User talk:Trevor MacInnis/Archive 6
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WPAVIATION class=NA
Hello.
I noticed you change WPAVIATION class to NA from Cat. I think it should stay as "Cat", but the template should be changed. The reason is that it fits into WP assessment categories and its easier to manage categories on that level. With NA it's impossible to distinguish category articles and other articles. Thank you! Solarapex 03:44, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
- I noticed it here Category talk:Aerospace companies of the United States. Basically, it should fall into this directory Category:Articles by quality, if the template is developed correctly. There are categories for categories, lists, templates, etc. These categories also are used by different kind of bots. "NA" is usually used as the last resort. I'll change the template tomorrow (I did that for a couple of projects) and revert some of your changes if you don't mind. Solarapex 04:22, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
== brand new at this just thought I was looking for an encyclopedia - found that I was going to be a collaborator. I searched for [aerodyne] and found that the definition left something to be desired. So I drafted a proposal on the talk page. Don't know if asking you to take a look at it is the right answer but I saw that you had looked at it a few months ago and your name also indicates that you are a frequent article reviewer. Waafcdr 06:58, 6 November 2007 (UTC)
1345
Do you have a specific year in mind? More recent years would be far more difficult. Wrad (talk) 04:53, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
Need your opinion
Hi, your name was dropped on my talk page--would you care to weigh in on this discussion? Thanks! Katr67 (talk) 20:11, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
XF-104
Hi Trevor, thanks for looking at the XF-104 article and adding corrections, I have been busy today adding a little text and many more inline refs. I am not entirely convinced by the use of 'first' and 'second' as headers, another editor did this, not sure if it is convention or if there is a better way. I am quite keen to help move some aviation articles up the quality ladder, we seem to hit opposition around the GA process. Cheers. Nimbus227 (talk) 13:50, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
- Hi Trevor, could you have another look at this please, I did a lot of referencing work the day after your comments and must have forgotten about it. I believe that there is a ref in virtually every paragraph now. Cheers and thanks very much. I drive a DH82 Tiger Moth BTW, a bit slower than your machine! Nimbus227 (talk) 21:16, 9 January 2008 (UTC)
Your recent edits
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Coordinate
Hi Trevor, I could do 'gliding' easily but I'm really not sure what needs to be done. There seems to be a pool of talent here (aircraft project) not quite knowing where it is going. We seem to have only one admin, the two Bills seem to lay down the policies?! Nimbus227 (talk) 03:07, 9 January 2008 (UTC)
Reeve Aleutian Airways
Thanks for your comments. Re the photos, I've managed to get three photos of aircraft in Reeve Aleutian livery, but at the moment they are not free use photos. Am is discussion with the author about getting free use versions onto wikipedia. The photo of the Grumman Goose may be an ex-Reeve aircraft too. Other photos are used to illustrate the type of aircraft used. They will be replaced as and when I'm able to source and get permission to use photos of the actual aircraft involved. As for the variety of sources, that is a tricky one. Reeve Aleutian never was a large airline, so there isn't likely to be much else available apart from the Airliners magazine mentioned on this talk page, and I doubt that would add anything not already known. Mjroots (talk) 08:42, 9 January 2008 (UTC) P.S. N19906 is still at Anchorage as far as I know, if you're ever that way could you take a picture?
