User talk:Finetooth/Archive 16

Thanks!

Thanks again for helping with the Roseland Theater article! That was a fun one to research and collaborate on. I was surprised to see there was no article for Mary's Club, so I created a stub a moment ago. The subject is either offensive/repulsive or totally appealing, depending on your research interests, hah! Personally, I look forward to learning more about this local landmark. Not sure if it's at the very top of my "to do" list at the moment, which is forever long, but I'd love to get this article promoted to Good status at some point. If you'd be interested in collaborating again, just let me know! (Or, perhaps there is another article that interests you?) --Another Believer _(Talk) 21:09, 5 February 2014 (UTC)

You are finding such great info! So cool. I will be unable to work on this article for a few days, but I most certainly have not forgotten and will resume work soon. Thanks so much for your work on this article. --Another Believer _(Talk) 19:21, 10 February 2014 (UTC)

I enjoy the research, and I'm often surprised at what turns up. Our discussion a few weeks ago about Louise Bryant led me to the library, where I borrowed three Bryant biographies and subsequently expanded the Bryant article something like 20-fold. What an interesting person she was. Finetooth (talk) 19:41, 10 February 2014 (UTC)

Awesome! Also, "reptile wrestler" might be one of the best edit summaries ever...! Mary's Club isn't exactly "my thing", but now I am totally curious to go (not for the reasons one might think). Not sure I could summon the strength, though, haha. --Another Believer _(Talk) 20:13, 10 February 2014 (UTC)

You really should consider nominating Louise Bryant for good article status, if not featured article status. I know article promotion is not your greatest concern, but the article looks great. Also, I have not forgotten about Mary's Club; I was on vacation and have some catch-up work to do, but consider this another good article "work in progress". --Another Believer _(Talk) 18:08, 19 February 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for reviewing my recent edits to the Mary's Club article. I was not sure how to include Love's "titties" comment/misspelling ([sic] inclusion?). Just a few more sources from the talk page to incorporate into the article, then GA nomination! --Another Believer _(Talk) 18:19, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

I had noticed that quote in WW earlier but couldn't decide whether to include it or not. Now that the article is more fully developed, it seems fine. You've added more than I thought possible. Btw, I've nominated Louise Bryant for GA; its expansion, as I've said, stemmed from thinking about the Rimsky-Korsakoffee House. Bryant led to Greenwich Village and then to Ida Rauh, formerly redlinked. It's interesting that working by association leads all over the place. Finetooth (talk) 19:01, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

Indeed! I have no doubt the article will be promoted soon. Job well done. I just created a very short article for Coming of the White Man, which then "forced" me to create a stub for Chief Multnomah. The never ending project...! --Another Believer _(Talk) 21:58, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

Here is an article for another local establishment. If you wish to give a quick read over, or even assist with Oregonian dumpster archive diving, feel free. If not, no problem! I don't mean to recruit you for every project I work on, you just make a good writing partner. This article will be very easy to finish and promote to Good status. I will also request a copy edit by GOCE soon. --Another Believer _(Talk) 21:10, 27 February 2014 (UTC)

Request

Our paths have not crossed recently, but I am pleased to see that you are still here, working quietly away. If you can spare a few minutes, I'd be very grateful if you could give your opinion on an image issue which has arisen on my latest FAC, Profumo affair. The gist of the matter is explained on Ruhrfisch's talk page (I've asked him to look, too), and on the FAC itself. Any contribution would be most appreciated. Brianboulton (talk) 14:06, 16 February 2014 (UTC)

(Later): There is no longer a need for you to concern yourself with this, as there has been sufficient discussion on the FAC page to resolve the issue. Sorry to have troubled you. I hope that all is well with you. Brianboulton (talk) 00:19, 17 February 2014 (UTC)

Ah, thanks. I was just looking into this when your second note arrived. Glad the problem was resolved. I'm enjoying the article. Finetooth (talk) 00:43, 17 February 2014 (UTC)

