Talk:M1 (Istanbul Metro)

combine articles Istanbul LRT and Istanbul Metro

Maybe the articles 'Istanbul LRT' and 'Istanbul Metro' should be combined under the Name Metro Istanbul, as "Hafif Metro M1" is not really a light rail line and - named M1 - it is part of the metro system. The "Istanbul LRT" article should just contain information about the tramway line T4, as T4 is indeed a LRT-line. The German wiki-edition has this structure and it is much more comfortable to get the information you need. 77.7.73.54 (talk) 22:26, 31 January 2013 (UTC)

Axle load

It would be good to add the axle load as it is an important technical information for metro lines. Unfortunately I haven't been able to find it on internet. 217.167.19.152 (talk) 09:47, 16 January 2012 (UTC)

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Proposed Article Move

I propose that this article be moved and refocused on just the M1 Istanbul Metro line. Reasons:

1. The M1 line, by this article's own admission, is now a fully "metro standards" line (i.e. is no longer a "light rail transit (LRT)" system), and is already well covered by the Istanbul Metro article.
2. The T4 line is categorized, even by the operator, as a "tramway", and so should instead be covered in the Istanbul modern tramways article rather than here.
3. Bundling the M1 and T4 lines together, as is done in this article, seems to be a completely arbitrary arrangement, as there is almost nothing linking the two systems together - the operator of these two systems certainly doesn't link them "together as one" in any way like this article does. (Even the corresponding Turkish Wiki article to this one is nothing more than a stub.)

The "cleanest" solution would seem to be to move/retitle this article to "M1 (Istanbul Metro)" (to 'synch' it with the "M2 (Istanbul Metro)", etc. articles), and then remove the T4 content from this article and move it over to the Istanbul modern tramways article.

I'd appreciate any thoughts on this proposal, but if there are no objections I will likely start on implementing this proposal in the next few weeks. --IJBall (talk) 17:24, 16 April 2014 (UTC)

I sitrictly oppose that. LRT is not a proper metro. As you know they are completely different systems at all. But i do support your ideas on revising or improving this article. By the way there is an ongoing conversion of the old suburban train to a metro line but there arent any works on lrt. Which makes the term proper 'metro' unapplicable in this cituation.elmasmelih (used to be KazekageTR) 17:41, 16 April 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for your response! Can it be explained exactly in what way the M1 line "fails" as a metro (metro standards are usually defined as: 1) fully electrified, 2) fully grade-separated (i.e. no at-grade road crossings, and no track sharing with other rail systems), and 3) high volume of service). It looks to me like M1 meets criteria #1 & #3, but I know nothing about how it meets (or doesn't) criteria #2.

On the Marmaray issue, because it will share tracks with freight rail, it does not seem to me that it will achieve "metro standards" ever.

As to the other point - why is Line T4 included here? The operator classifies the line as "tramway", [1] and I can't figure out what the T4 line has to do with the M1 line, and why the T4 line isn't better covered by being merged over into the Istanbul modern tramways article.

Thanks in advance. --IJBall (talk) 18:19, 16 April 2014 (UTC)

Actually mate, if you check the Medium-capacity rail transport system article, these light-metros have separate articles from their city's proper metro articles, right? They are complying the facts that you gave - 1) fully electrified, 2) fully grade-separated (i.e. no at-grade road crossings, and no track sharing with other rail systems) etc. You're right about T4 line in one point, which is it's classification. But since it has LRT standards, would it matter anyway? Edit: Let's do your "cleanest" solution for M1, but something else for T4. elmasmelih (used to be KazekageTR) 20:08, 17 April 2014 (UTC)

Ah, OK - based on the Medium-capacity rail transport system article, the M1 is getting to be near the outside of "Light Metro" (i.e. if they ever switch to, say, 6-car trains, then M1 will really be a full "metro" line). But, point taken - for now, it is in a different category than lines M2-M4.

So, I propose two solutions here:

1. On T4, I'm starting to copy some content over to the Istanbul modern tramways article. It doesn't matter to me if the info on T4 is in both articles (i.e. both here, and over in the Istanbul modern tramways article), but T4 should definitely at least be included over in the Istanbul modern tramways article. And if the T4 line ever switches to low-floor vehicles like the T1 line uses, then I think T4 should be fully eliminated from this article. (IOW, it seems like the only reason that T4 line is included here is because it currently uses high-floor light rail vehicles (LRVs), despite being in every other way a traditional "tram" line...)
2. On this article, I'd suggest a name change/move is in order (again?). Because M1 is definitely "more" than just a "LRT" line - it's at least a "light metro". So maybe, the T4 portions of this article should just be fully moved over to the Istanbul modern tramways article afterall, and this article should be retitled back to something like "Istanbul Hafif Metro (M1 Line)" (or "M1 (Istanbul Hafif Metro)") or "Istanbul Light Metro (M1 Line)" (or "M1 (Istanbul Light Metro)").

