Sachithd

Your submission at Articles for creation: Flamstead Cricket Club (November 28)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed. Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reasons left by WikiOriginal-9 were: Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit after they have been resolved.

• If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:Flamstead Cricket Club and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
• If you do not edit your draft in the next 6 months, it will be considered abandoned and may be deleted.
• If you need any assistance, or have experienced any untoward behavior associated with this submission, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk, on the reviewer's talk page or use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors.

~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 23:07, 28 November 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Sachithd! Having an article draft declined at Articles for Creation can be disappointing. If you are wondering why your article submission was declined, please post a question at the Articles for creation help desk. If you have any other questions about your editing experience, we'd love to help you at the Teahouse, a friendly space on Wikipedia where experienced editors lend a hand to help new editors like yourself! See you there! ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 23:07, 28 November 2023 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Flamstead Cricket Club (November 29)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed. Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by WikiOriginal-9 was:  The comment the reviewer left was: Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit after they have been resolved.

• If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:Flamstead Cricket Club and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
• If you do not edit your draft in the next 6 months, it will be considered abandoned and may be deleted.
• If you need any assistance, or have experienced any untoward behavior associated with this submission, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk, on the reviewer's talk page or use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors.

~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 14:32, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

Hi Thanks for reviewing the article. The information of this article (Mainly the history of the club) are not available any where online to refer. This information coming from a document the club officials have prepared in the past. Can you please advise how to inlcude such information in the references section. Many Thanks Sachithd (talk) 15:04, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Flamstead Cricket Club (November 29)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed. Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by Hey man im josh was:  The comment the reviewer left was: Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit after they have been resolved.

• If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:Flamstead Cricket Club and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
• If you do not edit your draft in the next 6 months, it will be considered abandoned and may be deleted.
• If you need any assistance, or have experienced any untoward behavior associated with this submission, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk, on the reviewer's talk page or use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors.

Hey man im josh (talk) 14:32, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

Hi Thanks for reviewing the article. The information of this article (Mainly the history of the club) are not available any where online to refer. This information coming from a document the club officials have prepared in the past. Can you please advise how to inlcude such information in the references section. Is that what you mean by inline citation? Many Thanks Sachithd (talk) 15:05, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Flamstead Cricket Club (November 29)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed. Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by 331dot was:  The comment the reviewer left was: Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit after they have been resolved.

• If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:Flamstead Cricket Club and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
• If you do not edit your draft in the next 6 months, it will be considered abandoned and may be deleted.
• If you need any assistance, or have experienced any untoward behavior associated with this submission, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk, on the reviewer's talk page or use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors.

331dot (talk) 17:03, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

Hi,

The below statement is not true.

"The nature of your edits gives the impression you have an undisclosed financial stake in promoting a topic"

Flamstead CC a village cricket club in Hertfordshire England. Its a non profitable organisation. As there wasn't any information available about the club on Wikipedia I've tried to compile an article based on the information available within the club and online.

Please advise what information do you need from us to prove that there is no financial stake in promoting a topic and what information I need to supply to get this article approved on Wikipedia.

There is a similar article available for another club Winchmore Hill Cricket Club and Flamstead CC is not much different to that interms of the setup. Sachithd (talk) 17:18, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

We don't need the whole url when you link to another Wikipedia article- simply place the title of the target in double brackets, as I've done here.

Please see other stuff exists. It could be that other articles are also inappropriate, and you would be unaware of this. As this is a volunteer project, it is possible for inappropriate content to get by us. We can only address what we know about. If you want to use other articles as a model or example, use those classified as good articles.

If you are employed by this club, you are a paid editor- that the organization is non-profit is immaterial, as Wikipedia treats nonprofits no differently than for profits. If you are a volunteer, you still have a conflict of interest to disclose(click those words for instructions).

Wikipedia is not a place for organizations to tell about themselves and what they do- an article about an organization must summarize what independent reliable sources with significant coverage have chosen on their own to say about the organization, showing how it meets the special Wikipedia definition of notability. Wikipedia is not interested in what an organization wants to say about itself. Most of the sources in your draft are associated with the club or its league, these are not independent sources. 331dot (talk) 17:37, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

Hi

Thanks for the reply.

1. "We don't need the whole url when you link to another Wikipedia article- simply place the title of the target in double brackets, as I've done here."

I believe this is how we have linked the wikipedia articles. The complete URLs are for external websites.

2. Im not an editor nor employed by this club.

The club is a non profitable organisation and it only has volunteers.

3. If you are a volunteer, you still have a conflict of interest to disclose(click those words for instructions).

Someone who's not associated with this club will not have the accurate information about this club. So the reliable and accurate information about this article can only come from some one who's part of the club. If it needs to be verified by other parties then you are more than welcome to.

4. "Most of the sources in your draft are associated with the club or its league, these are not independent sources."

Again these are the mainly available online resources we can link to the club with. Where else would you expect to have the information about a cricket club if its not linked to the club website or the league website. Both these links are reliable sources as both the league and the club are associated with the England Cricket Board. I understand that you need reliable sources before approving an article but the question I have is, if someone is doing an article about something for the very first time on the internet , how can they include references as there is nothing available.

