User talk:SandyGeorgia/arch122

Wikipedia needs you!

@SandyGeorgia: Sandy, your holiday has been too long. When are you coming back? --Dustfreeworld (talk) 18:36, 23 January 2024 (UTC)

Just wanted to check in to make sure you were still doing alright, as well. Hog Farm _Talk 23:38, 4 February 2024 (UTC)

+1 ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 00:35, 5 February 2024 (UTC)

+1 to the above, hope all is well. Eddie891 ^Talk _Work 02:02, 5 February 2024 (UTC)

Sandy, if you return we will elect you coordinator of ITN... tempting, I know ;) Aza24 (talk) 07:22, 5 February 2024 (UTC)

+1 --Dustfreeworld (talk) 06:32, 6 February 2024 (UTC)

Please be safe and sound, in good health, and in all things blessed. Godspeed. –♠Vamí_IV†♠ 09:05, 5 February 2024 (UTC)

Yes. Hope you are well. You have a God-given baloney detector that won't quit. Without you Minneapolis might still be "second only to New York City in live theater per capita" and have the "fourth-highest percent of LGBTQ" in the US. Miss you. Much obliged, SusanLesch (talk) 21:00, 6 February 2024 (UTC)

+2, just in case if a +1 is not enough. Panini! • 🥪 22:14, 8 February 2024 (UTC)

Been missing you SG. I had a dream last night that you made some minor edit somewhere, and I was relieved to know you're alive and well, even if still mostly detached from this project. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 17:37, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

Miss you. MUCH. --Dustfreeworld (talk) 06:04, 11 March 2024 (UTC)

+1 Stay safe. My best wishes, --NoonIcarus (talk) 03:07, 16 March 2024 (UTC)

Sandy, I'm so sorry you suffered such a traumatic event. Losing one person is tough but two around same time is crazy difficult. I know the feeling and I know dealing with the grief takes time. I hope being with your children and taking this break has allowed you to somewhat cope and process. Just know that there are those here in this community that love and care about you. We admire your strength to make it through this difficult time and we appreciate what you mean to this community. Your impact is felt. I sing for strength and wholeness over you on this journey. --ARoseWolf 15:21, 28 March 2024 (UTC)

Sandy, I just saw your note at ANI about your losses and imminent hand surgery; my sympathy on all counts. Get better soon, both emotionally and physically. And while I was here I noticed the thread farther up the page: yes, I did develop the facstats tool in response to people asking for hard numbers and evidence instead of intuition and anecdote. I'm glad it's been useful! Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 16:01, 28 March 2024 (UTC)

I saw on the ANI about your recent losses as well, so I'm sharing my condolences and hoping for your speedy recovery. We had a lot to finish and though we've had our differences, you've made me a better Wikipedia user. WMrapids (talk) 16:12, 28 March 2024 (UTC)

Oh your post surprised me .. I thought you would have sent it by email... anyway, yep, though I don’t know how she made you a better user, I do believe she has made me a better Wikipedian. So, thanks Sandy :-) --Dustfreeworld (talk) 16:41, 28 March 2024 (UTC)

A bowl of soup for you!

A bowl of soup for you! I have given you a barnstar to thank you for all you have done already. I don’t know what else to give … I hope you like this. :-) I hope all is well with you and yours. --Dustfreeworld (talk) 10:15, 9 February 2024 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Barnstar of Diplomacy
	Through my short time editing Wikipedia I have found you an excellent administrator who has the potential to fairly resolve conflicts with speed and proficiency, even when there is a large power disparity in such a conflict. — Scientelenisa (talk) 13:06, 13 February 2024 (UTC)

History lesson on lists

When did we start officially encouraging sources for lists?

