Talk:York United FC

Not always "York9" as some editors have been posting

I found https://www.cbc.ca/sports/soccer/cpl/canadian-championship-explainer-1.5137240, which is published by CanPL.ca and redistributed by CBC sports, lists the team as "York9 FC". We need to determine if the use without the space ("York9") is formal or a stylized version of the name. Walter Görlitz (talk) 19:18, 15 May 2019 (UTC)

York9 FC's website uses the name without a space, as does the CPL, and as it's being used in common media we should move to no space. Vaselineeeeeeee^★★★ 21:38, 15 May 2019 (UTC)

Those are official media, direct mouthpieces of the league. Per WP:NCST, "In cases where there is some ambiguity as to the official spelling of a club's name in English, the name most commonly used by the English-language media should be used." So examples from the broader media should be factored in. Radagast (talk) 21:49, 15 May 2019 (UTC)

Along that vein:

• sportsnet.ca: "York 9 FC" and "York 9" "York 9 FC" and "York 9"
• thescore.com: "York 9 FC" and "York9"
• nationalpost.com: "York 9 FC"
• theglobeandmail.com: appears to be a subscription site, but the Google searches hit on "York 9" but not "York9"

It appears to me that when the "FC" is used, it's always "York 9 FC", and only thescore.com uses the compressed format. This is not an exhaustive search. Walter Görlitz (talk) 22:48, 15 May 2019 (UTC)

TheScore source above also uses York9 FC with the "FC". Vaselineeeeeeee^★★★ 22:57, 15 May 2019 (UTC)

More news sources using York9 FC: CBC, Hamilton Spec, Edmonton Journal, Global, Edmonton Sun, National post when written by Zach Laing, but York 9 FC when written by Neil Davidson, National Post, Canada Soccer. Vaselineeeeeeee^★★★ 12:45, 17 May 2019 (UTC)

That's not CBC, it's Canadian Press via CBC. And National Post used "York 9" multiple times as well. I'm also disappointed you made a decision to create an entire paragraph about this mis-spelling.

Let's look at this statistically. News over the past week with the space: 22 as of now. News over the past week without the space: 12 as of now, and Google suggesting the correct spelling of "York 9". That avoids the pissing game where we find exactly what we want and present it as the only option. Walter Görlitz (talk) 15:02, 17 May 2019 (UTC)

The paragraph I wrote has nothing to do with the spacing of York9 FC vs York 9 FC (only about their firsts and their sourced nickname Y9, you'll notice I still used York 9 FC). As for this issue, the search engine test isn't always the best thing to judge something like this; obviously Google will suggest "York 9", it's Google, in English there would be a space, but that's not the case in most of the common reliable sources here. (By the way, Google shows a lot of blogs in those hits). Vaselineeeeeeee^★★★ 15:24, 17 May 2019 (UTC)

It's not a search engine search. It's a search of news sources over the past week. Several sources use both terms. One of those news hits is a blog that uses both terms. When I revisited the results we were at 22 to 14. A 23rd was actually a hit on "Markas Besar PBB, New York (9/5/2019)". Walter Görlitz (talk) 15:47, 17 May 2019 (UTC)

Again, several of those are blogs, and several aren't even about the subject York9 FC. Vaselineeeeeeee^★★★ 16:59, 17 May 2019 (UTC)

This is not a notability discussion but rather determining common use of the team's name. Walter Görlitz (talk) 17:20, 17 May 2019 (UTC)

If blogs aren't considered as reliable sources for content addition here, then they aren't good sources for anything else here. Vaselineeeeeeee^★★★ 19:17, 17 May 2019 (UTC)

Have you spent much time on WP:RSN? Many sources are not considered reliable for some things and not others. We would never use a blog to support a transfer or something similar, but they are an excellent reflection of common usage. Walter Görlitz (talk) 19:18, 17 May 2019 (UTC)

No, not really, also considering these discussions are about two days old and don't show any policy. Wikipedia:Reliable sources, policy, doesn't second your opinion about blogs. Vaselineeeeeeee^★★★ 19:25, 17 May 2019 (UTC)

@TrailBlzr:, @QQ2NFLD:, @UmpireRay:, @Blaixx: any thoughts? Vaselineeeeeeee^★★★ 21:48, 18 May 2019 (UTC)

It seems to me that the "York9" style has become more common over time. Perhaps this trend will continue and we can resolve this name issue with a formal move discussion once things are more stable in the future. BLAIXX 17:14, 20 May 2019 (UTC)

York9 appears to be the more common spelling in every medium. I would support changing the infobox header (|clubname=) to York9. Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/Clubs suggests using the clubs common short name in this space, not the official full name, so I think York9 would fit that description. TrailBlzr (talk) 16:57, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

Still not empirically supported. The news results still favour "York 9". Walter Görlitz (talk) 17:00, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

It's somewhat difficult to find a source that refers to the team as "York 9" with the space since the season began. Most of the sources calling the team "York 9" are about the launch of the club and the league, before club branding was properly established. Since the club branded itself as "York9" without the space, virtually all media call the team "York9"... CBC, Times Colonist, Global News, YorkRegion.com, Calgary Sun. Not to mention the CPL website: standings, schedule, clubs. TrailBlzr (talk) 17:19, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

