Talk:List of convicts on the First Fleet

Untitled

I do not think that this article should be deleted. Other editors have put together a good list, even though it does badly need re-formatting. Please do not delete. There are other worse, poor, non notable and even hoax articles and comments that are still in existence on WP. Cgoodwin (talk) 04:39, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

Proposed restructure

Unless there are strong objections I'd like to reorder the list to be by vessel rather than alphabetically. My reasons are:

• Utility - there is no particular relevance to the alphabetical sequencing, and of itself it tells us nothing about the convicts of the Fleet. Listing by ship enables more interesting sorting - making it easier for example to see the youngest/oldest per vessel, the death rates on board etc.
• Readability - the list at present is overlong and not broken up with explanatory text. Lists by ship would allow sections giving a small amount of background info, taken from the various ship articles, which would add to the article and make it less spammy for readers.
• Linking - lists by ship would add utility to the various First Fleet ship articles, which could be linked to the sections of this page.
• (minor point) Copyright - an argument in the deletion discussion was that the list is largely a copyvio from the University of Wollongong site. This was evidently discounted at the time, but a refactoring of the page would ensure no similar claim can be raised. UOW might have some proprietorial right over the formatting, but certainly not the actual information.
• (minor point) Anti-vandalism - there's an occasional problem with people adding their or their friends' names to the list. Hard to spot or correct when the entire list is as anonymous as this presently is. Easier when it can be compared against the shorter and more logical ship lists.

Other views welcome, as always. I intend to lay the new list out in a sandbox and then move it across. So, no hurry as this process would take some time. Euryalus (talk) 12:08, 14 October 2013 (UTC)

Consistency

Addendum: We also need some consistency in the information, which presently varies from letter to letter. I suggest something like the following. in passing I've removed the "date of sentence" column because although the data exists, it's trivia.

Suggestion:

Name	Age	Trade	Crime	Sentence	Place of sentence	Post-voyage
Forbes, Ann	--	None	Stealing	Death (reprieved) 7 years	Kingston-upon-Thames	Common-law wife of George Bannister (convict, Charlotte) Two children, born 1789 and 1792 Sent to Norfolk Island, March 1790.
Clark, Elizabeth	20	None	Stealing	7 years	Derby	Died at Sydney Cove, September 1788

Views? Euryalus (talk) 13:36, 14 October 2013 (UTC)

Sounds reasonable. But I don't think you should remove the date of sentencing - I think it's a reasonably important aspect of any conviction. --99of9 (talk) 02:56, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

Intro

The introduction needs restructuring.

The First Fleet is the name given to the first group of eleven ships that carried convicts from England to Australia in 1788. Beginning in 1787 the ships departed with about 759 convicts (586 men, 192 women), provisions and agricultural implements.

The impression given here is that the convicts, with their provisions and agricultural equipment, simply departed.

The fact that there were sailors and marines on board these ships ought to take priority over the mention of provisions and equipment. Amandajm (talk) 06:53, 21 October 2013 (UTC)

External links modified

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Proposed editing

Should the "other information" section be shortened for convicts to only a brief summary? This page looks quite messy at the moment. For example, Ann Inett has over 500 words, Charles Peat has nearly 800, and Thomas Limpus has over 800 words in the "other information" section. Further, should some of these people with very long "other information" sections be converted into articles? EllsworthSchmittendorf (talk) 07:46, 2 May 2016 (UTC)

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Jobs Of First Fleet Convicts

First Fleet convicts would have definitely had jobs on the ships, the problem is websites do not show a list of jobs. This needs to be changed. If you agree please add a comment. Also, if you have found a website with a list of jobs, please leave the link down below. If you believe they didn't have jobs, please feel free to comment too. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.54.176.234 (talk) 05:07, 4 June 2019 (UTC)

Do you have a reference to support the statement that "First Fleet convicts would have definitely had jobs on the ships"? Mitch Ames (talk) 09:02, 4 June 2019 (UTC)