Talk:Surya

Request proof-reading.

I have added the Sanskrit text for the surya-namaskar shlokas. I have done it based on the existing English transliterated version given and also made some changes as per what I feel should be the correct spellings. I request that someone with knowledge take a look at it and improve it if required. Thank you. Rohitbd 14:03, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

Wouldn't it be better if the sholkas for Surya namaskara were put on that page. I don't think once this article expands and improves that there will be enough space here. Gizza^{Chat ©} 06:34, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

[1]https://vedictime.com/ru/library/graha/surya 176.65.96.9 (talk) 17:38, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

Yantra image

I believe that the Yantra displayed on this page in a western invention and has little or nothing to do with the various yantras classically associated with Surya, both as a Devata (deity) and a Graha (planet).

Significance of the seven horses

I was thinking if the 7 horses of the demi-god Surya might be related to the seven colors of light. I know this might sound 'Hinduic' or 'New Age', but a couple of things come to mind - 1) Surya is the only celestial being depicted as riding a chariot with 7 horses but the numbers are usually even like 4 or 6. Also 3 and 9 and their even multiples are very important in Hindu traditions, but a number like 7, though it has been considered sacred by many cultures of known history has been reserved exclusively for Surya. 2) I came across an article at http://www.medieval.org/music/world/carnatic/lyrics/navagraha.html, about Konark which has this interesting thing to say :-

The seven horses at Konarak are named after these colors: Rakta (red), Rocika (orange), Pita (yellow), Nila (blue), Indra-nila (deep blue), Mocika (violet) and Shukla (white).

I am not sure, but sunlight as we all know, is composed of seven colors and despite the 'sacredness' of 7, it is reserved only for Surya.

I like your idea, but isn't the Goddess Ushas also depicted, riding in a chariot with seven horses? Then again, the horses are supposed to be all red, so your point still might stand. —Preceding unsigned comment added by AaronCarson (talk • contribs) 16:25, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

7 archangels as well Bozo33 (talk) 18:34, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

Surya's Feet

I red somewhere that it was forbidden to depict Surya's feet in iconography, but all the images I see of Lord Surya, show his feet. Can somebody please write something about this strange contradiction?AaronCarson (talk) 16:33, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

@AaronCarson Hewan Teferi also covers her feet.

thank you 196.191.156.180 (talk) 15:26, 1 April 2024 (UTC)

Yes this is very odd. I’ve also seen that she wears the daughter figure icon on her neck.

thank you 196.188.182.146 (talk) 15:29, 1 April 2024 (UTC)

Surya's feet-one reason for iconography habit

Surya’s feet Reference: Matsya purana. During the ‘great flood’ the boat (ark) was being towed by Matsya (fish). Matsya was an incarnation of Vishnu who recounted to Manu (first man) the Matsya purana. Solar line history. Surya: father sage Kashyapa and mother Adita. Wife: Samjna. Samjna found Surya’s radiance too much to bear so created a doppelganger out of her own body called Chhaya (=shadow) and left him. Vishvakarma (architect to the Gods) shaved off Surya’s radiance so people could bear to look at him but left his feet unmodified. The energy was used to construct the celestial weapons. No one can bear to look at Surya’s feet. It is forbidden to visualise Surya’s feet when praying to him on pain of being labelled a sinner and suffering from leprosy.--Graham401142 (talk) 09:25, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

I had read something similar to what you posted about Surya's feet here. I do appreciate your response. I have a copy of the Matsya Purana, and I've been pouring over it, but I must admit that I can't find an answer to my original question, which is that: why, if it's forbidden to depict Surya's feet, do we still see them in statuary, and portraiture? AaronCarson (talk) 19:36, 11 December 2011 (UTC)

Kashi Vishwanath Temple

Is there a connection between Vishwanath and ("His other names include) Vivasvat (Sanskrit: वैवस्वत) (also Visvakarma or Vivasvan)"?

Austerlitz -- 88.75.192.30 (talk) 11:54, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

I've read that Vivasvat is the father of Yama and Yami.

