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Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/Lil Debbie discography/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by PresN 04:07, 18 August 2015 (UTC) [1].[reply]

Lil Debbie discography edit

Lil Debbie discography (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

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Nominator(s): Azealia911 talk 12:09, 31 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

This article details the discography of American rapper Lil Debbie, from her early 2012 mixtapes to her recent 2015 EPs. It features a strong, well-covering lead along with a well-referenced comprehensive list of releases. Azealia911 talk 12:09, 31 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

  • Quick drive-by comment - "Following an appearance in the music video for group member Kreayshawn's "Gucci Gucci" in 2011" - what group? No group has been mentioned............ -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 15:32, 2 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
So it hadn't, added a note about it now. Azealia911 talk
  • Back for a proper review.....
    • "In 2011" mentioned in two consecutive sentences, not sure both are needed
Removed one. Azealia911 talk
    • V-Nasty wikilinked in two consecutive sentences
Removed one. Azealia911 talk
    • "These videos later saw commercial release as singles" - the videos themselves can't have been released as singles. The songs were released as singles
Corrected. Azealia911 talk
    • "Due to the relatively minuscule track listing, Queen D was not eligible to chart on any album charts in the United States" - is it really necessary to state this? Why would people expect EPs to be eligible for the albums chart? Certainly in the UK, where I am based, an EP would always chart on the singles chart.
I'd say it was appropriate. I too live in the UK, but rules are seemingly different for US charting. EG, her first EP, Queen D featured five tracks and charted on singles charts. However, her second EP, California Sweetheart, Pt. 1, released less than six months later, featured eight tracks and charted on an album chart. Both are technically EPs so are listed as such, but one charted on singles charts while the other logged in on an album chart. The note clears up any possible confusion. Azealia911 talk
That makes sense, but "Due to the relatively minuscule track listing" seems a little verbose, I'd be inclined to say simply "Due to its short length". After all, I presume the criterion is based on total run time rather than number of tracks. Napalm Death could release a CD with 20 tracks but it would still probably be eligible for the singles chart ;-) -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 15:36, 3 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Lol you're right about Napalm Death, changed the sentence. :) Azealia911 talk
    • "commercial success of it's predecessor" - there should not be an apostrophe in "its"
Corrected. Azealia911 talk
    • "The EP featured guest appearances from Wiz Khalifa, Paul Wall and Bricc Baby Shitro." - not sourced
Sourced. Azealia911 talk
    • Promotional singles table - sources do not confirm that these were promotional singles? For that matter, what is the definition of a promotional single as opposed to a regular single?
Regular singles are always released commercially. However, the lines on what promotional singles are is quite blurred, especially on this site. Usually, anything that garnered notable release but wasn't an official single gets thrown in that box. From my perspective, after seeing examples in other discographies and reading over the article for promotional single, anything that was released for free, but was still largely reported on, used to promote a project, received artwork ETC, is a promotional single. I'll use that for the two specific listings.
The "What It Look Like" remix received an artwork, notable coverage from Complex, and was released for free. Having another rapper on the song reaches out to their fanbase and promotes the work of Lil Debbie. "420" was released on July 30, a day before the Home Grown EP dropped, and was the only track to feature a barely-relevant rapper she's ever worked with, hyping up the release for the EP. However, that is my interpretation and you may well class that as WP:OR, but I think you'll struggle to get the same answer out of two people on what a promotional single is. Azealia911 talk
    • List of non-single guest appearances - two of them apparently did not appear on any album. If they weren't on albums, and weren't singles, what were they??
They're just that, guest appearances. Songs in which she wasn't the lead artist of, that didn't garner a single release. You'll find non-album guest appearances a common occurrence in modern FL discographies. Azealia911 talk
How were they released, though, if not either as singles or on albums? That's what I'm struggling to grasp...... -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 15:27, 3 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
In this case, the two tracks were released to online streaming, the song "Not the Same" was uploaded to AudioMack, a site where users can stream/download urban music, while the song "Pump" was uploaded to Red Bulls site. Azealia911 talk
Thanks for the clarification. I fear I'm a bit out of touch with all the ways the kids get their music these days ;-) Out of interest, if tracks had been uploaded to those sites which were not guest appearances but were by Debbie alone, where in the discography would those have appeared.....? -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 07:19, 4 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