I'm pretty sure that, several years ago, I saw an old version of a guideline that said lists (not just dab pages, but ordinary 'List of films made in this country' type lists) should not cite sources. I can't find it now. Does anyone else remember this? WhatamIdoing (talk) 00:26, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

Yukky things

Welp, inspired by your yukky things I tried to ask for an edit of lede in Hernán Cortés about a woman who "bore his first son" to make the language less sexist, but was preciously ignored. Well, at least I tried. Ellegony (talk) 11:59, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

DeadbeefBot

I didn't remember the notice at the top of the talk page, so I just left you a ping and got occupied with other stuff. A proper notification this time :) Would appreciate your feedback on this. (You can find a more detailed summary of the edits the bot made during the trial here) 0xDeadbeef→∞ (talk to me) 12:28, 19 January 2024 (UTC)

CCI update

Wikipedia:Contributor copyright investigations/20220720 is now complete. Thank you for your assistance in the evaluation of this CCI!

Sennecaster (Chat) 02:31, 2 March 2024 (UTC)

story · music · places

Thank you for your work there, and best wishes for whatever you do! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:49, 3 March 2024 (UTC)

Cataract surgery

Hello, friendly talk page stalkers. I wonder if a few of you would comment at Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Cataract surgery/archive1. This article is relevant to anyone who is old, who knows someone who is old, or who hopes to be old in the future. It averages 20K page views a month, which means that having the best article we can is important to the world.

If you're not up for a full review, then please do a partial review. Even having someone post something like "I read the ==Section== and I didn't understand ____" would be helpful. Thanks for considering my request, WhatamIdoing (talk) 00:14, 4 March 2024 (UTC)

Nice try...

Special:Diff/1217122704 here but I'm still not going to get involved. Especially now that there are calls to put "holocaust denier" in the lead of a BLP.. that's just not worth the stress I'd endure dealing with it. Ealdgyth (talk) 14:44, 4 April 2024 (UTC)

I typed a long response and then deleted it; I am still reeling from loss of soul-sisters, and still don't feel ready to comment here. (With apologies to all whose talk posts and well wishes I haven't yet responded to since December losses.) SandyGeorgia (Talk) 15:01, 4 April 2024 (UTC)

I did not mean to drag you down. I just don't have the energy to deal with that level of POV-ness. My own life is busy/hectic/stressed/depressing-at-times enough that I just don't need the stress. Do not want to drag you further down - I know you're dealing with much of the same. (hugs) Ealdgyth (talk) 15:45, 4 April 2024 (UTC)

Ealdgyth you didn't drag me down at all ... I was threatening to take another road trip to see you, except I just spent two weeks on the road and am struggling to catch up on my other volunteer gigs, and I was reminiscing about how it feels to have lost friends in real life relative to the loss of our group of strong women on Wikipedia. It was good to hear from a soul sister who sees how crazy it has gotten in here, and I 'spose those of our friends who left long ago had good sense. Your feedback was validating as I miss my lost friends. I just feel badly that I don't have words for everyone who has reached out. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 01:01, 5 April 2024 (UTC)

Well, if you wanted to road trip this weekend, we'd be out on the road to the inlaws to see the eclipse. That is, if we can get the hubby home in time.. it's been wild. Ealdgyth (talk) 01:14, 5 April 2024 (UTC)

Venezuelan politics opened

You recently offered a statement in a request for arbitration. The Arbitration Committee has accepted that request for arbitration and an arbitration case has been opened at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Venezuelan politics. Evidence that you wish the arbitrators to consider should be added to the evidence subpage, at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Venezuelan politics/Evidence. Please add your evidence by April 20, 2024, which is when the evidence phase closes. You can also contribute to the case workshop subpage, Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Venezuelan politics/Workshop. For a guide to the arbitration process, see Wikipedia:Arbitration/Guide to arbitration. For the Arbitration Committee, Dreamy Jazz ^{talk to me | my contributions} 23:37, 6 April 2024 (UTC)

Cheesy AOL ding here!

Hello, SandyGeorgia. Please check your email; you've got mail!
It may take a few minutes from the time the email is sent for it to show up in your inbox. You can at any time by removing the {{You've got mail}} or {{ygm}} template.