Austerlitz -- 88.75.192.30 (talk) 12:07, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

• SURYA AYURVEDA: THE HEALING SCIENCE OF THE SUN, History and Mechanics of a Lost Science

What's wrong with geocities? It happens quite often that their links are deleted automatically.

Austerlitz -- 88.75.192.30 (talk) 13:09, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

Eye of Mitra-Varuna/Ahura Mazda

Please see my comments on the talk page for Ahura Mazda. The Vedas refer to Surya several times as "the eye of Mitra, Varuna, and Agni." The Zend Avesta refers to the Sun several times as "the eye of Ahura Mazda." Hokie Tech (talk) 18:16, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

"Chief executive of gods"

Really? What's the basis for this claim? It sounds contemporary and made up and I haven't found any similar correspondence in the mythology aside from his "once" being comparably important to the Trimurti. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.97.253.87 (talk) 01:37, 30 May 2016 (UTC)

Surya/Sun worship in China

@Prodigyhk: We must re-add the "According to Chung Tan,..." because "ancient worship of Surya in China" is not a broadly held scholarly view. The source clearly admits that the "Surya in China" is Chung Tan's speculation / theory. Yes, the cite at the end of the para you added identifies the author to Chung Tan, but an accurate summary must clarify if a certain statement is one individual's claim or a broadly held scholarly consensus. Your wording makes it appear to be the latter, which is WP:Undue and WP:POV. We must be careful in both "what we say" and "how we say it". Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 02:22, 10 September 2016 (UTC)

ps: Is "Surya worship in ancient China" theory borderline fringe? FWIW, I have no preference whether this Chung Tan's theory is or is not included in this article. Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 02:22, 10 September 2016 (UTC)

This information is from 1600 BCE. This is not fringe theory. Chung is qualified. Like all historians, Chung is stating this, based on evidences he has seen, and no other qualified person is disputing this. There is no reason to add qualifiers "according to xxx,". If we were to add qualifiers, then will need to add for all claims in this article and almost all of WP articles. Prodigyhk (talk) 03:52, 10 September 2016 (UTC)

@Prodigyhk: Chung Tan writes on page 13, "There is a gold sheet with the design of four birds flying around the sun-deity which in my personal view is akin to a depiction of Surya". The admission, "in my personal view" is noteworthy. How about we quote Chung Tan exactly as above? Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 14:35, 11 September 2016 (UTC)

This entire article(like any similar WP article), are based on opinions of the author cited. Will you add similar qualifier statement for every sentence ? Prodigyhk (talk) 06:27, 12 September 2016 (UTC)

No. You are mixing WP:Primary, with sources that review scholarship, or are secondary / tertiary WP:RS. I will accept your generic version if you present a reliable source for "Surya was worshipped in ancient China" or something equivalent. Even Chung Tan is not saying that, if you read the source carefully. Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 14:35, 12 September 2016 (UTC)

@Ms Sarah Welch:in this case the artifacts are the primary source; and author Chung's writing is the secondary. Chung is a reliable secondary source for us editors to cite.

Primary source - In the study of history as an academic discipline, a primary source (also called original source or evidence) is an artifact.

WP:Secondary A secondary source provides an author's own thinking based on primary sources, generally at least one step removed from an event. It contains an author's analysis, evaluation, interpretation, or synthesis of the facts, evidence, concepts, and ideas taken from primary sources. Prodigyhk (talk) 02:53, 13 September 2016 (UTC)

i dont think Chung tan's theory is atleast a speculation similar object has been discovered from India as well so i think probably his theory is based on some evidences. 175.145.217.144 (talk) 17:53, 21 June 2019 (UTC)

Multan temple

@Willard84: I am reverting some of your edits because it is undue and WP:Coatrack. This is an article on Surya, and overemphasis about one temple, its Ismaili destruction, soapboxing about "Muslim world", attacking Richard Eaton etc is inappropriate. Per WP:BRD, please discuss. Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 12:51, 20 March 2017 (UTC)

What is actually over-emphasized is the conflict surrounding the temple. You are choosing to display only the sets of facts which support conflict, while deleting details that show how the temple was freely allowed to also exist - which is important to note.