Another request

Hi Finetooth, Remember me from FAC? I need your help. I'm being driven up the wall by two editors who are champing at the bit to undo my edits to V. S. Naipaul. I've been away from Wikipedia on account of serious illness in my family. I am back now, but these editors, who suddenly turned up out of the blue two days ago, claim I have ownership issues. I've said over and over again to let me at least finish the article and to then have the article peer-reviewed by any number of capable WP reviewers, but they don't seem to be listening. Please help and weigh in at Talk:V. S. Naipaul. Fowler&fowler«Talk» 23:24, 21 February 2014 (UTC)

POTD notification

POTD

Hi Finetooth,

Just to let you know that the Featured Picture File:East face painted hills panorama.jpg is due to make an appearance as Picture of the Day on March 23, 2014. If you get a chance, you can check and improve the caption at Template:POTD/2014-03-23. Thank you for all of your contributions! — Crisco 1492 (talk) 02:48, 6 March 2014 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Louise Bryant

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Louise Bryant you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Rosiestep -- Rosiestep (talk) 04:20, 6 March 2014 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Louise Bryant

The article Louise Bryant you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold . The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needing to be addressed. If these are fixed within 7 days, the article will pass; otherwise it may fail. See Talk:Louise Bryant for things which need to be addressed. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Rosiestep -- Rosiestep (talk) 03:40, 12 March 2014 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Louise Bryant

The article Louise Bryant you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Louise Bryant for comments about the article. Well done! Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Rosiestep -- Rosiestep (talk) 03:11, 13 March 2014 (UTC)

Congratulations on this GA, Finetooth! You really did a good job on the article. I saw the movie Reds a long time ago but want to watch it again after doing this review... maybe over the weekend. --Rosiestep (talk) 14:59, 13 March 2014 (UTC)

Congrats on the GA! Amazing work! --Another Believer _(Talk) 20:56, 13 March 2014 (UTC)

Stumbled across this article again today. One might consider it... featured... article... worthy... ... :p (no pressure, just a compliment) ---Another Believer _(Talk) 02:13, 13 December 2014 (UTC)

Thank you. She was a very interesting person. Finetooth (talk) 02:16, 13 December 2014 (UTC)

Gate to the Northwest Passage

FT, I don't know if you are interested in helping with this or not (fine either way), but I am seeking third-party reviewers to assist with a peer review for this short article. Previously, I submitted a request for comment re: three specific pieces of content which another contributor has removed from the article. However, that request has gone unaddressed for more than two weeks. I am seeking neutral feedback about the article in general and about these three specific blurbs (see talk page). If you have a few minutes to check this article over, I'd be much appreciated. If not, no problem! Thanks. --Another Believer _(Talk) 16:15, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for responding. --Another Believer _(Talk) 17:48, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

Ping MMM

Just checking in to see if I addressed all your concerns at the Mucho Macho Man FAQ, (wikicup points, lurking, I'm short, hope I can get this through before the end of the month) Montanabw^(talk) 23:56, 3 April 2014 (UTC)

I'm a hunting...

For a GAN to review. Do you have anything up or know anyone who has an article languishing in the queue? (Yeah, I need wikicup points, but I'll do a really good review no matter what). Montanabw^(talk) 22:30, 17 April 2014 (UTC)

Thanks. I don't have anything, but I'm checking around. Finetooth (talk) 22:38, 17 April 2014 (UTC)

Ooh! *raises hand* Orchestral Works by Tomas Svoboda, Mary's Club (with Finetooth), or GU Energy Labs, if you are interested. --Another Believer _(Talk) 22:39, 17 April 2014 (UTC)

Off to take a look; will grab one. Montanabw^(talk) 05:24, 18 April 2014 (UTC)

WINC (AM)

I have finished with most of the items on the PR, the others (which are few and far between), I have added notes to. - Neutralhomer • Talk • 10:35, 19 April 2014 (UTC)

On the formatting references part, with the initial capital letters on major words, does this one look correct to you? "Voice of Prophecy" to Go on NBC on June 3 The word "Go" looks weird to me, but I'm not sure if that is a "major word" or not. - Neutralhomer • Talk • 00:33, 20 April 2014 (UTC)

