Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2009 September 14

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September 14

Marriage

How common is it for two people to get married for reasons other than romantic interest in each other? And more specifically, how common is it for couples who are close friends, rather than lovers, get married? What are some of the reasons that a couple might get married without a romantic interest in each other? For the purposes of these questions, ignore forced and/or arranged marriages. Ks0stm ^(T•C•G) 02:04, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

There are various reasons. There are sexless marriages, spiritual marriages, marriages of convenience, lavender marriages, mariages blancs, etc. None of these necessarily involve coercion, so they seem to meet your specifications. It would probably be difficult to come up with statistics, because many of these arrangements are deliberately deceptive. LANTZY^TALK 02:44, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Assume in all my questions that the type of love is platonic love, in the form of a very close friendship. Ks0stm ^(T•C•G) 03:02, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

The Asexual community report some marriages of platonic love. Prokhorovka (talk) 08:40, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

The actual question was "how common". To me that suggests a request for percentages or something. That might be pretty hard to track down. Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots 08:46, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Yes, pretty much I was asking how common sexless, platonic (and willing) marriages are compared to romantic ones...Ks0stm ^(T•C•G) 14:42, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

I would point out that as our article mentions arranged marriages are often quite different from forced marriages. While some arranged marriages may have a degree of coercion, many couples do enter arranged marriages relatively willingly, even if they may later regret their decision Nil Einne (talk) 11:56, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Arranged marriages seem to work out pretty well. Marrying for fire and passion is what tends to ultimately make a marriage fail, if and when that fire and passion go on the back burner. "Forced" marriages would be "'cause there's a baby on the way". But it would be pretty hard to come up with a good answer to "how common". It would require finding surveys that ask questions like that. Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots 13:26, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

I have seen the statistics showing arranged marriages working better than unarranged marriages, but I would interpret them with care - you need to take into account the acceptability of divorce in different cultures/legal systems. "Forced marriage" is usually used to refer to arranged marriages where one or other party is forced to go ahead with it. A marriage following an unplanned pregnancy is usually called a "shotgun marriage". --Tango (talk) 14:00, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

The rise in divorce rate in America is often cited as somehow being an indicator of "moral downturn" in the country. Alan King said it much better: In the old days, divorce was a luxury, that few could afford. There was also a social stigma. So staying together was not proof of "happiness". Nor is it proof of such in arranged marriages. But carefully arranged marriages theoretically have a better chance, by trying to match people who should be compatible, which they themselves are not necessarily the best judge of, especially if they are "in love". Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots 16:40, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

If you've ever seen Gone With the Wind, there's some cogent social commentary about marriage. Scarlett marries for various reasons, none of them very sound. In contrast, her father at one point says, "What does it matter who you marry, as long as he is a southerner, and thinks like us." That's the cultural aspect in a nutshell. Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots 16:42, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Marriage for status and/or/in-exchange-for wealth. Pretty much the standard for choosing a partner among the old nobility. --Pykk (talk) 16:28, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Rough approximation of text length

Let's suppose that I have a printed document, not an electronic one, and must make a quick and dirty approximation of how many words it contains. I assume that some sort of simple algorithms exist for this purpose, but what are they? LANTZY^TALK 02:33, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Use a word processor to determine the word count of a page from a similar electronic document? Pollinosisss (talk) 02:42, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

I don't understand what you mean by "similar electronic document". To be clearer, let's say I have an old yellowing paperback and want to determine how many words it contains. Also, let's say I don't have a computer. How can I reach an approximate figure using only pencil, paper, and perhaps a calculator? I'm curious about how people determined the word length of long documents in the time before electronic word processing. LANTZY^TALK 02:47, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

First estimate the number of words per line. To do this I would suggest counting words for several lines, and then dividing by the number of lines you counted. The more lines in your sample the better. Then count the lines per page on a typical page. Then look at the number of pages. Then multiply. Rckrone (talk) 02:52, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

For a more accurate estimate, flip through the document and correct for pages that are only partly full, i.e. those with illustrations, the last page, that sort of thing. Count them as the appropriate fraction of a page according to how full they are. Also, if the document has blocks of text that aren't formatted like the rest (long quotations written on shorter lines, long footnotes in small print, etc.), do a separate calculation for each kind of formatting. --Anonymous, 04:53 UTC, September 14, 2009.

This site may be worth looking at [1]Pollinosisss (talk) 03:27, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Yes, this is an interesting and helpful site. LANTZY^TALK 17:11, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

BLR ?

