KeepItGoingForward

PRODs

Hello, KeepItGoingForward,

If you are going to be tagging pages for any kind of deletion, you really should be posting notifications of this tagging to the talk page of the article creators. Content creators should be informed if articles they created might be deleted.

I encourage you to start using Twinkle to tag articles, it's a great editing tool that makes the process much simpler than handling things manually. And if you set up your Twinkle Preferences to "Notify page creator", then Twinkle will post these talk page notices on your behalf. Most page patrollers and many admins use Twinkle throughout the day, it has many great features and I encourage you to try it out and see what it can offer you as an editor. But whether you use Twinkle or find an appropriate template, please start informing editors when you tag a page for deletion. Thank you. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:53, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

I have posted extensive notifications for the tags of deletion. Which page are you referring to? I will look into using Twinkle. KeepItGoingForward (talk) 03:46, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

Thank you for mentioning Twinkle to me. It is just what I need. KeepItGoingForward (talk) 03:52, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

On reflection, I suspect you are thinking of the authors that are under bans and cannot respond to notifications, so those authors I didn't notified. KeepItGoingForward (talk) 03:54, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

• Many, probably most of this mass of prods should be deleted, but please could make an attempt at WP:BEFORE, in order to save everyone a lot of time and delete only articles that should be deleted. One sample article, Albert Chaumarat is a cyclist with a career of 150 wins. I know he's not an American, and almost all of the sources are in French, but they are still valid sources for notability. Before I would delete a non-English article, the first thing I do is look at their language version of Wikipedia. In this case, that was no help as it was basically this same stub. Nevertheless, we are supposed to avoid language and nationality WP:BIAS: How can we know the notability of a subject if we only evaluate the sources in a language other than their own? For this reason, I normally leave the French articles up to French speakers, because my French is terrible! Here's one French article. [1], not the best, but you can get a bit of a feel for his significance. Jacona (talk) 21:23, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

  Are you seeing significant wins as [2] and [3] are only showing three criterium wins? KeepItGoingForward (talk) 21:41, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

  May I ask what you’ve done to find French-language sources about this Frenchman? — Jacona (talk) 22:45, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

Disclosures

Hello! I'm trying to understand and address your concerns about my COI with Top Level Design/Ray King/.design/.gay/.wiki. I thought I did a good thing, noting my COIs (initially by prose and later by template), but you're not satisfied and that's OK. Feel free to add whatever talk page templates you think are necessary, I'm not trying to hide my connection. Also, perhaps once the dust has settled a bit, the articles' content can be reviewed and we can determine if the "close connection" tags are necessary forever? I'm down to address content concerns, or seek changes from uninvolved editors. ---Another Believer _(Talk) 15:55, 6 January 2023 (UTC)

My concern is the page appears to be created and mainly edited by a paid editor based on our discussion on Talk:Ray_King_(entrepreneur) without the specific disclosure to that fact. You stated, "I have chosen to disclose that I have a personal connection to this subject. I will spare details". You have created a lot of amazing pages, but where you are working as a paid editor needs to be clearly disclosed. KeepItGoingForward (talk) 19:05, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

I'm not understanding what solution you have in mind here. I've made my COI known, so what more do you want from me? Is there a specific template you want to see on the talk page? Can you just remove any non-neutral text so the tags are addressed? What are you proposing exactly? ---Another Believer _(Talk) 19:29, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

I've replaced the talk page templates with "{{Connected contributor (paid)|User1=Another Believer|U1-employer=Top Level Design}}", if that's how a disclosure for a former employer should look. Please let me know if you need anything else here. ---Another Believer _(Talk) 19:38, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

May I also remind you, Template:Connected contributor (paid) did not even exist when I worked on these articles. I don't mind adding/changing the templates retroactively, but please don't give me too hard a time for not using a template which was not even an option at the time. Again, I'm not trying to hide the fact that I used to work for Top Level Design and I've done my best here to address your concerns. You're welcome to adjust as needed. Thanks! ---Another Believer _(Talk) 19:47, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

What I found concerning is from your statement I could not see that you worked for Top Level Design. You stated that you had a personal connection and did not provide details. On the spectrum of COI one can be from knowing or have met someone in passing to the other side of being paid to create articles. Based on prima facie that the COI is more serious and should be clearly stated when someone is a paid article creator and editor. That is my concern about this situation. Which then makes me wonder in other cases where you have a COI are you not stating clearly that you are a paid editor in those cases? KeepItGoingForward (talk) 22:33, 8 January 2023 (UTC)

Another editor has removed the tags. I hope you will consider this matter resolved. Thanks! ---Another Believer _(Talk) 19:08, 13 January 2023 (UTC)

