Talk:Zeus/Archive 1

Archive 1

Archive 2

Jupiter (mythology)

Shouldn't stupider get his own article? Sennheiser! 21:41, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)

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However, disregarding linguistic evidence, some people claim that the worship of Zeus originated among the Mycenean heirs of Minoans, where he was known as the Earthshaker.

Mycenean Linear B tablets were shown to be in Greek half a century ago, so I'm not sure where the "disregarding linguistic evidence" part comes from. Also, as Wetman pointed out, Poseidon the the eartshaker. If someone wants to track down what "Zeus" was in Linear B then the Myceneans might be worth a mention, but for now I'm just cutting it. Bacchiad 22:10, 14 Jul 2004 (UTC)

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Steven Colbert is more godlyer than Zeus

I shrunk the "Seductions" sections significantly. Nearly all the material in the sub-sections was duplicated word for word in the linked articles on the women/nymphs in question; in a few cases the article had a fuller explanation. In the couple of cases where there was less, I pasted the material from this page into Aegina (mythology) or Astreia or whatever. Then I cut out the text on each seductee, leaving only the wiki-links. I believe this makes the article more manageable and balanced. Please do revert if you disagree. Bacchiad 05:41, 15 Jul 2004 (UTC)

I cannot find any mention of the seductions in the article anymore. Were they removed? Or have they been moved to another page? If so which one?

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In the epithets section for xenios, I changed "ready to avenge any wrong done to a stranger." to "any offense to xenia was an offense against Zeus." This way xenia is actually mentioned a linked too. Also, Zeus didn't always avenge misdeeds. In the case of the Trojan War, it was up to the suitors of Helen to avenge the misdeed against Menelaos. --~ Jared ~ 22:22, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

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Minor vandalism fixes, 09/26/2006

While reading the article today I caught a couple of lines not handled by the revert some hours before my visit. Vandalism was introduced here:

(cur) (last) 21:00, 25 September 2006 65.96.67.0 (Talk) (→Zeus and Hera)

(cur) (last) 20:58, 25 September 2006 65.96.67.0 (Talk) (→Spoken-word myths - audio files)

and was carried through future revisions. The 9/26 revert didn't catch these, so I took them out by hand rather than revert the article further. Wingchild 17:49, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Melissa

Does anyone have a citation for the goat-milk thing? Everything I've found says she plundered honey, which is where the meaning for 'Melissa' (honey bee) supposedly came about. Of course, those are no more reputable than this without a source, so... Melissa Della 09:02, 13 December 2005 (UTC)

Amalthea (mythology) for the goat-milk thing. Walter Burkert, Greek Religion for some context. --Wetman 09:05, 13 December 2005 (UTC)

The "necklace"

What does Pausanias mean when, reviewing the site of the olympic festivals, he refers so casually to the "necklace" worn by Zeus pictured as a boy:

"The figure of Zeus as a boy wearing the necklace is the votive offering of Cleolas, a Phliasian" [1].

Does anyone recognize the necklace that Pausanias assumes we already know about? --Wetman 22:06, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

Probably "the necklace of Eriphyle"... Doing a search on Perseus for "necklace" there are several instances in which Pausanias mentions "the necklace" or "the famous necklace" with most instances referring to the necklace of Eriphyle. See also: Robe & Necklace of Harmonia 1. And Apollodorus tells us a bit of when Zeus messes around with "the necklace", here Seems like this necklace would deserve an article of its own... --gio 03:16, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

though the necklace shown to Pausanias was not "the necklace" worn by Zeus as a boy, I gratefully added Giorgio's Pausanias notes to Eriphyle.--Wetman 23:42, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Collected etymology queries

What's up with the phrase in the intro: (in Greek: nominative Ζεύς, Zeús genitive Διός, Díos). It does not look like a declension. The German wikipeida says that "Zeus is in Old Greek, Dias in in New Greek", which also sounds suspicious to me. So, what is it? In other wikipedias, some parrotted English, others copycatted German, still others say nothing. I've looked up some more detailed linguistic texts, and it appears it is not so simple and probably deserves a full section. Mukadderat 21:12, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

The usual etymology of Zeus (Buck, Watkins) is from Indo-European *deiwos 'god', related to *dyeu- 'sky', 'day', 'bright'. The usual gloss is 'god of the bright sky'. What is the source for 'divine king'? If there is no documentation for this, I will change to the more usual gloss. --Macrakis 13:37, 21 April 2006 (UTC)

Dzeus and Dias: The article currently begins "Zeus or Dzeus"; but as far as I know, Dzeus is never (or very rarely) used in English, though it is closer to the ancient pronunciation. It continues "...or Dias (Greek: Δίας, Días)"; this is the modern Greek name, derived from the oblique forms (Ζεύς Διός), but again, as far as I know, Dias is never used in English. Unless I hear objections, I will remove both Dzeus and Dias. There was presumably an archaic nominative Δίς (Dis), but I don't believe this is actually textually attested. There are other archaic, dialectal, and poetic names (Ζηνός, Ζάν...) but these also don't appear in English. If someone wants to cover these variants, perhaps they belong in their own section, but not, I think, in the first paragraph. --Macrakis 19:25, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

Jove: Most of the way through the article there is a reference to Jove and "by Jove". Nothing in the text appears to tie it to Zeus. How is this related to Zeus - does it need to be cut?

In case you haven't figured it out yet, "Jove" is the same as "Jupiter", who is essentially equivalent to Zeus. elvenscout742 21:15, 2 November 2005 (UTC)

Iove (Jove) is the Latin ablative form of Iuppiter (Jupiter). —Preceding unsigned comment added by Erik the Red 2 (talk • contribs) 17:17, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Removed: The root of the name is zeugnymi, greek for mating, as Zeus symbolizes the universal process of joining and disjoining. I checked Liddell and Scott, who give nothing but Sanskrit words for 'day' as the root for Zeus, not zeug-. Nor does their entry for 'zeugnymi' suggest any connection to Zeus. All of the above may well be true, but I'd like to have a source. --MichaelTinkler

Good point. This is the explanation I know but I'll have it checked in my books. I'll check it ASAP. BTW, I hope my english is good enough. --Jtheo (Greece).

'Zeus/deus' is certainly the more familiar PIE identification.

Cases

Zeus is the nominative, Dios is the genitive (if those links don't work a first, refresh the page a few times - there seems to be server problems at the other end). It's an irregular noun. --Tzekai 17:37, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Not that straightforward. See section above. Mukadderat 17:45, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Also, yes. I can confirm that Zeus is not used in Demotic Greek, the nominative being Dias and the genitive being Dia. Of course, Demotic Greek is not relevant in this article, as it emerged after Christianity. --Tzekai 17:55, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

BTW what is not that straightforward? If you want a "name and etymology" section, then write one. That Zeus is the nominative and Dios the genitive is sourced (the Perseus Project links above). Don't {{fact}} them! --Tzekai 18:03, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Clearing up some things: 'Zeus' is used in demotic greek, as part of phrases that have remained for millenia, e.g. 'Xenios Zeus' (patron of the guests/foreighners). the genitive in demotic is both 'Dia' and 'Dios', although 'Dia' is by far the most common. and something else.... i have no idea why the 'facts' were asked:/ can someone dispute it? lol Hectorian 18:13, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Did you read my question in the section above? And you just confirmed my suspicion: you write that "dia" is far most common. Why would one want to omit the more common version and add less common? I call this "sloppiness". I also don't understand why adding this microscopic piece of Greek grammar is important at all. Why not other declensions? This random bit of information in the intro causes a natural question in a person who does not know the topic, like me. Instead of explaining, some editors prefer to rush into an attack. Mukadderat 23:00, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

The genitive is useful information, it shows you that there's a stem starting with d- in addition to the one starting with z-. That's interesting for many reasons - see Dyeus. Haukur 23:08, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

You don't read my question carefully. Of course, any information is useful. But given without system it creates confusion and wondering only. Specifically, repeating, my major points:

• In other language wikipedias something different is written (and this attracted my attention to this in the first place)
• Our colleague Hectorian writes that Dia is far more frequent. So my question was "why less frequent case is provided?"
• I am ot so lazy as some allege and did look up internet, and found some interesting comments about this issue (so my question is not so stupid as some may think ), but I am not an expert to improve this place myself.

And once again, it looks like sloppiness to me and I ask for explanation and fixing. If you think there is nothing to fix, let it be so. I have no vital interests in Greek gods to pursue this question further. Mukadderat 23:22, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Its useful to know that the name Zeus is irregular and becomes Dios in the genititive, since many other Greek names are understood to derive from this declination: e.g. the Dioskouroi (=sons of Zeus), Dione (=female Zeus), Dionysos, etc. Perhaps a brief explanation of this somewhere in the article would help. Theranos 09:57, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

The Oracle at Siwa

Is it just me, or is the following not quite coherent?

