Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Entertainment/2023 January 20
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January 20
edit1941 Warner Bros. Studio Café menu items
editHi! I recently came across this image scan of the menu from the WB Studios commissary dating back to 1941, and I can't make heads or tails about what some of the "Fancy Special" items (located towards the bottom of the center column of the menu) actually entail. I've tried looking into what the "Vitaphone", "Warner Bros. Theatre", and "First National" specials are, but the fact that they seem to share names with various brand names associated with WB have made research here difficult. I strongly doubt these menu items are really what they say on the tin either, as a Vitaphone sound system for 30 cents sounds like quite the steal, even adjusted for inflation. Any insight would be highly appreciated! ~Helicopter Llama~ 18:19, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- So, my guess is that they were either desserts or cocktails, based on the layout of the menus. Given that "Banana Split" and "Chocolate Bonbon" are also listed in the same section (both types of dessert or confection) that would allow us to deduce that the other three items were also similar. Or, they were cocktails of some kind; you'll notice that everything above and below the "Fancy Special" Section are drinks of some kind, whether beers, juices, sodas, whatnot. A decent cocktail is likely twice the price of a PBR or a Miller High Life (the champagne of bottled beers!), so the price structure checks out, AND since they also have a dessert section already, it seems quite possible they had hard-liquor based drinks listed under "Fancy Specials". Though there were laxer attitudes towards "day drinking" back in the 1940s than there are today, it was likely still treated with a bit of a nudge and a wink. I suspect that the use of the specific names was something of a code at the time (like maybe a Manhattan was a "Vitaphone" and a Martini was a "First National") but I can't find anything to corroborate. Just mostly WAGs right now. --Jayron32 18:44, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- And now I'm invested. Been hitting the Google Fu hard. To throw it back into the "desserts" column, Here is a 1930's era menu from the Fox Gold Room, if you page over to Page 2, you'll see "Fancy Specials" listed there; they are ALL complicated Ice Cream Sundaes; which would fit with the "Banana Split" option. Now I'm leaning more in that direction. --Jayron32 18:56, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- Yup. I'm sure of it. They're all names of ice cream sundaes. University Creamery, San Jose, 1930s menu Page 4 uses the terminology "Fancy Specials" for the same. Lenhardt's, Oakland 1920 menu page 2, does as well. --Jayron32 19:03, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- By the way, if you want to go down a really weird rabbit hole, the Vintage Menu Art website is really interesting. --Jayron32 19:08, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- The strangest menu item that I noticed was the "chop suey ice cream sundae". Here's the scoop. Cullen328 (talk) 23:29, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- By the way, if you want to go down a really weird rabbit hole, the Vintage Menu Art website is really interesting. --Jayron32 19:08, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- Yup. I'm sure of it. They're all names of ice cream sundaes. University Creamery, San Jose, 1930s menu Page 4 uses the terminology "Fancy Specials" for the same. Lenhardt's, Oakland 1920 menu page 2, does as well. --Jayron32 19:03, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- And now I'm invested. Been hitting the Google Fu hard. To throw it back into the "desserts" column, Here is a 1930's era menu from the Fox Gold Room, if you page over to Page 2, you'll see "Fancy Specials" listed there; they are ALL complicated Ice Cream Sundaes; which would fit with the "Banana Split" option. Now I'm leaning more in that direction. --Jayron32 18:56, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
- What's a "glass of half and half"? In Britain "half and half" would be half bitter, half mild. DuncanHill (talk) 00:06, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
- DuncanHill, half milk and half cream in the US. These days, it is mostly used in coffee. Cullen328 (talk) 00:12, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
- Ah, what an odd thing, thanks. DuncanHill (talk) 01:23, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
- Wiktionary gives two US senses of half and half, the second being a mixture of half lemonade and half iced tea. Also an odd thing (if you ask me), but less odd (to me) as a drink than a glass of half milk and half cream. --Lambiam 16:41, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
- I don't think half-and-half milk-and-cream is typically drunk from a glass; it's usually mixed in with something, such as coffee. If you ask for half-and-half in an American grocery store, they'll send you to the dairy department. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 18:37, 22 January 2023 (UTC)
