Talk:Albert Blithe

Comments

For those who want to know: the text after the third episode from Band of Brothers mentions that the man died in 1948 as well...

this article is very incomplete

While unclear, this article means to suggest that the documentary portrayed the event incorrectly as the veterans they interviewed in crafting the character recalled the events wrong. His family pointed out the error after watching the show.SirLamer 04:37, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

It's not documentary (even if it's thoroughly based on real stories). This case is evidently matter of mistake, but there are many other occasions when Band of Brothers is not historically accurate (in soldiers stories). People just shouldn't see it as documentary...--79.98.72.36 (talk) 14:59, 17 February 2009 (UTC)

It's perilously close to one. Certainly historical inaccuracies (as in this case) and literary license (as in other cases in the series) are appropriate for inclusion in the article. I'd add that I've heard that the Blithe family disputes the account of his performance under fire, but I don't have a reliable source handy. Wellspring (talk) 11:05, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

Patch

Why is he wearing both the 101st and 82nd Division Patches? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Daysleeper47 (talk • contribs).

Hi Daysleeper47, he's wearing both the 101st and 82nd Division Patches because he served with the 101st during World War II, and reenlisted for another tour of duty on 28 March 1949 (he received an honourable dischage 27 March 1949). His affidavit accompanying his Master Parachutist Badge award shows that he jumped with 82nd on 16 November 1953, though he was probably assigned to the 82nd before this date. Incidentally, it was with the 82nd that he rose to Master Sergeant and won the "82nd Airborne Division 1958 Trooper of the Year" award. --Deathphoenix ʕ 05:01, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

A patch on the right sleeve indicates a unit that he served in combat with (The 101st). A patch on the left sleeve indicates the unit that he was assigned to at the time (82nd). SoldierMedic —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.144.134.2 (talk) 13:46, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

Service Record

How did he serve in [Market Garden] and [Bastogne] if he wasn't released from the hospital until after the war was over? As stated previously, this article is incomplete, although it does at least elaborate on the incorrect information provided by the book and dvd. Also his discharge papers from 1945 list the Purple Heart and the Combat Infantryman badge, papers from the 1950's list the silver star and bronze star medal for service in the 506th. Something isn't adding up here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.255.61.196 (talk) 16:18, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

There is something seriously wrong with the service history reported for this individual. There3 are repeated references to him serving with the 82nd Airborne Division in Korea, and during the Korean War. But - the 82nd never participated in the Korean conflict. Possibly, he was serving with the 187th Regimental Combat Team - but that was not part of the 82nd.

I have seen a copy of his orders for the master parachutist badge which also includes a list of the required 65 jumps that he "participated" in. One listed was the combat jump into Holland, as well as jumps stating that he served as a Jumpmaster and as a pathfinder, all these in 1943/44. Now how can a soldier that was still in a military hospital in September 1944 possibly make the Holland Jump? And no Private has ever served as a Jumpmaster. No where have I ever seen his name listed as a pathfinder from E/506.

I have also seen claims that he was awarded a silver star and bronze stars in Korea but his service record gives the award authority as the 506th. For a soldier that only served a couple weeks in Normandy how is it possible that he was awarded a silver star and 3 bronze stars?

I would venture to say he fabricated a lot of his service record, which I'm sure if someone did some good research would be able to verify what I've been thinking. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.234.23.150 (talk) 02:25, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

That's a piss-poor accusation. With the exceptionally shoddy research on him by Ambrose and others, you should take into account that conflicting information is the fault of others. His paperwork says he served with the 187th Airborne RCT in Korea (somebody else made the mistake of listing him with the 82nd during that time). According to paperwork, he was with the Pathfinders for 6 months from Oct '43 to Feb '44 before transferring back to Easy Co. Also, his orders were attached to his application for Master Parachutists Badge (but they are not shown online) and they were verified by the personnel officer per the affidavit. His DA 638 Recommendation for Award lists 1 Silver Star, 3 Bronze Stars, 3 Purple Hearts, a Combat Infantry Badge and a Good Conduct Medal with 3 knots. -- all from his service with the 506th Co. E during WWII. He didn't create that document..Capt. Peter E. Burns did, who was putting him up for a Commendation ribbon with a metal pendant. YOU go do the research if you want to level such dishonorable accusations.
⋙–Berean–Hunter—► ((⊕)) 03:42, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Ok, here are some facts which have been verified as to his WWII service, he was wounded around the 25 of June 1944 which would mean he served approximately 20 days in combat. After being wounded he was sent back to the United States and never returned to the 506th which is why the members of Easy company thought he died from his wounds.