Secondly, the "attack" on Richard Eaton was not an attack at all. You misunderstood the point. The point was that you initially stated "Let's stick to scholarly sources," and what I replied was that a published book is no less a scholarly source than a journal article. So please, don't twist what I said about sources into an attack on Eaton himself. The only thing I was challenging was your logic that a published book is not as good a scholarly source as a journal.Willard84 (talk) 19:30, 20 March 2017 (UTC)

@Willard84: Let us keep the context and content focus to be Surya, the subject of this article. No side stories and coatracking. Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 21:10, 20 March 2017 (UTC)

unsourced content

@108.29.80.184: Welcome to wikipedia. Please review the content guidelines such as WP:V, WP:RS and WP:LEAD before insertion of unsourced content into this article (and others such as Soma (deity). The cited source should directly support the content. Wikipedia is not a personal blog or a place to publish original research. If you have concerns, please explain and discuss it on this talk page. Your cooperation is requested, Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 21:31, 3 August 2017 (UTC)

Proposed origin and cognates for Surya

If: 'Yah', is in languages present in Indian subcontinent, an equivalent of: 'god', as in: 'YahWeh', or in: 'Yah Lord, protect us' ('Rastaman vibration', Bob Marley), perhaps also existent in the name for those out of caste system in India. system existing in South before arrival of Europeans, people not even being given a right to work: 'Paryah', that could be exploded as: 'par'='per'='by', and: 'yah'=god', 'paryah', would be an equivalent to: 'beggar' ('pordiosero', in Spanish). The surname 'Arias', may come from: 'Aryah'='The god's lion'='Judah', and the surname sometimes spelled as: 'Soria', 'Soryah', as in Jakob Soryah, a French huguenot pirate involved in some killings of Jesuits in the Canary islands waters, as they travelled to missions in America, to revenge the attacks by French Catholics on French huguenots, could be related to a: 'sun god', which reminds the Beth-El cult, sometimes presented in Old Testament as positive, others as pagan, leading to their worshipers being executed. The remembrance of the Beth-El cult is kept in today's Spain, as certain people, to point something is far away, say: 'En casa dios', 'In the god's house', as Beth-El was away from Jerusalem the distance that can be walked in a single journey. Does this line deserve further analysis, someone can provide more data, 'Soryah' being an hebrew translation of the Greek Apollyon cult, once identified, or having: 'the dawn with its rose fingers', as an specially devoted time?. 'Sur' cognate to surging, surge, as 'rising sun'? Thanks, regards. Salut +--Hijuecutivo (talk) 23:27, 28 August 2017 (UTC)

Surya Kriya - Yogic asanas like Surya Namaskar

I would like to suggest adding an new section called "Surya Kriya". There are Yogic institutions teaching Surya Kriya a set of Yogic asanas like Surya Namaskar but not same as Surya Namasakar. I have found few references which we can add them to this section. Below are the list references. RDKB (talk) 00:08, 14 November 2017 (UTC)Dhiraj

References

surya with greco persian influence

Sun is a common deity in ancient and medieval cultures found in South America, Europe, Africa and Asia. The features and mythologies of Surya share resemblances with Hvare-khshaeta of pre-Islam Persia, and the Helios-Sol deity in the Greek-Roman culture.[19][31][32] Surya is a Vedic deity, states Elgood, but its deity status was strengthened from the contacts between ancient Persia and India during the Kushan era, as well as after the 8th-century when Sun-worshipping Parsees moved to India.[33] Some Greek features were incorporated into Surya iconography in post-Kushan era, around mid 1st millennium, according to Elgood.[33]

the idea that surya god may have have been infleunced by greek o persian pantheon is most definitely wrong. Kassite suriash god is thought to be a combination of surya and shamash god of ancient india and mesopotamia. both surya and shamash ride chariots and both are sun gods. surya is attested before persian and greek sun gods, secondly suria god depicted in bodh gaya is a buddhist one not hindu one, so it represents hindu influence on buddhism not greco persian influence on hinduism. 202.188.53.210 (talk) 03:05, 11 December 2018 (UTC)