My apologizes for the slow reply. I took a break from editing on wiki. I do consider the matter resolved. Happy editing. KeepItGoingForward (talk) 21:10, 6 February 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for removing the tags at Ray King (entrepreneur), Top Level Design, and .gay. Are you willing to remove the tags at .design and .wiki, too? Thanks and happy holidays, --Another Believer _(Talk) 16:34, 22 December 2023 (UTC)

Done, happy holidays and editing. KeepItGoingForward (talk) 03:52, 29 December 2023 (UTC)

Thanks! ---Another Believer _(Talk) 03:54, 29 December 2023 (UTC)

Operating field moved to draftspace

An article you recently created, Operating field, is not suitable as written to remain published. An article needs more information and citations from reliable, independent sources to remain in the mainspace. Information that can't be referenced should be removed (verifiability is of central importance on Wikipedia). I've moved your draft to draftspace (with a prefix of "Draft:" before the article title) where you can incubate the article with minimal disruption. When you feel the article meets Wikipedia's general notability guideline, has suitable content and thus is ready for mainspace, click the Submit the draft for review! button atop the article. Silikonz💬 20:01, 6 February 2023 (UTC)

Did you review the references, as for instance the chapter referenced and also a quick search by you would show that the article subject meets the general notability guidelines? The article was also requested by Wikipedia:WikiProject_Medicine/Cardiology_task_force. KeepItGoingForward (talk) 20:09, 6 February 2023 (UTC)

@KeepItGoingForward, my concerns were not per notability, and I do not refute the fact that it was requested. Currently, the article reads more like a dictionary entry than an article, and has minimal content; The field is also undertaken for the efficient procedure of the surgery. just seems redundant as text filler for me. When the article is up to standard you are welcome to submit/move it into mainspace. Silikonz💬 20:12, 6 February 2023 (UTC)

Are you familiar with how the operating field is undertaken? How you setup the field is critical to the surgical procedure. KeepItGoingForward (talk) 20:14, 6 February 2023 (UTC)

I have expanded and moved the article. It would be fantastic to get some edits by you to improve the article. KeepItGoingForward (talk) 21:05, 6 February 2023 (UTC)

Re this, I've done some basic copyedits and will take a more comprehensive look in a while. Best, Silikonz💬 21:19, 6 February 2023 (UTC)

Sounds good. The article could do with lots of improvements. KeepItGoingForward (talk) 21:20, 6 February 2023 (UTC)

Mass article-creation vandalism

Hello, thank you for PRODing the articles you described here[4]. It is disruptive and counter-productive that they were spuriously deprodded. Your comment "AFD is already overworked with too few editors." is very true. If you haven't taken care of them already, I could help with nominating the articles to AfD. Saucysalsa30 (talk) 23:13, 11 June 2023 (UTC)

Sure, please do. I stepped away from the AfD process. KeepItGoingForward (talk) 01:47, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

Concern regarding Draft:Wolfram Schultz

Hello, KeepItGoingForward. This is a bot-delivered message letting you know that Draft:Wolfram Schultz, a page you created, has not been edited in at least 5 months. Drafts that have not been edited for six months may be deleted, so if you wish to retain the page, please edit it again or request that it be moved to your userspace.

If the page has already been deleted, you can request it be undeleted so you can continue working on it.

Thank you for your submission to Wikipedia. FireflyBot (talk) 05:02, 29 July 2023 (UTC)

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Query

Hello, KeepItGoingForward,

I was wondering if you could tag Draft:Language attitudes-delete2 and Draft:Language attitudes-delete for speedy deletion, maybe CSD G7 if that is appropriate. If you want to move an article from Draft space to main space and there is a redirect at that page title, please do not move an existing redirect to Draft space under a rather useless page title. Either do a CSD G6 Move request, ask an admin for help or go to WP:RM. What you did is not the best solution to this problem. Page deletion happens under quite limited conditions and if you can't find a CSD criteria that fits, you'll have to nominate this pages for deletion at WP:RFD. Thank you. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 03:00, 30 December 2023 (UTC)

I did a G7 on Draft:Language attitudes-delete2 and a G6 on Draft:Language attitudes-delete since I am not the original author.