What does it means by “BLR plus X rate" and “BLR minus X" ? Arteyu ? _{Blame it on me !} 05:57, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

In what context? Disambiguation page BLR suggests "Base Lending Rate" as a possibility... AnonMoos (talk) 06:19, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Ya, BLR in this case refers to "Base Lending Rate" Arteyu ? _{Blame it on me !} 06:25, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

It is used for variable rate mortgages and loans. If you have, a loan at BLR+3% then when the BLR is 1% your rate will be 4%. --- Q Chris (talk) 11:29, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Over here we use "Best" lending rate, rather than "Base." DOR (HK) (talk) 04:12, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Photo of child Holocaust victim

There is an iconic photograph of a young boy, about 10 years old, arriving at one of the concentration camps during WWII. He is wearing a jacket with the yellow star on it , a cap and he has arms above his head as presumably someone is holding a gun on him. Does anyone know which one I mean? Has it ever been established who that little boy was and whatever happened to him? I know he was probably murdered, but just on the off chance that someone knows a little background. Thanks!196.37.99.82 (talk) 06:43, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

I think you're thinking about a famous picture not from a concentration camp, but from the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising. It's on that page. The image caption says the boy may have been Tsvi Nussbaum, who actually survived the Holocaust. --Pykk (talk) 09:41, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

(ec) If you mean this famous photo, the description page says that the boy has not been positively identified, though there are some suggestions as to who he may have been. It does not say what the fate of those persons was. —Kevin Myers 09:43, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Central Africain trade unions; C.G.A.T.

While googling for material for expanding Confédération générale des travailleurs africains, I came across Confédération générale aéfienne du travail and started and article on it. At least nine books at google books mention CGAT. But when googling for 'Confédération générale africaine du travail', I got much more results. Are these the same organizations? One could guess that CG africain T would be a later name adopted after independence. Another explanation would be that the former name would be an error, but 'aefienne' (of AEF) is such an unusual word, so it appears unlikely that a writer would have come up with the name him/herself. [2], page 92, mentions both CGTK and CGAT as separate orgs (with CGAT not having branch in Cameroon). Perhaps CG aefienne T was divided into CGTK and CG africaine T when AEF was dissolved? Any info would be appreciated. --Soman (talk) 07:39, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Biological rythmns in schooling

Didn't some Scandinavian country institute school hours that were compatible with the actual biological rhythms of teenagers ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Rachmaninov Khan (talk • contribs) 10:55, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

I remember reading some news stories about this idea a few months ago. Here's one: http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/2009/mar/08/teenagers-sleep-education-secondary-school but it doesn't mention Scandinavia. 81.131.42.38 (talk) 19:43, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

There was a proposal for a new North Auckland, New Zealand school to adopt such hours. See School bell delay to let students 'wake up'. I don't know what happened to the proposal.-gadfium 05:45, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Is there any evidence that "biorhythms" are anything more than quackery? Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots 10:36, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

I believe they're referring to Circadian rhythms, not to the rigid 23-28-33 day quasi-astrological cycles which are sometimes called biorhythms... AnonMoos (talk) 13:30, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Cognitive (dis)abilities and Down syndrome

If you had to test only the cognitive abilities of a person with Down syndrome, what would you find? Is there something specific of Down syndrome?--Mr.K. (talk) 11:18, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Hi Mr.K. I know you like to ask a lot of questions here, but a lot of them are already answered here in the encyclopedia. Please check that out first, otherwise you just look lazy or that you don't care about wasting our time. The answer to your question can be found at Down's_syndrome#Cognitive_development. --98.217.14.211 (talk) 11:44, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Do I like to ask a lot of questions here? Perhaps wikipedia pays me for this.

Anyway, is there anything really specific about Down syndrome? The article is not completely clear (excluding the part of speech, which I didn't think at when I thought about cognitive abilities...).--Mr.K. (talk) 12:03, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Take a look at [3] for a serious comparative study between mental retardation and Down syndrome. Quest09 (talk) 15:53, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

BA (HONS) BUSINESS FINANCE & BSC(HONS) BUSINESS FINANCE

What is the difference between BA(Hons) Business Finace and BSC(Hons) Business Finance. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Onugba (talk • contribs) 13:21, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Probably nothing. Different universities give different degree titles for the same subject (I have a BA in theoretical physics). If you are choosing between different universities focus on the quality and content of the course, not the title. DJ Clayworth (talk) 13:59, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Generally speaking, if it is offered by the same university, then a BA degree is more "liberal arts" with focus on breadth (i.e. more classes outside of the major) while a BS or BSc degree is more concentrated (with more classes in the major). However, there is no real way to draw a correlation between universities (i.e. comparing a BA offered at one school and a BS offered at another). Your best option is to consult with a career counselor or, better yet, at the people who do the hiring at a prospective employer. However, the three most important things you can do to get a job are a) NETWORKING! (its who you know!) b) getting ANY university degree and c) your grades; in roughly that order. --Jayron32 19:45, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Inheritance