Mayday
Actually, what is preferred is Mayday (Air Crash Investigation, Air Emergency) as the same episodes are aired worldwide, but under different show names. WhisperToMe (talk) 16:30, 9 January 2008 (UTC)
737
Thanks for the invitation. I am very interested in the 737 article. In fact, it was about #4-5 in my mental list of articles to re-write. It can be potentially be made into a FA but needs some work. Archtransit (talk) 18:32, 10 January 2008 (UTC)
A request for your consideration regarding CAT:AOTR
| Hello fellow Wikipedia administrators open to recall category member! |
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I am leaving you this message because recent events have given me concern. When Aaron Brenneman and I, and others, first developed this category well over a year ago, we visualized it as a simple idea. A low hassle, low bureaucracy process. We also visualized it as a process that people would come to trust, in fact as a way of increasing trust in those admins who chose to subscribe to the notion of recall. The very informal approach to who is qualified to recall, what happens during it, and the process in general were all part of that approach. But recent events have suggested that this low structure approach may not be entirely effective. More than one of the recent recalls we have seen have been marred by controversy around what was going to happen, and when. Worse, they were marred by some folk having the perception, rightly or wrongly, that the admin being recalled was trying to change the rules, avoid the process, or in other ways somehow go back on their word. This is bad. It's bad for you the admin, bad for the trust in the process, and bad for the community as a whole. I think a way to address this issue is to increase the predictability of the process in advance. I have tried to do that for myself. In my User:Lar/Accountability page, I have given pretty concrete definitions of the criteria for recall, and of the choices I can make, and of the process for the petition, and of the process for other choices I might make (the modified RfC or the RfAr). I think it would be very helpful if other admins who have voluntarily made themselves subject to recall went to similar detail. It is not necessary to adopt the exact same conditions, steps, criteria, etc. It's just helpful to have SOME. Those are mine, fashion yours as you see fit, I would not be so presumptuous as to say mine are right for you. In fact I urge you not to just adopt mine, as I do change them from time to time without notice, but instead develop your own. You are very welcome to start with mine if you so wish, though. But do something. If you have not already, I urge you to make your process more concrete, now, while there is no pressure and you can think clearly about what you want. Do it now rather than later, during a recall when folk may not react well to perceived changes in process or commitment. Further, I suggest that after you document your process, that you give a reference to it for the benefit of other admins who may want to see what others have done. List it in this table as a resource for the benefit of all. If you use someone else's by reference rather than copy, I suggest you might want to do as Cacharoth did, and give a link to a specific version. Do you have to do these things? Not at all. These are suggestions from me, and me alone, and are entirely up to you to embrace or ignore. I just think that doing this now, thinking now, documenting now, will save you trouble later, if you should for whatever reason happen to be recalled. I apologise if this message seems impersonal, but with over 130 members in the category, leaving a personal message for each of you might not have been feasible, and I feel this is important enough to violate social norms a bit. I hope that's OK. Thanks for your time and consideration, and best wishes. Larry Pieniazek NOTE: You are receiving this message because you are listed in the Wikipedia administrators open to recall category. This is a voluntary category, and you should not be in it if you do not want to be. If you did not list yourself, you may want to review the change records to determine who added you, and ask them why they added you. |
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Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Aviation
I don't know why you are changing the archiving settings. Your change will put some of the 2007 data into what I think you intend to be the 2008 archive. One of the options in the settings is to have a by year archive. If that is what you want, let me know and I'll revise the header to have this happen automatically. Vegaswikian (talk) 07:38, 12 January 2008 (UTC)
Hi mate, saw your assessment of this one. Not a lot on his personal life but what there is I've put into a 'later life' section so pls see if you think that satisfies the remaining B-class criterion... Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 13:19, 12 January 2008 (UTC)
Orphan talk page
Trevor, can you look in on Talk:Cessna Citation Sovereign? It's an orphan talk page, the history shows someone wants it saved?!? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Canglesea (talk • contribs) 04:32, 16 January 2008 (UTC)
Greetings
Just wanted to say thanks for all of the work you've done on WikiProject Aviation. I stumbled upon you after you added a couple of templates and categories I was working on to the project, specifically Template:Future airport expansion and Template:Future airport.
As a fellow pilot I appreciate all that you've done. --Ng.j (talk) 09:17, 17 January 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for the welcome
Thanks for the welcome to Project Aviation. I'm still getting my toes wet and trying to avoid jumping in the deep end, but I love it. Travellingcari (talk) 15:25, 17 January 2008 (UTC)
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Types of Airports
You should discuss renaming categories on Wikipedia:CFD. Category:Types of Airports should not have been depopulated without a discussion. Or did I miss a discussion? Vegaswikian (talk) 20:16, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
- Since it was deleted, it is kind of late. However if there are differences in the subcats, it might be a good idea to do a group nomination to move everything to a common format. Vegaswikian (talk) 20:37, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
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Hindenburg and Graf Zeppelin
HI Trev, I thought there was a separate provision for airship infoboxes? Can you check that? If a determination has been made to use an existing aircraft infobox then the LZ-127 Graf Zeppelin may also have to be changed. FWIW Bzuk (talk) 03:29, 28 January 2008 (UTC).