lol it's fine, I appreciate the thorough review. Umm, if Debbie was the lead artist, I probably wouldn't have included it, maybe if she had enough stand alone releases as a lead artist, I'd create an "Other releases" section like I did at Azealia Banks discography. Azealia911 talk 09:54, 4 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your comments. Azealia911 talk 12:56, 3 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - all seems OK now, thanks for bearing with me ;-) -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 11:58, 4 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
No problem whatsoever, thankyou for the support :) Azealia911 talk 12:19, 4 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved comments from Littlecarmen (talk) 20:57, 4 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Comments from Littlecarmen
  • "all of which received music videos" -> "all of which were accompanied by music videos"
Done Azealia911 talk
  • It did however, chart Remove the comma.
Done Azealia911 talk
  • "The EP featured no guest appearances as opposed to her earlier releases" Neither did Queen D, just leave this part out.
Done Azealia911 talk
  • "In October 2014, a compilation of the two California Sweetheart EPs was released, with a re-edited cover, exclusively on CD format." The cover art and format aren't that important, you don't need to mention that. Remove the year.
Done Azealia911 talk
  • "In November of that year, Debbie's second mixtape, Young B!tch, was released." You can remove "of that year". Maybe say "a month later"
Done Azealia911 talk
  • "as a part of the Colt 45 mixtape Colt 15." -> ", which appeared on the Colt 45 mixtape Colt 15."
Done Azealia911 talk
  • For "Lofty" you only mention a year, for Home Grown you give an exact date. Mention the months "Lofty" and Home Grown were released.
Done Azealia911 talk
  • Maybe move the references behind the place it was released. It looks cleaner that way.
Done Azealia911 talk
  • References: Only italicize magazines and newspapers.
Done, side note, can you link me to the relevant guideline/policy on italicization in references? It seems to be a reoccurring issue at my FLCs that I should see to before nominating in future. Azealia911 talk
WP:CITEHOW mentions what should be in italics. Littlecarmen (talk) 20:57, 4 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Commercial sources should be avoided on Wikipedia. Can you find other references for the info sourced by Amazon, iTunes Store etc.?

Littlecarmen (talk) 19:33, 4 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Unfortunately not. Believe me when I say that I searched high and low for non-commercial references. I completely cleared out Complex and HotNewHipHop, as well as trundling through every urban hip-hop site imaginable. The two hardest things to reference were the "Me and You" single, where I actually resorted to an archived iTunes link from Italy, as the US and UK versions have deleted it from their database, as it was seemingly pulled as a single after a bad response, and the California Sweetheart compilation, which was seemingly a limited release, and not reported on at all. Any commercial references are the last resort.

Thankyou for your comments! Azealia911 talk 20:10, 4 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

All right, I don't think commercial sources are forbidden, it's just best to use others if possible but I completely understand that it can be difficult and sometimes impossible to find other sources. Littlecarmen (talk) 20:57, 4 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Thankyou! Azealia911 talk 21:01, 4 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Reviewer: Eurofan88 (talk)

  • You should change the number of singles from 14 to 12 as 2 of them are promotional singles.
No, they're still singles, promotional or not. Azealia911 talk
  • Why Riff Raff's name is capitalized? It's a stylization and should be omitted anyway.
Changed. Azealia911 talk
  • Use Director(s) in the Music video section as Joe Dietsch and Louie Gibson directed two vidoes together. --Eurofan88 (talk) 22:06, 6 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Changed. Azealia911 talk

Thankyou for your comments. Azealia911 talk 22:11, 6 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

  • Support, in overall it's a good list, but sad that none of her releases have their own articles on Wikipedia. --Eurofan88 (talk) 22:15, 6 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Thankyou for the support, yep I agree, it's hard due to her being such a low charting artist, although I am working on a couple. Azealia911 talk 22:19, 6 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from FrB.TG edit

