Talk:Anderson (footballer, born 1988)

Youth Teams

Surely has hasn't been playing for the Gremio youth side ever since he was 5 years old?

I wouldn't doubt it. Clubs routinely pick up children around that age. Cricketseven (talk) 23:44, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

Work Permit issues

2 reasons why I think this does not belong:

1) All we have in the citation is a tabloid paper making what appear to be speculative comments. AFAIK, the Home Office are not in the habit of leaking reports of the state of progress of work permit applications: they simply release the result of their deliberations at the end of the process. No spokesperson from the Home Office or from Manchester Utd is quoted: we appear to have no more than journalistic speculation.

2) Even if this is true (and it seems quite likely to me, although that is not sufficient for inclusion), and the journalist's word is taken as proof; I would contend that Wiki should not be the place for day to day reports on the progress of a transfer. This is the route to extremes of recentism. There is an extent to which this project needs to be up to date: it would not be reasonable for the page not to report that moves towards a transfer are well advanced and in the public domain, but details of the stage of such negotiations are the material of news reports, not encyclopedias. Kevin McE 23:30, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

I concur. Hjorten 16:08, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

I also provide my support. Recentism is the buzzword that comes to mind. I'm almost tempted to remove the sentence on his proposed future transfer from the lead section, to be honest. --Dreaded Walrus ^{t c} 23:34, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

And again editors seem determined to include lengthy reflections on the obtaining of a work permit. By the time he has played 2 or 3 games for Man U (assuming that he does now jointhem) this will be forgotten. Although it is a necessary stage, it is not a major biographical element; one may as well describe in detail the compilation of an individual's tax returns: it is necessary, and one's career might be very different if it is not done, but it is scarcely a key life event. Kevin McE 16:53, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

Rape allegation

A Manchester United star aged 19 (believed to be Anderson was arrested on suspicion of rape at the Manchester United party.

Watch this space he is yet to be named but the rumour on the forums is its him, guilty or not—Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.211.18.167 (talk • contribs)

Not even close. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/manchester/7151624.stm

This is exactly why forums fail WP:Verify.Darkson (Yabba Dabba Doo!) 16:45, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

surely this should be removed as not only did the allegations turn out to be against Jonny Evans but they were false and he is currently counter-suing the accuser for damages. I fail to see the relevance —Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.73.108.219 (talk) 13:40, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

Caps

i think the number of caps Anderson has needs to be checked. I count up to his latest appearance for brazil against argentina that he has only 5 caps yet the page says 7. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.73.108.219 (talk) 13:42, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

Unsourced edits

instead of deleting new posts why not beef them up and add the references??? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.73.108.219 (talk) 15:01, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

You're looking at it backwards. Because Wikipedia is not a publisher of original thought, you shouldn't add to articles anything that isn't already published in a reliable source elsewhere. The second problem is the paragraph that begins with "Anderson was quick to earn the adoration of many United fans" is simply not verifiable, since it's either pure opinion or collective feelings of unidentified, unspecific group of people. And the paragraph about his callup doesn't really seem to be notable. It's just a news update, which would be more appropriate in Wikinews. --Mosmof (talk) 13:47, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

I would disagree and say that a 20 year old footballer being good enough to earn a start for his country against Argentina as well worth including in an article about the footballer. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.218.198.201 (talk) 18:58, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Olympic appearances and goals

Please don't add these to the infobox stats. Olympic matches are NOT senior "A" international matches, and it is, despite the overage players, an U-23 tournament. --Mosmof (talk) 20:56, 10 August 2008 (UTC)

WP:LAME edit war about 1 cm

I've been watching the edit war, and the "discussion" on User talk:122.107.185.144, with a mixture of annoyance and amusement. But after seeing PeeJay call the IP editor's edits "POV", I can't resist chiming in. PeeJay, did you really just call this "POV"? Implying, I suppose, that you are somehow "NPOV"? I can't help but point out that saying someone is being "pointless" for continuing to insist on adding one centimeter, while you continue to insist with an equal lack of flexibility that removing the centimeter is defending NPOV, is a bit surreal. The {{convert}} template is meant as an aid to editing; if slavishly following it is getting in the way of writing the article, just do a manual conversion. And I suggest you both take a look at the articles Significant figures and Precision (arithmetic), and think about what each reference would report if his actual height was 5 feet 9.2 inches (1.758 m)