Anyway, those are just my thoughts and suggestions on the matter... --IJBall (talk) 22:38, 17 April 2014 (UTC)

Im totally ok with those steps. There is an article, M1A (Istanbul Metro), that needs to be merged with the main M1 line. elmasmelih (used to be KazekageTR) 05:31, 18 April 2014 (UTC)

Page moved: to M1 (Istanbul Metro). --IJBall (talk) 19:17, 23 April 2014 (UTC)

Proposal To Merge This Article With The M1A (Istanbul Metro) Article

OK, having now finished the 'transfer' of the T4 tramline information to the Istanbul modern tramways article (where it belongs), as outlined in the Talk topic above, and refocused this article just on the Istanbul Hafif Metro (i.e. the M1 Line of the Istanbul Metro), the next issue becomes what to do currently, as this article now strongly overlaps with the M1A (Istanbul Metro) article.

I therefore propose that this article, and the M1A (Istanbul Metro), be merged in to one article.
(Note: A parallel discussion on this topic is going on at the M1A (Istanbul Metro) Talk page.)

This article is older, and is more generally focused on the entire Istanbul Hafif Metro system (rather than just one branch line as the M1A (Istanbul Metro) is), it seems more logical to merge the M1A (Istanbul Metro) article into this one, and then to delete the M1A (Istanbul Metro) article.

Once the two articles are merged, this article should then be retitled something along the lines of "M1 (Istanbul Light Metro)", as discussed above.

Any thoughts, suggestions, or additions to this proposal will be welcome. Thanks in advance. --IJBall (talk) 22:48, 19 April 2014 (UTC)

I support your decision and pledge my help to you if it is needed. We could just rename it M1 (Istanbul Metro) instead of M1 (Istanbul Light Metro) cause the operator of these systems claims that it is a metro not a light one right ? elmasmelih (used to be KazekageTR) 19:04, 20 April 2014 (UTC)

Honestly, elmasmelih, I think my preference would be to move this page to M1 (Istanbul Metro) (my original proposal) because:

1. that is what the operator calls it (I don't see any evidence of the use of the term "Hafif Metro" for M1 on the operator's website),
2. that will put this page in parallel with the other Istanbul Metro line articles, like the "M2 (Istanbul Metro)" article, etc.; and
3. while M1 may technically still be a "Light Metro", I think its passenger volumes might be getting close to about 20,000 passengers per hour per direction (PPHPD) which would basically make it officially "metro"-level in terms of passenger volumes.

So I think the way forward from here is to: first, move this page to "M1 (Istanbul Metro)"; second, to merge the content at "M1A (Istanbul Metro)" into this article; and then, third, to nominate the "M1A (Istanbul Metro)" article for deletion (NfD)... or to do an "article merge"? (I've never done one of those before!...) --IJBall (talk) 21:49, 20 April 2014 (UTC)

Mate you dont have to nominate it for deletion, just redirect it to M1 (Istanbul Metro) article. And I agree with your reasons. elmasmelih (used to be KazekageTR) 05:25, 21 April 2014 (UTC)

OK, in a few days, one of us should move this page to M1 (Istanbul Metro). I'd like to wait to see if anyone else comments, so I'll target next weekend to merge of the contents of the "M1A (Istanbul Metro)" article over to this one, and then set the 'redirect' from there over to here. --IJBall (talk) 20:51, 21 April 2014 (UTC)

Update: The content of the old "M1A (Istanbul Metro)" article has now been merged in to this one, and a redirect from that article to this one has been put in its place. IOW, this task is now:  Done! --IJBall (talk) 02:00, 26 April 2014 (UTC)

Recent edits to this article

I am concerned about a series of recent edits to this article. These edits have come from a series of IP addresses and have involved problematic changes to the lede, as well as changing direct links to articles about the stations on the M1 line to articles that do not directly reference or describe the stations in question. I am hoping the IP editor in question might be willing to discuss the purpose of these edits so that we might be able to understand what they are attempting to achieve with them, and hopefully come to a consensus about the article. If anyone knows what I am referring to, please comment here. Thanks in advance. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 21:25, 17 October 2015 (UTC)

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