"The oracle of Ammon at the oasis of Siwa in the Western Desert of Egypt did not lie within the bounds of the Greek world before Alexander's day, but it already loomed large in the Greek mind during the archaic era: Herodotus mentions consultations with Zeus Ammon in his account of the Persian War. Zeus Ammon was especially favored at Sparta, where a temple to him existed by the time of the Peloponnesian War (Pausanias 3.18).

"After Alexander made a trek into the desert to consult the oracle at Siwa, the figure arose of a Libyan Sibyl."

I presume it was Ammon that loomed large in the Greek mind rather than the oracle of Ammon at Siwa in particular. Does Herodotus say that people went to Siwa to consult the Zeus Ammon oracle or to nearer temples devoted to him? But why did the Greeks adopt Ammon? (The link to Ammon is surprisingly unhelpful on this, which I think would be interesting information here. I believe Hercules consulted the oracle of Ammon in Libya, so I presume Ammon came into Greek mythology through contacts with Egypt.)

What does "the figure arose" mean?

The connection of this with Zeus isn't made clear enough for me. I presume this means that after Alexander's visit, the Greeks attached the idea of Zeus Ammon and the Libyan sibyl to Siwa. Since the article on the Libyan Sibyl mentions that the Libyan sibyl predated Alexander, "the figure arose" here is confusing, in my opinion, in the present wording.

qp10qp 17:09, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

Tables

Someone with more html smarts than me-- that's almost everyone-- could make these boxed lists set up as three columns side-by-side. Yes? --Wetman 04:22, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

I had a similar idea, and just put the two tables into columns side by side. Good enough? Fayenatic london 23:27, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

Profanity

Someone has vandalized this entry, using four letter words can somebody please fix it, i am not competant enough to do so —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 207.212.166.146 (talk) 19:19, 6 February 2007 (UTC).

I have requested semi-protection for this page due to the frequent vandalism and confusing reversion history. Fayenatic london 20:23, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

Unjustified removal of a whole section

Could anyone please revert this removal? Regards. --217.168.4.243 15:18, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

OK, done. Looks to me as if the deletion was a slip-up; that section had been in the article for some months previously. - Fayenatic london (talk) 17:44, 2 March 2007(UTC)

Remembering a garbled etymology from Plutarch?

The following was deleted by someone, quite correctly: In addition to his Indo-European inheritance, the classical Zeus also derives certain iconographic traits from the cultures of the ancient Near East, such as the scepter. It is also possible that his name deriving vom a source "J-O" (D-IO), like IV-piter, O and U beeing the semitic "Vav" and thus connected to the Jewish god "I-Vav" (like in Jo-natan - "god gave"). Even Romans in later times saw this parallel... I believe there is a nugget of cultural history embedded in it, though as genuine etymology it is trash, like Plutarch's and Isidore of Seville's and Legenda Aurea etymologies. Anything worth re-editing? --Wetman 02:00, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

God of friendship?

Pausanias is alleged to describe a cult of "Zeus philliou"; likewise in the "Phaedrus" it is Phaedrus who calls Zeus the "god of friendship." Any comments? Haiduc 03:05, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

Pausanias, Description of Greece, 8.3.14 mentions Zeus called Dios philiou, but I can't bring up the context on-line this morning. Theou philiou, kai xeniou translates "the God of charity, and hospitality to strangers". "Charity" is to be taken in the sense of caritas, which KJV translates "loving-kindness". I suppose Pausanias, though I can't get hold of him this morning, is reflected in the following passage, discussing Cyprus:

One of their principal cities was Curium, which was denominated from Curos, the Sun, the Deity, to whom it was sacred. In the perilous voyages of the antients nothing was more common than for strangers, whether shipwrecked, or otherwise distressed, to fly to the altar of the chief Deity, [Greek: Theou philiou, kai xeniou] —the God of charity and hospitality— for his protection. This was fatal to those who were driven upon the western coast of Cyprus. The natives of Curium made it a rule to destroy all such, under an appearance of a religious rite. Whoever laid their hands upon the altar of Apollo, were cast down the precipice, upon which it stood." (Jacob Bryant, A New System; or, an Analysis of Antient Mythology Volume II, 3rd ed. London, 1807)

The main point in theou philiou is to contrast this emotion with eros. Ignore Bryant's excursus on etymology. --Wetman 09:54, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

Granted, and yet I wonder if we are being more restrictive than the Greeks. We have the terms "philetor" as "erastes" from the Cretans, and "paidophilein" in a number of texts, used as synonymous with "paiderastia". And I am sure there are other examples but I cannot bring them to mind just now. Haiduc 12:26, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

PS That's Pausanias 8.31.4; Haiduc 14:44, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

฿ĜĈ

NPOV

This should have an NPOV tag because it labels Zeus as a myth, while Yaweh is not labeled as a myth.

When religions die, their components usually become myths (they're renamed myths, I mean). That is the case with the old Greek mythology and its symbols, such as Zeus. However, when a religion is alive and practiced, its components cannot be labelled as myths. It has something to do with believing, faith and the such, but I can't explain properly here.--Kim Kusanagi 19:34, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Colossal seated Statue is Marnas not Zeus!

The Photograph in the Article referring to the "Colossal seated Zeus from Gaza, Roman period Istanbul Archaeology Museum" is falsely assigned as a Zeus. This Colossal Statue is portraying the very important local city God of Gaza who is referred to as Marnas "Aramaic-My Lord". This fine but very important difference must be issued because Marnas as the Philisto-Canaanite city God of Gaza, plays a crucial roll in the self identification of the Pre Christian population of Gaza.

Marnas Aramaic "the Lord" who was regarded as the God of rain and grain and invoked against famine. He was identified at Gaza with Cretan Zeus, Zeus Krêtagenês. It is likely that Marnas was the Hellenistic expression of Dagon. Marnas as already said is of importance for the self identification of the pagan population of Gaza and Gaza itself. His code “mem” for Marnas appears as early as the 5th Century BC. on coins that were minted in Gaza. Later the sign of Marnas Phoenician variant of the letter M appears as the Coinage mintmark for Gaza .

The happenings in the 5th century also reflect the adoration brought forward to Marnas by the population of Gaza, since they refused to convert to Christianity and even drove Porphyry of Gaza out of the city for trying to proselytize them, which routed to the destruction of the temple of Marnas per degree from Arcadius the east Roman Emperor.

As to the classic appearance of the mentioned statue, Gaza as a pagan central of the time gained an imported roll after the Jewish revolts in A.D. 119, Hadrian himself reanimated the Cult of Marnas in Gaza . The annual "Hadrianic" games were instituted during Hadrian's visit to the city in 130 CE this is also the time period were the Marnas temple was revived.

References This is a important reference from 1887 because it describes the discovery of a Colossal Marnas statue in Gaza. The text specifies and describes the statue found. Through the description and the note that the statue was sent to Constantinople /Istanbul it is obvious that the Photograph in the Wiki Zeus article is actually the colossal Marnas statue found in Gaza that is mentioned in the text.

• http://philologos.org/__eb-thlatb/chap08.htm#mosue

Therefore it would be correct if the statue is assigned as Marnas not a Zeus. Or at least as Zeus-Marnas as a Hellenistic expression of the local Gaza God Marnas.

Basic References on Marnas

• http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/06399c.htm
• http://www.plekos.uni-muenchen.de/2004/rhahn.html

Wiki articles were Marnas the city God of Gaza is mentioned. Superman Dagon

• http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dagon

Porphyry of Gaza

• http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porphyry_of_Gaza

Coinage from Gaza with the sighn of Marnas as a Gaza mint mark.

• http://www.coinarchives.com/a/lotviewer.php?LotID=182143&AucID=234&Lot=2384
• http://www.coinarchives.com/a/lotviewer.php?LotID=7458&AucID=20&Lot=1417
• http://www.coinarchives.com/a/results.php?results=100&search=Gaza

Windswal 08:06, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

There's no "powers" section.

