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in re: Draft:Makkar College of Technical Education (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

hi there,

the college just started last year, and references of-course will be provided with time. Till then, you can at least LIVE the page.

thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mringeup (talkcontribs)

@Mringeup: Hello. The draft will not be accepted until you include these references and sources. Wikipedia is built on verifiability and if the information you have written does not have sources, it cannot be published to the mainspace. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 08:55, 27 May 2019 (UTC)

mine is a college associated with top Indian university, until then it can be included with quote - this article does not cite any sources or is stub. Your main space has many unverified sources articles? In time my article will have verified sources, thats for sure thanks Mringeup.

@Mringeup: Just because other articles don't have sources does not mean that this article can be published without sources. See WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS. Wikipedia is built on verifiability; so, instead of saying that this draft should be published, sources should be added to the articles already in mainspace. The draft will not be accepted until you add sources. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 10:31, 27 May 2019 (UTC)
Furthermore, at the current time, this draft would be categorised as a stub. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 10:32, 27 May 2019 (UTC)

so you are saying verifiability occurs only in my case and not on others. Stub can also be verified, in time. Just because my college is fresh does not means it is verified, it is associated with renowned University of India that cannot be authorized with anyone just like that. Various authorizations are involved to start a college, which we have complied. The article and the verified sources will be provided that for sure, till then it can be LIVE. thanks Mringeup.

@Mringeup: No. That is not what I am saying. Your article will not be published until it has sources. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 13:40, 27 May 2019 (UTC)

now after providing you single source time by time, you still have the hypocrite answer, where you have given main space to pages without single source. like this And when my source shows course and affiliation verfification of 2 pages, you still want to argue with your wrong reason? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mringeup (talkcontribs)

@Mringeup: That's not the point. Wikipedia has many articles without verification, but just because other unverified or under-sourced articles exist does not mean that your draft can be published. Wikipedia is a volunteer organisation and so, as volunteers, we only have a certain amount of time that we can give. This means that not every article that is on Wikipedia will have the sources needed. Because our verifiability policy mandates this: The final, non-negotiable and unchangeable point is that unless you add more references, your draft will not be accepted. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 10:44, 28 May 2019 (UTC)

Why only in my case your policy is included.I gave you a neutral reference (without bias), and that too from your reference providing links Now there you could not judge it. I already said that with time I will fill more references. Obviously, I want my page to have more references and details, which I will surely provide as it takes time. But you are limiting me from the start.It is not right thing to do. I have given you a source from a verified company — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mringeup (talkcontribs)

@Mringeup: You need multiple references to verify the information you have written and so that it meets the notability guideline for organisations and companies as explained in the decline message on your talk page. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 11:21, 28 May 2019 (UTC)

now first you declined me without source, then after I provided you verified neutral source, you say another. Compared to those without single source, at MY least must be made LIVE. On Wikipedia you can edit whenever you want. And those without sources, still have not been touched for long. You talk about organisation, not a single organisation or source has been referred to them but I have provide you same website reference links that already appear on your site. In different cases, you can see yourself.I do multiples, but it takes time. Wikipedia is to be edited forever by anybody with good substance, and I have provided the substance. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mringeup (talkcontribs)

@Mringeup: The draft will not be made live until you have added more sources. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 11:38, 28 May 2019 (UTC)

this is not a valid answer even after showing you the difference, you give more preference to the un-sourced ones? You easily see it yourself the value of my source but you want to ignore? I have already mentioned the multiple sources will be added, but you consider it un-serious. The seriousness is compared to value of source and un-sourced ones. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mringeup (talkcontribs)

what hypocrisy is this, I gave you multiple resources from your own wikipedia links but you do not live the page. You have pages with zero references but you dont show your hypocrisy on them. Talk to me straight face, dont go back to hiding without replying or removing the message — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mringeup (talkcontribs) 11:42, 7 June 2019 (UTC)