Resolved comments from Frankie talk
* "It did however chart at" → "However, it charted at".
Done Azealia911 talk
  • Why am I seeing so many months in the third paragraph. Normally we mention years of works, and here I see too many months.
Reduced, reshuffled. Azealia911 talk
  • Why is Amazon is piped to Amazon.com in ref 3? ".com" is the part of its title.
Done Azealia911 talk
  • Is there a substitute available for BallerStatus?
Substitute meaning a different source? Azealia911 talk
Yeah! -- Frankie talk 12:35, 8 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Replaced :) Azealia911 talk
Can you point out where? The only instances of shouting are RiFF RAFF's name styling and "Suckas ASKiN QUESTiONS (feat. LiL DEBBiE)" which is how it's stylized in the source. Azealia911 talk
  • "Rap Dose" is not the part of the titles of ref 46 and 47.
Removed Azealia911 talk

I don't know if it's only me, but I think she looks pretty much like Lady Gaga in this image. -- Frankie talk 09:48, 8 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Hmm, I don't see it! Azealia911 talk 11:11, 8 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Thankyou! Azealia911 talk 14:06, 8 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Comments from WillC
Disclaimer: I'm unfamiliar with the style of discographies so I'm going to try my best here.
  • Not much to really look at now. My only issue is as far as I am aware, tables are exceptions to overlinking. If I'm not mistaken that is my only issue with formatting stuff in the tables is linked only once.
  • I'll take the references in good faith. I'm sure some of them have already been covered above and from what I can tell they seem to check out. Overall, I'm not really finding much of an issue here.--WillC 02:38, 13 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Wrestlinglover Do you have any requests for change on the article? Sorry to ask, but you comments seem like observations as opposed to suggestions. Azealia911 talk 17:18, 13 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
My only concern is the linking of all terms in the table even if they are featured several times. Wish I had more, but I don't really see any issues since I'm not familiar with the style too much.--WillC 20:15, 13 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Wrestlinglover While I see what you mean about overlinking regulations not applying to tables, I think I'll leave it if it's all the same to you. Once in the lead and once in the first occurrence in a table seems to be enough. Thankyou for your comments. Azealia911 talk 16:48, 15 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
It doesn't matter to me really. Just a preference of mine, you don't have to share it. No one else seems to have an issue with it so I'm fine.--WillC 00:38, 16 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Support from WillC. Azealia911--WillC 00:38, 16 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Thankyou! Azealia911 talk 08:13, 16 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from West Virginian edit

Support: Azealia911, following my review of this list, I assess that it meets the criteria for both Wikipedia:Featured list criteria and Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Lead section and it looks like the concerns raised above have been addressed and incorporated into the list. While Lil Debbie lacks a robust musical catalog, this list is the most comprehensive compendium of her work out there, and is in line with other music artist discographies. Congratulations on a job well done! -- West Virginian (talk) 15:11, 13 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Thankyou very much! Azealia911 talk 17:18, 13 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Delegate comments

Looked through this list before going to promote it, and I have some issues with the lead that I'd like to see fixed first:

  • I'd like at least one sentence actually saying who Lil Debbie is before launching into her album count. Just the first sentence of her article, "Jordan Capozzi (born February 2, 1990), better known by her stage name Lil Debbie is an American-Italian rapper, model and fashion designer.[1]" is fine.
  • In the second paragraph, you say that the other two members of the group were Kreayshawn and V-Nasty, but the very next sentence you reiterate that Kreayshawn was a member of the group and don't mention that V-Nasty was when you mention her. I think you should change "group member Kreayshawn's" to just "Kreayshawn's".
  • "In August [...] California Sweetheart, Pt. 2[, ...] later, a compilation[, ...] the following month Young B!tch..." - so the compilation was released a nebulous "later", but Young B!tch was released one month after later? either the compilation or Young B!tch need a more specific date, because one month after later doesn't make much sense. I'd replace "later" with an actual month, because right now it's the only release to be so vague. --PresN 01:49, 17 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
@PresN: Thankyou for your comments, done. Azealia911 talk 09:39, 17 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Closing as passed --PresN 04:07, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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