You are aware that influence can be bi-directional, that you're talking about a period of history covering a few thousand years (enough time for influence to go back and forth), and that during a portion of that period Alexander the Great's successors ruled a large portion of India, right? Ian.thomson (talk) 03:14, 11 December 2018 (UTC)

About Surya and Brahman

Hello. It's not very clear for me this: "Surya is one of the five deities considered as equivalent aspects and means to realizing Brahman". I know what the Brahman is, but not the relation with Surya that sentence refers. Regards. Martinwiki (talk) 11:51, 29 January 2020 (UTC)

In Zoroastrianism

I'm surprised this hasn't been mentioned, but I believe it is of importance to note that the Iranian/Aryan name for Vivasvan (Surya) was Vivahvant/Vivandjhan/Vivanghant/Wijahan/Wiwandjhan the father of Yima (Jamshid) who is also said to have been the same as King Yama son of Vivasvan (Surya).--MuslimKnight786 (talk) 04:03, 21 May 2021 (UTC)

Mentioned in the latter part of the article.245CMR.•^👥📜

Suna, Zuna and Ksunas

I have doubts about this recent addition of the terms "Suna", "Zuna" and "Ksunas" as alternative names of Surya.

It's cited to two sources. One is Gupta 1977. The only relevant content there is the following mention: "Yuan Chwang gives a lucid description of the temple of Suna or Kṣuṇas, the God of Hūṇas which he happened to visit in Zabulistan. From the description it is clear that the temple was of Sinya or Sun worshipped by Hūṇas in Zabulistan or Afghanistan." Here we see those names as referring to a solar deity of the Central Asian Hunas. It's very plausible that it ultimately stems from the same proto-Indo-European source as Vedic Surya, and it's conceivable that contemporaries may have seen the two deities as related. However, it's still a big WP:OR step from here to the claim that the names of this Huna deity are actually names of Surya.

The second source cited would presumably be of use here. It's a paper in the The Journal of the Bihar Research Society, which unfortunately I don't have access to. Does anybody do? It would be good to have some context, or at least more bibliographic data, like the title of the paper, the name of the author and the volume number. Given the unusual nature of the claim, and the fact that the editor who added it has the apparent habit of citing offline sources they haven't read (and only going by the tiny snippets on Google Books), I believe we shouldn't keep this claim in the article unless we've got an extended view of the context of the second source. – Uanfala (talk) 12:51, 11 November 2021 (UTC)

Oh, now I see that the original contributor has themselves removed this text earlier today [2]. Does that mean the question is settled, or is it possible some better sourcing could come up? – Uanfala (talk) 13:01, 11 November 2021 (UTC)

Surya Mantra is wrongly spells

Surya Mantra is as follows : Omm Jaba kusumo sankashom Kashyapeyong mahadyutim Dhwantaring sarbopapoghnam Pronotosmi Divakaram. 43.252.250.119 (talk) 04:40, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

Unsourced content

In the Mahabharata and Ramayana, Surya is present as the spritual father of Lord Rama and Karna(the protagonists of the Mahabharata and Ramayana). Extensively used as a glorification for the heroes of the epics by Vyasa and Valmiki. Surya was the supreme deity after Lord Shiva during the time of Mahabharata and Ramayana. -Source? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 223.230.131.244 (talk) 11:08, 21 February 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 3 December 2022

The Infobox picture used to be

File:Shri Surya Bhagvan bazaar art, c.1940's.jpg

100x

before it was changed. Kindly restore it as this picture is a better representation of deity which includes key iconographical elements that are missing from the current one.

In short please copy paste this file in the Infobox — File:Shri Surya Bhagvan bazaar art, c.1940's.jpg 2405:201:402D:90AC:F1CE:F0E7:6FA5:6B5D (talk) 15:51, 3 December 2022 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Lemonaka (talk) 00:08, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

@Lemonaka: How am I supposed to provide RS for this request which is about the img. Have u even read the request!? See the history of the page if u want proof.