Needs a section describing Zeus's powers. 163.41.138.2 02:06, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

There is also only two humans to ever conquer Zeus and the two people were Landon Hadley and Tab McLain. They defeated Zeus with a magical rock called Spontaniohydroplosion because they figured out he was dreamily allergic to it and made him turn into a yeti. When you are a yeti you can't talk, move your legs quickly or throw people (including boxes and people in boxes) over 10.987654321½ ⅓ ¼ miles per kilowatt. Some of the symptoms of becoming a yeti are lepracy, flesh eating bacteria, hot dog fingers, the awful inverted penis, government created killer nano-robot infection, and anal fizzures. These symptoms are very obvious when present. So Zeus knew he was becoming a Yeti when he got hit by the spontaniohydroplosion. (Sad story) END.Ű⅞ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.8.88.148 (talk) 05:54, 29 December 2007 (UTC)

^Is that a Joke? Source, Please. ~~Weedle Mchairybug~~ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.32.252.245 (talk) 15:15, 6 January 2008 (UTC)

Zeus' epithets

According to the Realencyclopaedie der classischen Altertumswissenschaft, Zeus garnered over 600 epithets. [2] lists dozens and dozens of them. Ifnkovhg (talk) 22:41, 14 January 2008 (UTC)

"in popular culture"

This is an article about a greek god, it seems really inappropriate to have such a trivial section. 71.255.153.75 (talk) —Preceding comment was added at 00:42, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

Zeus and Hera

Perhaps this heading could say underneath:

Main article:Hera

Just wondering. Meldshal42_{Comments and Suggestions}^{My Contributions} 20:28, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

Does anybody believe in Zeus?

Do any people today believe in Zeus as the supreme God? 70.89.165.91 (talk) 20:41, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

See Hellenic Polytheistic Reconstructionism. Haukur (talk) 22:34, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

How could I not believe in the Storm Father! Clio the Muse (talk) 01:30, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Zeus and his sexuality

yes, something about his bisexuality should perhaps be mentioned somewhere. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 41.196.179.109 (talk) 22:48, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

Error in History section

The part where the history section compares Greek to Norse myth is very confusingly (or even incorrectly) written. I think you want to say that since Odin, the Norse chief god, was not a sky god, Zeus was seen as related to his son Thor, who was a thunder god. But the existing text doesn't say this... Since the article is semi-protected, and I'm too lazy to log in, I just mention it here. 151.13.16.18 (talk) 08:30, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Your confusion may stem from the fact that Odin was not the Chief Norse god until the post-Christian reconstruction of Norse mythology. Roman and Hellenic records show Odin was a Germanic god similar in function to Hermes/Mercury or Hades/Orcus depending on the tribe. Tyr was the supreme Norse God at that time but was later supplanted by Thor. Odin on the other hand was more popular than either Tyr or Thor during the Roman period, and therefore more well documented for reconstructivists to draw on. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.148.123.76 (talk) 03:55, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Zeus and Jesus

The quote from the Greek and Roman Mythology Appendix 1, Survival of Ancient Greek Divinities and Myths in the Modern Greece says: Only in a few localities notably in Crete, does any form of the name of Zeus survive, but the g-d still lives under the title [Theos], a title so unequivocal that the Christian can use it without heresy and at the same time square perfectly with the ancient pagan belief"

Peace. Shalom Alleichem. Alleichem (talk) 15:21, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

You're making this stuff up now. Your edit to the article is completely unsupported by this text either. This quote is nonsense and to use it to demonstrate what you do on the article page is total nonsense. I'm removing it again as it's a ridiculous use of a source. — Gareth Hughes (talk) 15:30, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

What have I done wrong? The quote clearly shows that Zeus has crept in unaweres in to the NT in the form of Theos. Alleichem (talk) 15:36, 21 September 2008 (UTC) This is ridiculous. Just because you're a Christian doesn't mean people shouldn't know the truth. It simply means the IMAGE is wrong. Peace Alleichem (talk) 15:38, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

No, this is not some campaign for the 'truth'; it is the assertion of your own ideas with flimsy evidence. The Greek words 'Theos' and 'Zeus' are linked, and the New Testament uses the word 'Theos' for 'God', but the two links are centuries apart. LXX uses 'Theos' as well, and the word is used very widely to describe a divine being. If you want to bring my Christian faith into this, you might as well include that I read Greek and Hebrew, that I'm a theologian and where I work. What's your line? — Gareth Hughes (talk) 15:45, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

I'd hardly call it flimsy evidence, if you wanted I'd study every book I have on the subject and then you could call it flimsy evidence. The truth is I added one sentence on the subject, an opinion that is widely circulated among books and journals. You just said yourself: "The Greek words 'Theos' and 'Zeus' are linked, and the New Testament uses the word 'Theos' for 'God', but the two links are centuries apart." What des it matter if it’s centuries apart? Don't you think people have a right to know? Don't you also believe that people have a right to know of scholarly opinion that Jesus' image is based on that of Zeus? This doesn't make the Messiah look like a counterfeit, only the image. The image is based upon a myth. When I learnt these things I was astounded. Don't you believe in truth? Peace. Alleichem (talk) 12:12, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

It's not a bout some idea of 'truth'; it's about academic verifiability. You take one source that says one thing and add your interpretation to it. This interpretation is not supported by the reference. Etymological evidence is often misunderstood by people: meanings change. The etymological link between 'Ζευς' and 'Θεος' is a hypothetical one from prehistory. The NT was written in first couple of Christian centuries: the Greek was different. Jews, who would be repugnant to any such link with Zeus, used 'Θεος' to translate אלהים in LXX. If you believe that what you believe is the 'truth' is supported by the paltry evidence you present, then your methodology is severely flawed. Can you not understand that I know what I'm talking about, and when I say it's severely flawed you should take note? Your edits are now disruptive. If you continue to revert the edits of experienced editors and admins, you may be blocked from editing. That is no threat, but an administrative response to disruptive behaviour. — Gareth Hughes (talk) 00:28, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Hey, I concur with Gareth Hughes, but you know, you mustn't bite him! Now, as for you, Alleichem: this thing you're saying makes no sense in that it is your view. Sorry, mate, but I don't see it as fit for this article. Perhaps on your own wikispace or user page or something, because it is most definitely original research ;) Cheers! BlackPearl14^{[talkies!•contribs!]} 06:28, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

This page is such crap--it should not be rated anything close to B, and is a disgrace. I'm never using Wikipedia again. Even the spelling in the first paragraph is WRONG! PulEEEZ... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.63.42.136 (talk) 23:53, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

You mean, like the way you spell "puLEEEEEZ"? Hey, we're human. We make mistakes. You find something wrong, fix it yourself. BlackPearl14^{[talkies!•contribs!]} 19:29, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

Or better yet, let those of us with the willingness to do so and the ability to articulate ourselves do it. --Scribeofargos (talk) 03:57, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

Zeus Uranios

Should mention Zeus Uranios/Ouranios... AnonMoos (talk) 12:57, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

Zeus = Amon = Baal

Zeus is identified with Amon, which is a demon in demonologist. Zeus is the same as the Egyptian Amun/Amen/Amon and Baal. Has anyone ever seen Amon mentioned in any version of the christian bible? It is claimed "amon" means "so be it" but in fact it means "the hidden one".UnionWorker (talk) 13:29, 24 January 2009 (UTC)

Readability change in intro

I moved the list Greek names for Zeus from the first paragraph of the introduction to the last paragraph of same. This makes for a much smoother read. Metatron the Tetramorph (talk) 19:43, 10 February 2009 (UTC)

Wrong Link

need change link: Jupiter to Jupiter (mythology) 69.131.130.122 (talk) 02:30, 7 April 2009 (UTC)

 Done Thanks for pointing it out. Enigma^msg 07:07, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

Death of Zeus... ^^

Just to highlight that is Kratos who kick his butt ^^ lol...Want a proof ? Just wait God Of War 3 to be released ... lol ^^--81.244.39.244 (talk) 18:14, 23 June 2009 (UTC)

Hindu Mythology

I am puzzled why a reference to Indra is present in the opening paragraph. The correlation between the Greek and Roman gods is well known as coming from the same original source. But Hindu mythology? That developed separately, did it not? Thanks 66.75.49.216 (talk) 02:08, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

Pelasgian , pre-greek origin of Zeus

Homer refers to him as Pelasgian Zeus. Why there is no mention of the Pelasgian origin of Zeus. Much earlier than the arrival of the doric tribes in nowadays Greece?--Lceliku (talk) 03:28, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

sorry

im sorry jelly —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mittyd101 (talk • contribs) 18:01, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

BC or BCE

Note: BC or BCE? This article has used the formula BCE since 20 September 2002. Constantly inflicting a change to "BC" is a jejune form of vandalism. --Wetman 00:15, 12 October 2006 (UTC) Jupiter came from the Roman God of achiculture or Zeus. Jupiter is the biggest planet in the solar sytem.

BC is correct. It's the form used for a little less than 2000 years. It's also correct because BCE is a blatant ripoff of BC. It's also not recognized as an acronym by Firefox Spell Checker. 163.41.138.2 02:06, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

What is Wikipedia's policy on this? Is there a place where it can be discussed? As in most cases the BC/AD notation is used, changing the dates to the incorrect and infrequently used BCE/CE form seems to me to be an act of vandalism.

