Talk:Joachim Wtewael

Latest comment: 9 years ago by MWAK in topic Pronunciation

Pronunciation

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Anyone know how the last name's pronounced (and can get a source...)? Q·L·1968 18:58, 7 February 2014 (UTC)Reply

Sort of "Ootievaal" Johnbod (talk) 13:59, 16 April 2015 (UTC)Reply
Well...try a-ee-tuh-wahl, with the "a-ee" as a single syllable and the "w" not too rounded — but not a v, please. And the "W" at the beginning of his name is just, as any W, a ligature of two Vs (so: V V) which again is the same as two Us (so: U U). His name thus really was Uutewaal, but the doubling of the U was rendered by putting a "y" or an "i" behind the first "u": Uytewaal of Uitewaal. And the doubling of the "a" was at the time written as "ae": Uytewael or Uitewael. It's all quite simple, really.--MWAK (talk) 06:54, 1 June 2015 (UTC)Reply
"Ootievaal" conveys better to me how Dutch people sound saying it. It would be good to get one of those sound-bite things added. Johnbod (talk) 12:07, 1 June 2015 (UTC)Reply
I can understand the "v", as the unrounded w sounds identical to adult English speakers. But Dutch uu and ui are totally different sounds from "oo". Unless you speak Cockney, of course :o). The e in "te" is an unstressed vowel and is basically identical to the English schwa.--MWAK (talk) 17:25, 1 June 2015 (UTC)Reply
So in other words, Wtewael is /ˈœytəʋaːl/; is that right? Q·L·1968 20:14, 1 June 2015 (UTC)Reply
Well, it is rather more complicated. Modern members of the Wtewael family pronounce their name as /ˈyːtəʋaːl/. This reflects mediaeval pronunciation, still common in eastern Dutch dialects, and the fact that the W is simply a "uu". So the article is correct in providing this pronunciation. But in modern Dutch the word would normally be spelled Uitewaal, indeed pronounced as /ˈœytəʋaːl/, and not using sounds overly alien to the English tongue, if you know which they are ;o).--MWAK (talk) 06:15, 2 June 2015 (UTC)Reply

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