All I did was run the query above which is over the past week, and we're a month into the season. Walter Görlitz (talk) 17:23, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

12 articles in the York 9 query have nothing to do with the subject of this article as they are picking up things like New York 9 and other false positives. Vaselineeeeeeee^★★★ 17:31, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

We cite reliable sources anyway, like the CBC. Not a self-generated search query. The reliable sources all unambiguously tell us the name is York9 without the space. TrailBlzr (talk) 18:42, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

@UmpireRay: Perhaps it is because that is an old source as the club even refers to themselves as York 9 FC there whereas now it is always York9 FC. I think a newer source would be in order to say it is still York 9 Football Club. Vaselineeeeeeee^★★★ 00:44, 28 May 2019 (UTC)

In this case, the long name is the full official name of the club and the official announcement of the club is the best/only source for that. While that name is now stylized in the short form of "York9 FC", I haven't seen any reliable sources to show that the full official name has been changed to "York9 Football Club". Until then, I think it should stay the way it is. UmpireRay (talk) 22:53, 28 May 2019 (UTC)

That sounds fine to me. BLAIXX 11:22, 29 May 2019 (UTC)

@UmpireRay:, @Blaixx: Several, newer sources, of York9 FC player signing announcements used "York9 Football Club" - [1], [2], [3], [4], [5], [6], [7], [8]. Vaselineeeeeeee^★★★ 01:47, 30 May 2019 (UTC)

What do secondary sources write? Walter Görlitz (talk) 03:05, 30 May 2019 (UTC)

Look at source 7, York Region.com always uses York9 Football Club, but I don’t see any other source writing out ...Football Club in full. Vaselineeeeeeee^★★★ 13:58, 30 May 2019 (UTC)

I contacted the club and got a response from Ryan Brennan that the official name of the club is in fact York 9 Football Club, so I suppose the original media release stands. Regards, Vaselineeeeeeee^★★★ 02:25, 1 June 2019 (UTC)

Do we have a consensus then? York9 looks cleaner than York9 FC on the player pages and these days all I see is "York9." Next home game I'm going to speak to their people and ask them about wording. I know the likes of Valour and Forge usually include the FC in their name but it seems York9 doesn't really.Vince193 (talk) 17:47, 18 August 2019 (UTC)

Requested move 22 May 2019

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Moved. Procedural close since this discussion landed at Malformed requests. Kudos to editors for your input, and Happy Publishing! (nac by page mover) Paine Ellsworth, ed.  ^put'r there  23:05, 27 May 2019 (UTC)

---

York 9 FC → York9 FC – The club is referred to as York9 FC (without the space) by virtually all reliable news sources, the league's own website, and all of the club's social media accounts. In accordance with WP:COMMONNAME, the page name should be moved to reflect this. TrailBlzr (talk) 18:53, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

• Support for reasons above. Vaselineeeeeeee^★★★ 19:08, 22 May 2019 (UTC)
• Support per discussion in above section, and per my own citing of WP:NCST there. Radagast (talk) 21:58, 22 May 2019 (UTC)
• Support. It is clear now that at least a slight majority of news sources are using the "York9 FC" spelling. Combined with the fact that the league and team refer to itself this way makes this an obvious move. "York9" (without the FC) should also be allowed in prose, once the topic is established. BLAIXX 12:21, 23 May 2019 (UTC)
• Support The league and team seem to use the term and their style guide seems to have filtered down to the press to become the common name. Walter Görlitz (talk) 14:46, 23 May 2019 (UTC)
• Support The league and team generally utilize the term and most recent news sources seem to have made the conversion. NorthOnt001 (talk) 17:26, 23 May 2019 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related page moves. GiantSnowman 14:47, 24 May 2019 (UTC)

• Support as above. GiantSnowman 14:49, 24 May 2019 (UTC)
• Support I think it's clear that the league and now the majority of reliable sources have switched to using York9 FC. UmpireRay (talk) 14:01, 27 May 2019 (UTC)
• Comment I think this merits a WP:SNOWCLOSE. Walter Görlitz (talk) 15:22, 27 May 2019 (UTC)
  • So the article was moved, but not the talk. Walter Görlitz (talk) 22:54, 27 May 2019 (UTC)

---

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Roster

Hi - just wanted to clarify the roster edit on Y9. I'm fine with leaving the roster for 2020, and to not update it until later. However, why did you only remove Hernandez? The previous player added (Ulbricht) was also just signed, and is not on the team roster on the York9 website either. Every time a new CPL player gets signed, someone adds him to the rosters on wiki well before the official website does, and it's never been a problem until now. Thanks. Cristane (talk) 21:34, 20 October 2020 (UTC)

Moved from my talk page.

Because that was the addition I checked. Feel free to remove the other purchase until he is reflected on the official roster. Walter Görlitz (talk) 21:37, 20 October 2020 (UTC)