No more edit warring. I won't block people or protect the article, since I've been dragged into the content dispute, but I'll go find an admin who will block or protect. If you don't like the edit I just made on the article page, discuss it on the talk page instead of mindlessly reverting each other. You can't imagine how little I care what the end result is, so if you all can come to some kind of agreement that isn't my compromise, that's fine. --barneca (talk) 18:47, 11 October 2008 (UTC)

Infobox

Why is it on the infobox we just have down Porto down and not FC Porto? – Michael (talk) 01:20, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

What do you mean? – PeeJay 07:23, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

Nevermind I thought their page in wikipedia was FC Porto but it's actually F.C. Porto, my bad. – Michael (talk) 16:49, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

Source 18

Since when did the sun become a reliable source.......... Wikipedia is not for speculation so i think you should remove the bit about the fine as no reliable source has confirmed it and it is minor news. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.150.162.135 (talk) 16:29, 1 February 2010 (UTC)

Err, what? The Sun is a reliable source. It's national newspaper, for god's sake! Info stays in. – PeeJay 23:14, 1 February 2010 (UTC)

National or not, The Sun is a tabloid that, among other things, breathlessly announces that Anderson is "on the verge" of leaving for Lyon. If what The Sun is reporting is true, you can probably find other sources corroborating it. If The Sun is the only source, then I'd have questions about its veracity. --Mosmof (talk) 00:37, 2 February 2010 (UTC)

I am staggered that the sun is given as a quote for this transfer to Lyon. It is quite clearly complete tripe drummed up by a "red top" newspaper. Unless you can find a reliable source this sheer speculation should be removed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.73.108.210 (talk) 10:10, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

So it's not OK to use The Sun as a source for transfer speculation, but it's fine to use it to cite Anderson being fined by the club? Double standards, much? – PeeJay 00:47, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

not really. i would take that out as well as its equally unreliable. I know you think you own united on wikipedia peejay but you cant use the sun as a source unless it is actually backed up by something a.) official or b.) has a reputation —Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.73.108.210 (talk) 08:46, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

Breaking news coming in that Anderson has been in a major accident

There's some breaking news coming in that Anderson has been in a major car accident, has been pulled unconscious from a burning vehicle. While there's not a great deal of information yet, there's already a few edits being made. I've flagged the article as a current event, partially just so the article can be tracked from when the news started coming in so we can easily collate the information together if the event does indeed become verified and more information comes in. Failing that, we can simply remove the tag in a few hours. Let me know if there's any issues. Pursey ^{Talk | Contribs} 22:14, 1 August 2010 (UTC)

Where are you getting this news from? We need a source! – PeeJay 22:17, 1 August 2010 (UTC)

I'm aware we need a source. The whole point of the current tag is so we can actually track the changes easily and then cite then. I'm working on it. The notice is to let people know the article may be unstable/uncited, that is its partial purpose. :) Pursey ^{Talk | Contribs} 22:20, 1 August 2010 (UTC)

This from the Guardian Paralympiakos (talk) 22:23, 1 August 2010 (UTC)

Wonderful, thank you. That makes things a bit clearer, there's still info coming out from Sky News at the moment as well so it may very well still be developing. There's multiple passengers by the sounds of things and may very well have a serious impact on his career. Obviously, people will want to speculate because of this so I think the best we can do for now is to continue to find sources and references for any information that does go on the page and watch for more dubious information being added. This isn't particularly a personal interest topic of mine, but I'll probably keep an eye on it and see if I can pitch in a bit of work finding refs etc. Pursey ^{Talk | Contribs} 22:27, 1 August 2010 (UTC)

Gremio

A bit of obscurity surrounds Anderson's career at Gremio and his subsequent transfer to Porto. Below is the discussion on my talk page which may be constructive for those who would like to help improve the corresponding sections:

The UEFA source first appeared in June 2005. Have you read the article it said loaned back. Matthew_hk tc 06:14, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Here is another article from Brazil, first published in June 2005. http://esportes.terra.com.br/futebol/europeu/interna/0,,OI558549-EI2035,00-Anderson+exGremio+acerta+com+o+Porto.html Matthew_hk tc 06:14, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

More correctly Anderson had signed for Porto via Gestifute In June 2005, but the FIFA protection on minor (under-18) prevented him to join the club. And Anderson's mother found in job in Portugal, and made Anderson eligible to immigrate to Portugal for family re-union, thus joined Porto in January 2006, as age 17th. The case seems likes Fabio and Raferal to ManU. Matthew_hk tc 06:45, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

No the UEFA article did not say loan back. All it said is he would return to Brazil to REST before the start of the campaign.