The link I sent on the previous message https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winchmore_Hill_Cricket_Club I can gurantee you that it was submitted by someone associated with the club otherwise no one else would have that kind of information. Flamstead CC is not different to that so I really don't understand why this article keep getting rejected.

Hope this make sense.

Many Thanks. Sachithd (talk) 18:22, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

The draft was declined, not rejected. In the draft submission process, "rejected" has a specific meaning, that a draft may not be resubmitted. "Declined" means that it may be resubmitted.

I was referring to your link to Winchmore Hill CC; it is an entire url. It only needs to be written like this, [[Winchmore Hill Cricket Club]], which appears as Winchmore Hill Cricket Club. Aside from being cleaner, it doesn't lock people into the desktop version of Wikipedia(many users use the mobile version). Just a tip to help you and others. Links to non-Wikipedia pages need to be urls.

In looking at the Winchmore Hill CC article, it seems to have the same issues as your draft, and I will mark it as such. This is the danger in using any random article as a model- it may have problems that you are not aware of. As I suggest, use good articles as a model.

If you aren't employed by the club, okay. You still need to disclose a conflict of interest. This does not mean that you cannot contribute about the club, but that you need to do so carefully and according to policy. Submitting a draft is part of that, so all you really need is the disclosure.

Typically, articles are written by independent editors wholly unconnected with the subject, who take note of coverage of a topic in independent sources and choose to write about it. The mission of Wikipedia is to summarize independent reliable sources, not what a subject says about itself, because it can do that on its own website. You ask who would know about the club other than a club member- on Wikipedia, independent sources need to know about the club. Manchester United, New England Patriots, and Boston Red Sox summarize what others say about those teams, not what they say about themselves or what they consider to be their own history. That's what we do here. If independent sources do not provide your club with significant coverage, it will not merit a Wikipedia article.

If you have direct evidence that editors from the Winchmore Hill CC edited that article and did not disclose it, please provide your evidence(without outing other users) at the COI noticeboard. 331dot (talk) 18:33, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

You say that we can verify your information- that's not what we do here. This is why we require independent reliable sources for most information- so that they do the verifying and fact checking. Primary sources may only be used in certain situations, and never to establish notability. 331dot (talk) 18:35, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for the detailed explaination. Please see below.

1. The draft was declined, not rejected. In the draft submission process, "rejected" has a specific meaning, that a draft may not be resubmitted. "Declined" means that it may be resubmitted.

Thanks for the clarification.

2. I was referring to your link to Winchmore Hill CC; it is an entire url. It only needs to be written like this, Winchmore Hill Cricket Club, which appears as Winchmore Hill Cricket Club. Aside from being cleaner, it doesn't lock people into the desktop version of Wikipedia(many users use the mobile version). Just a tip to help you and others. Links to non-Wikipedia pages need to be urls.

Understood.

3. If you aren't employed by the club, okay. You still need to disclose a conflict of interest. This does not mean that you cannot contribute about the club, but that you need to do so carefully and according to policy. Submitting a draft is part of that, so all you really need is the disclosure.

Can you please confirm if this has been done correctly.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Sachithd

4. Typically, articles are written by independent editors wholly unconnected with the subject, who take note of coverage of a topic in independent sources and choose to write about it. The mission of Wikipedia is to summarize independent reliable sources, not what a subject says about itself, because it can do that on its own website. You ask who would know about the club other than a club member- on Wikipedia, independent sources need to know about the club. Manchester United, New England Patriots, and Boston Red Sox summarize what others say about those teams, not what they say about themselves or what they consider to be their own history. That's what we do here. If independent sources do not provide your club with significant coverage, it will not merit a Wikipedia article.

Yes I get your point about those clubs you have mentioned above. But a village cricket club such as Flamstead is not known to people outside of the club. So this is why I said, the information coming from a person who is associated with a club can provide more accurate and reliable information towards the article. And by having an article online, the general public can read more about the club which has a history over 150 years. I also understand your point that it can be biased sometimes so this is why the article was prepared such a way that it only highlights the main information about the club from where it started and what it is today.

4. If you have direct evidence that editors from the Winchmore Hill CC edited that article and did not disclose it, please provide your evidence(without outing other users) at the COI noticeboard.

The reason I pointed out that article was to show the similarities between Flamstead CC and Winchmore Hill CC and definetely not to report any violations (Which I wasn't aware of). I do not have direct evidence but being part of many cricket clubs in the last 20 years, I'm 100% certain that the information on that article can only be provided by someone associated with the club.

5. You say that we can verify your information- that's not what we do here. This is why we require independent reliable sources for most information- so that they do the verifying and fact checking. Primary sources may only be used in certain situations, and never to establish notability

I get your point. For this particular article I'm not sure how else we can provide the online sources other than the ones I have already included in the article. As this is pretty much the very first and proper online article some one writing about the cricket club.

Again thanks very much for your time explaining the issues. Please advise if I need anything else to do to get this article published on Wikipedia. Sachithd (talk) 22:24, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

Hi Just resending the message if I haven't responded to the correct message previously. Thanks.

