassment and abuse should he indeed return to settle in Australia.

Despite his education at the Australian Institute of Sport (AIS) - a taxpayer funded elite sports institution - he decided not to play for his country of birth but instead play his international football for the country of his parents' heritage, Croatia (also the country of his parent's birth) in October 2001

Come on guys,i'm half aussy but i must tell that these parts of the article are still not neutreal.I'll try to change them. Pavlos1988 (talk) 12:02, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

Whats all this about him being a traitor? The man feels more like a Croat than an Australian. Maybe its because his family is Croatian and they speak Croatian, and he spent a lot of time in Croatia. Does growing up and learning football in Australia mean he HAS to play for Australia too? If I remember correctly there are about 7 players in the Australian team with Croatian heritage so I really don't understand why you are complaining. Besides FIFA has no rules against it and the Australian football federation (or whatever its called) already complained about "players being stolen" and those complaints fell on deaf ears. Sorry guys, you don't own a person just because he lives in your country. There are many people from Ex-Yugoslavia all over the world and they keep strong ties to their home countries. They are very often involved in sports, for example there are a lot of football players in Scandinavian leagues from Ex-Yu countries. Some of them choose to play for their parents country of birth and some for their own. Its a valid choice and all your complaining about you paying taxes for some football academy don't matter. Why do you accept them in your football academies? Is it maybe because there isn't enough interest among the "native" population? And usually the most determined, active and talented players are immigrants? Don't blame them when they chose to play for the country they feel they belong to. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.177.86.88 (talk) 17:26, 12 February 2009 (UTC)

3 card trick

I presume Simunic speaks English with an Australian accent, which may have confused Poll into recording him as Australia's number 3 rather than Croatia's. 81.77.143.121 22:39, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

"Fascist songs"

In this change [1], Paulcicero, you've said in comment: "(rv, it´s not irrelevant that he enjoys fascist songs)".
This is a serious accusation.
Tell us, Paulcicero, when you're so big expert in fascism, what are the "fascist elements" in that song? Is fascism glorified in that song? Is Mussolini glorified in that song? Is Movimento sociale italiano in that song glorified? Or Nedić's Judenfrei Serbia from WW2? Or any neofascist party?
Tell us. Answer on this question. Don't play dumb.
Paulcicero, go deal with Serbia and Serbia's recent blasphemic act: rehabilitation of Chetnik movement, movement that collaborated with Hitler's and Mussolini's forces. Kubura 10:01, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

What song are you referring to? The article spoke about Thompson in general, are you denying that he has sung fascist songs? Paulcicero 16:54, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

No, Paulcicero.
Read what you've wrote in the comment [2]]: "rv, it's not irrelevant that he enjoys fascist songs".
Answer us, Paulcicero.
We're speaking about your edit on the article about Josip Šimunić. Don't play dumb.
What fascist songs Josip Šimunić enjoys?
Tell us!
We saw what you've wrote, now defend your words.
Give a proof for such heavy discrediting words. Otherwise, leave this topic and don't mess into things that you don't understand, don't speak about things that you don't know anything about, don't accuse and don't discredit living persons for such heavy things as fascism.
You're etiquetting people for such heavy things as if you're speaking about spilled milk.
Grow up. Kubura 08:29, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Kubura did you even read what i wrote in the article? Didn´t Josip say exactly what i wrote? Did i write that he enjoyed fascist songs? No i wrote that he criticized the croatian FA for not playing songs of known ustasa-supporter Thompson. Are you saying that that´s untrue? Paulcicero 13:48, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Paucicero - Sorry but I have to stop you right there. I know its pointless to ask you but I think it matters where you are from on this topic. I'm going to give you what I think its a rather objective view on Thompson. Most people either love him or they hate him. Let me tell you first that I hate his music. I heard it and I hate it. However, most people who accuse him of being a Ustasa do so without really knowing the lyrics to his songs. I actually decided to not follow this trend of name calling and read his lyrics. The song Simunic was referring to has absolutely nothing to do with anything fascists or nazi or anything that could be seen as negative towards anyone else. I believe this is the reason you get so heavily criticized here. You simply say he is a ustasa and anyone who likes his music must be ustasa also. This is just bad logic, sorry. I don't know if you understand Croatian but to make such a statement like you did I guess you must understand it. So I challenge you to find something fascist or nazi in the song "Lijepa li si" which Simunic refers to. Here is the text in Croatian

Kad se sjetim suza krene Zamirišu uspomene Svake stope rodnog kraja I narodnih običaja

Prepoznah ljepotu tvoju Što probudi ljubav moju Kad sam s tobom srce moje Kuca jače, veliko je