Airco DH 5
Your recent page move seems to have ignored the discussion which was proceeding at Talk:Airco DH 5 about the naming of the DH aircraft article pages. You also seem to have lost this talk page which is no longer attached to the Airco DH.5 article page. It would have been more useful if you had participated in the discussion which was trying to build a consensus, rather than unilaterally undertaking the page move. Could you please rectify the above issues. Thanks. -- MightyWarrior (talk) 17:39, 28 January 2008 (UTC)
- Thanks for your response. You'll see that I've moved the discussion to the project talk page as you suggested. After re-reading the discussion, I think I was coming to the conclusion that 'DH.5' was the best solution, but another editor (as he admitted) "bit the bullet" and moved the page to 'DH 5'. Unless any there's any further change in the consensus, using 'DH.n' is probably best for all the DH articles and text. There are a number of articles that use a different format, either 'DH n' or 'D.H.n' - do you concur that it would be better to make them all consistent with one agreed naming convention? -- MightyWarrior (talk) 23:46, 28 January 2008 (UTC)
A Sock attack
A particularly vicious vandal known as Wikzilla has surfaced again in the form of socks: User:68.244.171.75 and User:68.245.43.252. See:[1] and [2]. Can you do your new admin' 'thin? FWIW Bzuk (talk) 12:58, 30 January 2008 (UTC).
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Glider task force
Hi Trevor, did this task force die? Shame if it did. I feel a bit guilty as I could have helped a lot with this (instructor for almost 20 years) but I spend my time on the powered articles. Cheers Nimbus227 (talk) 22:20, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
1948 B-29 Lake Mead Crash
Hey thanks for the edit, any help is welcomed!Jon Holly (talk) 03:38, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
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Featured list removals
Instructions for the articlehistory template are at {{articlehistory}}; also, you can scroll to the bottom of the article talk page after updating articlehistory to see if the red error category is lit up.[3] Since Gimmetrow (talk · contribs) is now handling Lists with GimmeBot, I'm curious if he's also doing list removal. If you're involved at lists, can you pls review that? Thanks, SandyGeorgia (Talk) 15:52, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
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WPAVIATION Outreach
Hi Trevor, I've been doing a bit of welcoming on the Aviation project recently. I've popped my name down for outreach co-ordinator and I'm very happy to do this. I was just wondering if you knew what the newsletter situation is, particularly with regard to delivery? Hope to work with you in the future. Wexcan Talk 20:12, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
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Watchlist...
Hey, regarding your watchlist request, it seems that even just the articles, is too many links on one page for MediaWiki to handle. Neither I, nor my bot, can even save the page, with that many links. I spoke with the devs on IRC, and, it seems I was crashing our apache's Can you think of any way to split it up a little? Maybe by task force or something similar? I think, it needs to be below about 10,000 articles per page. Presently, it seems that template transcludes onto about 27,000+ pages. Anyhow, if you think of anything, let me know! :) SQLQuery me! 00:24, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
Airport identification codes
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AfD nomination of Duff Beer (The Simpsons)
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Sorry, it seems that the bot quit before completing its run last week. Here is the last two weeks' worth of Signpost. Ralbot (talk) 09:26, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
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Meetup
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CfD Category:Disambig-Class aviation pages
Category:Disambig-Class aviation pages, a category you created[4] now is at CfD. See Log. GregManninLB (talk) 15:51, 1 May 2008 (UTC)
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Since you wrote it, could you check maximum speed? 124 km/h seems much too low; according to a Russian page Ugolok Neba it's 200 km/h (maybe 124 mph?). Pibwl ←« 20:26, 18 May 2008 (UTC)
Image:Main Page Usability.png
Hi. I was just wondering if it might be relatively painless to update Image:Main Page Usability.png for 2008? Just curious, to see how it has changed. :) -- Quiddity (talk) 19:31, 21 May 2008 (UTC)
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Welcome to pt Wikipedia
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See You! Crespus2006 (talk) 09:49, 7 June 2008 (UTC)
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This is an automated message from CorenSearchBot. I have performed a web search with the contents of William Lancelot Jordan, and it appears to include a substantial copy of http://www.theaerodrome.com/aces/safrica/jordan.php. For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or printed material; such additions will be deleted. You may use external websites as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences.