You said you didn't have anything else at the moment. Do you think the article is ready for FAC or still needs some tinkering? Just curious. - Neutralhomer • Talk • 08:41, 20 April 2014 (UTC)

I tinkered with one sentence that was becoming a bit of a run-on and split it into two. Lemme know what you think. - Neutralhomer • Talk • 04:20, 26 April 2014 (UTC)

Looks fine as you have it now. I posted a few comments just now to the PR page. Finetooth (talk) 04:27, 26 April 2014 (UTC)

Excellent, I have corrected all but the last one (which has a note). - Neutralhomer • Talk • 04:41, 26 April 2014 (UTC)

WINC (AM) on FAC

Hello, I just wanted to let you know that the WINC (AM) article, which you did a peer review on, is currently up on FAC. - Neutralhomer • Talk • 20:02, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

You are invited to an upcoming WikiWednesday meetup!

FT, you are invited to come meet fellow wiki enthusiasts at WikiWednesday, a series of meetups for fans of Wikipedia, PortlandWiki, and wikis in general. If you are interested in attending, we will be meeting at NedSpace (619 SW 11th Avenue, Suite 250, at the corner of SW 11th and Morrison) at 6pm on Wednesday, May 21. You would be welcome to work on Wikipedia articles of your choosing, or other preferred wikis. I'll be there to help out. Hope to see you there! (Feel free to RSVP on my talk page or here.) --Another Believer _(Talk) 23:12, 14 May 2014 (UTC)

Thank You!

With your help, the WINC (AM) was just promoted to Featured Article status. Together, we took a C-Class article, edited, added and made it a Good Article. We didn't stop there, we made it better and now it is a Featured Article. Whether you made one edit or twenty, you still helped and I thank you. :) - Neutralhomer • Talk • 10:04, 18 May 2014 (UTC)

• Like. --Another Believer _(Talk) 22:56, 24 May 2014 (UTC)

Mary's Club review

Just an FYI. Thanks! --Another Believer _(Talk) 22:57, 24 May 2014 (UTC)

Actually, never mind, the article passed! Congrats. --Another Believer _(Talk) 23:19, 24 May 2014 (UTC)

Wow! That was fast. Congrats to you, who did most of the work. Finetooth (talk) 23:21, 24 May 2014 (UTC)

WP:ENGVAR

Hi! Would you please be careful not to mess with other people's spelling with your edits, as you did at Mondovì with this edit? MOS:RETAIN is fairly clear on this, I believe. Thanks, Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 10:55, 27 May 2014 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for your help with Lake James (Indiana). If you have any ideas for improvement, please let me know. TwoScars (talk) 00:54, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

Wiki Loves Pride

You are invited! Wiki Loves Pride

You are invited to participate in Wiki Loves Pride, a global campaign to create and improve LGBT-related content at Wikipedia during the month of June, culminating with a multinational edit-a-thon on June 21. The project is being spearheaded by two organizers with roots in the Pacific Northwest. Meetups are being organized in some cities, or you can participate remotely. Wikimedia Commons will also be hosting an LGBT-related photo challenge. In Portland, there are two ways to contribute. One is a photography campaign called "Pride PDX", for pictures related to LGBT culture and history. The Wiki Loves Pride edit-a-thon will be held on Saturday, June 21 from noon–4pm at Smith Memorial Student Union, Room 236 at Portland State University. Prior Wikipedia editing is not required; assistance will be available the day of the event. Attendees should bring their own laptops and cords. Feel free to showcase your work here! Wikipedia:Meetup/Portland/Pride PDX Wikipedia:Meetup/Portland/Wiki Loves Pride 2014 https://www.facebook.com/events/804661466218694 If you have any questions, please leave a message here. You can unsubscribe from future notifications for Oregon-related events and projects by removing your name from this list.

