Talk:Abraham Maslow

Content

Section on Maslow's hierarchy of needs

The picture of the pyramid only has five levels of needs, but the written text describes seven levels of needs. I have noticed similar discrepancies on other sources on Maslow, too. Vorbee (talk) 20:48, 10 August 2017 (UTC)

three new stages of Maslow's Model?

there is also three new stages that have come about over time the first two were in the 1970s thers stages are: Congitive needs: the need for koowledge and meaning. and Aesthetic needs: the appreciation and search for beauty, balance, form. These two new stages fit between stages four and five. The third new stage was that of "Transcendence needs": or the helping others to achieve self actualization. this is now the eighth and final stage of Maslows model.

for mor information see http://www.businessballs.com/maslow.htm

***

this is an example of how modern business perverts Maslow's original work to suit their specific needs. If you go look at it, you will see how they have inserted a great deal of business oriented language throughout it, and moved parts of mental ability up higher in the model to imply labor need not have, for example, knowledge or an aesthetic sense; these are reserved strictly for management. They have even inserted the concepts of subservience and dominance, when the original hierarchy was never about that. no, this is someone else's hierarchy, and only uses Maslow's name in an attempt to seem valid.

and in fact, if you actually read the page this refers to, instead of just looking at the pictures, the page acknowledges this. 108.2.231.252 (talk) 16:59, 13 January 2016 (UTC)

My recollection is that Maslow did elaborate on the hierarchy and add some additional levels in his late career, so I think the original poster is right on the general thrust of this. I'd have to chase up references. Lauchlanmack (talk) 05:15, 29 November 2019 (UTC)

Pyramid - "sex"?

Why is "sex" at the base of the pyramid? It is a well-documented fact that animals in zoos will only mate if their basic needs are fulfilled, and most will mate only if all the layers of the pyramids are fulfilled. Shouldn't "sex" figure higher on the pyramid? --Ireon 22:32, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Maslow put it there? Also, I think the basic needs (food, water, excretion, sleep, etc.) are on the same level as sex, so it would make sense that there might be an order of priority within the step on the pyramid. The step groups sex with the other ones because it is a biologically driven desire, harkening back to its heyday as Freud's go-to motivation for basically everything and its mom. -Nietzscheanlie 12:04, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

You are probably right with the sex. Buddhist's are self-realised without any of the trash we are told to buy and habits 'we' do, therefore Maslow was being a bit of a scally-wag! His diagram is only half complete! Maslows original should have a two-tier, smaller pyramid placed on underneath. First level, Physiological/safety needs. Next level, Self-realisation (no Ego, no BS, no need for possessions). Your natural state by the way.86.153.90.118 (talk) 20:03, 8 August 2016 (UTC)

An answer:

Maslow himself was ambivalent on the topic. In A Theory of Human Motivation he said that sexuality was multi-determined, it could be part physiological, it could also be part love which is "self-esteem" level.

"One thing that must be stressed at this point is that love is not synonymous with sex. Sex may be studied as a purely physiological need. Ordinarily sexual behavior is multi-determined, that is to say, determined not only by sexual but also by other needs, chief among which are the love and affection needs. Also not to be overlooked is the fact that the love needs involve both giving and receiving love."

Like for much of this, Maslow was less black-and-white than the people who came after him and made this into a fixed, rigid pyramid. His overall point was the drive that was strongest would take precedence, and this tended to be the lower level drives on the pyramid. Also bear in mind Maslow was writing about psychology as a psychotherapist helping people heal, not about work or other contexts. Lauchlanmack (talk) 05:42, 29 November 2019 (UTC)

Section on self-actualisers

The section on self-actualisation names Albert Einstein and Henry David Thoreau as two people who Maslow considered self-actualisers, but surely Maslow considered more people self-actualisers than just these two individuals. Vorbee (talk) 20:16, 31 August 2017 (UTC)

Einstein and Wertheimer are mentioned in the section on "methodology", which could be improved. Thoreau is no longer mentioned. See also the Self-actualization page Lauchlanmack (talk) 04:49, 29 November 2019 (UTC)

About Maslow

"best known for ..."

