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Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/2020 Masters (snooker)/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by Ealdgyth via FACBot (talk) 23 July 2020 [1].

2020 Masters (snooker) edit

Nominator(s): Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 10:01, 23 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

This article is about the 2020 edition of the Masters, an invitational event for the 16 best snooker players in the world. Seven-time winner Ronnie O'Sullivan decided not to play, and was replaced by Ali Carter, who reached the final where he played Stuart Bingham. Bingham won the event 10-8, winning his second Triple Crown event, having won the world championship in 2015. He was the oldest winner of the event. The event was one of the best Masters event in recent history, with world champion Judd Trump scoring a century break in every frame he won. The tournament was one of the final ones before the break due to COVID-19. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 10:01, 23 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Eddie891 edit

  • "; the remaining places were allocated according to the world rankings after the UK Championship in December 2019" based upon our rankings, wasn't Trump also ranked first according to the world rankings? So they would all have been allocated according to those rankings?
    • Yes - they were, however that's not how the seedings are chosen. It is defending champion 1, then the next 15 in the rankings. This has previously been players not ranked one in the world, and theoretically could be players not in the worlds top 16. I think it would be wrong to comment against this. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 17:59, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • You say the O'Sullivan "ranked third, chose not to enter", but later say that he "pulled out of the event", implying (to me at least) that he was entered and then pulled out. What could be the reason for this?
    • So, the event is invitational, but there is some confusion as to if he RSVPed, or if WST thought he would just play. If he simply refused to enter, or if he was in the event and withdrew is up for debate, and is commented on later. Realistically the result is the same. Happy to change either way. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 17:59, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
      • Perhaps you could add a mention about the confusion as a note to avoid confusing any readers such as myself? Eddie891 Talk Work 23:18, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • "The draw for the tournament" anywhere you could link for 'draw'?
    • draw doesn't really give a decent target. "Draw, the schedule of fixtures in a sports league" is the closest, but no article. There may be something in a glossary somewhere, but nothing at cuegloss. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 17:59, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Shortly before the 2020 Masters, organisers World Snooker were re-branded as the "World Snooker Tour"." reads oddly to me, probably my lack of common sense. Anyways, can you be more specific as to when the re-branding occurred?
    • Like the week before?
  • " the change in branding" which change? Both?
  • "The 2012 Masters champion Neil Robertson played UK Championship runner-up Stephen Maguire" do they have seeds? You also seem to largely omit seeds after this paragraph-- am I missing something?
    • Sure, I can add them throughout if you'd like, but I usually like to have one distingisher, such as X year champion, or X seed rather than both. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 17:59, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
      • Well I'd just want consistency. You say "Three-time Masters champion and fourth seed Mark Selby" and ". The 2019 UK champion and eighth seed Ding Junhui". I'd personally prefer champion and seed so people know both, but it's pretty much a matter of personal preference. Eddie891 Talk Work 23:18, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • "During frame five of the match, referee Ben Williams was stung by a wasp when attempting to remove it from the table" this seems really trivial to me-- is it even worth mentioning?
    • it was a DYKhook. Can take or leave, but I usually leave these things in to be a bit topical. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 17:59, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • "played world number 17 Ali Carter." you've mentioned Carter pretty often already, I doubt it's necessary to mention his rank (again)
  • "receive the Paul Hunter Trophy" why the italicization?
  • Are there viewership statistics?
    • I'd love to know if the BBC or Eurosport do indeed publish this - I would love to add it. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 17:59, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Overall, a very nice article imo. Snooker will never make sense to me, but this article does! My comments are pretty subjective, please feel happy to discuss any/all further. I might comment again later... Best wishes, Eddie891 Talk Work 17:00, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Epicgenius edit