The book "Rendezvous with destiny" which is the WWII history of the 101st does not have him listed under the roster of silver star recipients, though this list could possibly not be 100% accurate. However with 20 days in combat it is HIGHLY unlikely that he could have been awarded 1 silver star, 3 bronze stars and 3 purple hearts. Pretty impressive, I would like to know what he did to supposedly receive the silver star and bronze stars. His grave marker at Arlington lists only the Purple Heart at the bottom of the Head stone.

As to his jump record it list's him serving as a Jumpmaster on various training jump's as well as the Normandy jump, never heard of a Private serving as a Jumpmaster. For example Lt Winters served as a Jumpmaster on his plane for the Normandy jump. As I previously mentioned his jump record lists the jump for Operation Market Garden, so if he never returned to combat after the 25th of June how again did he make that combat Jump on the 18th of September? His signature is on the jump record which confirms the record is true and correct to the best of his knowledge. So if there was a paperwork SNAFU why did he not have it corrected and why did he sign it?

Plus his jump record does not list a single jump between September 1944 and 16 November 1953, if he did serve with the 187th ARCT during the Korean war why are no jumps listed between these dates? The 187th made 2 combat jumps during the Korean war, I suppose he did not participate in those jumps.

Military personnel have been known to lie about their awards and decoration's, this is nothing new. Do a google search on CSM Stoney Crump and SGM John letuli for examples. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.234.23.150 (talk) 00:52, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

1. Where does it say that he was sent home after being wounded on Jun 25, 1944? Need a source other than the bad memory of the 101st vets. None of them got anything right about him.

2. His paperwork shows that he transferred to the 187th ARCT in 1954 and then went to Korea five months later. He was serving during the Korean War but didn't go to Korea until after the conflict was over. His paperwork didn't show him asserting combat time in Korea (shoddy researchers did that).

3. What are the dates of his promotions? Maybe he was a corporal and not a private when claiming jumpmaster.

4. I haven't seen evidence that there was a jumpmaster school/course at the time they trained...they seem to have cross-trained without rank requirements. Ambrose stated that the 506th PIR was an experimental unit, being the first regiment to undertake airborne training as a formed unit. (page 18) An article in the Army Times, "Duty, Honor, Country: Today's parachutist badges reflect jumpers' experience" (Fred L. Borch and Robert F. Dorr), stated that "Additions were made to the requirements for senior and master badges after 1950, including satisfactory completion of the jumpmaster course". The same article states, "When not enough men volunteered for airborne training, the Army forcibly assigned soldiers to airborne units and made units conduct their own airborne training. In the late 1940s, for example, the 11th Airborne Division, then in Japan, conducted its own parachute and glider training." That means it is perfectly plausible that Blithe might have been serving as a jumpmaster. Notice that he places percentages for the number of times he served as jumpmaster -- sounds like they were doing rotations between members of the stick.

Blithe seems to have gotten treated poorly all the way around. Those reporting on him are the ones I've seen screwing up and creating the misunderstandings. Until something shows up in real records that contradicts what he wrote, we should extend good faith and a bit of honor for one who has been shafted so badly. I encourage you to keep looking.
⋙–Berean–Hunter—► ((⊕)) 02:30, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

The following website has a copy of his discharge from 1945 http://www.tircuit.com/bandofbrothers/messages/135/879.html, I see no silver stars, bronze stars or additional purple hearts listed. It does list his one purple heart and CIB from the normandy campaign though. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 160.134.5.27 (talk) 12:57, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Wearing unauthorized awards