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Nador Int Airp
Hi Trevor, Tks for reassing the Nador International Airport page. Is it possible to specify what types of info really need changing/added to "grow" in clasification. Many tks, JanT (talk) 04:55, 16 June 2008 (UTC) (I do and will further read guidelines on the Wiki Avi proj page, but this is quite general, so some help for me as new member would be great. PS: Don't know how good your Dutch is but just added nl:Bonaire International Airport. After awaiting the first cmmts and chs I'll make an Eng version as well. JanT (talk) 04:57, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
Hello!
Hello me, it's you from Tungsten Mine NT. Horray! - 208.114.191.62 (talk) 19:30, 18 June 2008 (UTC)
And Again. - 208.114.191.62 (talk) 21:12, 18 June 2008 (UTC)
3x, XXX
Errmm... OOPS! I have no idea how I messed that up. Thanks for fixing. --Geniac (talk) 18:42, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
Wikinews Importer Bot
Seeing as you just set up the aviation portal to run on Wikinews content via the bot, could you take a look at why Template:WPAVIATION Announcements/Aviation accident/Wikinews doesn't show properly on the template? Thanks Blood Red Sandman (Talk) (Contribs) 19:47, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
- Thanks. I was never the best with the coding. Blood Red Sandman (Talk) (Contribs) 19:58, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
Award Center Newsletter
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Trouble ahead
Well, Trevor, it looks like we got an edit war on our hands. It's happened before with other olympic pages. Just wanted to let you know, I'll be watching the 2010 Winter Olympic pages as well, and I do have your back. This should be interesting. Perakhantu (talk) 04:29, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
Thank you for uploading images/media to Wikipedia! There is, however, another Wikimedia Foundation project called Wikimedia Commons, a central media repository for all free media. In the future, please consider creating an account and uploading your media there instead. That way, all of the other language Wikipedias can use them too, as well as our many sister projects. This will also allow our visitors to search for, view and use our media in one central location. If you wish to move previous uploads to Commons, see Wikipedia:Moving images to the Commons (you may view images you have previously uploaded by going to your user contributions on the left and choosing the 'image' namespace from the drop down box). Please note that non-free content, such as images claimed as fair use, cannot be uploaded to the Wikimedia Commons. Help us spread the word about Commons by informing other users, and please continue uploading!--OsamaK 06:11, 26 June 2008 (UTC)
Just a heads up
I thought you might like to know that the Awards Center page has been deleted, along with its newsletter. :(
So, where do we go from here?
To new and even more interesting projects, of course!
As announced in the newsletter, I've been preparing to co-coordinate a large collaboration/competition called Around the World. It was going to be run at the Awards Center, but since that no longer exists, the collaboration will be hosted somewhere else.
Around the World will begin July 15th as planned - it's location will be announced soon.
It'll be a blast. In the competition, participants will be helping to develop over 200 pages (drafts, which will be moved to article space once they are ready), using advanced tools to edit every single one of them!
This is going to be interesting.
And the event shall have awards which are being created specifically for it as we speak!
If you would like me to keep you informed of this and other interesting collaborations I'll be working on and/or organizing in the future, please drop me a note on my talk page, and I'll be happy to keep you in the know.
I look forward to your reply.
Sincerely,
The Transhumanist 21:55, 26 June 2008 (UTC)
Signpost updated for June 23 and 26, 2008.
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You are receiving this message because you have signed up for the Signpost spamlist. If you wish to stop receiving these messages, simply remove your name from the list. Ralbot (talk) 08:42, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
I need your feedback...
Which of the following medals looks better. This one:
Or this one:
Which one do you like better?
Please let me know on my talk page.
Thank you.
The Transhumanist 21:45, 30 June 2008 (UTC)
What is Around the World?
It's a collaboration!
A collaboration using advanced wiki-tools!
If everything goes according to plan, it will begin on July 15th.
The event is being co-sponsored by Wikiproject Lists of basic topics and WikiProject Geography, and participants will be "traveling" all around "the World" visiting each country online (here on Wikipedia and perhaps beyond) as they apply advanced wiki-tools to improve pieces of the profiles of each and every country on Earth!. Each pass through these pages is a "trip around the World..."