Mringeup, the problem is that, as I have been saying all along, you need multiple sources to demonstrate notability. It does not matter about other pages. The polices are clear. The draft will not be accepted until it is shown to meet the General notability guideline or the notability guidelines for schools/colleges.
Regarding unsourced articles: We are volunteers and so we can only do so much. Articles don't just magically improve and there are many unsourced articles on Wikipedia, so it may be some time before an editor improves the page. If a volunteer decides that they will spend time to improve that page, they will. This does not give you a free card to get a draft published which does not have the sources needed.
Furthermore, the sources you have used don't establish notability. Sources which establish notability, talk about the topic/subject in a significant way. They must also be independent and reliable. The sources you have used don't establish notability because:
  • The first source (the college's website) is not independent
  • The second source does not talk about the college in a significant way, as it only lists basic information about the college
  • The third, fourth and fifth sources do not cover the college in a significant way, as they all are lists of colleges in the Ludhiana area.
This means you have no sources which demonstrate notability. For this (and any) draft to be published it must have received significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject and that these sources be included in the draft to support the information you have written. If you are unsure about anything I have written, please explain what you don't understand. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 13:34, 7 June 2019 (UTC)

your respectful quote " so it may be some time before an editor improves the page. If a volunteer decides that they will spend time to improve that page, they will."

I am gladly willing to help volunteers with my article in time #as they will to improve article#.

The significance of my (notable & non independent) sources is just the beginning, as also you can see I am citing to every word in my article I can find, just give some time as you give your volunteers the time to do, till then I request you to do the least to LIVE it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mringeup (talkcontribs) 05:35, 8 June 2019 (UTC)

Mringeup, as I have said before. On Wikipedia articles need to be shown to meet the notability guidelines before any draft is made into an article. Once you have enough independent and reliable sources in the draft, then it will be published. Until then, the draft will remain a draft. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 09:34, 8 June 2019 (UTC)

Draft:Craig Jones (Royal Navy officer)Edit

in re: Draft:Craig Jones (Royal Navy officer) (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Hi Dreamy Jazz!

Thanks for reviewing the page Craig Jones (Royal Navy Officer)!

I just wanted to ask what sources to Early Life & Education and Early Career for this person would need to be added? There are no published records of Bingley Grammar School that can be referenced. For the Career section there is no public armed forces list for living people (only deceased). The rest of the article has a lot of references and reliable sources.

thanks! Sam

Samcherry5 (talk) 10:28, 31 May 2019 (UTC)

Samcherry5, Wikipedia is built on verifiability and original research is not allowed. Therefore, everything you write must be supported by references. This leaves you with two options:

Hi again,

The article is supported by a lot of sources. The original was moved into draft space but no reason was given and it took over 2 months for the review. Ive added further references to the sections you mentioned. Hopefully it should be enough to move to mainspace. If not can you provide some specific feedback with respect to what it needs please?

thanks Samcherry5 (talk) 17:24, 31 May 2019 (UTC)

Samcherry5, can't see anything in particular from a quick look. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 14:53, 4 June 2019 (UTC)

Hi, What happens next with the article? I guess I need to wait again for it to be reviewed? is there anything else you think that can be done? Samcherry5 (talk) 14:51, 4 June 2019 (UTC)

thanks! Finaly managed to work out how to reference birth and access the Navy Lists to reference career so have re-added section with proper sources! When you get a moment can you have another look so hopefully its ready for mainspace :) Samcherry5 (talk) 18:42, 4 June 2019 (UTC)

ACC tool access request approvedEdit

Thank you for your interest in the account creation process. I have verified that you have signed the confidentiality agreement for nonpublic information and approved your request.

You may now access the interface here. Before you begin handling any requests, please ensure you have read and understood the account creation guide and username policy to familiarize yourself with the process.

Please subscribe yourself to the private ACC mailing list by clicking here and following the instructions on the page. I also highly recommend that you join us on IRC. We'll be able to grant you access to our private channel (#wikipedia-en-accounts connect), where a bot informs us when new account requests arrive, and where you can chat with the other members of the team and get real-time input, advice, and assistance with requests and how to handle certain cases that are giving you confusion or trouble.

Please note that repeatedly failing to correctly assess and process account requests and take the correct resulting actions will result in the suspension of your access to the ACC tool interface. Processing account creation requests is not a race, and each request should be handled with your utmost diligence, care, and attention. Closing each account request correctly, accurately, and within full compliance of the ACC tool guide is your goal and your priority; never sacrifice accuracy and compliance of policy in exchange for quantity, or to close a high number of requests that are in the queue.