USGS map question

Greetings, Finetooth! I thought I might respond here as I understand you to be more active on en.wiki. There are two related issues to consider: 1) underlying geographical data and 2) the visual manifestation thereof (the map).

1) As a general proposition, facts are not protected by copyright by virtue of being common property lacking in authorship. (U.S. Copyright Office Circular 1) The shoreline of Lake James, for example, owes its physical characteristics to the forces of nature. Indeed, the conversion or translation of these characteristics into (presumably) a data set of geographical coordinates may not be eligible for copyright protection as mere sweat of the brow. As a logical corollary, I could take precise measurements of the furniture in my office. Before considerations of how I select and organize those dimensions, such a list would not be expected to contain sufficient originality, as it is merely a mechanical description of the world as it is - devoid of anything recognizably "my own."

That said, copyright does indeed extend to complications—“works formed by the collection and assembly […] of data that are selected, coordinated, or arranged in such a way that the resulting work as a whole constitutes an original work of authorship.” (17 U.S.C. § 101) It is thus the selection, coordination, and arrangement (i.e., the original/creative input of the compiler) that may receive a copyright. For example, “the collector may change the form of information and so make it more accessible, or he may change the organization and so make the data more understandable” (Rockford Map Publishers v. Directory Serv. Co. of Colo., 768 F.2d 145, 148 (7th Cir. 1985)) The question then, particularly in relation to DeLorme, is to what extent, if any, DeLorme provided non-trivial selection, synthesis, and judgment to the data set.

2) Whatever DeLorme's contributions to the data, the more pertinent issue here is that of the visual manifestation of the data - the map itself. For the sake of simplicity, let us assume that DeLorme does not exist and only the USGS and Esri are involved. If it is Esri's software that takes the USGS' geographical data (public domain by virtue of federal authorship) and renders it as a map, Esri, as a non-federal government entity, would indeed be expected to hold a copyright on the map by virtue of its original contributions related to coloring, shading, orientation, scaling, etc. The map is, in a sense, a visual compilation.

Meshwerks, Inc. v. Toyota Motor Sales U.S.A., Inc. 528 F.3d 1258 (10th Cir. 2008) offers an interesting corollary and, perhaps, a more easily understood example of the above concepts. Meshworks had scanned a vehicle and used those scans to create digital wire-frame models - essentially playing "connect the dots" with the various data points collected. Meshworks' wire-frame models were denied copyright as "Meshwerks did not make any decisions regarding lighting, shading, the background in front of which a vehicle would be posed, the angle at which to pose it, or the like—in short, its models reflect none of the decisions that can make depictions of things or facts in the world."

So, returning to Lake James, the copyrightability depends upon the contributions of the non-federal government entities to the map. My suspicion would be that the USGS' licensed Esri's mapping software to create visuals of USGS (or DeLorme) data. Is the software like Photoshop where the user (presumably, a USGS employee) controls the visual output, or is it like Google Maps where a user can enter coordinates to create a specific route, yet the substantive visual (and thus the copyright) is controlled by the software (Google)? Эlcobbola _talk 14:52, 20 June 2014 (UTC)

Thank you Elcobbola for this detailed response. As it happens, a Federal employee at the Geographic Names Information Service of the USGS, responded to my e-mail query today about these copyright issues as follows:

"While the Geographic Names Information System is freely accessible, the underlying base map services are created by ESRI so restrictions do apply if you are a for-profit entity.

"If you go to Esri's web page, you can find their licensing agreement, http://www.esri.com/~/media/Files/Pdfs/legal/pdfs/e204_e300.pdf, where it states that the product may be used for commercial application service provider (ASP) use if licensee is a governmental or a not-for-profit organization that operates a website or offers an Internet service on a cost recovery basis and not for profit. If you do not meet this requirement, we cannot authorize copyright usage of the Esri base map services even though the USA_Topo_Maps Map Service was built from USGS topographic map content.

"We request that the following acknowledgment statement be included in products and data derived from our map services when citing, copying, or reprinting: "Map services and data available from U.S. Geological Survey, National Geospatial Program."