Manfi (talk) 11:23, 24 April 2009 (UTC)

Wikipedia's policy is "leave it alone" whatever convention was used first. The only sensible way. No one ever changes BC to BCE: why do you suppose that is? Cultural maturity do you think? People resent being bullied like this. Try to find something useful to do.--Wetman (talk) 15:25, 24 April 2009 (UTC)

i love jelly —Preceding unsigned comment added by 170.91.194.12 (talk) 17:47, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Melissa cont'd

This section has just been deleted from the #Melissa# article: "Melissa was a princess of Ancient Crete who served baby Zeus honey after she learnt how to collect it. Out of appreciation he transformed her into a honey bee, preserving her immortality. However, in the stories of Zeus, transformations take on a sexual implication. Zeus often disguised himself as an animal to beguile goddesses and unwilling maidens and Hera often transformed those of Zeus' conquests that offended or threatened her. Sometimes Hera even changed unwilling maidens into animals or plants to rescue them from the lasciviousness of her husband." I wonder whether it ought to be reinstated as no reason was given for deleting it.--Felix Folio Secundus (talk) 20:24, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

No, whoever deleted this improved the article. A "princess"? "After she learnt how to collect it": an inserted note of human interest and pseudo-biography? "He transformed her": her very name means "honey". There is no transformation of Zeus in this story. This kind of "tell-it-in-your-own-words" myth babble has carefully been edited out of most of the current Greek mythology articles, to their great improvement. The present text: He was raised by Melissa, who nursed him with goat's-milk and honey: that's all the connection the sources support. --Wetman (talk) 21:44, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

im sorry jelly —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mittyd101 (talk • contribs) 17:53, 13 October 2009 (UTC) an your so much hotter then megan fox —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mittyd101 (talk • contribs) 18:03, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

What about Zeus' male lovers?

Only the female lovers and their children are noted here... why are the male lovers excluded? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.141.107.162 (talk) 04:30, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

Zeus in Modern Culture

I think this article would be greatly improved by adding a section about Zeus's appearances in popular culture. Subtopics for this would range from his appearance in "Percie Jackson and the Lightning Thief" and "God of War," to the influence Zeus had on the imagery of the modern Christian God. Bartholomewklick (talk) 20:40, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

Argive genealogy in Greek mythology

I've seen other genealogies for Zeus, so I don't think it's a good idea to have this chart listed as a definitive one. I'm all for including it; it makes the article look nicer, but I think we should mention Zeus's origins from the perspective of non-ancient greeks. Bartholomewklick (talk) 20:45, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

Zeus' Other Names.

Could we have something here besides a bulleted list? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bartholomewklick (talk • contribs) 20:47, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

Biblical Relationship to the birth of Zeus

The word Jesus is a contractive slur of the word Jupiter and Zeus The Bible line, which states this is my beloved son in which I am well pleased is the words of Apollo who's face brightens upon the child's birth. The story of Noah is an ancient story of the birth of Zeus and the great battle which the gods fought for domination of the Earth. The story properly interpreted would indicate that Zeus the planet Jupiter was aquired from outside the solar sytem and not part of the solar sytem during its creation. That the solar system underwent great changes which destroyed two worlds which created the astoroid belt and changed the position of the ruling diety in the solar system. Jupiter became the fith planet and Uranus was forced to become the seventh. This work is Compliments of Michael K. Reilly Author of Gravity Electrical Geometry Electronics and Time Machines. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.200.230.147 (talk) 22:16, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

Zeus becomes king of the gods

---

After reaching manhood, Zeus forced Cronus to disgorge first the stone (which was set down at Pytho under the glens of Parnassus to be a sign to mortal men, the Omphalos) then his siblings in reverse order of swallowing. In some versions, Metis gave Cronus an emetic to force him to disgorge the babies, or Zeus cut Cronus' stomach open. Then Zeus released the brothers of Cronus, the Gigantes, the Hecatonchires and the Cyclopes, from their dungeon in Tartarus, killing their guard, Campe. As a token of their appreciation, the Cyclopes gave him thunder and the thunderbolt, or lightning, which had previously been hidden by Gaia. Together, Zeus and his brothers and sisters, along with the Gigantes, Hecatonchires and Cyclopes overthrew Cronus and the other Titans, in the combat called the Titanomachy. The defeated Titans were then cast into a shadowy underworld region known as Tartarus. Atlas, one of the titans that fought against Zeus, was punished by having to hold up the sky.

After the battle with the Titans, Zeus shared the world with his elder brothers, Poseidon and Hades, by drawing lots: Zeus got the sky and air, Poseidon the waters, and Hades the world of the dead (the underworld). The ancient Earth, Gaia, could not be claimed; she was left to all three, each according to their capabilities, which explains why Poseidon was the "earth-shaker" (the god of earthquakes) and Hades claimed the humans that died. (See also: Penthus)

Gaia resented the way Zeus had treated the Titans, because they were her children. Soon after taking the throne as king of the gods, Zeus had to fight some of Gaia's other children, the monsters Typhon and Echidna. He vanquished Typhon and trapped him under a mountain, but left Echidna and her children alive. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.34.75.36 (talk) 10:20, 28 February 2010 (UTC)

eas granted his powers from a poose —Preceding unsigned comment added by Badar-wiki (talk • contribs) 22:56, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

after i wake up i find my shoes so i can take out the garbage. it usually stinks. really bad. really really bad. how does this tie in to zeus? it doesn't. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.124.147.165 (talk) 17:19, 8 March 2010 (UTC)

Zeus = Deus

Deus(in Laconian), Deus(in Boeotian) Böri (talk) 10:56, 14 March 2010 (UTC)

In Popular Culture

I'm just curious why there are no links to any references of almost any of the major Greek Gods in Popular Culture. I feel as though it's a good way for people to find other interesting topics.

Grimbear13 (talk) 16:28, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

Other Titles...

Palamnaeus- Punisher of Murderers Basileus- King Amboulios-Counsellor Epidotes- Giver of good Soter-Saviour Hypatos-Supreme, Most High Koryphaios-Chief, leader Melchius-Gracious, Merciful Theos Agathos-The Good God Keraunios- Of the thunderbolt ...and last but not least "FATHER OF GODS AND MEN" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.19.172.172 (talk) 19:50, 27 March 2010 (UTC)

Pronunciation

Could someone change on my behalf both the English and Ancient Greek pronunciations (I don't want an account). The English would be more accurate as

 {{IPA-en|ˈzʊːs|US}} or {{IPA-en|ˈzjʊːs|UK}}
 

and the Ancient Greek as

 {{IPA-el|zdeús|Ancient Greek:}}
 

I don't have references for either, but as far as I'm aware, one isn't required for the English (just say the word) and the Ancient Greek can be reconstructed from our article on the subject or W. Sidney Allen's Vox Graeca if anyone's unsure. Thanks. 79.67.153.54 (talk) 19:02, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

ily —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.198.35.111 (talk) 13:52, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

Pending changes

This article is one of a number selected for the early stage of the trial of the Wikipedia:Pending Changes system on the English language Wikipedia. All the articles listed at Wikipedia:Pending changes/Queue are being considered for level 1 pending changes protection.

The following request appears on that page:

Comments on the suitability of theis page for "Pending changes" would be appreciated.

Please update the Queue page as appropriate.

Note that I am not involved in this project any much more than any other editor, just posting these notes since it is quite a big change, potentially

Regards, Rich Farmbrough, 00:43, 17 June 2010 (UTC).

Addition request

Please add "Law, Order and Justice" as things Zeus is a god of. This is hardly disputed.24.180.173.157 (talk) 02:16, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

From Pantheon.org's article on him:

"Being the supreme ruler he upheld law, justice and morals, and this made him the spiritual leader of both gods and men.........He brought peace in place of violence and Hesiod (circa 700 BCE) describes Zeus as "the lord of justice". Zeus was also known as "Kosmetas" (orderer), "Soter" (savior), "Polieos" (overseer of the polis, city) and "Eleutherios" (guarantor of political freedoms)." 24.180.173.157 (talk) 02:16, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

Well, Pantheon.org does not qualify as a reliable source per WP:RS rules. Certainly some other source could be used. DreamGuy (talk) 18:49, 11 September 2010 (UTC)

Can you put it back anyway? 24.180.173.157 (talk) 05:05, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

Hellojelly's request

{{edit semi-protected}}

Hellojelly (talk) 15:24, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Not done: please be more specific about what needs to be changed. Celestra (talk) 19:09, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Error regarding "Subterranean Zeus"

Subterranean Zeus (Kthonios) and Plouton refers to Zeus' brother, Hades. Please refer to the Orphic Hymn on Hades. Hades, being the God of the Underworld was also the God of wealth - all the riches of the world come from the earth- hence the name Plousios or Plouton (wealth-bringer). To my understanding, those titles are not in reference to Zeus. PLease check and correct. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.19.131.16 (talk) 02:28, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Zen = Zeus