Releasing any kind of nonpublic personal data (see access to nonpublic personal data policy), such as the IP addresses or email addresses of account creation requests, whether intentionally or unintentionally, is treated as an extremely serious violation of policy and breach of confidential information, and will generally result in immediate suspension of your access to the ACC tool interface. Depending on the severity of the offense, the intent, and the level of misconduct that occurred, the violation and the breach of the confidential information will be reported to the Wikimedia Foundation, which can result in further sanctions and actions being taken against you (such as being blocked, banned, or having your access to nonpublic personal data status revoked). If you have questions about this or aren't sure about anything in regards to this policy, please ask a tool administrator.

Please don't hesitate to get in touch with me or any other ACC tool admin if you have any questions. Thank you for participating in the account creation process, and we're glad to have you as part of the group! Welcome to the ACC tool user team! — JJMC89(T·C) 06:36, 1 June 2019 (UTC)

If you are consistently active at ACC this week and hitting the limit, ping me (or post at WP:PERM/ACC again) next weekend. I'll try to keep track myself, but I may forget. — JJMC89(T·C) 03:12, 3 June 2019 (UTC)
JJMC89, OK. Thanks. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 09:04, 3 June 2019 (UTC)
@Dreamy Jazz: If you haven't already, you should join the IRC channel, but you'll need a Wikimedia cloak first. m:IRC/Cloaks will get you there. Welcome to the club.   — AfroThundr (u · t · c) 19:57, 3 June 2019 (UTC)
I have requested the cloak. Hopefully it won't be too long   Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 20:01, 3 June 2019 (UTC)
A cloak is a good idea, but you don't have to wait on one to get access. Last I checked the GCs have a backlog of cloak requests. If you have a nick registered with nickserv, I can give you access with that until your cloak goes through. (Post your nick here or on your userpage or email me.) — JJMC89(T·C) 04:39, 4 June 2019 (UTC)
JJMC89, hello. My NickServ nick is "Dreamy_Jazz" Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 10:14, 4 June 2019 (UTC)
You should be able to access the channel now. — JJMC89(T·C) 00:33, 5 June 2019 (UTC)
JJMC89, unfortunately it still won't let me join. I can wait till I get the cloak if needed. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 14:33, 5 June 2019 (UTC)
I see you on the channel invite exception list. You must be identified to NickServ and connected using SSL to access the channel. — JJMC89(T·C) 00:30, 6 June 2019 (UTC)
────────────────────JJMC89, strange. I have tried again and still isn't working.
I am using "" over SSL (using https). I used the identify command /msg NickServ IDENTIFY ... and it logged me in to Dreamy_Jazz. I then used the command /join #wikipedia-en-accounts and it still redirected me to the unreg channel. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 09:22, 6 June 2019 (UTC)
I may be missing something obvious, as I am inexperienced with IRC. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 09:24, 6 June 2019 (UTC)
On further investigation, it seems to be the SSL part. In the status part I have the message / log Only users using SSL could join this channel!. I am unsure what to do to enable SSL? I could not see a enable SSL button / command. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 10:27, 6 June 2019 (UTC)
I'm not sure. @Stwalkerster: Any ideas here? — JJMC89(T·C) 02:20, 7 June 2019 (UTC)
JJMC89, Dreamy Jazz, While your connection to webchat is protected with SSL, webchat doesn't connect to the server with SSL unfortunately. My advice is to use either a real IRC client (I use HexChat) or IRC Cloud (which is like webchat but actually connects via SSL). stwalkerster (talk) 06:59, 7 June 2019 (UTC)
Stwalkerster, Ah ok. I have downloaded HexChat and will use that. Thanks, Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 10:31, 7 June 2019 (UTC)
Looks like it has worked! Thanks Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 10:34, 7 June 2019 (UTC)
JJMC89 I have been as active at ACC as I can (the rate limit was sometimes limiting me to 2 or 3 account creations from my IP). It is next weekend now. Do you think I am ready? Thank you, Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 07:00, 9 June 2019 (UTC)
I'm guessing you hit AntiSpoof some. Each creation attempt counts toward the limit. I've reviewed all the non-purged requests that you've handled, and they look good. I am granting accountcreator due to the lower rate limit with the expectation that you will continue take it slow for a bit since you're still new to ACC. As always, please ask questions if you're unsure about how to handle a request. — JJMC89(T·C) 07:33, 9 June 2019 (UTC)
JJMC89, yes that is fine. I will continue to ask on IRC and will also keep on continuing to take it slow with requests. Thanks, Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 07:43, 9 June 2019 (UTC)

accountcreator grantedEdit

After reviewing your request for the "accountcreator" permission, I have enabled the flag on your account. Keep in mind these things:

  • The account creator right removes the limit on the maximum number of new accounts that can be created in a 24-hour period.
  • The account creator right is not a status symbol. If it remains unused, it is likely to be removed. Abuse of the account creator right will result in its removal by an administrator.

If you no longer require the right, let me know, or ask any other administrator. Drop a note on my talk page if you run into troubles or have any questions about appropriate/inappropriate use of the account creator right. Happy editing! — JJMC89(T·C) 07:33, 9 June 2019 (UTC)


in re: File:ServicarBus.jpeg (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

I reverted it to the original low quality format. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Railpage (talkcontribs)

@Railpage: I presume you are talking about File:ServicarBus.jpeg. What is it about the file you want to ask me about (I am unsure why you are telling me you reverted to an older version on this file). Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 22:37, 5 June 2019 (UTC)

how to save changes to a draftEdit

Hello Dreamy Jazz, I am working on the draft for David Samrick (thank you for putting it back in drafts). I added a picture, but see nowhere to "save draft", so each time I leave the page, it is gone again. I don't want to hit Publish Changes, because then it will go back into a live status again I assume. Can you help? Thank — Preceding unsigned comment added by Robertversteeg (talkcontribs)

@Robertversteeg: Hello, when you are editing a page, the "Publish changes" button means that your edit is made to the page you are editing (in your case the draft). Although the name of this button is similar to publishing a draft into Wikipedia, it is not the same thing. Publishing a draft (or making a draft live) is done when the draft is moved into mainspace (where articles such as Elvis Presley and Albert Einstein are).
This means you can safely press the "Publish changes" button, without the draft becoming live. If you are still unsure, please say. If you have further questions you can ask me. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 18:02, 6 June 2019 (UTC)

centiJimbo calculatorEdit

Hey there, I noticed you tinkering with the centiJimbo counter template, and I think you were trying to get it to read page watchers from a subpage? For one thing I noticed you used "usepage" instead of "userpage" in a few places, but I don't think that's what the problem is. I'm pretty sure that there is no way to programmatically read the number of watchers of a given page in the software, and anyway {{User Centijimbo calculator}} doesn't do it. With the "new" template you still have to look up the number of editors watching your page and pass it as a switch to the template, otherwise it pulls whatever default number was coded into the template. Just so you know!

If you do find a better way to do it, I'm interested. Cheers. Ivanvector (Talk/Edits) 21:51, 6 June 2019 (UTC)

Ivanvector, yes. I was trying to add the ability to customise the page which the website tool pointed to. I had assumed that, that tool was able to automatically update the number of watchers. I had made the change and then reverted it when it didn't "fix" the issue I was having. I had assumed that it wasn't working for me because it was on a subpage. The usepage parameter was supposed to force this template to point to my userpage.
However, I now understand that it does not auto update the watchers. I'll have a look into it. Thanks, Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 09:36, 7 June 2019 (UTC)
It may be worth getting a variable set up which can return the number of watchers. For example, {{PROTECTIONLEVEL}} grabs and returns the protection level for a page (or a different page if specified). I assume that it would be as easy as implementing this into mediawiki. I'll look into this. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 09:46, 7 June 2019 (UTC)
From what I can see custom magic words can be set up by adding them to the $magicWords dictionary. It may be worth seeing if there is support for such a magic word on VP. I'll create a thread on Wikipedia:Village pump (idea lab). Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 09:51, 7 June 2019 (UTC)

Oh hey Dreamy JazzEdit

in re: Draft:Kristopher Wright (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Well, I just talked to the other user you mentioned. I did give her sources. So are we good or not? Because I honestly don't know. Kew1121 (talk) 20:48, 7 June 2019 (UTC)