Looking at the Lake James map, I would say that it appears to be a compilation of USGS topo maps plus DeLorme maps and perhaps other data all merged by ESRI. As you well know, although Wikimedia is not a for-profit entity, its licenses do not allow a non-commercial restriction on re-use of its images. Based on the information in the GNIS note above, it appears to me that if a commercial entity re-used the Lake James map stored at the Commons in, say, a textbook sold to schools, that would violate the ESRI copyright restrictions and DeLorme's as well. I would be happy to hear that my interpretation is wrong, but... Do you think I should advise the map uploader to mark the Lake James file at the Commons for deletion? Finetooth (talk) 17:17, 20 June 2014 (UTC)

Date formatting

Hello, I notice you're going through articles about Italian places such as Frascati, and changing date formatting (among other things). However, the guideline about strong national ties to a topic only mentions English-speaking countries, which Italy is not, so the date formatting shouldn't be changed. I don't think it's a big enough deal that your date-related edits need to be undone, but it's worth mentioning. Graham87 03:37, 21 June 2014 (UTC)

Hi. Thanks for pointing this out. I was operating under the false impression that the national preference applied to all countries. In the case of Frascati the date formatting was already internally consistent, and I should have left it alone as well as any others with consistent formatting. I will be more careful about this. Finetooth (talk) 04:28, 21 June 2014 (UTC)

I reverted my date changes to Frascati as a gesture of good will and good intentions. Finetooth (talk) 04:45, 21 June 2014 (UTC)

Thanks! Graham87 16:09, 21 June 2014 (UTC)

And I've just redone the non-date-related change that you undid during your self-reversion. Graham87 16:17, 21 June 2014 (UTC)

Thank you. Finetooth (talk) 16:23, 21 June 2014 (UTC)

Precious again

creeks, wilderness and people
Thank you for raising our attention for Tryon Creek, Petrified Forest National Park and Ernest Shackleton, for your assistance in peer reviews, for your images, in other words: you are an awesome Wikipedian (28 August 2010)!

--Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:11, 23 June 2012 (UTC)

Two years ago, you were the 160th recipient of my PumpkinSky Prize, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:04, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

Thank you for both of these awesome Gerda. Affirmation is certainly an inducement to continue. Finetooth (talk) 15:05, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

Feminist+Queer Art Wikipedia Edit-a-thon: Saturday, September 13, Portland, Oregon

			You are invited to the Feminist+Queer Art Wikipedia Edit-a-thon, to be held on Saturday, September 13, 2014 from noon–4pm at the Independent Publishing Resource Center (IPRC), located at 1001 SE Division (97202). Prior Wikipedia editing is not required; assistance will be available the day of the event. Attendees should bring their own laptops and power cords. Female editors are particularly encouraged to attend, but all are welcome. Hope to see you there! If you have any questions, please leave a message on the talk page. You can unsubscribe from future notifications for Oregon-related events and projects by removing your name from this list. --MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 15:59, 4 September 2014 (UTC)

Your efforts are appreciated!

	The fine-tooth comb award
	Thank you for copyediting articles to do with Bangladesh. Sminthopsis84 (talk) 12:37, 19 October 2014 (UTC)

Ganges

Thanks for your note. I've responded on my talk page. -User:Grutness

Marcy Cottrell Houle

Thanks for the work on the Houle article! I got a good start on an article about another OBA winner, Janet Stevenson, then my browser crashed. Hmph. Grrr. I wonder if she is any relation to the Cottrell, Oregon, Cottrells? I've got a couple blurbs from some speaking engagements ready to add more info to the article if you don't beat me to it. It looks like all of her books have gone through 3 editions, and also she has a new book coming out next year! Busy! I wasn't aware of her work before, surprisingly, so this was a good discovery. Cheers, Valfontis (talk) 18:00, 13 November 2014 (UTC)

Is your Wikipedia e-mail on the Fritz? Valfontis (talk) 18:54, 13 November 2014 (UTC)