Not sure if you got my email there. Been on holiday with the family for the last week, and won't be back editing for another couple of days. Should be able to respond at Rowling's article towards the end of the week. Sideswipe9th (talk) 00:52, 9 April 2024 (UTC)

Whew, that's a relief. I have not had time to check my email. After two weeks of travel, catching up on what little I could from iPad in the car ('til I lost battery), then serious few days of work once back at home and then to catch up on my other volunteer jobs before surgery tomorrow ... I am still not back in the saddle, still not sure I really want to be back in here, but relieved to know that you are well! SandyGeorgia (Talk) 01:56, 9 April 2024 (UTC)

Prostate cancer at FAC

Hi Sandy, glad to see you're back. Just wanted to let you know that prostate cancer is currently at FAC (here), thanks in no small part to your efforts. It has received plenty of feedback there, so there's no immediate need for you to give more of your limited time. Of course, if you have feedback big or small, positive or negative, you're welcome to share it. Once this FAC is through, I'll plan to launch another this spring/summer. Probably dracunculiasis if I can wrap up my to-do list. Breast cancer at some point after, to balance out prostate cancer. Not trying to add to your to-do list, but rather wanted to thank you for pushing me in this direction, and for your ever-useful feedback on articles. Cheers. Ajpolino (talk) 16:57, 16 April 2024 (UTC)

Once again, we can thank the awesome Hog Farm for doing a layperson review on a medical article :) SandyGeorgia (Talk) 19:10, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

It's true, we don't deserve him :) Ajpolino (talk) 19:38, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

That particular problem was the beginning of my disappointment with FAC :) Since I've reviewed hundreds of articles on topics of little interest to me, I still can't understand why we can't buy a medical review, at least just for a jargon check, and am so grateful for Hog Farm. I vowed to stay away from FAC forever more, but then here you are, and I can't refuse you either !!! SandyGeorgia (Talk) 19:44, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

Prostate cancer FAC wrapped. Launched dracunculiasis. Realized the feedback you gave on it was from August 2022 (time flies!) and figured I shouldn't sit on it any longer. Sadly, not much new literature on the topic since we last discussed it. Anyway, no pressure to comment there, just wanted to let you know; I mentioned you in the nom. statement, but I try not to ping you per your message at the top of this page. Ajpolino (talk) 20:26, 22 April 2024 (UTC)

Best Wishes

Best wishes for a continuing recovery. Robert McClenon (talk) 11:57, 22 April 2024 (UTC)

Robert McClenon thanks ! I am already pretty much recovered, and I'll get biopsy results tomorrow when the sutures come out, but the doc has already stated he's confident it's not malignant, and I'm sure if something negative had surfaced they would have called :) So for now, it's only the inconvenience of the location of the sutures that impedes typing, which should be resolved tomorrow. Best regards, SandyGeorgia (Talk) 12:11, 22 April 2024 (UTC)

Talk:Digital media use and mental health#FAR notice

Hello, User:SandyGeorgia! I was wondering if you have the time to leave a comment on the talk page for the Digital media use and mental health article in the FAR notice section. You raised issues with the content of the article at the FAR notice discussion last November and December that I've attempted to address, but I was hoping if you could provide some additional comments to what I've tried to do to improve the article. I didn't know that you don't get along with pings, so I guess it's a good thing that I decided to leave a talk page message. :) -- CommonKnowledgeCreator (talk) 23:30, 18 March 2024 (UTC)

Welcome Back!

The Return of SandyGeorgia to the Wikipedia Community. (Frederick Leighton)

I was working on one of my pages that you had helped me with and was just wondering about you. So, I looked to see if you had checked in lately. I saw you had! You've been missed!

You've been through so much lately. I hope that if you find yourself back here that you find the return to interacting with the typical range of Wikipedian behavior- the good, the bad, the ugly- and let's not forget the grateful. If you are here more regularly, I hope it remains something meaningful and challenging that supports your world in terms of your latest RL transitions. I also hope that you will feel the meaningful difference you make to the fellow editors that have worked with you and to the readers who continue to get the best of your heart and intellect because you are here. Wtfiv (talk) 21:32, 30 March 2024 (UTC)

+1, Welcome back! --Dustfreeworld (talk) 19:34, 2 April 2024 (UTC)

Rowling

Hi Sandy. I've sent the full text of Whited to you. It seemed better to download the entire book instead of separate chapters. I've been distracted and haven't had much time to read closely except for a cursory skim. It's interesting but I'm not seeing a nicely written timeline of her Twitter/X feed - which isn't a surprise from a scholarly work.

