Talk:Magdalena Solís

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bit oddly written. Seems to have been taken word for word from another website and doesnt really fit the tone of wikepedia

Could use a rewrite — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.235.154.171 (talk) 19:39, 27 October 2013 (UTC)

Agree. While pedofilia is obviously not okay, calling other of her kinks “perversions” sounds like someone was writing for a cheap tabloid while clutching their pearls. Alvarosaurus95 (talk) 00:42, 26 May 2023 (UTC)

Is this real at all?

I've had doubts of the reality of this figure for a while, partly because of this poorly cited page, and a bit ago, a friend of mine looked into the books cited on the page - I wouldn't say either of them are reliable, and neither properly source anything about Magdalena either, save for something that leads to a book on the occult, and that therefore is not a reliable source either. Searching up her name yields little of anything reliable either, mostly blog posts. There's nothing of note in the news or newspaper searches provided by the "citations needed" template, and most of the books that actually touch on her specifically in the scholar search are from the 90's or later, recycling the same story with no apparent origin. The ones that aren't from the 90's or later are books on folklore or occultism. JSTOR has nothing on her either. I'm nearly 100% positive this is folklore, and that this person never existed. I'd be happy to be proven wrong, but I'm pretty skeptical right now. Promestein (talk) 19:54, 31 May 2019 (UTC)

This all seems an urban myth. I would like to see reports from reputable newspapers from the time. My bet is it's all a load of horse droppings. Some creepypasta that has taken on a life of its own. Trigaranus (talk) 20:45, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

The 1964 "Western Folklore" journal listed in the bibliography DOES mention her, but the details are quite different from those in the article. For instance, she was possessed by Nino Feliciano and her brother by St. Francis. It's barely the same story. 71.169.134.234 (talk) 20:58, 18 January 2022 (UTC)

Most of the sources on the Spanish version are in English... bit of a red flag, that. As well as that the English Wiki page is older than the Spanish. And the photo I keep seeing is Dagmar Overbye, an early-20th Century female serial killer from Denmark (OK, this is devolving into non-Wiki complaints). Wikipedia has a list of online newspaper archives, and a search of El Informador's, which dates from 1917, came up empty--- perhaps it wasn't covered, as the paper is from Guadalajara? Perhaps that year hasn't been digitized? There are at least scans. It certainly hasn't been digitized for HNDM's El Porvenir archive (a Monterrey paper). In fact, the few papers on that site for that year that I can access are blocked with the message Esta publicación es de acceso restringido y sólamente puede ser consultada dentro de las instalaciones de la Hemeroteca Nacional de México (I don't speak Spanish, but it's pretty clear that someone needs to do the search at a facility in Mexico). Considering the sensational nature, there should be something---anything. And if not, it's clear this is a hoax, à la Lucian Staniak, the Red Spider of Communist Poland, who I first read about on Crime Library, the other source for this article's first iteration. 03:36, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

Nota bene: El Bravo, a paper from Matamoros, has its 60s papers scanned. Also, now I have access to The Wikipedia Library, so thank you to whomever did that. Paris1127 (talk) 03:48, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

I'm really glad that some other users finally took notice of the issues with this page. Given that no one else has been able to find any reliable sources on the matter, should we go ahead and propose a deletion? Promestein (talk) 03:15, 22 January 2022 (UTC)

I find it fascinating that this story could be totally bunk. Fantastic long-running, likely misogynistic hoax if so. The true crime fetish ecosystem is still fully behind the story. I did turn up this bit of potential corroboration from what is seemingly a reputable source— https://drtonyzavaleta.com/the-cult-of-yerba-buena/ He also indicates that there was a story in the Brownsville Herald in ‘63-‘64 on the cult, along with the El Bravo article mentioned above. I’ll leave it to those better suited to determine authenticity and/or dig further. JGray (talk) 10:14, 22 January 2022 (UTC)

Unfortunately, El Bravo hasn't scanned its papers from 1963---1964 is as far back as it gets. There's a paper in Monterrey, El Porvenir, that has a scanned archive but you need to be a subscriber to see it. And then, there's this: two articles in The Cuero Record of Cuero, Texas, the first dated June 5, 1963, the second June 13, 1963. Folks, this story may not be entirely a hoax... The second refers to a "Celina Salvana" being a high priestess burned at the stake in Yerbabuena, but if she was: 1. a victim of Solis or 2. the basis of Solis. This UPI story I found (page 6, from a paper in the Marshall Islands) referred to her as the sorceress, but also refers to the Hernandez brothers and other things associated with this story. And thanks to my local library, I discovered an article on the front page of the Chicago Tribune from June 4, 1963, talking about a cult in Mexico led by "Eleasor Solis". Paris1127 (talk) 18:53, 22 January 2022 (UTC)

Oh, that's nice! Some actual dependable information. I suppose it'd just be a matter of correcting any issues and inaccuracies on the page, and getting better sources. Promestein (talk) 00:45, 23 January 2022 (UTC)

I've also got as far as the 1964 Western Folklore report which is based on a (6 June 1963, I think) Dallas Herald article that is in turn based on an UPI dispatch. I find it telling that the Western Folklore journal picked it up, basically implying that this is folklore (here meaning: a confabulation that made it into UPI) rather than actual news. The Western Folklore article is available online, but for me (in Switzerland) only through a roundabout route. I can forward the PDF to people who are interested though. Trigaranus (talk) 13:05, 23 January 2022 (UTC)

BTW, out of curiosity, who else was sent down this rabbit hole by a post on Imgur / Reddit, or by MrBallen? Trigaranus (talk) 13:07, 23 January 2022 (UTC)

What I'd like to see more than anything is something, anything, from Mexico, from the time of what happened, completely en español for confirmation. News articles or court records (assuming that's even available). These English sources are great to have, but ring of sensationalism and can be inconsistent. The Western Folklore article (which I found on JSTOR), eg, refers to her as "Maria Magdalena Solis" while the UPI dispatch calls her "Celina Salvana", which might actually be the name of a victim? And then the American papers lose interest. Surely there's something better in Mexico? I'd share the Trib article, but I'm not sure how I can do so while not running afoul of Wikipedia/American copyright rules. Paris1127 (talk) 04:44, 24 January 2022 (UTC)

I completely agree. Would we be able to post a beacon somewhere on the Mexico Portal of Wikipedia? I doubt anyone commenting here is Mexico-based. If we had a contributor with access to the UNAM Central Library, that would increase our chances of turning up a contemporary Mexican newspaper source. (Court records are on a different tier of difficulty.) Trigaranus (talk) 10:08, 24 January 2022 (UTC)

WP:MX has a talk page that seems to serve that purpose. We could ask if anyone over there is interested/able to assist. Paris1127 (talk) 14:52, 24 January 2022 (UTC)

it's Aztec gods not Inca gods

even in the source it's clearly talking about Aztec gods. those cultures are not even on the same continent. please correct it. 2A01:CB1A:4028:E6A3:0:41:E1F2:6B01 (talk) 15:27, 1 June 2023 (UTC)

Which source is that? Most articles about this case refer to the Inca, despite being the wrong continent---the cult leaders had no idea, supposedly. Paris1127 (talk) 17:32, 1 June 2023 (UTC)

The three shitty sources we have for the article are literally evenly spread (if I remember correctly): one talks about Aztecs, one about Incas, the other about Aztecs or Incas. Which is another tick in the "Eh, probably all made-up nonsense that never happened" column. Trigaranus (talk) 07:47, 3 June 2023 (UTC)