Also a placeholder. epicgenius (talk) 15:52, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • O'Sullivan was eligible to compete in the event, but chose not to participate; his entry was given to Ali Carter, who reached the final where he played Stuart Bingham. - saying "who... where..." is a bit strange as it's two clarifying phrases attached onto each other. I suggest "who reached the final and played Stuart Bingham there" or something similar.
  • with players who had won all three events wearing a crown on their playing waistcoats - also a bit strange in light of the previous phrase. I'd get rid of "with" and change "wearing" to "wore", e.g. "players who had won all three events wore a crown on their playing waistcoats". But this is optional. I think "playing waistcoats" is weird but I assume that's the proper phrase.
  • During this frame, he played a shot that BBC commentator Steve Davis described as "the most amazing shot in the history of snooker." - Not really a critique, but that Steve Davis?
  • In attempting to pot a red ball into the top right pocket, Maguire struck the cue ball with such force that the red leapt into the air after hitting the back of the pocket and landed on the table, but had so much backspin that it rolled back into the pocket; the cue ball jumped the pack of reds, hit the knuckle of the right middle pocket and went in-off in the bottom right pocket. - This is a pretty long sentence, and I suggest splitting it.
  • highest number of career century breaks - why not say "most century breaks"?
  • Perry missed a red allowing Murphy to clear the table for a 5–2 lead, winning the match in frame eight - first, should there be a comma after "missed a red", and second, should we put a conjunction before "winning the match in frame eight"? E.g. "Perry missed a red, allowing Murphy to clear the table for a 5–2 lead, thus winning the match in frame eight".
  • The winner of the match would receive the Paul Hunter Trophy - who is Hunter?
  • due to the 2019–20 Australian bushfires. - to help out with recovery from said bushfires?

That's it from me on prose; it seems to be a very well written article. I intend to claim this review for points in the WikiCup. You know why :P epicgenius (talk) 23:06, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Support from MaranoFan edit

  • In the first sentence of the Overview section, I would suggest adding snooker between "invitational tournament".
  • "Ali Carter, who was ranked 17th prior to the tournament" - Was 17th a global rank, a rank from a prior tournament? Might help to clarify this.
    • From the world rankings - it does say " the top-16 players from the snooker world rankings invited". Happy to change to "17th in the world rankings prior to the tournament" if you'd like. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 18:06, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • "O'Sullivan had pulled out of the event for 'personal reasons', but O'Sullivan later commented" - Would substitute the second O'Sullivan with "he" to avoid repetition.
  • "Selby then won three consecutive frames to go into the lead for the first time" - Maybe "Selby then won three consecutive frames and took the lead for the first time" sounds a bit better, might just be me though.
  • "but O'Sullivan commentating for Eurosport said of Lisowski: "to lose six frames on the bounce, you can't do that. There's something seriously wrong in your game" - The fact that he was "commentating for Eurosport" might be unnecessary to mention in this sentence and disrupts the flow a bit.
    • The thing is - why is he making this comment? He's a player (and one that was supposed to play in the event), so clarifying him as working the event as a pundit seems relevant. Let me know what you think.Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 18:06, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Carter won the first frame with a break of 126, before Bingham took the next two frames" - "Claimed the next two frames" or "won the next two frames" might work better.
  • Good to see alt texts for all the images.

I will admit that as someone completely unfamiliar with this sport, it did contain some jargons I didn't know before, but they are appropriately wiki-linked at the first mention. The article is also well-researched and well demonstrated with lots of quality images. Found it a great read. Cheers.--NØ 16:04, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Support - Good luck with this! And in case you have some time later and feel like it, I do have an active FAC which could use comments. Cheers.--NØ 18:35, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Support from Naypta edit

n.b. I'm only leaving comments as this is my first FAC review per the FAQ; also, disclaimer that I know very little about snooker!