O Zagoro, lijepa li si Slavonijo, zlatna ti si Herceg-Bosno, srce ponosno Dalmacijo, more moje Jedna duša a nas dvoje Pozdrav Liko, Velebita diko

Kad Neretva moru krene Ti se tada sjeti mene Mojoj pjesmi budi tema Za sve one kojih nema

Ajde, Istro i Zagorje Podignimo sve tri boje Zagrlimo se pred svima Neka vide da nas ima

Lijepa li si

If you don't understand it then you really are talking about something you know nothing of. If you do then please show me where he is being all fascists as you call him. The song is corny and melodramatic but it is certainly not fascist. What Simunic talks about is the fact that this song was banned from being played on the Croatian national stadium. Me not liking the artist's music or style isn't reason enough to ban him. That is not done in democratic nations, freedom of speech and all that. Banning this song made it exactly the song everyone wants to hear.

If you are referring to rumors that Thompson did sing some "fascists" songs in the 1990s then you are talking about another topic and something that doesn't really have anything to do with Simunic. This may not be the best place to discuss that but I will say that I do believe the rumors. He probably did sing some fascist song in the 90s. Personally I don't really care because, as I said earlier, I believe music and lyrics fall into the domain of free speech and I may not like it but it shouldn't be illegal or censored. On the other hand, this did happen in the 90s and if you're familiar with the things that were happening in Croatia during the 90s you might understand where he was coming from. He didn't sing his own songs but he sang some old songs that use to be banned for a good half a century or so because they were associated with the Ustasa regime. Just the act of banning these songs made them into something special and when Croatia declared independence it so happened that people could sing songs without being persecuted anymore. I don't want to excuse the acts of Ustasa but I do want to make it clear that we are talking about a song. The 1990s were a very dramatic period in Croatian history where Croats weren't sure if they were going to have a country or not, whether they were going to live or die so personally I am ready to forgive some nationally pumped up songs. At that time I must admit that they did boost my moral quite a bit, and not only me. But show me a war where propaganda isn't being used to boost moral among the population. Anyway, you call Thompson a fascist and anyone who listens to him is automatically a fascist too. I think you're the one thats showing signs of intolerance and ignorance. You chose to believe what you believe without even trying to consider the other side. I think Thompson is a corny, patriotic musician and the only reason he is so widely popular in Croatia is because he is constantly being banned, censored and attacked by people who don't even listen to his lyrics. This makes him somewhat of a rebel figure among the young. As for the song Simunic is talking about, it really has nothing at all negative in it let alone fascist. 62.177.86.88 (talk) 18:10, 12 February 2009 (UTC)

Paulcicero, you're playing dumb again.
You behave like you don't know what you've wrote. Here's again, to remind you [3], "(rv, it´s not irrelevant that he enjoys fascist songs)". Kubura 12:01, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

You are playing dumb kubura, this is the talk-page of the article NOT the history log. Paulcicero 21:14, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Edit request from 161.53.38.197, 31 August 2011

161.53.38.197 (talk) 12:19, 31 August 2011 (UTC) Josip Šimunić is not a player od Dinamo Zagreb, he is still a TSG 1899 Hoffenheim player

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Avenue X at Cicero (talk) 09:37, 1 September 2011 (UTC)

File:Josip simunic hoffenheim.jpg Nominated for Deletion

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Scandal With the Moron Shouting a Croat version of "Sig/Heil" ("Za dom/spremni") Four Times

Someone has been persistently eleiminating from the article the reference to "Šimunić was involved in controversy following a 2–0 win for Croatia against Iceland in Zagreb on 19 November 2013. He was accused of neo-nazi sympathies having directed the crowd in a chant following the game. The use of the expressions, "For the homeland!", with the fans responding, "Ready!" was a revival of chants used by the fascist organization Ustashas during World War Two. Šimunić defended his actions saying that he was driven by love for his Croatian homeland."

It should definitelty be put back in and perhaps the passage expounded, as he has been offically sanctioned by the Croat courts to pay more than 3,000 Euros because of his moronic and criminal activity, and the FIFA is looking into the matter seriously, so deleting the fact from the article does not change the fact that all this has happened.

References

Issues with the Controversies section

After the incident where Simunic was fined for shouting a fascist salute, there has been issues with vandalism in this article. We have had an IP that blanked the whole thing, then another IP that put a huge wall of text with no sources, like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Josip_%C5%A0imuni%C4%87&oldid=585321638 Then there has been someone putting quotation marks around the word Fascist, despite that he was considered guilty by FIFA and fined for doing it. Then the word "Fascist" was removed entirely.

Some people seem to wish that information about this incident is partially or totally erased, and therefore I suggest we apply semi-protection of this article for a year. Anonimski (talk) 00:30, 26 December 2013 (UTC)

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