Prevalis

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Sokole

..could you PLEASE bring your word, User:Imbris is spreading false info about Montenegrin flags across the Wikipedia. Your good friend User:PaxEquilibrium has done a lot of work and research of Montenegrin flags (List of flags of Montenegro) and this dude just keeps attacking him and damaging his work.

I mean about Image talk:Princely Standard of Danilo I of Montenegro.png. I mean he actualy thinks this EXISTED!

Danilo_I,_Prince_of_Montenegro

Sada Danilo očito ima DVA alaj-barjaka, a ovaj drugi ni nema bijelu boju, već neku žutu koju je izmislio!

Since you too are a Montenegrin, I sea no other way than to convince him with words that hes wrong. Thx PPNjegos (talk) 08:46, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

Uncivil behaviour reaches both ends

Also such behaviour came from unsourced material. I honestly want to work out the difference of oppinions and sources with Pax but it is very difficult because constant threats and attempts to shut me up. I will not comply to such methods. Have you seen the latest addition in the form of commons:Image:NemanjicCrnojevic.svg (this image has roots on this Wiki made by Pax). I have tried to label it for deletion but dropped the issue because I do not want any more bad blood with that user. Have you heard that he claims without any source that there has not been - not ever - in the history of Montenegro the golden/yellow double headed eagle. Have you looked at his attempts to brand the symbols of Montenegro as a one party symbols by constant claims that one of the parties in Montenegro invented current symbols. If you want to answer be aware that he thinks you as a pro-independist supporter and that I watch RT CG almost everyday through sattelite, especially Dnevnik and TV Kalendar. -- Imbris (talk) 21:41, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

No I didn't, one party proposed it and that is clear fact - Prevalis here will be able to confirm that. Also, I'm looking forward to hear Prevalis' reply on the other (historical) matters. :) --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 22:09, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

Pax, please, calm down. I am not aware that a party proposed it or anything but I do know that the Montenegrin Falcon is based on the old Royal Coat of Arms. If you honestly want to know my reply to other (historical) matters, I'm chalk full of 'em, so ask away, mate. --Prevalis (talk) 22:14, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

I can never get angry at you, except for silence. ;) I am writing to SDP in precise to acquire me full detail of the designer (names & everything) so that we can actually add this into the article.

Well here then:

1. Was the bicephalic eagle on the alaj-barjak silver (claimed by me and everyone else) or golden (claimed by Imbris)?

2. Did Danilo have two different alaj-barjaks, one of them having a violet background instead of red (and the other a yellow eagle instead of white)?

P.S. A better pic/commercial for Medo is really needed. This way, Milic, Mandic and Vujanovic seems "superior" to him. --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 14:22, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

I have once in my not so long contribution to this W. argued with Panonian which is a league of his own, no one has been so rude to me, but I handled it and find the strength to continue.

If you have the time to tell me one more fact. The football representation of Montenegro. Is the goal-keeper dressed in pink or what. I think that this has to do with my current issue of the Prince Danilo Flag. -- Imbris (talk) 22:04, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

I have watched a couple of times, just as an antropological experiment and seen such dress of a goalkeeper. I am not a devoted football fan so I need help on this. As for the question of Prince Danilo Flag apparently he had a Royal Princely Standard and a War flag all documented on the image talk of that file as citted by PPNjegos. -- Imbris (talk) 22:23, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

Interesting debate led by Pax and me

Talk:Flag of Montenegro#POV by PaxEquilibrium and below that one there is initiated by me a title POV by Imbris also. I the title POV by PaxEquillibrium i have quoted to Pax sentences from the Constitution of the Republic of Montenegro and the Constitution of Montenegro which he doesn't accept.

In this debate I used also http://www.kontra-punkt.info/print.php?sid=193 as a source which denies that the symbols of Montenegro were mada by one party only.