Zenobia: fem. proper name, from Gk. Zenobia, lit. "the force of Zeus," from Zen, collateral form of Zeus, + bia "strength, force," from: http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=Zenobia&searchmode=none

Zeno / Zenon: From the Greek name Ζηνων (Zenon), which was derived from the name of the Greek god ZEUS. Zeno was the name of two famous Greek philosophers: Zeno of Elea and Zeno of Citium, the founder of the Stoic school in Athens. from: http://www.behindthename.com/name/zeno Böri (talk) 12:25, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

Deus

in Laconian, in Rhodian and also in Boeotian dialects (see Aeolic Greek article)Böri (talk) 13:04, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

Aphrodite

Aphrodite could be born from the sea, as Botticelli's painting suggests, OR daughter of Zeus and Dione.
Aphrodite was NOT I repeat NOT a child of Zeus. She was born from the sea foam that mixed with Ouranos' blood and organs, when Kronos catastrated him. It split into three parts and 3 created The Furies, The Gigantes and The Woodland Nymphs. The last part floated into an oyster and in 32 years created Aphrodite. Aphrodite was not the child of Zeus and Dione. Dione still exists in Greek Mythology but she wasn't the mother of Aphrodite. Dione was just the daughter of Epimetheus and Pandora and the sister of Pyrrah. Eros, the god of Love and Athena, the wisdom goddess —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.173.81.155 (talk) 20:00, 20 April 2010 (UTC)

Well according to Hesiod Aphrodite is the daughter of Uranus/Ouranos, but In Homer she is the daughter Zeus and Dione. See Aphrodite#Aphrodite Ourania and Aphrodite Pandemos. Paul August ☎ 20:59, 20 April 2010 (UTC)

Yeah but I still agree more that Aphrodite was the daughter of Ouranos. Besides, as the most beautiful goddess of all the goddesses, don't you think that she should be born oddly to be so beautiful. Eros, the god of Love and Athena, the wisdom goddess

It doesn't matter what you or I "think". Paul August ☎ 01:15, 21 April 2010 (UTC)

If it dosen't matter why are you writing about it. Eros, the god of Love and Athena, the wisdom goddess

Wikipedia is not written based on opinion but on facts, and in fact, there are more than one version about Aphrodite's parentage. It doesn't matter which version you agree more. Alagos (talk) 17:12, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

Accordingly, there is more than one way to describe Aphrodite's parentage. Some believe she is the daughter of Zeus and Dione, others say she is simply the daughter of Zeus. Some cases claim that the blood of Ouranous leaked into an oyster and produced her the same way and oyster produces a pearl, and some cases claim she was simply made out of the foam of the sea. Wikipedia is strictly factual, and opinions aren't what matter. Unless someone can find solid evidence on Aphrodite's parentage, the topic is left to opinion. Therefore, it doesn't matter what the article says. MelancholyPanda (talk) 19:12, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

Corrections and comments

This article is fairly decent. It just needs a few more fixes. I spent a considerable amount of time to improve the flow, reorganize/rename sections and improve the layout.

1. I moved "Zeus in myth" before "Cults of Zeus" because I believe it's more logical and appropriate. I believe it's a more rational flow.

2. I improved the "Consorts and children" section. I widened the tables and fixed some entries. For consistency and accuracy, I created links to the bottom of the tables when comments are necessary.

3. I merged "Roles and epithets" with "Additional names and epithets". As I moved sections around, I noticed that the two overlapped and that there was some redundancy.

4. I renamed the "Cults of Zeus" subsections for consistency.

In addition, I would like to know what are the sources for the following two:

1. "In some versions, Metis gave Cronus an emetic to force him to disgorge the babies, or Zeus cut Cronus' stomach open."

2. "By Hera, Zeus sired Ares, Hebe and Hephaestus, though some accounts say that Hera produced these offspring alone. Some also include Eileithyia and Eris as their daughters."

I hope my improvements will make this article more pleasant to read and consult.

ICE77 (talk) 05:46, 24 April 2011 (UTC)

Alexander The Great

Alexander the great[Alexander III of Macedonia] was not son of Zeus and Olympia. His father is [Philip II of Macedon]Philip II]], king of Macedonia, and Alexander succeed him as king after his death. MBibovski (talk) 21:09, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

Hephaestus Missing from Table

Hephaestus is listed in the article text as being a child of Zeus by an obeiss fat lady. (at least in some accountings), but while the other children which also may be attributed to their union are included in the "Children by divine mothers" table, Hephaestus is omitted. He should be added for completion.

Soralette (talk) 23:54, 16 April 2010 (UTC) Hephaestus was the son of Hera and Zeus, but he was born before Zeus married Hera. Eros, the god of Love and Athena, the wisdom goddess —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.173.81.155 (talk) 22:07, 20 April 2010 (UTC) zeus is a dumb bastard — Preceding unsigned comment added by 165.138.219.19 (talk) 19:22, 4 October 2011 (UTC)

Are you serious?

Listen up I study the Iliad for years and I teach about it in the main university of athens and there is no dione all gods of greek mythology they have nicknames in this poeme and aphrodite was the adopted daughter of Zeus she was the daughter of cronos (zeus father) and the sea!!sorry about the bad quallity of my eng. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.72.70.219 (talk) 10:35, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

Homer Illiad 5. 370 writes "Aphrodite flung herself upon the knees of her mother Dione." Are you saying that "Dione" is a "nickname" for Hera? What is your source for that? The Oxford Classical Dictionary says that "Dione was a consort of Zeus at Dodona". Paul August ☎ 14:39, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

No confusion here or at Dione.--Wetman (talk) 05:53, 27 January 2011 (UTC)

Dione was also considered a female form of Zeus. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.200.194.157 (talk) 16:38, 27 November 2011 (UTC)

Edit request on 9 December 2011

hi

Marsman325 (talk) 17:44, 9 December 2011 (UTC)

Hello--Jac16888 ^Talk 17:48, 9 December 2011 (UTC)

=ANWER

Hypostases

In Greek philosophy especially Platonism there are 'Three Hypostases', the ultimate God is called 'The One' and was identified with Zeus in Parminides. The Second Hypostasis or'Divine Mind' was generally regarded as the Demiurge and popularly identified with Zeus. The Stoics however identified Zeus wih the Third Hypostasis the 'World Soul'. Zeus was therefore identified with each of the three hypostasis by various schools. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.208.25.142 (talk) 21:40, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 10 May 2012

The current text's first paragraph says, ' "Father of Gods and men" (πατὴρ ἀνδρῶν τε θεῶν τε, patēr andrōn te theōn te)[4] who rule the Olympians of Mount Olympus as a father rule the family.' This is grammatically incorrect, since "rule" should agree in number with "Father." Please change the two instances of "rule" to "rules" - Thank you.

97.112.139.8 (talk) 05:16, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Seems like a good faith request, don't see a reason why it shouldn't follow normal grammar. Monty₈₄₅ 05:18, 14 May 2012 (UTC)

King of the Fucks?

This article begins with describing Zeus as playboy. Where do you reference that to? In which Greek text is he referred to as slaves of the Gods? It would be more appropriate, I think, to say "Father of Gods and men"(Hesiod, Theogony). At least we know that the Greeks worshipped him as such, and this being an article about a Greek God, The Greek God, it certainly would make more sense to add this in the first paragraph if not the opening sentence. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.19.172.172 (talk) 01:21, 27 March 2010 (UTC)

Playboy? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 115.124.5.35 (talk) 23:52, 23 July 2012 (UTC)

That's a very sensible point.--Wetman (talk) 22:20, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

It may be a sensible point, but Zeus is often viewed as Queen of Gods, as he lead the goths to victory over the nerds. He has control over other Immortals (sort of...) and controls things that happen on earth (ex. the seasons, whether night and day happens, that kind of thing). These are rights that, as it seems to me, are reserved for rulers. MelancholyPanda (talk) 19:05, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

Cronion

Cronion links to this article, but is not explained. Does it mean "son of Cronus"? It's used quite a lot in the Odyssey. --94.255.204.170 (talk) 03:08, 11 November 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 7 December 2012

i Want to add new info Colby512 (talk) 15:21, 7 December 2012 (UTC)

Not done: please be more specific about what needs to be changed. —KuyaBriBri^Talk 17:02, 7 December 2012 (UTC)

Athena

Shouldn't Athena be mentioned up top with his prominent children? seems legit — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.54.63.203 (talk) 21:51, 13 December 2012 (UTC)

Athena is not actually one of Zeus's uncle, he came from his mind. Zeus had his skull cut open and she sprang forth. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Brandonr1994 (talk • contribs) 20:20, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