This article begins with a sentence stating that Maslow is best known for his hierarchy of needs. Should it not say that he is best known as the founding father of humanistic psychology?Vorbee (talk) 17:56, 12 December 2017 (UTC)

I'd say the HON are more widely known than humanistic psychology, so I suggest leave it as is :) Lauchlanmack (talk) 05:21, 29 November 2019 (UTC)

I'm with Vorbee on this. Just because Joe Public has heard of the pyramid doesn't mean it should lead an encyclopaedic entry on a great thinker. We can note that the Archimedes entry doesn't mention 'Eureka' in the lede. Onanoff (talk) 22:47, 11 April 2021 (UTC)

Maslow and Positive Psychology?

I don't believe that he was in fact involved in Positive Psychology, as this field wasn't established at the time of his work. His work was considered Humanistic Psychology, as Joshua said, which was a predecessor to Positive Psychology. The citation for this point about Positive Psychology is also inaccessible.

Deleting this point from the article. Jmspin (talk) 08:44, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

The reference still seems to be there. Lauchlanmack (talk) 05:53, 29 November 2019 (UTC)

Cornell

Bit of confusion about his connection to Cornell. It is listed among his affiliated institutions and he is marked as an alumni via a hyperlink at the bottom of the page, but there is no mention of Cornell University in the body of the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 132.236.97.31 (talk) 23:55, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

His death

Maslow died a relatively early death, aged 62.

• Was he himself person fulfilled?
• What did he die of?
• What were his last writings, sayings, thoughts?

92.11.30.201 (talk) 03:25, 15 January 2016 (UTC)

Response:

His state of mind seems subjective and speculative to me, and beyond the scope of an encyclopedia article unless someone has some good biographical sources on this. I suggest delete this part of the comment from 2016 to tidy up the talk page.

He died of a heart attack, if I recall correctly,

His last writings were probably Maslow on Management. Also google for his theory Z. Both would make good additions to this article. Lauchlanmack (talk) 05:27, 29 November 2019 (UTC)

Is there a "correct" pronunciation of his name?

I've heard Maslow pronounced "mah-zlow" and "maw-zlow", with the first syllable being similar to either "matrimony" or "mock". Is there a "right" way to say it? How did he say it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Karuna8 (talk • contribs) 20:13, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

Hmmmm...since he was of Jewish descent the first pronunciation would seem closer to Ashkenazic or even Hebrew dialect. However, such a leap in logic would also place the accent on the second syllable. CWatchman (talk) 01:56, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

I was Abe Maslow's research assistant 1942-43. The first pronunciation is the only one he ever used. Marin Programmer23:24, 18 October 2008 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Marin Programmer (talk • contribs)

Although he was born in the U.S., his parents were immigrants from Russia--what is now Kiev, Ukraine. "Maslow" in that region would not be native, in fact would not even be Russian, whereas "Maslov" is quite common. I have seen him being referred to as "Maslov" in some literature. Is it known whether the name had originally been "Maslov"? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.160.77.68 (talk) 10:25, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

The -ow is common in Polish, and Galicia (nowadays Western Ukraine) had a substantial Polish population, and Jews from the region that used to be Poland, some of whom certainly ended up in Kyïv (especially Jews, tending to be more urban than Eastern European Christians). And Freud's article tells us that he was a Jew too, and from Galicia no less ... (don't mistake for the Galicia in Spain). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 189.63.152.210 (talk) 03:00, 28 September 2012 (UTC)

I have lived in Kiev, Ukraine and the word 'Maslow'( масло ) in both Ukrainian and Russian is the word for 'butter' (almost the same in Polish) and is pronounced as it looks with a long 'a' as in 'ahh'. It could be as simple as that; after all people in English-speaking countries have surnames such as Wood, Stone, Apple, Sugar, Baker... 91.232.101.27 (talk) 15:45, 8 September 2014 (UTC) Jean-Pierre el-Rif ----

Source of Maslow "hammer and nail" quote

In trying to track down the hammer-nail quote by Abraham Maslow. My lengthy searches revealed several versions (see below). I am keen to have the quote in its original form and the source in which it appeared. "If the only tool you have is a hammer, you treat everything like a nail." "To the man who only has a hammer in the toolkit, every problem looks like a nail." "If the only tool you have is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail." ?When the only tool you have is a hammer, all problems begin to resemble nails.? at http://www.gurteen.com/gurteen/gurteen.nsf/id/S613630/ i asked in a forum for help, but the original question is old, so noone might come around. i would be happy if anyone might post a comment with the pagenumber there. thx, tomk