Imbris (talk) 22:30, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

Yes, SDP CG proposal. "Only one factor" can do that - no? You know this Prevalis, right? --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 14:17, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Why didn't you say anythin'

...then? :)

BTW the fact that something's mythic, doesn't render it irrelevant, does it? I didn't fabricize, but Montenegrin tradition - regardless if it's true or not. Also it's more of a representer of a seal, than a flag. --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 14:16, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

This mythical stuff you are talking about is unencyclopaedical. It has not been proven that it is traditional belief but instead just that Jovan B. Markuš used it as a propagandist tool. His contributions are very dubious to me because the Angelino Dulcert map doesnt show the flag-pole nor even a vague outline of a flag. I will investigate the credibility of Solovjev's citation of a drawing made by a yet another person (that being sr:Aleksandar Palavestra. I suggest if you agree that a mere symbol (emblem) would be used under the CoA section but not in the flag section because it was not a flag. But I will leave it be if you leave certain things be. -- Imbris (talk) 19:40, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

The origin of Greeks is practically all mythic and yet it belongs. As long as it's posed as such, we should keep it. That is not something Markus fabricated - go to the Cetinje Monastery and see it hang there yourself. I have. ;) Also note that Markus explicitly says that there is no greater direct support of the flag and himself expresses pure reluctance of it, so I don't understand why could you consider it propaganda - although he probable does it because he himself doesn't really like it. It was used during the age of the Petrovic-Njegos, and Prince Nicholas claims (in his own words) that he used "Dusan's sacred banner" for the Montenegrin alaj-barjak, that is the war flag. HRH Nicholas also writes in full belief of the story that Dusan's banner was brought to Montenegro and kept for centuries "high and mighty".

But I still don't understand your double treatment of sources. Your very own source, which you said is ..reliable source for most of the community.., claims that. You seem to put them forward when they back up your claims, but completely disregard them when they don't (e.g. a "golden" bicephallic eagle). I'm talking about FotW. --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 21:18, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Here are the words of Nešo Stanić, the Secretary and Scribe of Podgorica:

“ But also that famous cradle, in which the most famous Nemanyiden was born came to be conquered by the Turks. And the beautiful Zeta, the nest of Serbianese greats became a pathetic foster sons of the arrogant conqueror Asian, and in the beautiful and plain Zeta, in the place "Šeher Podgorici", in the place of the double-headed Dusan's Eagle a crescent moon flew up, under his weight the tears of the Serb flew, and of the proud nobility a sad peasantry was created.. ” — Monuments of the Shadows of the Podgorica Serbs, Nešo Stanić, 1912

This is the brochure of Pero Šoć, a Green and armed resister of Yugoslav unity, fighter for secession and independence of Montenegro

“ ..The Brake of Serbia and Montenegro, was the greatest impact, which our people has ever endured in its history. For the first days of January of the year of 1916, there was not a parchment of free Serb land. Serb rulers old King Nicholas and old King Peter with his successor Alexander found themselves without a land, without a people, with the remains of the army - on foreign grounds. Without the common warfare of Montenegrins and Serbians, Dusan's eagle would not have returned with both wings to the Imperial Gates.. ” — Pero Šoć, Montenegro and the breach of the Thessalonican front, 1929

And this is from the speech of King Nicholas himself:

“ ...for they, the knights glory to them, sacrificed just like you, their lives for the appeal of our banner; the very same banner which was always since five hundred years ago high and which first flew when from Gradina and the Fundina sides the Montenegrin cannon gave a sign to all Balkan to rise up in unison. ” — Giving Medals to Montenegrin heroes after the Balkan Wars, Nikola I Petrovic, 1913

Montenegrin historian Marko Dragović:

“ Cetinje, the silent hill like a quite night, but glorious as the glory of the Montenegrin heroism, famously served Montenegro, for four centuries by now; the famed eagle of Dusan the Great flew out from the little field Cetinjian below The Eagle's Karst, and led along the Montenegrins into battle, so that it dawns for the Montenegrins, so that the strong sun sweeps to the People Serbian, subdued, defeated by Barbarian force.

The Turkish force is approaching to these sides and here came to reign the beautiful Serb Zeta, the cradle of the famous Nemanyden.

Leading the parade were red standards. On one was depicted the Holy Archangel Michael - patron of the glorious dome of the Nemanyiden, and on the other Saint Nicholas, patron of of the Crnojevics dome. The third banner carrier carried a national flag on which was depicted a white double-headed eagle - the Coat of Arms of the Serbian state.