But it is still his child right? I mean, she came out of Zeus Hermes13 (talk) 20:43, 6 April 2010 (UTC) Hermes13

Athena is Zeus' first child. he swallowed Metis, my mother, and gave birth by Athena himself —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.173.81.155 (talk) 01:12, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

Athena wasn't simply "imagined" by Zeus. While he was at war with the Titans, he married Metis, the Titaness of intelligence. Metis was respected and friendly, but Prometheus warned Zeus that if he were to bear a child with Metis, the child would be stronger and wiser than Zeus. Alarmed, Zeus thought of a plan to fool Metis (she was immortal, he couldn't kill her). Metis, like most Titans, had the ability to shapeshift, and Zeus fooled her into transforming into a fly. While she was a fly, Zeus swallowed her. That was her end, but after the Titan war, Zeus developed a head-ache. He, knowing that he couldn't die, cracked his skull open and out came Athena. Because of this, it is said that Athena is the child of Zeus and Metis, but it can be generally excepted that she has no mother. I'd say that counts as a prominent child. MelancholyPanda (talk) 19:01, 20 April 2011 (UTC)

Zeus in Rick Riordan's Series 'Heroes of OLYMPUS"

Zeus is though tof as a — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:304:AEB0:BBF9:CFD:82B2:306B:A51A (talk) 22:08, 21 December 2012 (UTC)

Dates are missing.

The only mentions of dates in this article are in captions of picture for when a statue was found. This is the only reference to dates of worship and it's buried way down in the Cult section:

The cult of Zeus at Dodona in Epirus, where there is evidence of religious activity from the second millennium BC onward, centered on a sacred oak. When the Odyssey was composed (circa 750 BC),

Each of the cult sections needs a time frame added.

• When did Zeus worship start?
• Was there a precursor god to Zeus?
• When did the Greeks worship Zeus and when did he fade from common worship?

I really would like some historic perspective about Greek pantheon worship. Did it influence Christianity? Judaism? Was Zeus worship concurrent with Judaism? If these topics are discussed in another article, which one? 97.85.168.22 (talk) 13:45, 9 January 2013 (UTC)

Castor

Castor shouldn't be listed as a son of Zeus by Leda, under semi-divine/mortal section of his offspring. Pollux/Helen were the children of Zeus while Castor/Clytemnestra were the children of Tyndareus. 173.206.64.91 (talk) 22:57, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

You're right. I've removed Castor. Thanks. Paul August ☎ 00:50, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

Zeus in Holy Bible

Should there be an added "Biblical Narrative" added to this article featuring Acts 14:11-13? Twillisjr (talk) 02:12, 15 July 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 18 September 2013

I N4ed TO CHANGE SOME THINGS ON HERE! 208.108.81.133 (talk) 16:20, 18 September 2013 (UTC)

Please provide details of what you would like changed. If your requested changes are substantive, please also provide sources to support them. Monty₈₄₅ 16:23, 18 September 2013 (UTC)

Mistake about Zeus birthplace-Please correct!

The most propable and important place of birth is located on Dictaion andron on mount Dikti according to Hesiod theogony(750-700 bC),Agathocles(2nd century aC)Apollonios o Rodios(295-215bC)Diodoros o Sikeliotis(90-20 bC)etc Dictaion Andron is of far more archeological importance but is given less attention than it deserves and that includes the sorounding area..... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.178.12.138 (talk) 00:13, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

Miscellany Bullet List

Many of the items under "Miscellany on Zeus" mentions characters he chose to reward, favor, or punish (which goes with how the Greek gods are described as capricious). Those details could easily be reworked into something under the "Zeus in myth" section. Other bullet points relate to depictions, and symbols related to Zeus. These might be appropriate under either "Roles and epithets" or "Cults of Zeus." w. 69.144.158.122 (talk) 21:50, 5 February 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 4 February 2014

There is a mistake in the Zeus article regarding his birthplace!The place of birth is located on Dictaion andron on mount Dikti according to Hesiod theogony(750-700 bC),Agathocles(2nd century aC)Apollonios o Rodios(295-215bC)Diodoros o Sikeliotis(90-20 bC)etc Dictaion Andron is of far more archeological importance Talos Severin (talk) 11:15, 4 February 2014 (UTC)

 Not done The birthplace of an imaginary god can never be established, as he was never born anywhere, so there can only be myths and contradictory myths. The current birthplace appears to be cited to a reliable text. If you wish to add alternative myths, you will need to quote specific references (title, author page-number etc.) However, do not remove the existing - but state there is disagreement. The archaeological importance of somewhere is irrelevant to a mythical birth. The article is currently unprotected so you can do this yourself. Arjayay (talk) 08:52, 7 February 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 5 February 2014

swich all the tunder words to blunt

FreeUsername123 (talk) 04:08, 5 February 2014 (UTC)

Not done: as you have not requested a change. Arjayay (talk) 08:53, 7 February 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 18 February 2014

Zues is the middle child. Abby72597 (talk) 00:57, 18 February 2014 (UTC)

 Not done Source? --NeilN ^{talk to me} 00:59, 18 February 2014 (UTC)

Edit request-wrong birthplace!

Th birthplace of Zeus (according to Hesiod Cosmogony,Apollonios o Rhodios,Aratos,Arrianos etc)is located on the Dikti mountains in the cave of Psychro!The Idi mountains is mentioned in much later myth which says that Idi was his second refuge from Kronos but never his birthplace! I am new at this please someone correct it! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Talos Severin (talk • contribs) 00:16, 6 February 2014 (UTC)

Please see my answer to your request above, As the article is currently unprotected you can do this yourself, but please do not remove cited material, or the article will be protected again. You may wish to read WP:Referencing for beginners - Arjayay (talk) 08:57, 7 February 2014 (UTC)

Well, I see it's been done and reverted, "see Mount Ida". Mount Ida describes it as Zeus's hiding place. Mount Ida (Crete) describes it as his birthplace. Cave of Zeus has just changed from Mount Ida to Dikti, however, by Donner60, a pretty experienced editor. Dikti says explicitly there are two myths. Pinkbeast (talk) 12:20, 10 February 2014 (UTC)

I undid my reversion of the change from Mount Ida to Dikti. I did not make the change to Dikti. I undid the reversion because a brief check of sources in various Wikipedia articles led me to conclude that there are three different possibilities and that I could not easily determine which one was correct. So I went with good faith on the change. Such little understanding as I had of the matter was that Mount Ida was correct but this seems to be a matter of dispute. Donner60 (talk) 00:26, 11 February 2014 (UTC)

Sorry, I appreciate you did not initially make the change, but undid the reversion. However, I think the situation at the moment is untenable. Some of the text in Cave of Zeus pertains to a real physical cave, as do the photos (although as mentioned I think the second one is probably of the cave in Turkey). Which cave's got the "beautiful stalagmites and stalactites"? Pinkbeast (talk) 01:03, 11 February 2014 (UTC)

There are many different traditions concerning the birth of Zeus, none is "correct"."Zeus" in A Dictionary of Greek and Roman Biography and Mythology, William Smith, Ed. says the following:

"Before the hour of birth came, Uranus and Ge sent Rhea to Lyctos in Crete, requesting her to bring up her child there. Rhea accordingly concealed her infant in a cave of Mount Aegaeon, and gave to Cronos a stone wrapped up in cloth, which he swallowed in the belief that it was his son. Other traditions state that Zeus was born and brought up on Mount Dicte or Ida (also the Trojan Ida), Ithome in Messenia, Thebes in Boeotia, Aegion in Achaia, or Olenos in Aetolia. According to the common account, however, Zeus grew up in Crete."

Paul August ☎ 01:10, 11 February 2014 (UTC)

I have some further thoughts on my talk page but I will add something similar here. I note that if more than one possibility exists, I think each one should be mentioned. If one is unsupportable or far-fetched, it should be excluded. If more than one possibility concerns a physical cave, pictures of each cave should be included. If some of the possibilities are myth, that should be made clear. If one possibility is more accepted than others, and several references show this, that should be mentioned. The bottom line is that I am not an expert, I originally thought that Mt. Ida was the only possibility but it seems other credible references exist. I do not want to get involved in a controversy about which I apparently do not know as much as I thought I did. So with these thoughts, if they are acceptable to editors working on this, I will leave the matter to those who know more or who are willing to do more research and cite reliable, verifiable sources for edits to the article. Donner60 (talk) 01:45, 11 February 2014 (UTC)

This seems a little odd because, well, they're all myth, Zeus not being real.