I'm wondering roughly who gets what if someone dies without leaving a will, and who it is that decides these proportions. I guess I'm searching the wrong words; there's doubtless an article or web page which can tell me, somewhere... Vimescarrot (talk) 13:33, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Oh, I forgot to mention: Primarily focussing on Britain, though I'm interested in other places too. Vimescarrot (talk) 13:34, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

In America, at least, dying intestate triggers various laws to kick in, whose purpose is to specifically cover such cases. In the USA those laws vary state-by-state. As far as I know, the federal government does not get involved except in the area of taxation, when applicable. Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots 13:36, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

We have an article Intestacy. Algebraist 13:48, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Using the keyword "intestate" gives this breakdown of how the estate is shared out. I assume it's referring to England and Wales; Scottish mileage may vary. AlmostReadytoFly (talk) 13:51, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

There is a lower limit for estates, beneath which the taxman just isn't interested - when I was sorting out my late father's estate (he died intestate in 2004), as it was beneath the £15,000 threshold, I just had to sort it all out myself. --TammyMoet (talk) 17:55, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

The articles you are looking for are Intestacy and Bona vacantia. --Tagishsimon (talk) 19:20, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Cadmus-Harmony painting ID request

Anyone knows the painter and the title of the cover image of Roberto Calasso's The Marriage of Cadmus and Harmony?

→ image

Thanks --Scriberius (talk) 16:06, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

The lady's got a box. The guy's got a caduceus. So: "Pandora carried off by Mercury" by Jean Alaux. (picture) --Pykk (talk) 16:24, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Geez thanks, now uploaded towards Commons (year?) --Scriberius (talk) 23:37, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Historicity

Is there any consensus regarding who is the earliest non-mythical figure in recorded history? TheFutureAwaits (talk) 16:38, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

One plausible candidate is Enmebaragesi, the earliest king on the Sumerian king list to be archaeologically verified. Another candidate is Narmer, who predated Enmebaragesi by several centuries, but I'm not sure if Narmer is strictly historical. LANTZY^TALK 17:19, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Several poorly attested Egyptian kings predate even Narmer. Tiu and King Scorpion are not thought to be mythical. See List of Pharaohs. 75.41.110.200 (talk) 03:45, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Iran and North Korea

Are Iran and North Korea allies? --204.184.214.2 (talk) 17:00, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Normally our article Iran – North Korea relations would be the place to look. It's a very short article but describes the relationship as "positive", and there are some references to Web news stories that may provide more detailed information. They are apparently cooperating with regards to Iran's nuclear program. Comet Tuttle (talk) 17:22, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

They cooperate on certain technical things, and have some mutual interests, but otherwise they don't overlap a lot. Iran does not really see itself as a similar kind of regime as North Korea (and really, it isn't very similar, except that it is it a kerfuffle about nuclear things and is opposed specifically to the United States). --98.217.14.211 (talk) 20:00, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Their relationship can be summed up as the enemy of my enemy is my friend. Clarityfiend (talk) 03:19, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Which doesn't necessarily mean anything at all. The Soviet Union and China were not particularly good friends. China and Vietnam were not friends. Iraq and Al-Qaeda were not friends. The list goes on and on... Contrary to what some Americans seem to think, the mutual relationships of the nations of the world does not revolve entirely around their relationship with the USA. --Pykk (talk) 12:04, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Presumably Muslims, if any, don't have it good in North Korea, ditto Communists in Iran. I understand that Stalin was allied to Hitler, while Hitler was clamping down on German Communists, and Hitler tolerated Mussillini's clampdown on German being spoken in northern Italy.192.30.202.13 (talk) 16:48, 17 September 2009 (UTC)

Text lengths of notable documents

This is somewhat related to my previous question. Wikipedia articles about notable books frequently mention how long they are, but tend to specify the number of pages. Is there a website where I might learn the word count of specific noteworthy books? (Incidentally, my Google searches have been futile. Every return has been something along the lines of "Is your manuscript the right length?") LANTZY^TALK 17:35, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Amazon.com has statistics for some of their books (I don't know what percentage; I assume just the ones you can search in). For example, here's the page for one of my favorite books, The Making of the Atomic Bomb. It has 316,487 words, a 279 word per gram value! --Sean 18:13, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

According to google there are 4400 words in the US Constitution. Mac Davis (talk) 18:26, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Usama bin Laden new audio tape

The message, entitled "A statement to the American people", was approximately 10 minutes long and appeared on a website often used by supporters of al Qaeda.