Re the Wikipedia Library. Access seems to be dependent of activity. Try the following:

1. Go to the Wikipedia Library portal
2. Sign in to access the "My collections" page
3. Scroll through the "My collections" page to find Project Muse
   1. If it's not there, then you need to submit an application. I don't see the application button so can't help there
4. Click "Access collection" >> brings you to ProjectMuse search page

That's all. In the meantime, good luck with hand surgery recovery and don't worry about things here. Take care. Victoria (tk) 23:01, 13 April 2024 (UTC)

Victoriaearle ... Thanks times two (got in to TWL and got the email). The hand is doing great, the doc says it's highly unlikely to be melanoma, healing well ... now if I could just figure out how to wash my hair for the next ten days 'til stitches come out! SandyGeorgia (Talk) 01:21, 14 April 2024 (UTC)

That's all good news. I see that Whited is getting some discussion over at JKR, so that's good too. Victoria (tk) 13:41, 14 April 2024 (UTC)

Yep. But I cannot take the lead this time (don't have the energy and unsure I want to be back in here yet), and while some are filling the talk page with complaints, no one there is actually doing the work necessary to rewrite, while several of those opining don't demonstrate research, sourcing or prose skills at the FA level, so unless something gives, we may be headed back to FAR. Thanks again for the source and well wishes. Bst, SandyGeorgia (Talk) 14:09, 14 April 2024 (UTC)

I think a bit premature to expect FAR. The Wikipedia Library is a good resource, but I hadn't looked there because I've not been very active. While I have access I'd like to do a search on Ebscohost too and see what pops there. In the meantime I'll post these access instructions to the Rowling talk page so others can use those sources instead of searching google - which is always slanted towards a person's interests. Victoria (tk) 14:43, 14 April 2024 (UTC)

Victoriaearle I found a bit of sloppy scholarship in Whited. Looking for the background on her status as a billionaire, Whited cites this marginal article, which in turn cites this piece-- neither impressive in their scholarship (or writing). SandyGeorgia (Talk) 12:33, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

Also, perhaps I'm accustomed to viewing scholarship through a WP:MEDRS lens, but the Rebecca Sutherland Borah chapter does not impress me. Relative to half a billion copies of books in print,

• "Because Harry Potter fandom is too large for exhaustive analysis, in this study I focused primarily on fans with online connections, using an online survey and observing and interacting with fans through websites, primarily social media platforms." (Biased sample)
• "Almost all the 1,217 people who responded (99 percent) were college age and older, with 64.7 percent in the millennial category (ages 29–43)." (sample size)
• "My survey was posted for a two-month period starting in mid-November 2019, so it was partially contemporaneous with the fallout." (Representative?)

is a pretty weak/biased sample. Our text may need to indicate that Borah's work is based on a limited subset of the entire fandom. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 12:44, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

So, yesterday I started working my way through the "Introduction". I noticed that Whited's numbers for HP book sales differed from ours (but I didn't dig into the footnotes). I also noted the discrepency re wealth. But, the "Introduction" does give a good timeline of the transgender tweets from 2019 to 2022 or 2023 that I think we can use. I've started taking notes in User:Victoriaearle/Rowling but didn't get very far. I also think we can use the material regarding the huge fan base, possibly the fan fiction aspect (which seemingly has caused lots of tension in terms of intellectual property/copyright), which I posted about here on the talk page. But, yeah, I noted the parameters for the study and had to shake my head. Literary scholars do weird studies, is all I can say. I thought that in grad school and it still seems to be a thing. But the background material in that chapter I think is usable. I have to be out today (migraine flare, so limited screen time) but will try to get back to taking notes tonight. I hope we can get enough from that source for some kind of a rewrite of the transgender section and then the lead. Also, there's updated info on her other projects I believe we can use. Victoria (tk) 14:43, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

