Talk:Winter Island

Merger

Merger looks reasonable to me; the description at National Register of Historic Places listings in Salem, Massachusetts seems to indicate that it's the entirety of the island, and the area of 45 acres looks entirely reasonable for the area of the island or virtually all of it. Nyttend (talk) 12:23, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

Nyttend, thank you for opening an explicit discussion section about the possible merger of this "Winter Island" article with the Winter Island Historic District and Archeological District article (that Polaron has been erasing by redirecting to here). However, the NRIS location description for the district (in the list article) only cryptically states "Winter Island". I note also that Fort Pickering is given the same cryptic "Winter Island" location description. It seems to me that they are both located on Winter Island; it is not clearly suggested that either one of them is the entirety of the island. doncram (talk) 20:26, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

I have no desire to get in the middle of this war, but ..... I know that "local knowledge" is not Wiki-valid, but perhaps I can help on this particular one, without making any general comment on the issues.

I was a couple of hundred yards from Winter Island on Sunday on my way from Salem to Beverly. If the sun had been out, I would have stopped to take pictures, for the HD article, for Fort Pickering and for Fort Pickering Light. I know the area well. The HD and the island (actually it's not quite an island) appear to be coterminous or close to it. If they're not quite coterminous, then so what? Sure, we need to acknowledge that, but the fact is that there's nothing on the island except the Fort, the Light, and a dozen residences.

This is a case where the name "Winter Island" has considerable local usage -- there are street signs directing you to Winter Island -- so that people might actually go into Wikipedia looking for it. I see no point in having two articles as most of the things that make the island notable in the Wiki sense are the same things that make it Historic. If I had taken the photos yesterday and therefore started editing the articles, I probably would have done the merger myself. If Doncram, Nyttend, and Polaron agree, I'll take a shot at rearranging this into a stub that appears to fit the facts as we know them. . . . . Jim . . . . Jameslwoodward (talk • contribs) 10:18, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

Unsourced material removed from article

I removed the following unsourced passage from the article:

The entire peninsula is listed as Winter Island Historic District and Archeological District on the National Register of Historic Places. Fort Pickering (Winter Island) Light is a part of the district.

Please don't just say you believe the statements are true, and restore them. Wikipedia works by use of wp:rs reliable sources for assertions made in mainspace. doncram (talk) 20:45, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

Is the HD/AD the whole island?

I copied the relevant portion of the USGS topo into AutoCAD, scaled it, and used AutoCAD's excellent area tool to measure the island's area to the high tide line, which turns out to be about 44 acres. Since the HD/AD is 45 acres, it's certainly safe to assume that the district is all, or essentially all, of the island, although I did not quite say that in the text of the article.. . . . Jim . . . . Jameslwoodward (talk • contribs) 16:09, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

Yes it is. The historic district includes the whole island plus one parcel fronting the causeway. Basically, everything from 5 Winter Island Road and eastward. --Polaron | Talk 17:03, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

I'm curious, not arguing -- where's your source?. . . . Jim . . . . Jameslwoodward (talk • contribs) 17:17, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

The city of Salem has a map of its historic districts (NRHP) here. Their interactive mapping application also gives more detailed information. --Polaron | Talk 18:05, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

I can't remember right now any other instance where Polaron actually followed up with a source that addressed a question like this and could be referenced. Thanks Jameslwoodward for dealing with this and thanks Polaron. I'm glad this one item seems to be resolved then. doncram (talk) 01:09, 8 October 2009 (UTC)