Talk:Johnny Young

Proposed major edits

As a 2010 ARIA Hall of Fame inductee (recently announced), Johnny Young deserve a B-class article (or better). Consequently Dan arndt has started improving this article, I'm going to join in, and the overall job should take about a week. Interim edits may look incomplete or disorganised, other editors are also welcome to join in.shaidar cuebiyar (talk) 11:20, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

I've done my bit and believe its now up to B-class.shaidar cuebiyar (talk) 23:53, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Inconsistencies and other problems

There are are few inconsistencies:

• Birth name: John Benjamin de Jong (lede para and info box) but Johnny Benjamin de Jong (Early life)

• Birth date: 12 March 1947 (lede), but 11 March 1947 (infobox and Early life)

• How can his origin be Perth if he was born in Rotterdam?

• Why do some sites say he was born in Indonesia?

• Johnny Young talent time 1947 gets 772,000 ghits, but Johnny Young talent time 1945 gets 892,000, suggesting the majority of sites think he was born in 1945, not 1947. This needs to be addressed and resolved, not ignored.

• The article is full of grammatical errors like run-on sentences and comma splices ("Young was raised as the son of Fokke Jan de Jong and his wife Anna, they already had three children Cornelia, Antonia and Ferdinand.").

• It shouldn’t even be B class at this stage. -- Jack of Oz ^{[your turn]} 12:30, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

I dispute your claim that the article is not even B-class. Your inconsistencies can be resolved:

Major reference for his birth name and date of birth is the National Archives of Australia record no. A2478 (currently ref [1]). It shows his name as Johnny B de Jong born on 12 March 1947 from The Netherlands (the same source gives details for the rest of his family). Australian Story interview, Ref [2], gives middle name of Benjamin and Rotterdam. Inconsistencies between use of John and Johnny in the article are minor and I've fixed these.

His origin being Perth relates to the start of his performance career per Template:Infobox musical artist.

Other sites giving Indonesia as his place of birth could relate to his stepfather serving there after world war II. See ref [2].

1945 vs 1947? An earlier form of this article also had 1945, Milesago ref (currently no. [6]) also uses 1945, however ref [1] is more reliable for dob.

There may well be grammatical errors and the article can certainly be improved: be bold, you could help.shaidar cuebiyar (talk) 14:14, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

• I've supplied a note detailing sources for his birth name, date & place of birth. I've listed some alternatives to these with sources for each.shaidar cuebiyar (talk) 20:45, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

External links modified

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• Attempted to fix sourcing for www.whammo.com.au/index.asp
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/20101030011024/http://www.themusicnetwork.com:80/music-news/industry/2010/10/28/aria-hall-of-fame-celebrates-musics-loved-ones/ to http://www.themusicnetwork.com/music-news/industry/2010/10/28/aria-hall-of-fame-celebrates-musics-loved-ones/

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External links modified

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I have just modified 3 external links on Johnny Young. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.whammo.com.au/encyclopedia.asp?articleid=804
• Added archive http://www.webcitation.org/6YiGE4tE6?url=http://erl.canberra.edu.au/uploads/approved/adt-AUC20050509.095456/public/02whole.pdf to http://erl.canberra.edu.au/uploads/approved/adt-AUC20050509.095456/public/02whole.pdf
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070329190636/http://www.poparchives.com.au/gosetcharts/1967/19671004.html to http://www.poparchives.com.au/gosetcharts/1967/19671004.html

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Suspected copy violations?

Recently two edits by @TheMagnificentist: (see here) removed content, which the user claimed as being copy violations. Note that much of the material in the Lead was removed leaving behind a short, single sentence. This makes the Lead uninformative and a poor summary of the rest of the article's content. Also removed was substantial content from the main text and ref tabs (leaving behind unused refs) this has caused unnecessary disruption to the article.

I contend that the material removed was not copy violation by WP. The user cites Earwig's Copyvio Detector (EPD) to justify the removals. EPD does not determine the direction of any copy violations nor does it determine whether material is available via creative commons licensing.

Consider:

1. EPD's highest reading (see here) is 30.6%, which is for material from Duncan Kimball's article, "Johnny Young", at his Milesago website. EPD states that "Violation Unlikely". In the WP article, this website, and Kimball, is fully acknowledged at ref tab [7]. Furthermore, Kimball has generously made his material at that site available via a creative commons licence (see his "Main Menu"). Some material cited to Kimball was removed. In what way is its usage at WP a copy violation?
   1. I invite the site's editor and chief author, Duncan Kimball @Dunks58:, to comment if he wishes to clarify the situation.
2. The 2nd highest reading (see here) is 26.5%, "Violation Unlikely". In the WP article a direct quote is cited to Martin Clarke at ref tab [8]. This material was not removed.
3. The 3rd highest reading (see here) is 12.3%, "Violation Unlikely". All content from Ian McFarlane's entry on "Johnny Young" is duly acknowledged at ref tab [4]. This is not copy violation as the reliable source is cited correctly and whole slabs of material from the site are not being used.
4. The 4th highest reading (see here) is 4.8% "Violation Unlikely". A sentence fragment for a direct quote, which is duly acknowledged by ref tab [14] is not copy violation.
5. The 5th highest reading (see here) is 1.0% "Violation Unlikely". The title of a documentary which is acknowledge by ref tab [13], this is not copy violation.

Some removed material was supported by reliable in-line citations. There is no copy violation in these.

I ask User:TheMagnificentist to justify the removal of the content from this article under the claim of copy violation when I dispute this claim. I am going to return that material to the article and request that it remain until such justification is given.shaidar cuebiyar (talk) 02:05, 6 July 2017 (UTC)

External links modified

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I have just modified 2 external links on Johnny Young. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20091015024603/http://www.whiteroom.com.au/howlspace/whoswho/aboutww.htm to http://www.whiteroom.com.au/howlspace/whoswho/aboutww.htm
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checked.shaidar cuebiyar (talk) 23:27, 1 December 2017 (UTC)

October 2021 reversions

On 7 October 2021, @1.43.15.97: made significant changes to this article. The differences are available here. User:1.43.15.97 did not provide any edit summary nor discuss the changes on this page. Consequently they were reverted per WP:BLP. Not only was content disrupted but also its display. According to WP:MOSLEAD, the Lead section of an article of this size should have 3 or 4 ¶¶ and provide content with relative emphasis and suitable readability.

Two days later, User:1.43.15.97 reverted the article, (see here) with an edit summary, "Undid revision 1048790638 by Shaidar cuebiyar (talk) I see he need a reference for th email implement, but he is known as John Young nowadays." Soon after they added new content to the Lead, (see here). Once again I reverted both of these changes, the latter content has a place in the main text under Later years, but its relevance to the artist's career is not sufficient to be placed in the Lead. I dispute the changes made by User1.43.15.97 and ask them to discuss their proposed changes here, in an attempt to reach a consensus.shaidar cuebiyar (talk) 04:47, 13 October 2021 (UTC)