” — The Migration of Ivan Crnojevic to Cetinje, Marko Dragovic

There are plenty more other, these are just some few. --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 22:39, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Local elections

Hey, why not make Montenegrin local elections, 2008 - for Tivat and Herceg-Novi. --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 22:40, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

Possibly unfree Image:Aco_Pejović.jpg

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Montenegrin Party

You'll probably be interested in this. --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 19:03, 5 April 2008 (UTC)

Golubovci & Tuzi

Prevalis, could you rework the administrative map of Montenegro so that the two are also visible (within the Podogorica municipality)? --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 02:37, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

Jovan Plamenac

Saved you the trouble. ;) --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 01:04, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

Thnks!

Thank you very much, but how did you know that I celebrate Saint George's Day? :) --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 11:20, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

A book for you

By then's greatest Montenegrin scholars, "History of Montenegro, Second Book, II Part". Titograd (modern Podgorica), 1970.

http://www.istorijabalkana.com/TEKSTOVI/Istorija%20CG.pdf

It follows the reigns of Balsics and Crnojevics in incredibly amazingly great detail.

Enjoy. :) --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 20:03, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

Did you see it? --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 17:24, 18 May 2008 (UTC)

Djuradj II

Hi! Could you also put the remainder of his name in Albanian? And also IPA? Thanks!

All remaining is to find an image of Djuradj's coins and of the ruins of Ulcinj (a map of his domain would be wonderful, but I do not think we'll be able to find / make it). Every article must have at least one image... --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 11:05, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

Sanjao sam san...

I created a stub at Sanjao sam san..., please go ahead and expand it into a real article. Thanks! ~ BigrTex 22:49, 14 August 2008 (UTC)

Sveta Gera

You've renamed it according to your own beliefs or...??? Per valid documents (cadastre map from 1861, cadastre parcelization in 1969, decision of Badinter commission in 1991) it is Croatia [1]. Slovenia disputes it but there are no valid dociments yet to support their dispution. Since an act of renaming was your action probably you could give some explanation at least? Zenanarh (talk) 11:57, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

You are well aware that users from the Croatian Wikipedia have always supported the creation of a Montenegrin Wikipedia. Nevertheless of the peak belonging to either side you should have read the discussion and sources before renaming. RfC has been answered by one (outside) editor only and you are not an outside editor, as none of the former Yugoslavia is not an outside editor. I expect you to reconsider your position on the issue since this would lead to a precedent to double naming most of Slovene exonyms.

Also the question is not whether the peak is in Croatia or Slovenia, the question is what is more common name in the English language. There is no way that a Slovene name could have more pertinence in the English Language since that Slovene name is from a time when German influences ceased. -- Imbris (talk) 18:13, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

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Croato-Serbian language

This Wikipedia is written in English, so there is no need to know any other. Also this is an example of my ability to write in that extinct language. Why are you excepting Avala's position as valid. -- Imbris (talk) 22:55, 9 October 2008 (UTC)

category:Albanian Muslims

Hi there,

I noticed you are quick adding "Albanian Muslims" to certain categories. One of these which caught my eye was adding it to Ibrahim Rugova. Albanian in category usage is refering to citiziens of Albania, while Rugova is a Kosovar Albanian leader. A more appropriate category for these people would be "Kosovar Muslims", since Kosovo is an separate entity from the Republic of Albania. Please consider fixing this. Thanks--Thomas.macmillan (talk) 03:26, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

??

I didn't get your text. You are against putting Montenegrin language or not? Also, don't are is it on paper or not I won't allow to edit Montenegrin articles in Serbian, even though they don't stand on that anthem. If they don't, then they should f*** off from our language, history and country.

Rave92 (talk) 22:05, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

Yes, but I won't stop. Tvrdoglav sam :). And ban is expected when Wikipedia is run by Serbs (they even didn't allowed Wikipedia on our language). Rave92 (talk) 09:34, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

I don't think Serbs are bad or anything. And to think of it, don't care much as long they leave our Montenegrin articles on Wikipedia. They can have their Serbian language on Serbian articles and even Bosnian. Rave92 (talk) 09:53, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

Hi

I thought i'd move this off the Bosniaks talk page, coz it no longer has to do with Bosniaks.