  • In winning the event, Bingham won £250,000 from a total prize pool of £725,000 - to me, reading this sentence reads as if the £725,000 would conceivably have been possible for him individually to win. It might be worth rephrasing to something like "A £725,000 total prize pool was available for the competitors; as the overall winner, Bingham won £250,000."
  • The week before the 2020 Masters, organisers World Snooker were re-branded as the "World Snooker Tour" - the infobox lists the organiser as WPBSA. Looking at the article for the WPBSA, it seems the one is a subsidiary of the other, but it's probably worth being internally consistent in terms of who's being branded the organiser.
    • Added World Snooker to the infobox. World Snooker is the subsidiary of the WPBSA. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 08:36, 15 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • He later remarked that Lisowski was "flawless for two frames", but O'Sullivan commentating for Eurosport said of Lisowski: - the "he" here is slightly confusing, as four different names are mentioned in the previous two sentences; it might be better to change the pronoun to a definite name.
  • In frame eight, Carter played a roll-up to the yellow ball which was called as a foul by referee Desislava Bozhilova who deemed the cue ball not to have made contact with the object ball could probably do with some commas - "Carter played a roll-up to the yellow ball, which was called as a foul by referee Desislava Bozhilova, who deemed the cue ball not to have made contact with the object ball", perhaps?
  • Video replays of the event showed that the balls had not in fact made contact - I think the flow here could be improved by either replacing "in fact" with a suitable adverb like "actually", or by splitting the clause again - "had not, in fact, made contact".
  • Carter looked likely to lead 5–2, requiring three shots to win frame seven but missed a shot on the brown ball which Murphy won should read with commas, because the clauses aren't independently split at the moment; "Carter looked likely to lead 5–2, requiring three shots to win frame seven, but missed a shot on the brown ball, which Murphy won" is how I'd write it, but you could avoid that last comma - that's just personal preference.
  • which was briefly delayed by a "whoopee cushion" device being set off in the crowd - does "whoopee cushion" need quotes? Genuine question - it's neither explicitly requested nor prohibited in MOS:".
    • So it's down as a quote, because it was very likely it was a fart machine, rather than a whoopee cushion, but all RS call it a whoopee cushion. I have no preference. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 08:36, 15 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Broadly, this looks good, but I'll leave that determination to those with far more experience than me Cheers! Naypta ☺ | ✉ talk page | 09:38, 14 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • I've covered the avobe Naypta, thanks for taking a look. If you could chuck an oppose/support on this if I've covered your concerns, I'd appreciate it. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 08:36, 15 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Coord note edit

I believe this needs an image and a source review? --Ealdgyth (talk) 14:05, 20 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

  • That's right - I've added it to the list on WT:FAC; but just needs looking at. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 14:14, 20 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Image review—pass

All images appear to be freely licensed. However, I think it would be beneficial to pick a lead image, since many readers do not read past the lead. (t · c) buidhe 14:24, 20 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Source Review - BennyOnTheLoose edit

Placeholder for the source review. I intend to claim Wikicup points for this review. (Note - I've made a handful of small edits to the article in the past.) BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 09:15, 22 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I've asterisked WPBSA/World Snooker sources. These appear to be used appropriately where alternatives would be difficult or perhaps impossible to find, and they are not used here to support controversial claims. "Usage" OK indicates that the source is used appropriately and that text is supported by the source. There is an open debate at WP:SNOOKER about reliability of sources - none of the sources used here are regarded as unreliable by consensus there.

I find the article to meet the relevant criteria:

  • "well-researched: it is a thorough and representative survey of the relevant literature; claims are verifiable against high-quality reliable sources and are supported by inline citations where appropriate;" - a range of appropriate sources for this type of article is utilised. I've read through the February 2020 issue of Snooker Scene, which covers the tournament in detail, and have no concerns about range or depth of the article here following that. (I did add one citation where the existing reference was to a video).
  • "consistent citations: where required by criterion 1c, consistently formatted inline citations using either footnotes" - I ran a script to remove a couple of empty parameters. I can't see any pending issues.
So I'm happy to support. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 11:28, 23 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  1. broadcast RS* OK, Usage OK
  2. bbc._Mast OK, Usage OK
  3. ronnie - see below.
  4. wst._O'Su - see below.
  5. snoo_Race RS* OK, Usage OK
  6. firstdraw - see below
  7. radi_Mast RS OK, Usage OK
  8. hitc_Snoo RS OK, Usage OK (I wasn't familiar with this source but it appears to be independent and with editorial oversight. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 18:21, 22 July 2020 (UTC))[reply]
  9. live_Cent RS* OK, Usage OK
  10. 2pMvO - see below.
  11. hYf7Y RS* OK, Usage OK
  12. OZuPY - see below.
  13. tc0Wd RS* OK, Usage OK
  14. 4eGXh RS* OK, Usage OK
  15. UQdE8 RS* OK, Usage OK
  16. rjrbG - see below under "Main Draw"
  17. Robertson/Maguire BBC RS OK, Usage OK
  18. tSJPo RS* OK, Usage OK
  19. spor_Mast RS OK, Usage OK
  20. asia_LIVE URL no longer available - fixed. OK BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 18:21, 22 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  21. finalfirstround BBC RS OK, Usage OK
  22. Perry/Ding & Carter/Selby BBC RS OK, Usage OK (Page title has changed since being archived, not an issue. Has Perry as "world number 16" rather than "15th seed" but O'Sullivan's absence is covered in the text elsewhere.)
  23. Carter/Selby & Perry/Ding SL RS OK, Usage OK
  24. Robertson/Maguire SL RS OK, Usage OK
  25. x75Yt RS OK, Usage OK (video not available outside the UK)
  26. Trump/Murphy RS OK, Usage OK (verifies "flattering")
  27. EiEI6 RS OK, Usage OK
  28. euro_Snoo_HvhrC RS OK, Usage OK (OK for Bingham breaks; not OK for "Seeded fourth.." ?(see below))
  29. quarter day1 RS OK, Usage OK
  30. Bingham/Wilson BBC RS OK, Usage OK
  31. bbc quarter 1 RS OK, Usage OK
  32. snoo_AliC RS OK, Usage OK
  33. quarter3 RS OK, Usage OK
  34. live_Matc RS* OK, Usage OK
  35. bbc semi RS OK, Usage OK
  36. Semi2Broadcast - video is unavailable - fixed. Lee Vilenski the link works but the video there says unavailable. Additional source added. BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 11:28, 23 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  37. Bingham/Carter live RS OK, Usage OK
  38. rte final - RSOK, Usage OK after change.
  39. wst._Bing RS* OK, Usage OK
  40. referee RS OK, Usage OK
  41. SL microscope RS OK, Usage OK
  42. snoo_TheM RS OK, Usage OK
  43. bbc final RS OK, Usage OK
  44. wst._Dafa RS OK, Usage OK
  45. whoopie cushion OK, Usage OK
  46. Final WST RS* OK, Usage OK

Article by sections

  • 0. Infobox & Lead - no sources used here, they are elsewhere - no issues
  • 1 Overview
  • 1.1 Prize fund - no issues
  • 2.1 First round
    • "Carter, 17th in the world rankings, had qualified for the event after world number three Ronnie O'Sullivan had chosen not to participate" is verified by the live version of **"Perry/Ding & Carter/Selby BBC" but not by the archived version from 12 Jan.- changed citation
    • "Robertson won the first four frames to lead 4–0 at the interval" is not in the cited source. "Robertson/Maguire SL" could be used -done
    • "above Neil Robertson" is not in the cited source. - removed - not all that important
    • "Seeded fourth, Higgins was the first higher-ranked player to win their first-round match and progress to the quarter-finals." is not verified by the live version of the cited source - sure, I'm not sure this one is such a biggie, and isn't a contentious item, considering we already mention what happened to the three players higher than him. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 17:25, 22 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • 2.2 Quarter-finals - no issues.
  • 2.3 Semi-finals - no issues.
  • 2.4 Final
  • "RTE final" doesn't verify "played as a best-of-19 frames". "tc0Wd" could be used instead. - done Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 17:25, 22 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • 3 Main draw / 3.1 Final
    • snooker.org ref archive link rjrbG is from before the final results and referee were included. the ref "referee" could be used here instead - I've just removed the archive Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 17:25, 22 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • 4 Century breaks - no issues.
  • 5 Broadcasting - no issues.
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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