- While we're on the subject, how can "non-fat half-and-half" exist? But it does. --jpgordon𝄢𝄆𝄐𝄇 22:40, 22 January 2023 (UTC)
- Googling "how can half and half be fat free" reveals that they replace the milk fat with corn syrup and thickeners. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 00:07, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- Right. So it's not "half and half" as in "half milk half cream", it's "milk + non-dairy creamer", I guess. --jpgordon𝄢𝄆𝄐𝄇 01:11, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- It's still marketed as "fat free half and half". The specific ingredients should be on the carton. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:26, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- Regarding the "Iced Tea + Lemonade" thing, though it wouldn't have been known by the name at the time, the modern name for it is an Arnold Palmer. --Jayron32 12:42, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- It's still marketed as "fat free half and half". The specific ingredients should be on the carton. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:26, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- Right. So it's not "half and half" as in "half milk half cream", it's "milk + non-dairy creamer", I guess. --jpgordon𝄢𝄆𝄐𝄇 01:11, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- Googling "how can half and half be fat free" reveals that they replace the milk fat with corn syrup and thickeners. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 00:07, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- While we're on the subject, how can "non-fat half-and-half" exist? But it does. --jpgordon𝄢𝄆𝄐𝄇 22:40, 22 January 2023 (UTC)
- I don't think half-and-half milk-and-cream is typically drunk from a glass; it's usually mixed in with something, such as coffee. If you ask for half-and-half in an American grocery store, they'll send you to the dairy department. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 18:37, 22 January 2023 (UTC)
- DuncanHill, half milk and half cream in the US. These days, it is mostly used in coffee. Cullen328 (talk) 00:12, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
Up in the specials at top center, "allumette potatoes" is interesting. That's French for "match", and my guess is that it means what I would call "shoestring French fries". Ah, and Wikipedia more or less confirms this.
Also in that section, liberty cabbage means sauerkraut. It's interesting that they were avoiding the German name at a time when the US was not at war with Germany, but Wikipedia says that name goes back to the previous war. --142.112.220.65 (talk) 03:49, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
- "Pommes de terre allumettes" is still a common menu term in France. Basically French fries, but with the potatoes cut thinner than usual. Xuxl (talk) 14:59, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
- See also these images of pommes allumettes. --Lambiam 16:30, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
- Yep, shoestring French fries, or close enough. (Not that you can really tell the size from that image, but those are the ones I have at home.) Thanks. --142.112.220.65 (talk) 09:15, 22 January 2023 (UTC)
- It also has "French fried", "American fried", and "Cottage fried" potatoes. Anyone know the difference? DuncanHill (talk) 17:02, 22 January 2023 (UTC)
- I'm not sure there are hard-and-fast rules, but typically French fries are slender (called "chips" by Brits), while cottage fries are slices and are typically round (hence more like what we Yanks would call "chips"). American fries are also called Home fries and are often chunks or diced potatoes. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 18:33, 22 January 2023 (UTC)
- These are cottage fries: [1] Basically, made like french fries, but sliced perpendicular to the long axis of the potato, making discs. --Jayron32 12:45, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
- I'm not sure there are hard-and-fast rules, but typically French fries are slender (called "chips" by Brits), while cottage fries are slices and are typically round (hence more like what we Yanks would call "chips"). American fries are also called Home fries and are often chunks or diced potatoes. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 18:33, 22 January 2023 (UTC)
- "Not at war" in 1941, but certainly on a war footing, and Americans in general by that point were not feeling very friendly towards Nazi Germany. --jpgordon𝄢𝄆𝄐𝄇 22:42, 22 January 2023 (UTC)
- They had re-established the draft, in 1940 I think, but there was still plenty of opposition by the "America first" types. When the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor and Hitler declared war on us, it was pretty well over for the America-firsters, though some of them clung to the conspiracy theory that FDR had pre-knowledge of the attack and "let it happen". ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 00:10, 23 January 2023 (UTC)
