Talk:Conspiracy theories about Adolf Hitler's death

Archives (Index)

1 2

This page is archived by ClueBot III.

Image in "Evidence" section

Despite what the Commons editor put in the upload details, those initials bear no resemblance to "JFK" (much less support a wikilink to John F. Kennedy). The initials look like "TJM" to me. And of course the source FBI file that the image is taken from is redacted. Schazjmd (talk) 21:07, 24 April 2023 (UTC)

Nor does that source interpret the text as the caption to the image does. I have removed it as OR. Beyond My Ken (talk) 22:48, 24 April 2023 (UTC)

Good catch, gentlemen. I removed this image from another article where it was placed and claiming the same thing. I also checked the cite, and you two are correct. There is nothing that states this note was written by JFK; it is only an OR stretch. Kierzek (talk) 03:53, 25 April 2023 (UTC)

Conspiracy theories...or Survival theories?

Or, Alternative theories. If Hitler was dead, the theories outlined aren't about that. They are about his survival, and would be subsumed under a title:

 Survival theories about Hitler

In any event, the term "Conspiracy" is only pertinent where there is collusion between two or more people to commit an evil or unlawful act. The fact that Hitler was evil does not entail that any plan to spirit him away to South America would be an evil or unlawful act, any more than preparing and bringing his meals to him.

All that said, there remains an alternative theory about Hitler's death undiscussed: that he was dead and buried elsewhere. I won't elaborate on this in the talk page as it is not the purpose of talk pages, but it can be found in various sources. JohndanR (talk) 02:42, 19 September 2023 (UTC)

I do not believe the title of the article should be changed. It states what the article is about, which is the various conspiracy theories and fringe theories as to cover-up as to his death and survival theories. The definition to be used it’s not “conspiracy”, but the definition of conspiracy theories.

See: Oxford English Dictionary (Online ed.). Oxford University states "the theory that an event or phenomenon occurs as a result of a conspiracy between interested parties; spec. a belief that some covert but influential agency (typically political in motivation and oppressive in intent) is responsible for an unexplained event". Kierzek (talk) 15:57, 19 September 2023 (UTC)

Heh, I've never loved this title but there's no compelling reason to change it. The article also defines the premise as a fringe theory that relies on alleged collaboration (i.e. conspiracy). The word "survival" is vague, since Hitler in fact evaded many attempts on his life. Death refers to a particular accepted event (even if its factuality is questioned by some nuisances). UpdateNerd (talk) 02:13, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

Proven survival would necessitate organizing ~Exaggeration of Adolf Hitler's death. Prose could be repurposed regarding 1) eyewitness accounts, 2) Soviet propaganda, and 3) forensics—novelly covering the development that, somehow freddy returned. UpdateNerd (talk) 04:43, 14 October 2023 (UTC)

Source for dental remains?

Please provide 2601:152:97F:8A60:B1B2:19E9:89C2:8605 (talk) 14:51, 28 December 2023 (UTC)

Terminology around suicide

I am intending to continue the work of other Wikipedians in changing the language around suicide from 'commit suicide' to 'die of suicide'. The phrase 'commit suicide' harkens back to the concept of suicide as a Biblical sin and propagates the stigma around suicide as a deliberate act of harm, when in fact it is an utterly blameless consequence of mental illness. There is no reason to make any exception to this new terminology here, just because the victim happens to be Adolf Hitler. That is irrelevant. My grandfather, for instance, didn't 'commit cancer' - he died of cancer. Hitler didn't 'commit suicide' - he died of suicide. Thecolonpagesaretoocomplicated (talk) 15:22, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

RfC on "commit suicide" language in the Manual of Style (2021). Schazjmd (talk) 15:26, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

Yeah we don't need to soften the language about Hitler's last act of cowardice. Simonm223 (talk) 15:31, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

There is no rule that states the language needs to be changed and as pointed out, an RfC has stated Wikipedia consensus. And that is what we go by. Not to mention major WP:RS biographers use that terminology when describing the act, still. And yes, he did “commit” an overt act, accordingly. Kierzek (talk) 20:11, 28 April 2024 (UTC)