I'm happy that you feel more free to declare and celebrate your heritage. I was born in Macedonia in the 80s, and ony lived there till I was 5. From my family's experience, life in Yugoslavia was great. But I suppose everyone has different experiences. Becuase my family were doctors, etc I suppose we lived a good life. So where does your loyalties lie ? Is Mecca your sacred land ? Hxseek (talk) 23:46, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

No, not at all. A serious question . Isn;t the teaching of Islam state that religious loyalties override nationalistic ones ? That's what I meant . I just want to understandHxseek (talk) 00:02, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

I was christianed as Orthodox, yes, went to a catholic, then anglican, highschool. But I am not really practising, if you know what I mean. Hxseek (talk) 00:33, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

I was just asking because obviously religion causes conflict. I think that's partly why Yugoslavia disintegrated. Too much religious tension. Each with different 'alliances'. I certainly have nothing against muslims, don;t get me wrong. But its alarming when i read the Izetbegovic, for example, is such an ardent follower of Islam, put that above (what was) his country. Tudjman has ustashe roots. Milosevic was a Serb nationalist, who saw himself as a "Crusader" . When the leaders are such fanatics, then this doesn;t set a good example for the people.

I just wanted your opinion, because I grew up in AUstralia and all my friends are Anglos. Haven;t been exposed much to what other people from former Yugoslavia think personally.

Look at Italians. They are more different than Serbs, Croats, Bosniaks are to each other. However, they are all Catholic. Tha'ts why they feel they are all "Italian". Hxseek (talk) 00:48, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

Exactly. Let's hope people get a bit smarter. We're all the same blood, going back to the Illyrians. A lot of conflict is started by outside powers, i think. Eg America. I don't think it really gives a shit about the Kosovar people. If the same pattern continues, every little town is going to be its own country . LOL Hxseek (talk) 01:12, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

Yes. "Dinarics". Anyway, keep well friend. Hxseek (talk) 01:39, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

Bosnian maps

For all users interested in discussion about Bosnian maps you can enter discussion on User:Rjecina/Bosnian census.

About Podgorica Assembly my advice is to look history of article and long dispute between me and Pax. My thinking is that because of this article he has created puppets. All in all if we look 95 % of articles about ex Yugoslavia Pax is OK....--Rjecina (talk) 06:17, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Re

Helo, Prevalis. Thank you for your kind words, they are most appreciated.

I have to catch yet another trip, so I'll be away again for some time, but I'd like to ask you: what do you think about creating an article on Prince Nikola Radonjić, the uncrowned Vasojević ruler of the Highlands & northern Albania? I think he deserves an article, but not sure whether the Holmia should have its own article (as per WP:N), or to keep it as a component part of Nicholas' article (which wouldn't big a very large one, anyways). What is your opinion on this?

Also, I could e-mail to you that book. I just noticed it's a dead link. --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 08:26, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Prevalis, technically speaking, not even Nikola's article belongs to the Wikipedia, as most things Montenegrin (try googling Prince Nicholas Thernoyevich from the Radonjic family - 0 results!!!). :D But no, I do not think Holmia should be kept as a separate article - unless you possess some new source on this perhaps? I do not, and thus I think it should be in Nikola's article.

You haven't set up the e-mail option in the Wikipedia preferences, Prevalis.

Nikola Vasojević is OK, but that is just because he is notable under that name to sources & popular thought - we should make distinction that his real name is Nikola Radonjić. --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 16:32, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Back from the trip again.

Prevalis, how could I e-mail you things without knowing the destination e-mail? ;-) --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 09:47, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

Really wonderful (it was more of a vacation, rather than a business trip, lol).

Well, that's the problem - I don't have much either. The source you're referring to is probably the Leksikon - right? Yeah, I've got it too. I'm still searching some further details on Nikola Vasojevic, but the good thing is that I have acquired his personal words (some letters, descriptions, etc)... :) You should just start the article. We shall work on from then, in due time.

