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Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of University of Illinois Presidents/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by Giants2008 via FACBot (talk) 00:26, 19 July 2021 (UTC) [1].[reply]

List of University of Illinois Presidents edit

List of University of Illinois Presidents (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

Toolbox
Nominator(s): Thrakkx (talk) 17:28, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I am nominating this for featured list because this list features all of the relevant information one would need to know about the office of the president of the University of Illinois System. Thrakkx (talk) 17:28, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Comments
  • I would integrate the "History" section into the lede.
    • Done
  • Much of the lede/history is unsourced.
    • I assume I was writing too many sentences between my sources, so I added references more frequently.
  • Add links to the image caption
    • Done
  • Why not just spell out the notes?
    • Changed
  • Another image would be nice.
    • Added another image. I could modify the table to resemble the image setup which appears on List of presidents of the United States, but not every president on this list has a picture available.
      • Depends on how many don't have pictures. If it's only a few, go ahead. But if you're missing half, it'll work as is. ~ HAL333 21:57, 1 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Link Illinois Industrial University.
    • Done
  • Add sortability to the table.
    • Done

More later. ~ HAL333 18:52, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Made changes according to your recommendations. Thrakkx (talk) 19:29, 28 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

  • Captions don't need periods.
    • Changed
  • Could you add scope to the name column?
    • Not sure what you mean here.
  • Link Stanley O. Ikenberry both times in the table.
    • Changed
  • Was White the only president to resign? Did any die in office?
    • Based off of the short bios of each, none died in office. White is the only president to have resigned from a scandal. The next closest to a scandal would be Stoddard's presidency, who was ousted with a no confidence vote.
  • Personal preference, but I think the images would look better if upright.
    • Changed

That's all. A short and simple list, but effective. ~ HAL333 21:57, 1 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

      • Changes made Thrakkx (talk) 15:00, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
        • Support Very sorry for my tardiness. ~ HAL333 22:31, 14 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved comments from ChrisTheDude (talk) 21:24, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
;Comments
  • The first two sentences would be better the opposite way round
    • Reworded
  • "The current president is Timothy Killeen since May 18, 2015." => "The current president is Timothy Killeen, who has held the position since May 18, 2015."
    • Changed
  • Don't need to wikilink JM Gregory in the first sentence of para 2 considering that you only just linked him in the penultimate sentence of para 1
    • Changed
  • "the original, Urbana-Champaign campus" - no need for that comma
    • Removed
  • "performs duties that are assigned by the president" => "perform duties that are assigned by the president" (the subject is the chancellors (plural))
    • Changed
  • Don't think the xlink to President's House in the infobox is appropriate
    • Removed
  • Image captions do not need to see "portait of"/"photo of"
    • Removed
  • Ref 9 does not make any mention of White's resignation, so that will need a separate ref
    • Added reference
  • Think that's it from me -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 16:52, 1 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Suggestion by the nominator:

The title of this article is not the greatest. "Presidents" should not be capitalized for one, and the wording is out of line with other articles about lists of presidents (usually it reads "List of presidents of ..."). The title should be switched to List of presidents of the University of Illinois or List of presidents of the University of Illinois system. I'm not sure I have the power to do that, and if I do, whether that would cause a problem, since it's in the middle of a nomination. Thrakkx (talk) 19:02, 1 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

You do have the power to do that, and no it won't cause any issues -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 19:45, 1 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I notice that the article has now been moved to List of presidents of the University of Illinois System, but the capitalisation is inconsistent with University of Illinois system....... -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 08:26, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Bizarrely, I noticed that our article on the system itself is at University of Illinois system (lower case S) but the first five words of the article are "The University of Illinois System...." (capital S). So is it correctly written with a capital or not.......? -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 12:05, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I noticed that too. That seems to be a mistake on Wikipedia's part. I checked some the system's own publications and they use a capital S. I assume we would go with the capital then. Thrakkx (talk) 14:48, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Source review – Pass edit

Will do soon. Aza24 (talk) 01:52, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

  • Non-source related, but I find the notes column to take up a lot of space for no real purpose. Most of the entries are blank after all. I wonder if the remaining notes can be converted to literal notes next to the appropriate name (perhaps with the use of the {{efn}} template) to avoid this.
    • Adopted
@Aza24: I made a lot of additions to the sources per User:The Rambling Man's comments. Would you mind taking a second look? Thrakkx (talk) 16:45, 25 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Don't know if I ever responded to this but yes it looks fine still. Aza24 (talk) 08:38, 6 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Formatting
  • multiple pages should be "pp." not "p."
    • Corrected
  • Your inclusion of locations is inconsitent
    • Corrected. Locations removed from sources
  • there is discontinuity with labeling the University of Illinois System as publisher vs website throughout.
    • Corrected. All listed as publisher.
Reliability
  • I have no doubts on reliabillity.
Verifiability
  • Spotchecks not done, will probably briefly do at some point. Aza24 (talk) 01:58, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Made recommended changes. Thrakkx (talk) 14:46, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

  • Pass for source review (unrelated query below) Aza24 (talk) 01:28, 5 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Timeline edit

  • Completely optional, but I thought I'd bring up the potential use of a timeline graph—which I think is rather neat (You can see one I made lower down on the Librarian of Congress page). If you're interested, it may be worth inclusion; you can either make it yourself or I'd be open to doing so, in case you're not sure how to go about it. Aza24 (talk) 01:28, 5 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Table accessibility review (MOS:DTAB): The table is missing column and rowscopes, as well as a caption and rowscopes.