Sorry for the extra work. I made a mistake in how I handled approving the Language attitudes draft and dealing with the existing redirect. KeepItGoingForward (talk) 17:49, 30 December 2023 (UTC)

Hello KeepItGoingForward,

After reviewing your history of edits, it appears that you consistently advocate for deletion without providing substantial reasoning. The page Ziad Sakr that you are tagging for deletion satisfies various criteria for notability, as the individual has won multiple international tournaments, including a significant event like the British Junior Open Squash. The person is cited and referenced in various articles, Wikipedia pages, professional squash association pages, and other publications. Furthermore, I interviewed with this person after their comeback to professional squash, so the story mentioned is fully correct. I kindly encourage you to look at other Wikipedia pages for professional squash athletes. The article is written in a similar style — Preceding unsigned comment added by Namexre (talk • contribs) 02:16, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

Hi Namexre,

I did provide a substantial reason for the proposed deletion, as per the concern posted on the page: "Page was turned down two times in page review and then put to mainspace anyways by the article's creator. Person does not meet notability standards and article almost appears to be an advertisement for the person, which may lend to the person that created the article having a conflict of interest or Ziad Sakr themself." The article never being approved by the review process is a sign it likely is not meeting the requirements to be a page.

I appreciate all the work you are doing for Squash pages here on wiki and we need more editors creating and updating squash pages; however the page still needs to meet wiki notability requirements Wikipedia:Notability_(sports) and as player with no significant coverage specific to them; beside passing mentions in other articles they don't meet the requirement. They are currently ranked 182 by the PSA, which is also not a notable ranking. On the PSA website on Ziad Sakr's which lists news and video specific to the player no listings are specific to Ziad Sakr. If you can provide some specific coverage that shows notability than the page should stay otherwise it should be removed and at this time with your tag removal it will have to go through the AfD process.

There is a conflict of interest policy for articles and you interviewing him, creating and editing Ziad Sakr's page falls within it Wikipedia:Conflict_of_interest. You may want to consider disclosing it on the talk page.

As a note you deleted all the wiki project links on the talk page of Ziad Sakr. The Wikiprojects are important as they mean there are groups of editors invested in improving the pages around those topics. As I am sure you are aware of being apart of Squash project.

As a side note, when posting on someone's talk page add a new topic title at the bottom and please sign your messages. I had to move your comment down my talk page.

I do want to reiterate I am glad to see someone so passionate about squash articles and I hope we can work together to improve and create some other pages. There are a lot of notable squash players without pages or with pages that leave a great deal lacking for the reader. KeepItGoingForward (talk) 00:59, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

I looked through your history and I was mistaken as I thought you were apart of the Wikiproject Squash Wikipedia:WikiProject_Squash and Ziad Sakr is the only page you have edited and created. Are you interested in working on other Squash pages or other pages on Wiki or is the only one of interest to you? KeepItGoingForward (talk) 01:04, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

Hi KeepItGoingForward,

Thank you for your comments; I appreciate the time you are taking to address them. Let's begin by addressing your concerns. The British Junior Open stands as one of the biggest and most prestigious tournaments in squash juniors' careers. Winning it is akin to securing a world championship. Moreover, this individual has clinched multiple significant international titles, including the Arabian Championship three times with the Egyptian national team and the 17th national championship for Trinity College. Since squash lacks a standardized league, the College Squash National Championship holds immense importance. For aspiring professional squash players, winning it is a pivotal goal, attracting sponsors and providing an advantage for promoters to grant access to wild cards and satellite tournaments in the professional circuit, a crucial step in starting a professional career.

Regarding the second point, Ziad Sakr moved from 800 to 182 in the rankings within a year. I respectfully disagree with your assertion that this is not notable. Achieving such a feat—climbing over 500 places in under 12 months at the beginning of a professional squash career—is a commendable and significant accomplishment. Ziad now qualifies to compete in major tournaments, and within the squash community, he is well-known. After conducting an interview with him, I am convinced he deserves to have a Wikipedia page so more people can learn about his achievements.

In response to your second question, while I have contributed to different squash articles for players I have interviewed, I haven't contributed to Wikipedia directly. However, I am eager to become more involved in editing Wikipedia's squash pages. There are numerous notable squash players without pages or with pages lacking essential information, and I aim to contribute to rectifying that.

Instead of deleting the page, together we can work on fixing any issues you suggest because this person and others who are in the same boat as him deserve recognition, and he is verified by the resources mentioned. Because if we deleted the page, trust me, in a couple months we would need to create a page again for him. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Namexre (talk • contribs) 02:31, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

You need to demonstrate significant coverage for the page to meet standards to be included on wiki mainspace WP:Notability_(sports). Can you find citations to meet those standards?

Trinity College's domination of the national title is a good example where significant converge exists for an article. While being apart of a team that wins the championship is impressive there is not significant coverage specific to Ziad. As an example for a college player (and pro) that met significant coverage Youssef Ibrahim who played for Princeton received significant coverage while still playing in college and therefore meets the requirements for a page.

