User talk:Agne27/Archive 4

Champagne (wine)

OK - I don't have a copy of Kladstrup, and it wasn't clear to me that the entire paragraph was sourced from there. It's good that it is easy to revert.

However, I will put back the re-casting. The bottles don't generate heat when they burst, so the idea that the heat generated by the 'explosion' of one bottle sets off the next is laughable. If anything, the temperature of the bottle and liquid will go down due to adiabatic cooling by the expansion of the compressed gas (carbon dioxide) that forms the bubbles in champagne. The bottles simply burst (just like a balloon being over-inflated) when they can no longer contain the pressure. The mechanical shock of debris hitting other bottles will cause the other bottles' structural integrity to fail if they are weak enough. Now, a bottle of nitroglycerin is capable of exploding, but bottles of champagne merely burst. Regards, WLD^talk|edits 21:30, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

Understood. The source described it as heat so I went with that. However, your explanation makes sense. No worries. Though if you like Champagne, I wholeheartedly recommend the Kladstrup book. It is a terrific read. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 07:53, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your invite

Thanks for your invite but I'm trying to cut down considerably on my wiki work. Nunquam Dormio 09:10, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Wine Project Newsletter

The Wine Project Newsletter! Issue I - February 18, 2007

In this edition: News & Notes Wine Project Article Assessment guide kicks into gear ; New Essay Wikipedia:Wikipedia is not a wine guide aims to develop POV and Notability guidelines for wine related articles; Wine related Requested Move on the Judgment of Paris; Wine related AfD on Goosecross Cellars Wine Sub-projects- A call for Bordeaux labels by the Bordeaux wine subproject. Wiki-Winos This week feature User:Charleenmerced Wine Improvement Drive - Carmenère

This newsletter is sent to those listed under Participants on the Wine Project page. If you wish to no longer receive this newsletter please include Decline newsletter next to your name on the Participant list. If you have any Wikipedia wine related news, announcements or suggestions drop a note in the Comments/Suggestion area of Wikipedia:WikiProject Wine/Newsletter.

"Be sure to hide the ice cube tray when Charleenmerced is visiting :)" LOL So funny! Great newsletter!CharleenmercedFile:SoleteRayosÑajo.gif 18:28, 18 February 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced

Wine Project Newsletter Tip Room

Agne..I left something in the tip room yesterday...did you see it? -- Steve.Moulding 17:52, 18 February 2007 (UTC) Wikipedia:WikiProject_Wine/Newsletter/Tip_Room

EEP! No I didn't. I'm so sorry. It was on my watchlist and everything. :( I'm sorry Steve. I will be sure to include it in the next issue. Hey, would you also be interested in being the next Wiki-Wino? Agne^Cheese/^Wine 17:56, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Actually...check that. I can add it now. Give me about 5 minutes. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 17:57, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Well its reallyno problem to wait a week! :-) -- Steve.Moulding 17:58, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Well it would be two weeks. :) I'm going to try and do this bi-weekly. But I've updated the newsletter and will update the talk page header. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 17:59, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Judgment of Paris

As it stands, I don't think this is one we're going to win...despite the excellent fight you fought. :-(

I don't think the disambig wouldn't hurt anybody (other than the pride of the myth-buffs), yet I can't wholly disagree with some of their points either. If it doesn't go our way I'll be happy to help out un-dabbing, if that's what we need to do. -- Regards Steve.Moulding 19:03, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

We've got policy WP:DAB on our side and the reader's best interest. I wouldn't give up. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 19:22, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

Wine article to GA

Hi Agne27, firstly I have to say that your commitment to the wine project is exceptional and what you are trying to achieve in the project is fantastic. I am fired up on the back of getting Yeast to GA (hopefully FA soon) and am keen to get Wine to the same ranking. I actually think that this should be top priority for WP:WINE as its generic article. Wine was actually the first article I ever edited back in Dec 2005 so it holds some significance (it actually didn't looked all that much different back then!). Probably the key to a successful GA nom is getting some inline citations. I think most content required is there. Anyhow I saw your comments on Talk:Wine about getting wine to FA and I just wanted to say that I'm with you all the way! ◄§ĉҺɑʀκs► 09:02, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

Cool! I will try to work on some inline cites this weekend. And thanks for the nice words. :)Agne^Cheese/^Wine 07:29, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Carmenere

• Thank you so much for improving this article. I believe that with time and effort this can really be a GA.Charleenmerced ^Talk 21:46, 22 February 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced

• Hello, I created the Concha y Toro Winery article and I am currently working on it quite a bit. Can you take a look at it. My concern is whether or not I should include descriptions of the aroma, bouquet and taste. I think including the acolchol content and acidity is ok but don't know about the other stuff. I tried to make it pretty neutral. Also, I saw a comment on the Wine page about Rioja and how the Spanish Wikipedi has a good history section; I'll translate that. If you know of any other Spanish wine articles that should be translated please post a comment on my talk page.Charleenmerced ^Talk 04:01, 23 February 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced
• Thanks for the review. Yeah, I just start with the winery website for raw info and will later move to outside sources. I still have to describe the other wines. Do you think labels is an appropriate title for the category or should I use something else?Charleenmerced ^Talk 04:18, 23 February 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced

I think "Labels" would be fine, especially for New World Wines where producers try to establish wines as their own distincyLabels. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 04:21, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

I might be stumbling in uninformed, but there's a wiki article for wine labels and there is a category for Wine packaging and storage. Is that what we're talking about? If it is, I guess we should stick to the current titles and make redirects where appropriate since they seem pretty reasonable.mroconnell 20:09, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

Well I think there is two different context in how "Label" is used. One if the "packaging and storing" context where it is a part of the wine bottle. The other would be as a distinct brand, which is how many New World's wine try to establish themselves--Yellow Tail, Charles Shaw, Silver Oak, Mondavi, etc. That context goes far beyond the practical, packaging usage and I think the question is whether that deserves its own character. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 20:24, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

• Oh please Agne don't pressure me, Please! Ok ok, I WILL open another bottle of Carmenere and take a picture and of it for the sake of the article. ;-)Charleenmerced ^Talk 20:00, 27 February 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced

LOL! Oh the sacrifices we make for Wikipedia. ;) Agne^Cheese/^Wine 20:06, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

• OK...I have a 2005 MontGras Reserve Carmenere waiting to go. Hopefully I can give it a tasting before the newsletter. -- Steve.Moulding 04:11, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
• I ordered about 10 different Carmeneres today from my Wine guy at the Liquor Store....Some will be here by Friday, can't wait. I will get the labels from those as well. I also ordered the Montgras, let me know! Oh and if you can get a picture of the label before I do, please upload itCharleenmerced ^Talk 04:57, 28 February 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced

• Hello Agne, you seem to have fixed something on the Carmenere article about the POV. I was making some major edits so I think whatever you changed was deleted. What was it? --Charleenmerced ^Talk 19:37, 4 March 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced

Basically it was two slight revision to essentially remove the words "Fortunately" and "Superior" which tend to be viewed as overtly positive POV for GA and FA consideration. Nothing too drastic. I'll take a look and tweak if need to. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 19:39, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

• Comments added to the Carmenère talk page -- Steve.Moulding 23:31, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

Wiki-Winos

Hi Agne. Sure! I'll drop off the question sheet sometime this week. -- Regards Steve.Moulding 01:59, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Labels

Hello Agne, do you know a method for removing wine labels? I tried steaming but it is not that effective since most of the time the label ends up breaking.Charleenmerced ^Talk 06:17, 27 February 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced

• A hair dryer with a very low heat setting. It takes a good 2-3 minutes a bottle but with the low heat setting it will loosen up the adhesive without charring it. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 08:06, 27 February 2007 (UTC)
• There's a section in the article on wine labels that discusses label removal alternatives. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Mroconnell (talk • contribs) 11:23, 27 February 2007 (UTC).
• For Bordeaux labels I bake mine at 275F for 15 mins. The label normally lifts right off. No fuss, no muss. The label comes off 'sticky' so it can go right into the album. I also pre-warm the bottle by filling with hot water while the oven is pre-heating (emptying out the water of course before it goes in the oven). A couple of problems I've encountered

(1) a couple of labels were not pure paper, but had some plastic additive. The labels shrunk and warped making them useless.

(2) Some labels needed another 15 mins before lifting off.

(3) With one label the glue baked hard and had to be lifted off with a sticky commercial 'label-saver' (last resort).

I've tried pretty much all other methods. This is the best one for me. Most of the time I get nice clean undamaged labels. -- Regards, Steve.Moulding 15:04, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Heh, who knew there were so many methods? :) Now in the US, some winemakers keep "sheets" of labels (normally 6 on a page) that can be purchase at the gift shop or through their website. It's not common but it certainly an easier way of getting a label. I think I'll include a note about label removal in the next newsletter. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 19:06, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

• THank you so much! Labels are coming right off, for the New World Wine. THe old world wines are impossible! Charleenmerced ^Talk 00:13, 28 February 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced

Cooking wine

Do you really have such wine in the US ?!? How bizarr !! --Symposiarch 11:00, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, it's disgusting stuff. However, the Charles Shaw Wines actually aren't that bad as cooking wine. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 19:08, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