Kew1121, have you added these sources to the draft? (I am assuming you are talking about Draft:Kristopher Wright)
Currently it does not have anywhere near enough sources to be published. This is due to there only being two sources which support any information in the draft (the second website I am not sure what it is). The only two sources which seem to support anything are IMDb. Per Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Perennial sources IMDb is listed as "Generally unreliable", so Outside exceptional circumstances, the source should not normally be used, and it should never be used for information about a living person.
If we consider the IMDb sources as external links which don't support anything, there are no sources in the draft. If you can add multiple sources which talk about the person in a significant way which are also independent and reliable (to meet the general notability guideline), then the draft will be accepted. However, from my check, I could not see that this person would meet this currently. If you can find the sources, then I will rereview the draft. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 21:10, 7 June 2019 (UTC)

Tech News: 2019-24Edit

17:06, 10 June 2019 (UTC)

Mic CrenshawEdit

Hello DJ!

I have been cleaning various WikiProject Oregon miscellany. There is one last item in Category:Oregon articles needing attention: Do you recall why you marked this article as "needing attention"? —EncMstr (talk) 17:29, 12 June 2019 (UTC)

EncMstr, I cannot remember, but I presume it was due to the multiple tags on the article. However, the article does not necessarily need immediate attention and the article is already included in specific categories for improvement, so feel free to remove it if you don't think it needs marked as needing attention. Thanks, Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 19:35, 12 June 2019 (UTC)
Thanks! —EncMstr (talk) 20:06, 12 June 2019 (UTC)



I've been looking for an adopter and saw your post. I'm not quite in your timezone (east coast Canada -4) but thought it was close enough?

I have an infosec background and like the stuff you're working on.

Hope we can connect. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Slarky says no (talkcontribs) 03:18, 13 June 2019 (UTC)

Slarky says no, hello. Why not. I will change the template on your userpage. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 09:17, 13 June 2019 (UTC)


Thank you for the information you left me. I will review it all and let you know it goes and what questions I have. Slarky says no (talk) 12:38, 13 June 2019 (UTC)


Hi there, I asked another mentor for adoption but I don’t think they will adopt me so is it fine if you can become my mentor? I’m from the UK so timing should be fine! Regards, Willbb234 (talk) 10:56, 15 June 2019 (UTC)

Willbb234, although I can help you, I would prefer to have one adoptee "on the books" (due to time constraints). That being said, I will be open to questions you may have (which you can ask on my talk page). You may be interested to read what I have written at User talk:Slarky says no#The start of your adoption. I have also left a further welcome notice on your talk page with several links which can help you explore Wikipedia. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 15:55, 15 June 2019 (UTC)
Sorry for the misunderstanding, but what do you mean by ‘on the books? Willbb234 (talk) 17:18, 15 June 2019 (UTC)
Willbb234, no problem. It is a turn of phrase. If something is "on the books" it means that it is official. The way I intended to use it was that I would be happy to answer questions etc., but wouldn't want to adopt more than one person. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 17:33, 15 June 2019 (UTC)
Ok, thank you. Are you currently adopting somebody else because I’m sure it said your available to become a mentor? Regards, Willbb234 (talk) 17:38, 15 June 2019 (UTC)
Willbb234, yes. I had marked myself as not currently taking any more adoptees, but the bot tasked with updating that page reverted me. Sorry for the confusion. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 18:15, 15 June 2019 (UTC)
So I am not currently planning of taking any more adoptees on currently Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 18:15, 15 June 2019 (UTC)
Ok, not to worry. Thanks for your help Willbb234 (talk) 20:21, 15 June 2019 (UTC)

Tech News: 2019-25Edit

20:37, 17 June 2019 (UTC)

Cornelius Kok IIEdit

in re: Cornelius Kok II (edit | visual edit | history) · Article talk (edit | history) · Watch

I only had time to start the translation. I intend to continue with it. Thank you for making contact. — Preceding unsigned comment added by M E Oettle (talkcontribs) 12:24, 18 June 2019 (UTC)

@M E Oettle: no problem. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 14:45, 18 June 2019 (UTC)
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