Thank you for the detailed explaination. Please see below.

1. The draft was declined, not rejected. In the draft submission process, "rejected" has a specific meaning, that a draft may not be resubmitted. "Declined" means that it may be resubmitted.

Thanks for the clarification.

2. I was referring to your link to Winchmore Hill CC; it is an entire url. It only needs to be written like this, Winchmore Hill Cricket Club, which appears as Winchmore Hill Cricket Club. Aside from being cleaner, it doesn't lock people into the desktop version of Wikipedia(many users use the mobile version). Just a tip to help you and others. Links to non-Wikipedia pages need to be urls.

Understood.

3. If you aren't employed by the club, okay. You still need to disclose a conflict of interest. This does not mean that you cannot contribute about the club, but that you need to do so carefully and according to policy. Submitting a draft is part of that, so all you really need is the disclosure.

Can you please confirm if this has been done correctly.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Sachithd

4. Typically, articles are written by independent editors wholly unconnected with the subject, who take note of coverage of a topic in independent sources and choose to write about it. The mission of Wikipedia is to summarize independent reliable sources, not what a subject says about itself, because it can do that on its own website. You ask who would know about the club other than a club member- on Wikipedia, independent sources need to know about the club. Manchester United, New England Patriots, and Boston Red Sox summarize what others say about those teams, not what they say about themselves or what they consider to be their own history. That's what we do here. If independent sources do not provide your club with significant coverage, it will not merit a Wikipedia article.

Yes I get your point about those clubs you have mentioned above. But a village cricket club such as Flamstead is not known to people outside of the club. So this is why I said, the information coming from a person who is associated with a club can provide more accurate and reliable information towards the article. And by having an article online, the general public can read more about the club which has a history over 150 years. I also understand your point that it can be biased sometimes so this is why the article was prepared such a way that it only highlights the main information about the club from where it started and what it is today.

4. If you have direct evidence that editors from the Winchmore Hill CC edited that article and did not disclose it, please provide your evidence(without outing other users) at the COI noticeboard.

The reason I pointed out that article was to show the similarities between Flamstead CC and Winchmore Hill CC and definetely not to report any violations (Which I wasn't aware of). I do not have direct evidence but being part of many cricket clubs in the last 20 years, I'm 100% certain that the information on that article can only be provided by someone associated with the club.

5. You say that we can verify your information- that's not what we do here. This is why we require independent reliable sources for most information- so that they do the verifying and fact checking. Primary sources may only be used in certain situations, and never to establish notability

I get your point. For this particular article I'm not sure how else we can provide the online sources other than the ones I have already included in the article. As this is pretty much the very first and proper online article some one writing about the cricket club.

Again thanks very much for your time explaining the issues. Please advise if I need anything else to do to get this article published on Wikipedia.

Sachithd (talk) 13:40, 4 December 2023 (UTC)

November 2023

Hello Sachithd. The nature of your edits gives the impression you have an undisclosed financial stake in promoting a topic, but you have not complied with Wikipedia's mandatory paid editing disclosure requirements. Paid advocacy is a category of conflict of interest (COI) editing that involves being compensated by a person, group, company or organization to use Wikipedia to promote their interests. Undisclosed paid advocacy is prohibited by our policies on neutral point of view and what Wikipedia is not, and is an especially serious type of COI; the Wikimedia Foundation regards it as a "black hat" practice akin to black-hat search-engine optimization.

Paid advocates are strongly discouraged from direct article editing, and should instead propose changes on the talk page of the article in question if an article exists. If the article does not exist, paid advocates are strongly discouraged from attempting to write an article at all. At best, any proposed article creation should be submitted through the articles for creation process, rather than directly.

Regardless, if you are receiving or expect to receive compensation for your edits, broadly construed, you are required by the Wikimedia Terms of Use to disclose your employer, client and affiliation. You can post such a mandatory disclosure to your user page at User:Sachithd. The template {{Paid}} can be used for this purpose – e.g. in the form: {{paid|user=Sachithd|employer=InsertName|client=InsertName}}. If I am mistaken – you are not being directly or indirectly compensated for your edits – please state that in response to this message. Otherwise, please provide the required disclosure. In either case, do not edit further until you answer this message. 331dot (talk) 17:04, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

Concern regarding Draft:Flamstead Cricket Club

Hello, Sachithd. This is a bot-delivered message letting you know that Draft:Flamstead Cricket Club, a page you created, has not been edited in at least 5 months. Drafts that have not been edited for six months may be deleted, so if you wish to retain the page, please edit it again or request that it be moved to your userspace.

If the page has already been deleted, you can request it be undeleted so you can continue working on it.

Thank you for your submission to Wikipedia. FireflyBot (talk) 08:06, 11 May 2024 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Flamstead Cricket Club (May 27)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed. Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by Greenman was: Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit after they have been resolved.

• If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:Flamstead Cricket Club and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
• If you do not edit your draft in the next 6 months, it will be considered abandoned and may be deleted.
• If you need any assistance, or have experienced any untoward behavior associated with this submission, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk, on the reviewer's talk page or use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors.

Greenman (talk) 10:40, 27 May 2024 (UTC)