I have copies of Blithe's records courtesy of the National Personnel records Center, Blithe was never awarded the Silver Star, Bronze star or the extra purple hearts. According to NPRC records he was awarded one purple heart, not three. Additionally he never saw any combat in the Korean war, from Oct 1949 to September 1950 he served at Fort Meade Maryland and from Nov 1950 to Oct 1953 he was serving in Europe. Blithe's combat service lasted approximately 20 during the Normandy campaign, after being wounded on June 21st 1944 he never returned to combat. Why he wore unauthorized awards that he did not earn is something that will never be known. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.234.3.147 (talk) 01:13, 5 April 2011 (UTC)

You are confused. He never wore unauthorized awards...rather, others have attributed him as doing so. You are correct to remove those from the article.
⋙–Berean–Hunter—► ((⊕)) 01:46, 5 April 2011 (UTC)

As for the Jumpmaster...that is likely a result of what the Chinese awarded him (Master Jump wings)... scroll down until you see the newspaper article of award.
⋙–Berean–Hunter—► ((⊕)) 01:53, 5 April 2011 (UTC)

No confusion here, Blithe can be seen wearing those unauthorized awards in a photo at this site, http://www.506infantry.org/his2ndbnwwiiphoto24.html. The silver star can clearly be seen as well as the purple heart with 2 oak leaf clusters. He did falsify his jump record by listing the combat jump into Holland which can also be seen at the site linked above. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.234.3.147 (talk) 21:14, 5 April 2011 (UTC)

1. I assume you mean the pic with his wife...I can't see what you say you're seeing. Not trying to be difficult here. It's a b&w photo, and I can't read the fruit salad all that well.

2. We can't jump to conclusions, there may be things we don't have records for. As I recall, the Army records center in Missouri burned and they lost many records...it's possible they lost some of his. (Yeah, this fire) There may be other reasons, too.

3. We need reliable sources to state what you seem to be deriving via original research or synthesis. We couldn't include your conclusions but it would have to be published from a highly-reputable source.

4. If you have his personnel record, why not upload it to the Commons so we can discuss further. That would be a nice addition.
⋙–Berean–Hunter—► ((⊕)) 22:09, 5 April 2011 (UTC)

So, this debate and all this research hit a dead end? This the reason for the article's pending deletion? It's been years and we still can't verify anything about this guy? 2601:87:4080:372:84D7:679C:1DA0:C7F6 (talk) 20:13, 29 March 2018 (UTC)

ARCT

I know nothing about the military. I am watching "Band of Brothers" for the first time and am reading a lot of military articles. This article had "ARCT" which was undefined and used only once. I find this common throughout the military articles I read. The Wikipedia guidance for use of acronyms says "Always consider whether it is better to simply write a word or phrase out in full, thus avoiding potential confusion for those not familiar with its abbreviation." Certainly most readers will not be familiar with the acronym ARCT. It is frustrating to read so many articles on a single topic (military), all of which are peppered with unexplained acronyms. Thanks for letting me rant. Very good article otherwise. Nick Beeson (talk) 04:23, 25 October 2017 (UTC)

Thanks for the note. Sometimes these things seem so obvious until...--Georgia Army Vet Contribs Talk 21:54, 26 October 2017 (UTC)

Death - again

I've removed the statement that the report of Blithe's death was the fault of Stephen E. Ambrose. While Ambrose's error rate may be considered legendary, this was not one of them. Ambrose described Blithe's temporary blindness (page 98) and his being a member of a patrol—leading to his being wounded in the neck (pages 103–104). Blithe also appears in the index (page 322). Ambrose never mentions Blithe dying. Please review the text of the book at Band of Brothers on Google Books.--Georgia Army Vet Contribs Talk 21:05, 13 January 2021 (UTC)

Ok - that's partly my mistake. It was relayed to me that this was an error in the book, but not the specific page so I edited a pre-existing sentence mentioning the error. Odd that Hanks, et al made such an egregious error in the show. Ckruschke (talk) 18:48, 14 January 2021 (UTC)Ckruschke

Assigning the "blame" for the error has become an on-going game. We've flagged the page internally telling people not to edit the date but people do it anyway. Most often, they change '67 to '47 in spite of the trailing text in the episode reading '48. I've made my share of mistakes, too.--Georgia Army Vet Contribs Talk 20:57, 14 January 2021 (UTC)