The set of pages we are working on is currently located at Wikipedia:WikiProject Lists of basic topics.
Each page presents essential information on each country in a topic outline format, for ease of overviewing and navigating. Most of the topics presented are linkified, which turns these pages into a hypertextual map to material about each country on Wikipedia. When completed, they shall all become part of Wikipedia's contents system.
The pages share a standard format, with the information on each country presented in the same general order. So rather than getting stuck on a single country trying to complete it, each participant works on all 200+ political entities, completing a single data item or detail across all of the pages!
For this they use advanced tools like WP:AWB, Linky, etc. It goes fast, and since others are doing this at the same time, it makes "the World" feel like a beehive, and the participants are its bees. :) The energy is contagious.
And since you are moving from country to country, the tasks make it feel like you are traveling around the world, and you get to learn a little about every country as you do so. This approach also allows for greater efficiency, because by the time you've done 30 or so of a particular item, you've figured out how to finish it faster and more effectively (such as where to find the data or how to make adjustments), and this specialization speeds up development - but more importantly it reduces errors.
The tasks are varied, which adds even more variety to the project. Some tasks are look-ups-and-fill-ins, some are copy and paste, some are image hunts, some are maintenance adjustments, some are link fixing, some are blue-linking (creating an underlying redirect so a link turns blue), some are fact checking, etc.
For an example of what a nearly complete page looks like, see these:
- List of basic Albania topics • List of basic Argentina topics • List of basic Australia topics • List of basic Canada topics • List of basic Ecuador topics • List of basic Egypt topics • List of basic France topics • List of basic Germany topics • List of basic Iceland topics • List of basic India topics • List of basic Indonesia topics • List of basic Iraq topics • List of basic Republic of Ireland topics • List of basic Italy topics • List of basic Isle of Man topics • List of basic Israel topics • List of basic Japan topics • List of basic Macau topics • List of basic Mexico topics • List of basic Russia topics • List of basic Taiwan topics • List of basic United Kingdom topics • List of basic United States topics
There are only about 200 more pages to go!
During the collaboration, co-coordinators will be standing by, to lend a helping hand to participants, provide instruction and tips on how to use the tools, and help them find what they are looking for. Co-coordinators will also be using advanced tools to inspect the work of participants, and touch it up as needed, or if a task was done wrong throughout, point this out to the participant so he or she can make the necessary corrections.
Co-coordinators are working on the set of pages right now, to familiarize themselves with "the World" so they can help more effectively by the time the main event starts. But there's still lots of preparation left to be done, and we are looking for editors experienced in advanced wikitools who would like to become co-coordinators.
The Transhumanist 09:53, 2 July 2008 (UTC)
Signpost updated for June 30, 2008.
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You are receiving this message because you have signed up for the Signpost spamlist. If you wish to stop receiving these messages, simply remove your name from the list. Ralbot (talk) 04:34, 4 July 2008 (UTC)
Hey Trevor. It looks like you are one of the few editors that are still around from this wikiproject. I am trying to revamp the page. We just had a big discussion on the project talk page about how to implement summaries and I'm trying to figure out what to change and where. I think the scope of the project is outdated. I really need some help deciding how this project should move forward. We've gotten two new members recently, so it looks like the beginnings of a revival, but if you could step in and add to the discussion that would be a HUGE help. Wrad (talk) 18:08, 5 July 2008 (UTC)
This WikiProject is having a revival and is trying to determine the direction it will be heading in the future. Questions are being asked, and exciting things are coming in the future, including the bringing of 1345 and other year articles to GA and even FA status. You are listed as a member and are invited to respond to this roll-call by putting an asterisk next to your username on the members list to show that you are still active in the project. Thanks. Wrad (talk) 20:22, 5 July 2008 (UTC)
Aviation terms
Hi! I sow this on your „To-do list“: List of aviation, aerospace and aeronautical terms. I did something likewise on Croatian Wikibooks and I will be delighted if you can use English part of the lists (of course without translation :-))))) and save you time.
Re:Excellent work!
Heh, thanks, nice to know time spent is appreciated ;). =) Do you think the other templates need restoring aswell..? —Reedy 16:37, 9 July 2008 (UTC)
Aerospecs - feedback?
