Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Red Rail/archive1

The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by Ian Rose 10:06, 15 June 2013 (UTC) [1].[reply]

Red Rail edit

Featured article candidates/Red Rail/archive1

Nominator(s): FunkMonk (talk) 01:57, 27 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Interesting extinct Mauritian bird, which has been overshadowed by the Dodo. The article contains most of what will ever be known about the bird, and all definite contemporary illustrations. FunkMonk (talk) 01:57, 27 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Support, final Comments from Jim Just a few comments for now Jimfbleak - talk to me? 10:45, 27 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thomas Herbert, Rodriguez Rail are overlinked

Fixed. FunkMonk (talk) 10:52, 27 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Taylor and van Perlo call this "Mauritian Red Rail" (pp. 59—60) and have Red Rail as a synonym for Ruddy Crake (p. 214) Taylor, Barry (2000). Rails. Robertsbridge: Pica. ISBN 1873403593. {{cite book}}: Cite has empty unknown parameters: |1= and |2= (help); Unknown parameter |coauthors= ignored (|author= suggested) (help). Perhaps some mention needed?

Haven't come across this anywhere else. Not sure how it could be cited, without it being some kind of original synthesis? Birdlife doesn't mention it as a common name.[2] I'll make Mauritian Red Rail a redirect anyway. FunkMonk (talk) 10:54, 27 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Same book (pp. 59—60) also has the Rodriguez Rail in Aphanapteryx

That is outdated (or a minority view at best) by now, most recent sources keep them separate. There is some discussion of this in the article. FunkMonk (talk) 10:52, 27 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

brought by them— seems redundant, that's implied by "introduced"

Fixed. FunkMonk (talk) 10:52, 27 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I'm happy with responses above. I'll have another read tomorrow to check of there is anything else I've missed Jimfbleak - talk to me? 14:36, 27 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I've had another read through, and I noticed free of predators in the lead. That should be mammalian predators, there are several birds of prey in the Mascarenes. I've changed to support above on the assumption that you'll fix this minor point Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:32, 28 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed both occurrences, thanks! FunkMonk (talk) 07:28, 28 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Sources review

Why does ref 23 indicate a French title, when the link goes to an English-language version of the book?
Other than that, the sources look excellent, all links work, and the citations are properly formatted. No spotchecks done.

Brianboulton (talk) 17:58, 29 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Ah, good catch, fixed. Someone had added a link to the English translation, so I just changed the info accordingly. FunkMonk (talk) 21:45, 29 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

A few thoughts-

"exploited by humans during hunting, by using red cloth to lure them." Not great writing

What if I remove "during hunting"? It seems redundant. FunkMonk (talk) 16:26, 5 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

It's the "exploited by... by..." which is problematic. I mused about "exploited by humans during hunting, through the use of red cloth to lure them" but the hanging "them" is also not great. You could try something like "Human hunters took advantage of an attraction Red Rails had to red objects by using coloured cloth to lure birds the birds so that they may be beaten with sticks." J Milburn (talk) 16:59, 5 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the suggestion. Heh, thinking about it, it sounded a bit kiddy-fiddlerish before... FunkMonk (talk) 17:04, 5 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

"etymology of bonasia is unclear. Some early accounts refer to Red Rails by the vernacular names for the Hazel Grouse, Tetrastes bonasia, so the name evidently originates there." It can't be "unclear" with an "evident" answer, surely?

The origin of the word is clear, but the meaning is not, as described later. Changed etymology to meaning. FunkMonk (talk) 16:19, 5 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Jan Brueghel is an ambiguous dablink.

Fixed. FunkMonk (talk) 16:21, 5 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

"The specimen is thought to have been the only one of its kind that ever reached Europe." The rail, or the dodo?

Red Rail, fixed. FunkMonk (talk) 16:23, 5 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Generally strong, but then I've already had my say on this article. J Milburn (talk) 15:58, 5 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Makes sense that these issues are mostly in text that was added since then! So thanks for the second look. FunkMonk (talk) 16:26, 5 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Support; well-written and sourced, and a very interesting topic. J Milburn (talk) 17:15, 5 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Support - Overall, quite well-written and sourced. I'm not crazy about the comparison in size to a chicken, as chickens come in many different sizes... If this is what the sources use, though, I don't think there's much we can do about it. Dana boomer (talk) 17:39, 9 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, on the chicken issue, due to the lack of precise measurements, the newer sources just repeat the old comparison. FunkMonk (talk) 09:31, 10 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Image check - all OK (PD-age). Sources and authors provided.

tweaked some tags from 70 to 100 and added authors' year of death (OK)
I am not sure, the distribution map is optimal here. It's basically showing an empty world map, and then a tiny (very tiny) spot in the middle of nowhere. Maybe the situation would be better visible in a smaller region, just showing the eastern coast of Africa, Madagascar and the island (completely optional). GermanJoe (talk) 09:05, 10 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

There are others on Commons[3], and I personally have no preference. The current map was used in other FAs, as well. FunkMonk (talk) 09:31, 10 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

After looking at File:DodoRangeMauritius.gif even that zoom level doesn't add much detail. If nobody feels strongly about it (i don't), it's probably best to keep the current one as "standard". GermanJoe (talk) 10:18, 10 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Support ~~Comments~~ ~~I'll jot some queries below.~~ Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 19:39, 10 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

.~~.. which resulted in a large amount of invalid junior synonyms.~~ ~~--> " which resulted in a large number of invalid junior synonyms." or " which resulted in many invalid junior synonyms." - as is makes it sound like a measurement...~~

Replaced. FunkMonk (talk) 20:14, 10 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

~~A complete specimen was found by the barber Louis Etienne Thirioux, who also found important Dodo remains~~ ~~- can any information be added which gives this sentence some context of date? As is could be any time till present....~~

Changed to "around the turn of the 20th century", as the source states, but is it just me or would that imply from 20th to 21th, instead of 19th to 20th? The latter is correct. FunkMonk (talk) 20:14, 10 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

agree Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 21:10, 10 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

So would it be improper to change it to "around the turn of the 19th century", though the source states otherwise? I know it is a mistake. FunkMonk (talk) 21:12, 10 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

How about "around the end of the 19th century" - less ambiguity Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 03:28, 11 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Done, thanks. FunkMonk (talk) 08:34, 11 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Otherwise looking good. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:01, 10 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Closing note: This candidate has been promoted, but there may be a delay in bot processing of the close. Please see WP:FAC/ar, and leave the {{featured article candidates}} template in place on the talk page until the bot goes through. Ian Rose (talk) 12:19, 14 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.