Will do so. --PaxEquilibrium (talk) 07:49, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

Considering

Thanks for your interest in the article on Serbian Christmas traditions and the well meaning edits :) I understand your reason that readers who understand Serbian but are not familiar with Cyrillic may be frustrated if they want to read the original lyrics. However, an average reader who is not familiar with the fact that Serbian uses two alphabets may find those three columns of text confusing. That would require an additional linguistic explanation, which would be superfluous in this article. Also, longer verses can't stay in one row on a smaller monitor, which makes the text visually awkward. In terms of quoting the original text, all the lyrics are written in Cyrillic in the sources from which they are taken, except for the first song. I propose that we write this song in Latin, and the rest in Cyrillic, as they are in the sources. As for the people who can read only Latin alphabet, we will hopefully write an article on this subject on Serbian wikipedia, where they can read it in both alphabets. You agree? VVVladimir (talk) 17:00, 18 December 2008 (UTC)

Montenegrin Wikipedia

Hi, perhaps you can request the creation of the montenegrin wikipedia now because it was declined earlier as being the same as serbian but I heard some more letters were added to the alphabet, see Montenegrin language and http://www.montenegro.org/language.html , but I suppose you know better as a montengrin
P.S. do you know why the "Crnogorska Enciklopedija" is not working? -- CD 19:56, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

Welcome

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Dobrodošlica

Ma ja to više da ne bude prazna strana!! pozzTadija (talk) 21:37, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

Invite to work on the SFK09

Hello We are working on creating a workgroup for wikimedia kosovo http://sfk2009.ning.com/group/wikimediakosova and have an event on august 29/30 in Prishtina. We would like to invite you to come. http://www.kosovasoftwarefreedom.org/index.php/sfk09/call-for-papers.html

Thanks,

mike Mdupont (talk) 11:22, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

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Proposed deletion of Crnogorska Enciklopedija

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Unreferenced BLPs

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Albania TF

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Possibly unfree File:Budva - Hotel Slavija 1979.gif

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Possibly unfree File:Isoseist Map - April 15 1979.gif

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File permission problem with File:MAA BG.jpg

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File permission problem with File:Capitanich.jpg

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File permission problem with File:NHBG.jpg

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Orphaned non-free media (File:Usne boje vina.jpg)

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May 2013

Hello, I'm BracketBot. I have automatically detected that your edit to Sadri Gjoni may have broken the syntax by modifying 1 "[]"s. If you have, don't worry, just edit the page again to fix it. If I misunderstood what happened, or if you have any questions, you can leave a message on my operator's talk page.

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Sadri Gjonbalaj

I supported your correction to Sadri Gjonbalaj, evidently wrong title, and tagged Talk page so Wikipedia:WikiProject Montenegro/Article alerts and football alerts will pick it up. In ictu oculi (talk) 09:33, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for June 6

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Disambiguation link notification for July 1

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Minority rights violations in Kosovo

A while ago, in Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Persecution of Serbs and other non-Albanians in Kosovo, you said the subject had potential. Would you be interested in working on it in a less contentious scope? I noticed we don't have a human rights in Kosovo article yet, and a lot of that content sounds like it might fit there. --Joy [shallot] (talk) 10:54, 4 September 2013 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Srećko Savović

The article Srećko Savović has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

Singer who has been tagged for notability for years with basically a discography and hard time finding reliable refs

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ArbCom elections are now open!

Hi,
You appear to be eligible to vote in the current Arbitration Committee election. The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia arbitration process. It has the authority to enact binding solutions for disputes between editors, primarily related to serious behavioural issues that the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the ability to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail. If you wish to participate, you are welcome to review the candidates' statements and submit your choices on the voting page. For the Election committee, MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 17:32, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

File permission problem with File:MNE Future Plates.jpg

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Tribes of Old Montenegro et al. move discussion

You have previously participated in dicussions about the title of the article now called Tribes of Old Montenegro, Brda, Old Herzegovina and Primorje. There is currently a formal move request discussion of the issue here if you are interested in participating. —  AjaxSmack  21:32, 31 May 2016 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Government of Kosovo

Template:Government of Kosovo has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Frietjes (talk) 14:04, 2 December 2016 (UTC)

MfD nomination of Portal:Kosovo

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Orphaned non-free image File:Medojevic2008.jpg

⚠

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Proposed deletion of Jasmina (album)

The article Jasmina (album) has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

Non-notable recording. No source of any kind to prove WP:NOTABILITY.

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Proposed deletion of 100 stepeni

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Non-notable recording. No source of any kind to prove WP:NOTABILITY.

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Proposed deletion of Volim te...

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Non-notable recording. No source of any kind to prove WP:NOTABILITY.

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Proposed deletion of Zauvijek tvoj

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Non-notable recording. No source of any kind to prove WP:NOTABILITY.

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