• The Annual Report 2005/06 of Porto ([1]) p.011 says that Porto took on Anderson in the January transfer window of 2006.
• Man United website ([2]) says he joined Porto in Jan 2006.
• A much more recent UEFA source ([3]) says that he joined Porto in December 2005.
• The Portuguese source seems to say that Anderson was signed by a consortium and then he was DUE to sign for Porto. We couldn't be sure the deal happened according to schedule.

I consider Man Utd and Porto to be the most reliable source since they have first hand access to the player. Craddocktm (talk) 06:50, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

If your point on Gestifute is right, it isn't possible for Anderson to join Porto in June 2005, since FIFA rules would make that transfer illegal and void. Therefore, strictly speaking, he was only signed by Gestifute in June 2005 and did not join Porto until January 2006. Craddocktm (talk) 06:54, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

It could stated in the article that the deal was pre-agree/ signed a pre-contract in June 2005. In the view point of International Transfer Certificate (ITC)/Transfer windows, Anderson officially joined Porto in January 2006 the opening of Portuguese window, in the view point of contract Anderson signed a contract with GestiFute the agent company and passed the medical in June 2005. Matthew_hk tc 06:55, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Fine with me. Craddocktm (talk) 06:59, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Transfer fee

I removed the part saying the fee was 17 million pounds, there was no mention of that in the reference given. I have linked to lequipe.fr where if you scroll through to the section on Anderson it confirms the price of the transfer at 25m euros. 58.167.198.107 09:23, 13 July 2007 (UTC)Rusty8.

transfer fee should be 30 million euro as announced by Porto. Matthew_hk tc 14:00, 11 February 2011 (UTC)

The transfer was originally announced in the UK as being a £30 million deal for both Anderson and Nani. Are we therefore saying that Nani only actually cost Man Utd about £5 million? – PeeJay 14:18, 30 June 2011 (UTC)

Club Honours

Anderson is listed as having won the portuguese league in a season where he only played 3 matches. would he still have won a medal or are the rules different over there? (here you need min 10 games) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.73.108.210 (talk) 13:59, 30 June 2011 (UTC)

It might be similar to Spain where you have to register a squad of players for the season and every member of that squad is considered to have won the league. – PeeJay 14:19, 30 June 2011 (UTC)

Opening paragraph description

'He is a box-to-box midfielder with good vision, adept tackling ability, strong, tireless and hard-working abilities.[2]'

I am deleting this line because it is nothing more than a subjective value judgement, and sounds more like it belongs in a brochure produced by his agent than an encyclopaedic article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.10.211.106 (talk) 15:31, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

And that is your own opinion. Objectively, the statement is sourced and should remain. – PeeJay 17:47, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

They are value judgements. You could just as easily source statements to the contrary, or statements about his lack of physical fitness. This is an encyclopaedic article and should be impartial. I am removing the line once again, and even though you will probably seek to put it back, I can assure you they you will be defeated, because clearly I am in the right. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.10.211.106 (talk) 18:43, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

Sure pal. A segment on a player's playing style is fairly common in more recent football biographies, and these are almost always based on people's value judgements than on any measurable stats. So much for clearly being in the right. Try reading WP:DICK. – PeeJay 13:19, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 3 February 2015

Under 2013-14 season, please add: "During his five month loan, Anderson only made seven appearances for Fiorentina, three of which were from the bench. At the end of the season, he returned to Manchester United." Citation: http://talksport.com/football/blow-man-united-fiorentina-send-back-loan-flop-14052192163

Add new section '2014-2015' and put this under it: "Anderson was not part of the 25-man squad that flew to US for United's pre-season tour, missing out because of a calf injury he sustained during training. Under new manager Louis Van Gaal, he only appeared in one game, against Burnley at Turf Moor. Anderson finally parted with Manchester United by making a switch to Internacional, on a free transfer, during the January transfer window." Citations: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2697417/Louis-van-Gaal-leaves-Anderson-Bebe-Patrice-Evra-United-tour-America.html http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/31118761

Darthkhare (talk) 19:32, 3 February 2015 (UTC)

Done, thank you. —Nizolan ^(talk) 00:42, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

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