I would like the newest audio tape released by Usama bin Laden. I can't find it anywhere. They have played it on the news so it must not be classified, and I am sure supporters of al Qaeda have interest in many people hearing it. What website is this, and how can I get the audio? Thank you! Mac Davis (talk) 18:08, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

I'd love to try to find the answer to your question but am afraid that finding and navigating to that website would put me on a terrorist watchlist. Not wishing to be surveilled, I don't want to go there. 192.251.134.5 (talk) 18:53, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Riiiight. You really think the government has the time to do blind surveillance on everyone who searches for "osama bin laden statement"? If it already has that capacity, then you are already probably being surveilled. If it doesn't or isn't, then you probably won't be no matter what you search for. --98.217.14.211 (talk) 20:04, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

You are living pretty far behind the times if you think that "having the time" is a constraint on surveillance anymore. Surveillance is no longer performed by human police officers reading text or listening to your phone conversations. It is all automatically sniffed and archived by government products like Carnivore and Project Echelon. Visiting certain sites and saying certain things on certain phone calls surely will get you added to various lists — not necessarily any list that is ever read by a human, but it's entirely believable that the automated surveillance on you will be stepped up. Comet Tuttle (talk) 20:47, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

I'm well aware of such mass programs, but I've yet to see them actually be able to successfully pick individuals out of the mire and make trouble for them. Again, we're either all probably already being watched, or we're probably not being watched. I say this as someone who searches for "scary" topics regularly and has yet to have difficulty flying, for example. --98.217.14.211 (talk) 14:06, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

You can find lots of clips on YouTube, e.g. here. --98.217.14.211 (talk) 20:08, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

A brand new tape? Not bad for a guy who's supposedly dead, if you believe the conspiracy theorists. Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots 20:37, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Does anyone ever compile the texts of these speeches anywhere? (Preferrably in Arabic and in English?) Adam Bishop (talk) 01:52, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Here are his 1996 and 1998 fatwas. Interesting to read.[4][5]. Many Qur'an quotes. His grievances in just about everything he publishes involve one of four things: The U.S. had been supporting apostate dictatorships in the Muslim world, given one-sided support to Israel, occupied holy land such as the Arabian Peninsula, and enforced brutal sanctions on the Iraqi people that had left hundreds of thousands of Muslims, mostly children, dead. Apparently the newest tapes lacks Qur'an quotes so much and he talks mostly about Isreal. He drops a lot of lines from American culture, like The Obama Deception, "neoconservatives," and things. Thanks for the video link, mysterious IP. Mac Davis (talk) 12:42, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

As for who compiles them, apparently IntelCenter (the source of this tape to the media) makes their money this way. --98.217.14.211 (talk) 14:06, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

It's being discussed here. It was the first hit on Google search for the title of the video. --KageTora - (영호 (影虎)) (talk) 17:15, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

For a kick, I once searched "car bomb the Whitehouse" on Google and got one innocuous hit, and no cops visiting me. :-)192.30.202.13 (talk) 16:52, 17 September 2009 (UTC)

London theatre tickets - where is a safe place to buy on the day?

I'm going to London at the weekend. I'd like to go to the theatre and I'm very open to seeing anything (bar Andrew Lloyd Webber). While I can browse online between now and then, I can't buy (as the people I'm going with are out of contact until Friday, and are fickle types at that). Where (physically) can I go in London to buy tickets, other than the individual theatre box offices (where, that is, that's safe - that won't sell me fakes)? I seem to remember there being a big booth thing in Leicester Square - the article for the square suggests that it's the one operated by TKTS (and says there are other, perhaps dodgy, ones too). Is that one reliable, and if so is it the one which has tkts.co.uk as its website? Where else might I go? I'm quite willing to leave content to providence, but I don't want to get duped into buying tickets for Ofello with Benny Henri in the back room of some pub. 87.113.10.108 (talk) 21:32, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

I cannot vouch for it, but the Leicester Square booth does look the real deal to me. Some more info here, from a website run by the Society Of London Theatre, which, again, looks like the real deal. --Tagishsimon (talk) 21:44, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Most hotels have a theatre desk, and I have never had a problem with the tickets. There is a service charge; it wasn't much as I recall. The desks also have all the posters and brochures and a calendar of everything that is showing, and you can usually take your time in deciding. The ones I have used also have seating plans. I don't think you have to be staying at the hotel to use the service, but I am not sure of this. // BL \\ (talk) 23:56, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Yeah the white pagoda-looking building in Leicester Square is 100% legit and the only one you should use. Don't go and see Blood Brothers, it's rubbish.--Richardrj ^{talk email} 07:32, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Absolutely go to the Leicester Square ticket booth. You'll get tickets for every show except the ones that are totally sold out. It's safe, legit, and cheap. If you ask a hotel desk they will probably go to Leicester Square, buy the tickets, and charge you a markup for doing it. The only exception is if you absolutely have to see the current sold-out smash hit. DJ Clayworth (talk) 13:42, 15 September 2009 (UTC)