Talk:Belize–Taiwan relations

Untitled

I suggest folding this article into the one on ROC foreign relations in general. WPxOG (talk) 08:17, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Moved. There is a wide margin in favor of this move. Some editors still opposed the move of individual articles where the main topic might be relations between certain countries and pre-1949 China, the one where ROC was still in power on the mainland. On the other hand, User:BDD has argued that our article on Germany–United States relations is expected to cover the whole succession of governments of Germany in one article. Those who want special coverage of pre-1949 relations seem like they would require a split of every current article which contains any mention of the pre-1949 period. That would go against the consistency argument which seems to be widely held by those commenting here. There was also a very weighty (and hotly contested) move discussion in February 2012 where Republic of China was moved to Taiwan. The logic of that move might suggest that the 'relations' articles would be expected to move as well, which is the topic of the current discussion. EdJohnston (talk) 16:25, 29 April 2013 (UTC)

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• Belize–Republic of China relations → Belize–Taiwan relations
• Republic of China–Dominican Republic relations → Dominican Republic–Taiwan relations
• Republic of China–Paraguay relations → Paraguay–Taiwan relations
• Republic of China–Venezuela relations → Taiwan–Venezuela relations
• Republic of China–the Gambia relations → The Gambia–Taiwan relations
• Republic of China–South Africa relations → South Africa–Taiwan relations
• Republic of China–India relations → India–Taiwan relations
• Republic of China–Japan relations → Japan–Taiwan relations
• Republic of China–Mongolia relations → Mongolia–Taiwan relations
• Republic of China–South Korea relations → South Korea–Taiwan relations
• Republic of China–Vietnam relations → Taiwan–Vietnam relations
• Republic of China–Denmark relations → Denmark–Taiwan relations
• Republic of China–Holy See relations → Holy See–Taiwan relations
• Republic of China–Russia relations → Russia–Taiwan relations
• List of diplomatic missions in the Republic of China → List of diplomatic missions in Taiwan
• List of diplomatic missions of the Republic of China → List of diplomatic missions of Taiwan

– It's a shame that more related articles weren't moved too when Republic of China was moved to Taiwan around a year ago. I don't take a personal position on the naming issue, but I do insist on internal consistency wherever practical—not just as a personal preference, but as part of our naming criteria. Too many of these derivative RMs have been bogged down in questions as to whether or not they deal with modern Taiwan only or mainland ROC before 1949, but this isn't relevant to simple, common naming as prescribed at WP:AT. And after all, Germany–United States relations includes relations between the US and the Weimar Republic, Nazi Germany, West Germany, etc. You'd never see a serious proposal to move that article to Federal Republic of Germany–United States relations. Let's best serve our readers by moving these articles to more recognizable, consistent titles. BDD (talk) 17:29, 16 April 2013 (UTC)

• Rename all per Taiwan, Foreign relations of Taiwan and per WP:COMMONNAME. There's far too much heel dragging in this area and attempts to keep refighting the RoC/Taiwan naming question wherever possible; let's put all that aside and match the top article. Timrollpickering (talk) 22:55, 16 April 2013 (UTC)

• Rename all per Taiwan, In ictu oculi (talk) 04:25, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

• Oppose some "Dominican Republic", "South Africa", "Japan", "Mongolia", "South Korea", "Holy See" need to be split into two, as they all have coverage pre-1950, when the ROC was still on the mainland. -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 05:54, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

• Oppose some. Articles which deal with relations both today and going back to before the time when the RoC was confined to Taiwan should probably not be moved. I also disagree with 70.24.250.103's suggestion that such articles should be split; that would just be clumsy, and it would make information less easy for the reader. The pages on relations with the Dominican Republic or Mongolia or the Holy See should remain in one piece, and should arguably keep their current name. (Other than that, I have no fundamental objection to the renaming.) Aridd (talk) 08:56, 17 April 2013 (UTC)
• Support. If the parent articles are Taiwan and Foreign relations of Taiwan, these child articles should follow. The Taiwanese government stopped pretending to be the real China a long time ago. I changed planes in Taipei recently. All the English-language signage at the airport says "Taiwan". No "Welcome to the Republic of China", "You've arrived in the Free Area of the Republic of China", or anything like that. Kauffner (talk) 03:28, 18 April 2013 (UTC)
• Oppose some. Several of the articles are about Republic of China (1912–1949), which is what Taiwan is a continuation of. Also, several others, such as the Holy See, are technically relations with what those countries recognise as "China". Osiris (talk) 12:39, 18 April 2013 (UTC)
• Rename all. per the moving request. Common/Official name should apply to both entities in the article, ex: the relations with South Korea should either be "ROC-ROK" or "Taiwan-South Korea". And we can see that conventionally the bilateral relation articles use common name, so Taiwan-South Korea is the proper name. Fizikanauk (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 18:17, 18 April 2013 (UTC)
  • Comment the pre-1950 common name for the Republic of China is "China", so how are you going to handle the two different common names? -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 04:42, 19 April 2013 (UTC)
    • In my opinion, I will move those data to History of Sino-Korean relations, but this move need a consensus. To name the contemporary issue in the common name Taiwan fit the naming policy of wikipedia.Fizikanauk (talk) 20:08, 19 April 2013 (UTC)
• Rename all unless we can find evidence that the trading partner in question specifically uses "China" IN ENGLISH to refer to Taiwan. In which case let that person present evidence. (Maybe SA?) If that evidence is lacking, they can always RM it back later. Red Slash 23:51, 23 April 2013 (UTC)
• Note that a related RM at Template talk:Foreign relations of Taiwan moved a template and a couple of broader articles to the Taiwan name. --BDD (talk) 20:08, 25 April 2013 (UTC)

• Support for consistency between the parent article Taiwan and all things associated with it. Sawol (talk) 19:28, 26 April 2013 (UTC)
• Rename all per WP:COMMONNAME AHCCCP (talk) 01:26, 28 April 2013 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.