Agree much of it is quite usable, but we have to be aware of problems like those I raise. I won't be able to look in any great detail until I've finished evidence for the arb case (and with slow typing due to stitches), and after that, I may just finally semi-retire, as I am so tired of dealing with POV and vandalism everywhere one turns. If I look at my watchlist from the months I took off, there are scores of articles I need to fix, and I just don't have the energy for it anymore; losing two close friends changed my whole world. So, I can't be counted on to work up the draft on Rowling, and I remain concerned that the main authors aren't stepping in either. Bst, SandyGeorgia (Talk) 14:53, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

Fortunately, not all parts of the wiki have been overrun with POV and vandalism; most volcanoes are going along merrily. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 15:04, 16 April 2024 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) (please point me to the proper discussion if this is the wrong place but I'm not seeing any discussion on this on the Rowling talk page) I wouldn't even use that Borah study at all. At least from my understanding of college stats classes and How to Lie with Statistics, that is really dreadfully bad sampling practices to draw a broad conclusion with, and "this is what a few people who responded to an internet survey think" isn't really useful for even a narrow conclusion for the question at hand. Hog Farm _Talk 15:17, 16 April 2024 (UTC)

HF, I haven't added it there yet ... my typing is limited and I have to focus on arb evidence and I have no sense (yet) that any serious work is underway at Rowling, although I trust that Victoria will sort which, if any, pieces of the Whited work are usable ... I'd agree on avoiding any conclusions based on very narrow survey of a relatively small sample, which could misrepresent views of broader population. (Jo-Jo, I envy editors who work in areas where articles aren't bombarded by inferior edits-- I have never been so lucky!!!) SandyGeorgia (Talk) 15:32, 16 April 2024 (UTC)

PS, we also have translations to 84 languages, while Whited has 80 ... so we are more current even though Whited is recent. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 14:56, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

Yep, I noticed that too, so I just ignored all those numbers. Victoria (tk) 15:09, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

sections

Hi Sandy, thanks for the headsup but it's a response to Noonicarus, under "Comments by others". So I think it is the right place? Or have I got this mixed up. Boynamedsue (talk) 14:12, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

Yes; arb pages intentionally keep those sections segregated and unthreaded ... the parties, the arbs, and all the rest of us ... I'm not sure why, and it's awkward, but that's how they work! SandyGeorgia (Talk) 14:17, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

Ah got it now, I was thinking you were talking about my most recent post. I've fixed it now, thanks for the warning. All the best.Boynamedsue (talk) 14:29, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

Boynamedsue, it wasn't a warning :) It was just information that I hoped was helpful. [1] Bst, SandyGeorgia (Talk) 14:36, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

I meant "warning" in a helpful way, because I don't really know how Arbitration works. I thought maybe if you post something in the wrong place there you are forced to find sources for opinions stated in football-player articles or something? Anyway, have a good Sunday :).Boynamedsue (talk) 14:51, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

Got it ... just didn't want you to have the wrong impression! SandyGeorgia (Talk) 14:59, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

A cup of coffee for you!

Here is a cup of coffee for you, Sandy, with my best wishes :-) --Dustfreeworld (talk) 14:12, 25 April 2024 (UTC)

Dustfreeworld, I want to thank you for the continued encouragement and kind words and for noticing all I've been going through of late, and apologize for appearing to ignore posts here. Not only have I been very short on time because of real life commitments and the arbcase; I have been undecided about whether to stick around, and so have stalled on getting caught up with everyone. I realize that you are hoping I will return to medical editing, but as I've examined the evidence in the arb case over the last month, I have seen enough of the most repugnant human behavior in here that I am thankful I did not expose myself to it while I was grieving, and even more doubtful that I will ever again be as active here as I once was. Thank you for the kindness, and sorry to disappoint. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 11:11, 26 April 2024 (UTC)

SandyGeorgia, there’s nothing to apologize for. I always appear to ignore posts here and there ;-) I’m not just hoping that you will return to medical editing, I’m hoping that you will return to *whatever* editing. Yep, we may have the most repugnant human behavior in here, that’s why we need editors from the other extreme (e.g., you) to balance that out.