Hammer-nail quote is given as: "I suppose it is tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail." and sourced at: http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Abraham_Maslow —Preceding unsigned comment added by 151.197.39.239 (talk) 00:46, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

Answer:

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_the_instrument Lauchlanmack (talk) 04:28, 29 November 2019 (UTC)

Critiques of Maslow's work

Methodology

The page specifically for the hierachy of needs includes this critique and I believe it should also be included on his main page. It is a major influencing factor in his work.

Maslow studied people such as Albert Einstein, Jane Addams, Eleanor Roosevelt, and Baruch Spinoza, rather than mentally ill or neurotic people, writing that "the study of crippled, stunted, immature, and unhealthy specimens can yield only a cripple psychology and a cripple philosophy." Maslow studied the healthiest 1% of the college student population.

How do other Psychologists view of his works? Critiques?

Here is a schwedish critical opinion: http://www.physto.se/~vetfolk/Folkvett/19992maslow.html

I can't offer any direct sources, but I am well aware that in describing self-actualized individuals Maslow used largely circular reasoning. To pinpoint individuals that had obtained this state he used an assessment to determine people's emotional well-being and took those from around the top 2 percentile. He used these people to deduce his traits for these people (kinship with the world, mystical peak experiences, problem-oriented). Of course, in assessing the level of self-actualization in individuals, he used his own subjective idea of emotional well-being and, for the most part, honed in on the traits that he later used in his conclusions. To put the idea simply, people behave a certain way if they are self-actualized. People are self-actualized because they behave a certain. The whole model is circular reasoning and loaded with flaws such as the one pointed out by the poster below.

---

Can You give an answer to the following cases, that doesn't fit in the Maslow's hierarchy:

-- For example artists, novelists can be starving and they can isolate themselves from social life to do their work?

-- Suicidal behavior

With king regars Hanna

I don't see how they "don't fit". I wouldn't have put it that way. Artists don't starve to the point that they can't move, and even when they and religious people fast, they do it on a temporary basis. Suicide has a myriad of psychological things associated with it. How are you relating it? It doesn't conflict with the ideas of Maslow concerned here. --DanielCD 16:40, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

Maslow's theory didn't really incorporate much psychopathology. As a humanistic psychologist he would have followed Carl Rogers' theory concerning discrepancies between actual and ideal self leading to psychopathology. Perhaps, when I'm less busy, I'll add stuff to this article that it sorely needs including refinements to the hierarchy including deficiency motivations, his work with monkeys, and gender biases unless somebody beats me to it. A lot of the psy articles in Wikipedia need work and I'll probably put some work in over the summer.Blue Leopard 10:04, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

Maslow never actually drew an hierarchy of needs - Yes, there are "lower" needs which tend to attract our attention more if they're not satisfied (ie you're not primarily concerned with love if you're starving) but Maslows makes a big point on that -they're all human-, critizing the religious idea of hunger and hornyness as "base" needs, and expression and love as a higher and more refined activities. They are all human needs, and in fact, a history of satisfaction of one need leaves us with a feeling of security in it. I can sit and write my paper here even if I feel hungry, for I know it is no big deal for me to feel hungry. I never have to worry about starving. The same goes for love, if I know I am a loved individual, I can live without the constant affirmation of others. It's all in "A Theory of Human Motivation". -Arvid Axbrink Cederholm arvidos@gmail.com —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.11.196.27 (talk) 23:00, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

How is the Christina Hoff Summers Opinion Relevant?