Hi Trevor. Since you've used {{Aerospecs}} over a range of aircraft types and were an early and enthusiastic proponent of this template (thanks!), I was wondering whether you've noticed anything missing? As in - as you've used this template to document aircraft, are there any fields that have been conspicuously absent when compared to the source data you've used? --Rlandmann (talk) 23:02, 10 July 2008 (UTC)
Signpost updated for July 7, 2008.
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| Volume 4, Issue 28 | 7 July 2008 | About the Signpost |
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Mark E. Kelly
What does Mark E. Kelly need to be class B. Where's the checklist? I had deleted the other assessment because it was different than the bio addessment.
I'd like to take him up to class B on aviation and living people? I've seen the rating scale but not the checklist you refer to--unless it's just part of the rating scale.--Utahredrock (talk) 16:58, 13 July 2008 (UTC)
Spitfire Articles
I appreciate the "heads up" on renaming the Spitfire variants articles, and I've added my thoughts to the Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Aircraft section. I'll put some more thoughts into this, but i'm happy to go with whatever other editors want to go with, and I'll help as much as possible, although work commitments means my time is more limited than it was a few months ago. Cheers! Minorhistorian (talk) 23:25, 16 July 2008 (UTC)
Having put some thought into this I think your ideas as to the new titles Supermarine Spitfire (early Merlin powered variants) are the way to go and, with the agreement of other editors, let the cutting and pasting begin.Minorhistorian (talk) 23:01, 19 July 2008 (UTC)
Signpost updated for July 14 and 21, 2008.
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You are receiving this message because you have signed up for the Signpost spamlist. If you wish to stop receiving these messages, simply remove your name from the list. Ralbot (talk) 06:34, 27 July 2008 (UTC)
Engine specs
Hi Trevor - just a quick note about a quirk of {{aerospecs}} since I've seen you run foul of it a couple of times now. If you trim out the "eng2" parameters from the template, an extra "each" will display at the end of eng1 line, even if it's a single-engine type (see here).
When I designed aerospecs, I'll admit that I didn't account for people occasionally removing lines from the code (let alone some people who've made a systematic crusade out of doing so!) and what effect that would have on the output. I've got a more robust version in development, but for now, please leave the eng2 parameters in there, whatever else you trim out!
PS: I removed your addition of the genhide and perfhide fixes from {{aerostart}} - we so seldom need to use these that they're probably better added on a case-by-case basis, as required. --Rlandmann (talk) 22:40, 27 July 2008 (UTC)
Moroccan airports
Tks for fast reviewing my edits/contr to the two Moroccan airports. For Ibn Batouta International Airport I removed the stub-template on the article page. But when I look on Talk it seems a C-class - or do I misunderstand the class-system. Also the classification of Al Massira Airport is said to be stub on talk.
Can you check what is correct - I don't want to change templates before I really know how they should be used. Tks again, --JanT (talk) 01:06, 29 July 2008 (UTC)
RfB Thank You spam
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Thank you for participating in my RfB! I am very grateful for the confidence of the community shown at my RfB, which passed by a count of 154/7/2 (95.65%). I have read every word of the RfB and taken it all to heart. I truly appreciate everyone's input: supports, opposes, neutrals, and comments. Of course, I plan to conduct my cratship in service of the community. If you have any advice, questions, concerns, or need help, please let me know. Again, Thanks! — Rlevse • Talk • 08:48, 29 July 2008 (UTC) |
Ji'an or Jinggangshan Airport
The Ji'an or Jinggangshan is same Airport . I know it very well. Because I live in Ji'an and studying medicine in Jinggangshan University. I have also visited the Jinggangshan Airport. So I would request to delete the Ji'an Airport article. Its original name is Jinggangshan Airport.--Kaish (talk) 15:35, 3 August 2008 (UTC)
WPAVIATION creator
I like it! Only one (small) gripe: the sources section presume using certain books. Might leave the title/location fields open. (Not that changing them is hard to fix...) If you leave it alone, I'd still use it. TREKphiler hit me ♠ 22:12, 4 August 2008 (UTC)
- I just copied Template:aerostart that User:Rlandmann uses. I'll remove the refs part. - Trevor MacInnis (Contribs) 22:20, 4 August 2008 (UTC)