You know, I can’t help thinking (and have been longing to tell you) that, I have been inadvertently doing something like “free play” (what children naturally do when adults aren't telling them what to do?) in the past few months while you’re not around (at WP:MED). IMO you have a gift for getting people together; and people like that you are someone who will listen. On the other hand, I probably have a gift for … pissing people off (?!) … (yep, almost *everyone* I think, no matter they like / dislike me ;-) In short, I don’t think you have the right to be undecided about / have stalled on / doubtful that ... You just can’t. Wikipedia needs people like you. --Dustfreeworld (talk) 14:52, 28 April 2024 (UTC); 15:56, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

You are funny! I can't do it anymore; it's nauseating in here. It's not just words on a screen; it's real people's safety and livelihood and families being jeopardized by ideological zealots. Bst, SandyGeorgia (Talk) 14:59, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

Sorry that I haven’t followed the Venezuelan case closely; I’m not sure I understand you correctly; and I haven’t expressed myself very well. Do you mean “it's real people's safety and livelihood and families being jeopardized by ideological zealots” through their editing at Wikipedia? If so, shouldn’t we be doing something to stop or prevent that (through better editing) instead of stepping away? Aside, there are a lot of things that one can edit besides Venezuela or medical content.. PS of course I respect whatever you choose to or not to do. Bst, --Dustfreeworld (talk) 15:39, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

a) "We" are doing something (there's an arbcase). b) Torture in Venezuela, Human rights in Venezuela, Corruption in Venezuela, Crisis in Venezuela; if anyone thinks editing Wikipedia will change a single thing, there's a bridge in Brooklyn I can sell you ... SandyGeorgia (Talk) 17:17, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

You are a Ray of Sunshine!

You are a Ray of Sunshine!

SandyGeorgia I am so sorry for your troubles. It's not fair that one person has to face so many challenges. Completely lost track of you for a while. It meant a great deal to get a message from you today. You brightened my day, week, month. Hope you'll stay with us. Let me know if I can help you anyhow. -SusanLesch (talk) 16:55, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

Curiosity

SandyGeorgia; do you know of any source(s) (news websites) on Venezuelan topics that are widely respected / accepted by most? I know there won’t be much, just one or two would be of great help (in English of course. I don't know Spanish). Thanks. --Dustfreeworld (talk) 07:29, 1 May 2024 (UTC)

Dustfreeworld: Generally, everything reliable (don't be misled by false statements made on the Arbpages); there is broad consensus that, for example, every election featuring Maduro was tainted with irregularities, he has not been democratically elected, and the idea that he has -- or that Wikipedia is biased in the opposition direction -- is a theme that reflects a cult-like ideological zealotry by those using Venezuela as a proxy for anti-US rhetoric. These zealots often reflect a Western or Eurocentric arrogance, denying the Venezuelans' own point of view (between 75 and 90% of Venezuelans are opposed to Maduro, and the Venezuelan Constitution mandates that citizens should rise up against any illegitimate government, and Maduro was appointed by Chavez through a series of events too complex for those new to the topic to grasp, while free and fair elections haven't been held since Chavez was first elected, and there is no longer any free press in Venezuela), reducing Venezuelans themselves to stupid pawns of the CIA (a view that is like a religion to its followers).

There is no shortage of reliable sources, so I'd need to know specifically what you are looking for.

There are scores of scholarly sources (but pro-Maduro editors regularly find a reason to eliminate or discount them, claiming the authors are "pro-opposition", which is an interesting concept, given that almost all Venezuelans are, allowing pro-Maduro editors to disqualify, well, everyone).