  • Please add `|+ table caption` to the top of the table, or if it would duplicate a nearby section header you can visually hide the caption as `|+ {{sronly|table caption}}`
  • Each column header should be marked with `scope="col"`, e.g. `! colspan=2 | Presidency` should be `! colspan=2 scope="col" | Presidency`
  • For each row, the 'primary' cell should be marked with `scope="row"`, e.g. instead of `| 1` it should be `!scope="row"| 1`. If the way this changes the formatting of that column bothers you, you can add the `plainrowheaders` class to the top of the table at `{| class="wikitable"`
--PresN 14:36, 2 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
 Done; Question: what about the bottom row of the table that lists the source? Thrakkx (talk) 14:46, 2 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Whoops, missed that- yeah, even at the bottom column headers are contraindicated per Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Accessibility/Data tables tutorial#Avoiding column headers in the middle of the table. Consider moving the reference into the top header like your note is, or into the text. --PresN 14:58, 2 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
 Done Thrakkx (talk) 15:10, 2 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Comments

  • According to our own article on the subject, University of Illinois system, the "s" of system is not capitalised, so why is it capitalised throughout here? Some templates do capitalise the S, some don't, looks like the category does... bit of a mess which need to be sorted out.
 Comment: So this is puzzling to me. I believe capitalizing the "s" is correct here. "University of Illinois System" is a proper noun and it is the naming convention that the institution itself uses. The article title does have a lowercase "s," but every mention of the system in the article had an "S" until April 22 of this year. At some point in the article history, someone redirected capital System to lowercase system, citing WP:NCCAPS; yet in the very first sentence, it says capitalizing proper nouns is the correct convention. Thrakkx (talk) 17:14, 30 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "operation of the university" previous sentence had plural "universities".
 Fixed Thrakkx (talk) 17:14, 30 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "the appropriate senate" I don't really understand what that means.
 Fixed. "Appropriate senate" refers to each university senate. I changed the wording to "On recommendation of each university and..." Thrakkx (talk) 17:14, 30 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "John Milton Gregory served as the first president" and "elected John Milton Gregory as the first president" repetitive.
 Fixed to "elected John Milton Gregory as president." Thrakkx (talk) 17:14, 30 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • "David D. Henry" redlinked in the table but not the lead?
 Fixed Thrakkx (talk) 17:14, 30 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • The year ranges in the table appear to be using em-dashes, not en-dashes.
 Fixed Thrakkx (talk) 17:14, 30 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • There's not much here on each entry in the table, such as why did each president leave? What did they do during their tenure, if anything?
 Comment: I will use the source listed in the table to craft some tenure summaries later in a few days and see what you think. Thrakkx (talk) 17:14, 30 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@The Rambling Man: I made updates to the table. Would love your input. Thrakkx (talk) 16:33, 25 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • There's an unexplained gap between 1953 and 1954.
 Fixed. Typo. Thrakkx (talk) 17:14, 30 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • And 2009 and 2010.
 Comment: According to the sources, it seems that White stepped down at the end of December 2009 and Ikenberry picked up at the beginning of January 2010, so I believe this gap would be justified. Thrakkx (talk) 17:14, 30 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
 Fixed Thrakkx (talk) 17:14, 30 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Notes, be consistent with use of periods: sentence fragments normally don't take them, complete sentences do.
 Fixed Thrakkx (talk) 17:14, 30 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

That's it for now. The Rambling Man (Stay alert! Control the virus! Save lives!!!!) 12:47, 29 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Drive-by comments from Sdkb

  • There's redundancy in the lead from mentioning Gregory twice. {{u|Sdkb}} talk 07:19, 8 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
 Fixed; changed wording to "established the office of the president," so that Gregory is not named twice.
  • The president's salary would be a good piece of info to include; it should be available somewhere publicly. {{u|Sdkb}} talk 07:19, 8 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
plus Added
  • The notes column should not be sortable. {{u|Sdkb}} talk 07:19, 8 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
 Fixed
 Fixed. Thanks for the comments! Thrakkx (talk) 02:38, 14 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Comment from nominator: what's the holdup? edit

Every comment here has been addressed, the article has passed image/source/etc. reviews (in some cases twice), and (only) one reviewer expressed their support. Is there anything left to be done? This FLC is quite old at this point... Thrakkx (talk) 19:13, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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