I propose the following. We edit this article in accordance with Paul August's cite above; I was hoping something like that would turn up. We revert Cave of Zeus to be the one on Mount Ida (Crete), because I believe the bits of physical cave description in that article pertain to that one, but note there is more than one Cave of Zeus. Ditto Psychro Cave, Mount Ida (Crete), Mount Ida, Dikti, etc; try and avoid any page having a statement that there is one generally-agreed birthplace of Zeus (in the way that, say, Jesus is generally agreed to have been born in Bethlehem). What do you think? Pinkbeast (talk) 02:04, 11 February 2014 (UTC)

Does any other editor have an opinion? I'm reluctant to make such widespread changes on my own say-so. Pinkbeast (talk) 11:08, 19 February 2014 (UTC)

I think you should go ahead a make the changes you think are appropriate. Any problems that arise can be fixed. Paul August ☎ 13:49, 19 February 2014 (UTC)

Done (finally, ahem). Pinkbeast (talk) 16:20, 17 March 2014 (UTC)

"Not to be confused with Dr Seuss"

Has anyone ever actually confused Zeus with Dr Seuss? This seems a silly edit to me. Pinkbeast (talk) 11:36, 2 April 2014 (UTC)

Agreed. Removed. Nsteinberg (talk) 07:29, 5 April 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 15 April 2014

would you be able add a photo to this page for me? two of my brothers feel this is an important photo. this movie is their fantasy of turning me to dust. http://0.tqn.com/d/scifi/1/0/Z/j/0/-/COTT2-00792r.jpg 206.45.107.73 (talk) 19:18, 15 April 2014 (UTC)

 Not done That image appears to be copyright . Arjayay (talk) 20:08, 15 April 2014 (UTC)

Opening paragraph presents Zeus as real

The opening paragraph is terrible. Maybe change to: Zeus is one of the twelve major deities of the Greek pantheon.

The first sentence ends "according to the ancient Greek religion." The second, and the infobox, identify him as a god. I think most people know that gods (except whichever they believe in) are not real. Pinkbeast (talk) 14:52, 21 May 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 24 May 2014

You put Zeus in Myth instead of Zeus in Legend. As in the fact that Zues never existed. AS this has happened Zeus is not a myth and in fact a legend for he may have existed and we can not prove otherwise. I will destroy you 420 (talk) 05:30, 24 May 2014 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. — {{U|Technical 13}} ^{(t • e • c)} 09:17, 24 May 2014 (UTC)

Zeus Herkeios

I see the god called Horkios, protector of oaths, the title for (e.g.) his statue in the Bouleuterion at Olympos, but not Herkeios, defender of the home, the title for his humbler statue in many an ancient Greek courtyard. I'm not finding anything that strikes me as a suitable secondary source, so I'm bringing the point up here and hoping a better scholar than I can add it to the article, properly footnoted. GeorgeTSLC (talk) 04:31, 30 July 2014 (UTC)

no dates?

some dates on when zeus first starts appearing in mythology, when the religion declined, and how many followers it had at its height seems needed 97.91.177.226 (talk) 07:10, 27 May 2012 (UTC)

That's covered pretty well in the general Greek mythology article--and some of those linked to it. And I think dating each mythical figure individually is a finer level of detail than is suitable for an encyclopedia article. GeorgeTSLC (talk) 04:37, 30 July 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 1 August 2014

Well, I would like to edit the page because you didn't include Hercules in the list of children of Zeus. So, please let me edit or edit it yourself. Thank you. Failuremonument Woas (talk) 08:20, 1 August 2014 (UTC)

Heracles (note this is the correct Greek spelling of the name) is included in the list of offspring already. QuiteUnusual (talk) 08:25, 1 August 2014 (UTC)

Article Rewrite

Alright, I'll flat out say it: This article is terrible. It needs to be rewritten. To begin with, this article needs to be chronological; that means the earliest sources need to be handled first, not just lumped into arbitrary categories. Second, someone really ought to go through the talk page here and purge the vandalism and bulletin board blather. Had I more time on my hands, I would gladly do it, but meanwhile this message may assist in inspiring someone to go ahead. :bloodofox: (talk) 20:19, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

Zeus's Infancy

The "infancy" section states categorically that Zeus was raised on Mt Ida, when this is in fact only one of many traditions. Hesiod places Zeus's birth on Mount Aegeum [Aegaeon] (Theogony - line 484), and The Library of Greek Mythology (pseudo- Apollodorus) says Zeus was "...brought [...] to birth in a cave on Mount Dicte[Dikte]." The Ideon and Dikteon caves are both tourist attractions on Crete, as can be seen in most travel books (Lonely Planet etc.) I would also like to know if his birth on Mt. Ida is a folk tradition or if we have a document that states this. AParks2012 (talk) 20:19, 19 November 2012 (UTC)

I've just added Dictaeon Andron as one of the variants of the Amalthea story, I thought it unwise (readability), to either contradict the Mt. Ida intro or introduce an extra possibility to the list.Pincrete (talk) 23:49, 12 August 2014 (UTC)

"Earthshaker" error?

Worship of Zeus originated among the heirs of your face, where he was well known as the Earthshaker. I had to insert Myceneans for obvious reasons. But the 'Earth Shaker' is Poseidon, the son of god. But the consort of the two goddesses of Crete and Mycenean Pylos, is he not? I've left that for you all to puzzle out. Wetman 03:21, 23 Nov 2003 (UTC)

I think that though Poseidon was the Earthshaker, that they may have thought that since Zeus and Poseidon were brothers Zeus would have some of that power. Therefore Zeus had the thunder so that might have "shaken the ground".[User:Kangaroo2] 05:19, 1 December 2008

What?

"Christian patristic writers took up the suggestion with ethnu"? What? I would add a period to the sentence, but that doesn't even make sense.

Kronos

It is Kronos, not Cronus

Semi-protected edit request on 28 October 2014

Zeus (Ancient Greek: Ζεύς, Zeús; Modern Greek: Δίας, Días; English pronunciation /ˈzjuːs/[3] or /ˈzuːs/) is the "Father of Gods and men" (πατὴρ ἀνδρῶν τε θεῶν τε, patḕr andrōn te theōn te)[4] who rules the Olympians of Mount Olympus as a father rules the family according to the ancient Greek religion. He is the god of sky and thunder in Greek mythology. Zeus is etymologically cognate with and, under Hellenic influence, became particularly closely identified with Roman Jupiter.

Zeus is the child of Cronia and Rhes, and the youngest of his siblings. In most traditions he is married to Hera, although, at the oracle of Dodona, his consort is Dione: according to the Iliad, he is the father of Aphrodite by Dione.[5] He is known for his erotic escapades. These resulted in many godly and heroic offspring, including Athena, Apollo and Artemis, Hermes, Persephone (by Demeter), Dionysus, Perseus, Heracles, Helen of Troy, Minos, and the Muses (by Mnemosyne); by Hera, he is usually said to have fathered Ares, Hebe and Hephaestus.[6]

As Walter Burkert points out in his book, Greek Religion, "Even the gods who are not his natural children address him as Father, and all the gods rise in his presence."[7] For the Greeks, he was the King of the Gods, who oversaw the universe. As Pausanias observed, "That Zeus is king in heaven is a saying common to all men".[8] In Hesiod's Theogony Zeus assigns the various gods their roles. In the Homeric Hymns he is referred to as the chieftain of the gods.

His symbols are the thunderbolt, eagle, bull, and oak. In addition to his Indo-European inheritance, the classical "cloud-gatherer" (Greek: Νεφεληγερέτα, Nephelēgereta)[9] also derives certain iconographic traits from the cultures of the Ancient Near East, such as the scepter. Zeus is frequently depicted by Greek artists in one of two poses: standing, striding forward, with a thunderbolt leveled in his raised right hand, or seated in majesty

50.51.10.54 (talk) 21:12, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

Not done: looks like you just want to change Cronus and Rhea to Cronia and Rhes. Don't see why. That seems to be incorrect. Cannolis (talk) 21:24, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

Pronunciation

The Ancient/Classic pronounciation given ([zdeǔ̯s]) is definitely wrong. Please provide a source and/or compare with the articles on ancient greek pronounciation, help:IPA_for_Greek and even the 'name' section of this article. While there is some uncertainty of the usage of Zeta for Dz or Zd in some cases, this does not apply to Zeus (as all other languages clearly show). --92.202.14.228 (talk) 21:31, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

See Dionysius Thrax' explicit testimony that zeta was generally pronounced like sigma + delta. This overrides comparative evidence – which is anyway not decisive in a case like this, since pronunciations can change. --Florian Blaschke (talk) 16:42, 8 August 2015 (UTC)

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Zeus/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

I think that if you made this easier to read, you would be able to attract a larger audience because of all the Greek words. Bottom line, make it easier to understand and people will come within spitting distance of this stinkin' website. with HATE, Alexis Graf please note: this entire artical is full of bull shiz —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.233.143.87 (talk) 00:44, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

Last edited at 00:45, 3 February 2011 (UTC). Substituted at 16:07, 1 May 2016 (UTC)

This page is being edited by a student ...