Ziad actually is not qualified at his rank of 182 to enter major tournaments. Are you familiar with the PSA tournament requirements? KeepItGoingForward (talk) 02:45, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for responding. I already provided articles and citations for every tournament, including the national championship title and All-American title. from the source you shared WP:Notability_(sports). It says the following about individual seasons below:

• A national championship season at the top collegiate level is generally notable.
• A national championship season at a lower collegiate level might be notable

The article provides coverage and citations for the college national championship in 2018 and the All-American title, which meet some of the criteria in the link you mentioned. From my point of view ist i well sourced for every achievemnts I am not sure how much oignificant coverage you are suggesting. In fact, Ii is providing more coverage and ccitationsthan the person you mentioned.

Yes, I am familiar; I have been in the PSA area for over 15 years. #182 will not get him to gold or platinum events, but he can be abltoe to get in 30Ks challenger tournaments for now. Namexre (talk) 02:56, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

Those are notability of the individual seasons being notable and having their own page. Notability is not inherited to the the individuals on the team for a noatable season. I agree that Youssef Ibrahim page is lacking and the citations are lacking; however, as you know with your PSA experience Youssef Ibrahim has had significant squash news coverage and results. KeepItGoingForward (talk) 03:02, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

I understand your point, and for sure, Youssef's has significant PSA coverage. I can't disagree on that. but I am also not fully on the same page, if you don't mind. according to Wikepdia Notability, and the link you sent Ziad has his own coverage and pages and is more notable from my point of view than this person, for instance, Matías Knudsen. Regarding Ziad's own articles, please find this link here [5] and many more that I am mentioning. The PSA itself made the title of an article about his return after 7 years on tour here [6]. and many more Namexre (talk) 03:11, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

Matias Knudsen is higher ranked now than Ziad [7]. Saying that there may be a case to be made that they are not notable and we should be having the same discussion about their page. Can you find significant coverage for them?

As an aside, to get more familiar with Wiki editing and your desire to improve other squash pages, maybe you could take on improving Youssef Ibrahim's page? Another possibility is Ex-world champion and current coach of Elias Jonathon_Power's is completely lacking in citations, so could use an update. KeepItGoingForward (talk) 03:26, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

I would be very happy to do so, and I am actually planning on doing that as we are discussing their pages. My goal is to provide the recognition these players deserve, as I mentioned earlier. But in the same time I just don't understand your perspective. I am sure you understand the PSA system. Being ranked #119 vs #182 is not a big difference at all. So your case here is not about notability and coverage anymore; it is about ranking ? I am just a bit confused and trying to understand the facts you are proposing. I feel you came very hard on the page I created by directly asking for. it to be deleted while others are already approved. Thank you Namexre (talk) 03:32, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

Also, to your point in regards of the interview I conducted with him, here you go. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fB3gdxTNgwE&feature=youtu.be&ab_channel=RoyPoodle. The page has no sound of promotion, as you stated; it is only addressing facts, and every fact is cited better than most existing squash player pages. As for asking on Ziad's article page to be indexed, I just wanted to understand the process, and I see no harm in asking.Namexre (talk) 04:15, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

@KeepItGoingForwardYou are violating Wikepdia rules Wikipedia:Don't restore removed commentsby constantly restoring the comments on the Ziad Sakr page while the editor keeps removing it. This is vandalism, and I feel you are trying to destroy the page without any reasoning. Namexre (talk) 17:45, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

As you are doubling posting this, I am just going to leave this quote from my response on the AFD in regards to your assertion of wiki policy violating, "Just as a point of note, I have not restored any comments on your talk page as per the policy on WP:Don't restore removed comments. I have posted notices on it though." KeepItGoingForward (talk) 20:30, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

A quick reply to your queries on User talk:Liz

Hi KeepItGoingForward,

You can withdraw your nomination in the following circumstances:

• If the nominator is the sole contributor to AFD, and for whatever reason he wishes to withdraw his nomination, he can just add a quick note that he had withdrawn, so that others get notified, and close that AFD as withdrawn. Nominator can also close himself (I personally use the XFD closure tool for this purpose).
• In another case, if the point of view of the nominator is contrary to that of other voters, just for example, your view point as the nominator of AFD is to delete X article, but your AFD received, say, five or six, keeps, without any other delete, redirect, draftify or merge votes, and at a certain point you agreed with the Keep voters, so you can just withdraw your nomination. I Hope this helps. Thank you. Maliner (talk) 07:17, 21 January 2024 (UTC)

Fantastic, thank you for taking the time for letting me know the circumstances and process. KeepItGoingForward (talk) 23:29, 21 January 2024 (UTC)