Why is the opinion of someone with no psychiatric training like Christina Hoff Summers is relevant to this article? Would the opinion of Jay McInerney be relevant? After all, he's an author too. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.36.142.190 (talk) 00:21, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

References

Development of his theory

Kurt Goldstein's influence on Maslow

(Moved from article space by Anthonyhcole (talk · contribs · email) 04:47, 17 August 2013 (UTC))

There might be a question that you have asked. How did Abraham Maslow came up with the Hierarchy of Need. The self-actualization pyramid did not come from Abraham Maslow himself but rather from biologist Kurt Goldstein who first used this term in the 1930s. When Abraham Maslow came across this self-actualization structure, he took it and expended it. Kurt Goldstein idea was that self-actualization is the internal driver of organisms to not only survive, but to thrive. And that the drive is the need for actualization and determines the life of an organism. Maslow expanded this concept from a human motivation perspective. He also borrowed more things from other psychologists. By taking others ideas and putting all of the things together will give up credit for all of your dedication, time, and work. That is what exactly Abraham Maslow did with his work, he also was advancing in it too. (Toward Psychology of Being (Third Edition) pg. 29) [1] — Preceding unsigned comment added by Stopbiches (talk • contribs) 04:32, 17 August 2013

This is a good point, and is covered on the Self-actualization page. Does it need to be reproduced here? Lauchlanmack (talk) 06:00, 29 November 2019 (UTC)

Connections to Evolutionary Biology

It gets really interesting looking at Maslow with an evolutionary biologist's toolbox. Up to the level of self-actualization everything makes a lot of sense, but from that point onward completely different dynamics ensue. Biologically, if an entity has reached the top of its abilities and has verified that this is indeed true and not wishful thinking (a translation for the very vague term of "self-actualization"), it necessarily will switch from entity-egoistic programs to genetic-code supporting programs.

In plain English: There need to be higher levels in the pyramid, constituting needs that would appear "altruistic" to psychologists. Since this is a self-emergent system under evolutionary selection, thinking in terms of "self-interest" of a single unit leads you completely astray.Hirsch.im.wald 11:02, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

Note the "2011" date in his education; is that a typo or vandalism?

Is there a possibility that your first paragraph hints at the problem? How can any entity verify it has reached the top of its abilities. What will it compare itself to to build that view? Does it just have to look around at everyone else and have its toe in front? Is there a chance something in your young life made you obsessive-compulsive about success and owning things? What purpose do you think it could have to do that. Which part of the brain does that affect?

There are two layers mixed up. First, Maslows pyramid is only one side of the story. Most of the features on his structure feed the Ego-self and because that self is merely a projection and continuation of previous knowledge, is mere illusion. If this is the case, the ego-self will constantly desire more and project on itself an over-inflated self-image which is required to have that 'more'. There is no top to that pyramid. Do the men who own private banks or earn a huge wage and have all their needs met suddenly become self-actualised and quit because everything is already perfect? No. Not ONE of them would do that, so self-actualisation on his pyramid is in fact a lie.

Second, half of the pyramid...or diamond, is missing. According to all religion, removal of the things in Maslows pyramid leads to self-REALisation. In other words, the removal of the Ego and self-illusion. Because desires are controlled, there is no chance One can be pulled in any direction.

Many people speak in a self-actualised manner, but this type of self-actualisation is nothing more than a schism.86.153.90.118 (talk) 20:46, 8 August 2016 (UTC)

Response: These are some interesting thoughts, but I think they are a little speculative / reflective, and I don't see that any changes to the article are needed. This could either be kept here as a reflection, or deleted to clear up space for discussion of actions that need to be taken to improve the article. Lauchlanmack (talk) 06:03, 29 November 2019 (UTC)

Early research into non-human primates

When mentioning Maslow's early research into non-human primates, should this article not mention Harry Harlow and Robert M. Yerkes, as Maslow did work with both of them? Vorbee (talk) 16:42, 27 August 2019 (UTC)

Image

I've created a cleaner version of the hierarchy pyramid but I'm not very familiar with the procedure to follow when replacing images. This is the image: Please consider replacing the current image with this version. Mrestko 09:35, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

hi, i have a made more space-saving (and imho more beautiful) graphic of the pyramid. http://me.phillipoertel.com/files/pyramid_of_website_needs.png feel free to use it if you like.

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External links

I have added one external link for Chimaera Consulting. I have used this site before for referencing purposes.--Pandaplodder 21:07, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Basic human Needs

Just clarify 27.63.199.77 (talk) 02:53, 8 December 2021 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Management

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 15 August 2023 and 5 December 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Acerda1 (article contribs). Peer reviewers: Cwdascher15, MBALead.

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