This page is being edited by a student in WikiEd course at Colgate University/CORE151 : Legacies of the Ancient World (Fall_2015) Tdisibio (talk) 16:35, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

Miscellany

Is the miscellany section worth saving at all? It is (with the exception of the mention of Athena as Zeus' favourite daughter) entirely unsourced, and it largely doesn't appear relevant to the article on Zeus. It might be the case, for instance, that Bia was described as being a constant companion to Zeus, but she is sufficiently obscure (her own article manages to find only 100 lines of Hesiod in which she is mentioned), but if we're going to have every mythological figure with only one line of poetry mentioning their connection with Zeus in this article, it's going to be absurdly large.

There are a few figures in this section who are fairly notable in their own right, and might manage to make it into the body of the article elsewhere (Prometheus, for instance, has a few interactions with Zeus: Hesiod mentions the Trick at Mecone, and Prometheus stealing fire from the gods and his subsequent punishment, which appears in Aeschylus' Prometheus Bound, for example). Even here I'm unconvinced, though...

Caeciliusinhorto (talk) 13:09, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Seeing as no one has objected in almost a month, I have gone ahead and removed this from the article. In case anyone wants to work anything here into the body of the article, it is reproduced below:

*Zeus is sometimes depicted as a middle-aged man with strong muscular arms. His facial hair can be a full beard and mustache or just stubble.
*Zeus turned Pandareus to stone for stealing the golden dog which had guarded him as an infant in the holy Dictaeon Cave of Crete.
*Zeus killed Salmoneus with a thunderbolt for attempting to impersonate him, riding around in a bronze chariot and loudly imitating thunder.
*Zeus turned Periphas into an eagle, making him the king of birds.
*At the marriage of Zeus and Hera, a nymph named Chelone refused to attend. Zeus transformed her into a tortoise (chelone in Greek).
*Zeus, with Hera, turned King Haemus and Queen Rhodope into mountains (the Balkan mountains, or Stara Planina, and Rhodope mountains, respectively) for their vanity.
*Zeus condemned Tantalus to eternal torture in Tartarus for trying to trick the gods into eating the flesh of his butchered son Pelops.
*Zeus condemned Ixion to be tied to a fiery wheel for eternity as punishment for attempting to violate Hera.
*Zeus sank the Telchines beneath the sea.
*Zeus blinded the seer Phineus and sent the Harpies to plague him as punishment for revealing the secrets of the gods.
*Zeus rewarded Tiresias with a life three times the norm as reward for ruling in his favour when he and Hera contested which of the sexes gained the most pleasure from the act of love.
*Zeus punished Hera by having her hung upside down from the sky when she attempted to drown Heracles in a storm.
*Of all the children Zeus spawned, Heracles was often described as his favorite. Indeed, Heracles was often called by various gods and people "the favorite son of Zeus", Zeus and Heracles were very close and in one story, where a tribe of earth-born Giants threatened Olympus and the Oracle at Delphi decreed that only the combined efforts of a lone god and mortal could stop the creature, Zeus chose Heracles to fight by his side. They proceeded to defeat the monsters.
*Athena has at times been called his favorite daughter and adviser.
*His sacred bird was the golden eagle, which he kept by his side at all times. Like him, the eagle was a symbol of strength, courage, and justice.
*His favourite tree was the oak, symbol of strength. Olive trees were also sacred to him.
*Zelus, Nike, Cratos and Bia were Zeus' retinue.
*Zeus condemned Prometheus to having his liver eaten by a giant eagle for giving the Flames of Olympus to the mortals.
*When Hera gave birth to Hephaestus, Zeus threw him off the top of Mount Olympus because of his repulsive appearance.

---

References

zeus

please let me edit 2001:56A:7002:D900:ADAB:8188:EEE2:13D4 (talk) 23:31, 15 January 2016 (UTC) 2001:56A:7002:D900:ADAB:8188:EEE2:13D4 (talk) 23:31, 15 January 2016 (UTC)

• Not done: This is not how edit semi-protected requests work. If you want to make a change you can be specific about it and tell us what you want to change, including reliable sources to back up any claims. Otherwise, you can create an account, and do the necessary steps to become autoconfirmed and make the edit yourself. --Majora (talk) 23:40, 15 January 2016 (UTC)

Edit request (modify link)

Please change link from [[goat]]'s milk -to- [[goat's milk]].
-107.15.152.93 (talk) 18:26, 12 June 2016 (UTC) [Modified:107.15.152.93 (talk) 05:29, 17 June 2016 (UTC)]

Done  ^B E _C K ^Y _S A ^{Y L} E _S  08:32, 17 June 2016 (UTC)

I 'piped' to 'goat's milk' rather than goat milk. Pincrete (talk) 10:45, 17 June 2016 (UTC)

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King of the Gods ?

User:Keivan.f , User:Bloodofox , regarding this edit. Would it not be simpler to put 'Ruled as King of the Gods' and omit 'God of the sky, lightning, thunder, law, order, justice'? I am arguing not from close knowledge, rather from the pov that infobox should summarise briefly and therefore 'King of the Gods' is how he is mostly known. Keeping an uncluttered infobox, is the base from which I am working, but am happy to be told how ignorant I might be about the subject! Pincrete (talk) 14:57, 30 July 2016 (UTC)

The edit isn't accurate. The page has a huge number of issues at the moment and this adds another. It has no concern for nuance, detail, or source relation—it's a mass of WP:SYNTH. And rather than discussing how the figure of Zeus developed over time, it's stuck in a synchronic perspective with little concern for the diachronic. It has more in common with Bulfinch's Mythology than where scholarship is at in 2016. :bloodofox: (talk) 21:23, 1 August 2016 (UTC)

Fair enough! I largely have this article on my list as a 'vandal watcher'. Pincrete (talk) 23:06, 1 August 2016 (UTC)

Student Edit

Hi, I recently edited the page with 3 new sections I have been researching for a while. Would love to receive feedback, and thank you for not editing too much during this process!Tdisibio (talk) 02:11, 10 December 2015 (UTC)

It Good to know Blackburn0805 (talk) 15:46, 11 October 2016 (UTC)

It Good to know Blackburn0805 (talk) 15:46, 11 October 2016 (UTC)

Some Suggestions:

Hi I'm a Rookie Wikipedian. (Still not sure if this is going to look right...So sorry) I'm not an expert on the subject unfortunately but some possible suggestions to improve this article is:

1. Put a section describing the development of Zeus' depiction since it's hard to get that sense when its all sorted into different sections. So there might as well be a section for it.
2. I know that Zeus has plenty of myths concerning him, so it would be nice to have a summarized version of the most well known ones or at least a label with a link to another article on the myth (For example, "Zeus and Ganymede's myth" with it linked to Ganymede>>I guess I just have a problem with the way the info. is sorted)
3. Going along the lines of #2, Maybe we can put a list of Zeus' lovers in general including both genders
4. Have a section devoted to Zeus' depiction in other books, such as Odyssey, Aenied, or other local myths so that it's easier to find.

That's all I can think of at the top of my head. Hope it was hopeful. :) Stacey.banh (talk) 18:10, 13 October 2016 (UTC)

Children of Hera

On the article it is said that Hebe, Hephaestus and Ares may have been born merely by Hera. As of Hebe in an alternative version it's said that "Her mother Hera became pregnant merely by eating a lettuce plant when dining with Apollo". As Athena was also born by Zeus without recourse to Hera, she bore Hephaestus alone. But what about Ares? In a part of Iliad Zeus tells Ares "And yet I will not long endure to see you in pain, since you are my child, and it was to me that your mother bore you", which obviously means that Ares is his son but is there another story about his birth? I couldn't find it anywhere. If there's no mention of an alternative version, then isn't it right to correct that note which says he might be born merely by Hera? Keivan.f^Talk 23:00, 13 November 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 29 November 2016

Hi! Please add the following categories on this page:

[[Category:LGBT themes in mythology‎]] and [[Category:Pederastic heroes and deities‎]]

Thank you! FábioEscorpião (talk) 15:40, 29 November 2016 (UTC)

Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template. - Mlpearc (open channel) 15:50, 29 November 2016 (UTC)

Nike

change ((Nike)) to ((Nike (mythology)|Nike))

Done Well spotted. Pincrete (talk) 14:59, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 22 January 2017

I'd like to edit Zeus, below his picture, as being a member of the Olympians. Tim McGervey (talk) 22:22, 22 January 2017 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. EvergreenFir (talk) 00:06, 23 January 2017 (UTC)