On news sources you've got the highly reliable Associated Press, Reuters, BBC, AFP, and all the usual reliable sources. The may leave out some things as they can't be "on the ground" because of limited press freedom, so they can't have in-depth coverage, but they report the overall picture. On US media, Washington Post and New York Times; Miami Herald at times has bias, so has to be taken with a grain of salt. Los Angeles Times is fine most of the time, but tends to miss more (I'm unsure they actually have someone on the ground).

The sources that have been deemed outright chavista propaganda or editors state have published false information are listed at Wikipedia:WikiProject Venezuela/Reliable and unreliable sources#Deprecated or blacklisted. At Wikipedia:WikiProject Venezuela/Reliable and unreliable sources#Generally unreliable sources are others that at times parrot those same deprecated sources. There are other proponents of the "Bolivarian revolution": see South of the Border (2009 film) on Oliver Stone and Mark Weisbrot (read the reviews, too).

Where it gets tricky is that most of the English-language coverage lacks depth, and to get the full story, you have to read Spanish language sources. For example, few English-language sources fully explore the fact that Venezuelan law required Afiuni to release Cedeño, yet when she did, Chavez had her thrown in prison, where her anus and vagina were destroyed.

Considering that the entire content area is likely to be a WP:CTOP soon, if you plan to wade in, I suggest you do so cautiously, and consider joining WP:VEN, where others can answer your questions; I don't plan to be very active, other than keeping an eye on Venezuela and bullies in other areas, after the case closes. If you would place your questions there rather than here, it would help you get answers more quickly, and help me shut down my talk to semi-retire. With Venezuelan editors sidelined by state repression and false charges, you'll find the entire suite likely to be enthusiastically whitewashed soon.

Certainly, for those with academic access, there's room to expand content using more scholarly sources, but just trying to keep up with the sock edits has been a monumental task, as the sock edits a lot and edits fast and makes so many mistakes that one's time is completely sapped. You should also be aware that there is decades worth of misinformation in the pro-chavismo direction on Wikipedia, as it has been widely known in Caracas since the 90s that Chavez put his best resources to work on internet propaganda; there is too much work to be done everywhere, and more pro-authoritarian editors than Venezuelans or pro-democracy to help with that work.

Also, by the way, this edit should be reverted; see MOS:LINKQUOTE and in the next edit, MOS:OVERLINK (no one is going to click abortion from that article). Maybe working on Afiuni will give you an idea of the Bolivarian revolution and its ideals-- particularly with respect to women. There are others: maybe Maria Corina Machado won't be murdered,[2] or Rocío San Miguel can come out with her vagina and anus intact. New York Times: In Venezuela, you're a critic one day, and arrested the next and NBC News and Associated Press and BBC, but then after the English-language media loses interest, you have to go to Spanish-language reliable sources. The reliable sources are plentiful, but most of our Venezuelan articles were translated from the es.wiki, so are lacking English-language sources.

I shall archive this thread as soon as you've read it, and hope you will post further questions at WP:VEN. Bst, SandyGeorgia (Talk) 14:44, 1 May 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for the reply, Sandy. I said I need one or two sources and you’ve given me so many :-) If I said I need one or two barnstars, will I get that many too? <joking> Em… to be frank I don’t plan to spend too much time in the area. From your reply, it seems that it’s not an easy task. <bridge too expensive or perhaps that’s just my imagination and the bridge simply doesn’t exist? And there’re so many things I want to do, but lacks energy and time... > I’m sympathy for the people there. I believe that they have been suffering a lot in recent years, and even access to clean drinking water is now a problem. Food, education, etc. are just basic needs. It’s so sad to see an once prosperous place turned into a place like that. I hope the situation can improve in the future, no matter how slow it may be. I’ll see what I can do. As for MOS:OVERLINK, I think many of our global readers don’t know what abortion is (that’s not an easy word for them) and I’m quite sure that many of them will click that link. And thanks for pointing me to MOS:LINKQUOTE. Again, thank you for the detail information and links. Bst, --Dustfreeworld (talk) 19:03, 2 May 2024 (UTC)