Not that I know of, but everything on the computer seems a bit slow this morning. Finetooth (talk) 19:06, 13 November 2014 (UTC)

Must be the #snowpocalypse. I forwarded you the message that bounced. Valfontis (talk) 19:40, 13 November 2014 (UTC)

Did you read past the gobbledygook in the forwarded message? There was actual content in there! :) Valfontis (talk) 20:06, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

Ay, yi! No. I didn't see it. Sorry about that. I sent an email reply a few seconds ago after reading your note here. Finetooth (talk) 20:53, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

Elk City

Thanks for finally starting Elk City, Oregon. Here's some notes on it. I think I did a bunch of research on a long time ago in wiki years and got bogged down. I suspect there is a saved session on my old hard drive with about 5000 Elk City tabs. P.S. Woohoo! and more stuff. Cheers, Valfontis (talk) 20:06, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for the cool links. I got to Elk City via the Yaquina River article, which I've been expanding this week. I think Elk City is a ghost town, but I don't have an RS for that. Finetooth (talk) 20:16, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, I think it's a "boom-bust" ghosttown. Where people still live ("we're not ghosts!!!") but a mere shadow of its former self. Some folks at the ghosttowns.com site (*not* a RS) evinced disappointment that it wasn't completely deserted. It's too wet on the west side of the mountains for what most folks think of a ghost towns! P.S. Got your e-mail too. Valfontis (talk) 21:21, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

CDPs

You are *on fire* with the CDP articles like Foots Creek, Oregon! I dunno if I showed you my my messy and opinionated list of CDPs but feel free to ignore or use as inspiration as needed. Valfontis (talk) 00:43, 5 December 2014 (UTC)

You are always inspiring, and I thank you for the list, which I had not seen before. I visited Foots Creek when I was working on the Rogue River article some time back, and I think I bought something at a little store there. No skyline photo, though. Maybe next time. Finetooth (talk) 00:54, 5 December 2014 (UTC)

Seasonal greetings

	Merry Christmas and best wishes for a happy, healthy and productive 2015!
	Ruhrfisch ><>°° 14:30, 25 December 2014 (UTC)

WPD?

Based on your research for Lola Baldwin and possibly other articles, do you think there should be a Wikipedia article about the Women's Auxiliary to the Police Department for the Protection of Girls, later called the Women's Protective Division? ----Another Believer _(Talk) 20:36, 25 December 2014 (UTC)

I think there could be one since the WPD lasted from 1908 until at least 1967. In addition to Lola Baldwin, there's Sybil Plumlee, who wrote about her police work, and there were others who are probably mentioned in police records and historical-society archives and newspaper articles. Finetooth (talk) 02:45, 26 December 2014 (UTC)

Oh, you are the main editor on the Plumlee article. I just noticed that. Cool. Finetooth (talk) 02:46, 26 December 2014 (UTC)

Yes, I just nominated that one for Good status. :) ---Another Believer _(Talk) 05:42, 26 December 2014 (UTC)

... aaaaaaand just retracted the nomination since the article clearly has a couple issues. Thanks so much for taking a look at it. I am currently going through Oregonian archives for more info and I also hope to address your question re: transition from Clackamas County to Multnomah County. ---Another Believer _(Talk) 18:21, 26 December 2014 (UTC)

Happy New Year!

Dear Finetooth,
HAPPY NEW YEAR Hoping 2015 will be a great year for you! Thank you for your contributions!
From a fellow editor,
--FWiW Bzuk (talk)

This message promotes WikiLove. Originally created by Nahnah4 (see "invisible note").

OR-7

Thanks for your work on this article! ---Another Believer _(Talk) 18:34, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

I find the topic very interesting. Like salmon, wolves have amazing tenacity. Finetooth (talk) 00:31, 15 January 2015 (UTC)

Thanks

Many thanks for your work the the Staryl Austin article! Connormah (talk) 21:17, 15 January 2015 (UTC)

Glad to help. He was a really solid guy. Finetooth (talk) 21:24, 15 January 2015 (UTC)