Talk:Red Square/Archive 1

Archive 1

Something is missing

There is no mention of the large, round stone podium that sits just north and east of St. Basils Cathedral. I am surprised it is still there, it was probably in the way of some military parade at some time. Anyway, it was used to give speeches and political addresses at one time. Now you can find anyone sitting on the steps talking or smoking and drinking. Some people think that is it like a wishing well, and there are hundreds of coins inside the fence around the top. Apparently, if you land your coin on the stone that sits in the middle, you get a wish! It's a fun place to sit, you meet all sorts of interesting people. If you look at the Sattelite Image of Saint Basil's Cathedral you can see it.

I believe you speak about Lobnoe mesto. I will start the article later today. --Ghirlandajo 07:33, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

World Heritage Listing

I need to know why it became world heritage listed. I can't find it anywhere!!! Kombatwombats (talk) 09:42, 10 May 2010 (UTC)

Too many photos

There are far too many photographs in this article; the overall impression is very cluttered as a result. I would recommend removal of many of them. WP is not an image repository etc. Anyone care to make some executive decisions on those what should remain? Jimjamjak (talk) 09:12, 10 October 2011 (UTC)

"Red" Square

"Krasnyi" means "red", but "krasivyi" is "beautiful". — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.245.147.30 (talk) 20:39, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

No, you perhaps don't have enough knowledge of Russian language. The main meaning of word "krasnyi" (this is masculine, feminine form is "krasnaya") is "red" (colour), that's right - but it also has the second (now archaic) meaning as "beautiful" (in modern time the words "krasivyi" or "prekrasnyi" are used for that meaning). Many of Russian fairy tales contain a lot of expressions like "krasnaya devitsa" (= "beautiful girl"), "krasnyi molodets" (= "handsome guy") or "krasnyi terem" (= "charming palace")... 213.234.223.193 (talk) 13:31, 5 March 2014 (UTC)Martin Eden

This link between the words for beautiful and red is widely mentioned in books about Moscow, specifically to explain the name Red Square. It should definitely be in the article. 83.251.170.27 (talk) 12:55, 5 April 2016 (UTC)

Requested move 1 December 2016

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: not moved. Closed early per WP:SNOW. Calidum ¤ 01:45, 2 December 2016 (UTC)

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Red Square → Beautiful Square – The Russian word ‘красная’ means ‘beautiful’ in this context. Also ‘Beautiful Square’ is used in reliable sources; exempli gratiā, Robert Lyall, M.D. (1823). THE CHARACTER OF THE RUSSIANS, AND A DETAILED HISTORY OF MOSCOW. p. 51., James Bell (1832). A SYSTEM OF GEOGRAPHY, POPULAR AND SCIENTIFIC, OR A PHYSICAL, POLITICAL, AND STATISTICAL ACCOUNT OF THE WORLD AND ITS VARIOUS DIVISIONS. VOL. I. p. 94., THE EDINBURGH REVIEW, OR CRITICAL JOURNAL: FOR APRIL......JULY, 1834. VOL. LIX. p. 377., &c. Γρηγόριος (talk) 03:16, 1 December 2016 (UTC)

• Oppose per WP:COMMONNAME. This high-profile subject appears in 81 Wikipedias and none translates it as "beautiful". —Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 05:17, 1 December 2016 (UTC)
  • We should follow the reliable sources, not other Wikipedias. Γρηγόριος (talk) 07:29, 1 December 2016 (UTC)
• Oppose per WP:COMMONNAME. It is well attested to as being known exclusively as "Red Square" in the English language. You've also omitted the fact that 'красный' means 'red' in Russian, as well as the long history behind its being known as 'Red Square'. Don't mix your 'красивый' and 'прекрасный' with 'красное'. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 05:39, 1 December 2016 (UTC)
  • Please watch up links.
    I don’t mix it. The word ‘красный’ primarily means ‘beautiful’, red color is the latest meaning. Γρηγόριος (talk) 07:29, 1 December 2016 (UTC)
• Oppose and speedy close time wasting In ictu oculi (talk) 08:09, 1 December 2016 (UTC)
• Could 'Beautiful Square' be added as an alternate name in the lead? The page text describes the name as both 'Red' and 'Beautiful'. Randy Kryn 11:27, 1 December 2016 (UTC)
• Oppose. This has got to be one of the stupidest RMs I've ever seen. It's always been called Red Square in English and nothing else. -- Necrothesp (talk) 12:53, 1 December 2016 (UTC)
  • Excuse me? I gave you the reliable English sources. Γρηγόριος (talk) 19:59, 1 December 2016 (UTC)
    • Er, you what? You provided a text from a traveller in the form of Lyall, who is quoted by the second source... from 1823! The common name in the English language is 'Red square', full stop. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 22:22, 1 December 2016 (UTC)
      • I have adduced three sources, and you have adduced nothing. Please read WP:RS. Γρηγόριος (talk) 23:24, 1 December 2016 (UTC)

  You have produced three 19th century sources, one of which just quotes what the first traveller said. It's irrelevant as to how a couple of 19th century sources chose to translate the name (which does not attest to what the locals understood it to mean). I'm not going to entertain you by wasting time in producing the hundreds of thousands of uses of 'Red Square'. Try looking it up in any other English language encyclopaedia, news article, or scholarly textbook. You're convincing no-one. You have editing experience of... how many edits? In the single digits!... and you're telling me to read WP:RS? You're wasting the community's time. What's next? Shall we change 'Red Army' to 'Beautiful Army'? --Iryna Harpy (talk) 23:47, 1 December 2016 (UTC)

• Do you discriminate me by the quantity of my edits?
  ‘Красная Армия’ means ‘Red Army,’ but ‘Красная площадь’ means ‘Beautiful Square’. These are different things. Also you must reach a consensus in accordance with WP:CONS. All you do at present is dictatura. Γρηγόριος (talk) 00:53, 2 December 2016 (UTC)

• Oppose and speedy close: per WP:COMMONNAME. First admin that sees this should close. Ebonelm (talk) 13:15, 1 December 2016 (UTC)]

  Agreed, but add 'Beautiful Square' as an alternate name. Randy Kryn 16:04, 1 December 2016 (UTC)

  In what form? It's already in the body of the article. There aren't even any Russian sources discussing whether it was intended to designate it as being 'red' or 'beautiful'. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 22:22, 1 December 2016 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Meaning of the word "krasnaya"

This word has only one meaning in modern Russian, this meaning is "red". "Beautiful" is the former meaning of this word in very old Russian. So, please, fix this sentence in article: "Russian word красная (krasnaya), which means both "red" and "beautiful"..." MBH (talk) 12:54, 10 June 2017 (UTC)