• But, you don't really drink it...At least I never have. Charleenmerced ^Talk 15:17, 28 February 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced
• Yeah but it is disgusting to even cook with. Just this horrible off smell :/ Agne^Cheese/^Wine 20:28, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
• Yeah, smells like vinergar Charleenmerced ^Talk 20:46, 28 February 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced

Thanks

Thanks so much for the Barnstar, my first one! Charleenmerced ^Talk 00:56, 3 March 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced

Your assessment

Hi, appreciate the work you've put into assessing different wine articles, but I have to disagree with the B grade you recently gave the Château Pétrus article. I would suggest Start class, given that it's barely more than a stub in its current, disorganized, rather minimal state. In my opinion, the most glaring flaws are the lack of sources and no meaningful mention of the critical acclaim, prestige and expense the wine enjoys.--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back 09:24, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

Well given the state of the majority of Wine articles, I suppose I'm grading on a curve. :p I agree with the flaws you noted but overall the article is in better shape then the majority of wine articles. My own, very subjective assessment scale for B-class is an article that could be brought up to GA level in a few days with some love and affection. You are more then welcome to downgrade.Agne^Cheese/^Wine 09:26, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

@The Fat Man Who Never Came Back, you are more then welcome to improve the Château Pétrus article.--Symposiarch 10:17, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. Being welcome is nice, but being willing and/or qualified is quite another. In all seriousness, I do have some stuff by Karen MacNeil--a big proponent of Pétrus--I could cite but don't have access to the material right now.--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back 10:27, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

Wine Project Newsletter

The Wine Project Newsletter! Issue II - March 4, 2007

In this edition: News & Notes Updates on Wine article assessment ; Wine Portal, Barnstars; and Notability of Masters of Wine Wine Sub-projects- Ongoing need for Wine labels with tips on removal. Project drive to get Wine article up to GA. Wiki-Winos This week's feature User:mroconnell Wine Improvement Drive - Languedoc wine plus update on last WID article Carmenère

This newsletter is sent to those listed under Participants on the Wine Project page. If you wish to no longer receive this newsletter please include Decline newsletter next to your name on the Participant list. If you have any Wikipedia wine related news, announcements or suggestions drop a note in the Comments/Suggestion area of Wikipedia:WikiProject Wine/Newsletter.

		The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
		For your endless energy and uncountable contributions to the Wine project and the wine project newsletter. Many thanks! Steve.Moulding 00:00, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Aw....thanks Steve. :) Now I'll be off to meet some friends and drink some nice Cava. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 00:23, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Christianity and alcohol

Hi, I saw that you added {{WP:WINE}} to Talk:Christianity and alcohol. I have two questions in this regard. First, does it even belong in this project, which says it is concerned with "wines, grapes, wine producers and wine growing regions"? Altar wine seems like an appropriate member, but Christianity and alcohol seems less so. Do you see things differently? Second, I see that you rated it as a "B-Class" article. Reading the description of that class at Wikipedia:Version_1.0_Editorial_Team/Assessment, I wonder if you could explain what you think is missing? (Or, perhaps you didn't rate it higher because it hasn't yet passed through the Good Article or similar review process? Speaking of which, I think I'll request some reviewing now.) Thanks! (You can respond here.) --Flex (talk|contribs) 14:23, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Howdy, in the Wine article we currently link to Christianity and alcohol as a main topical article under the header Religious uses and after reviewing the article, I saw the relevance especially with the Winemaking in biblical times sections. The article is quite good and I encourage the submission for GA. It should pass quite easily and you may even think about FA. I think the article is an important aspect to understanding the Religious uses of wine and it would be prudent for wine project members to keep an eye on the article for the benefit of vandal fighting, etc. Hope this clarifies it for you. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 19:37, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Ok, thanks. I notice the article is actually a "See also" rather than a "main" reference in the article. Don't know if that makes a difference to you. --Flex (talk|contribs) 20:03, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Heh, different tags used since there were three articles to ref. We are actively working on improving the Wine article to FA and part of the process was trimming the sections done and making more usages of splinter and related articles. Essentially what we are doing with the Religious Uses section is giving a brief paragraph description and directing the reader to read more about the subject in the broader context of the main article. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 20:07, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Wine articles assessment

Hello Agne, so are we done with the assessment of the wine articles? Charleenmerced ^Talk 21:29, 8 March 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced

Looks like it. YAY! :) Unless there are more wine stubs that haven't had the {{wine}} attached to it. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 21:30, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

• • there are a bunch, there is a list of the ones that are done on the Talk page of the WIne Project. Most of the letters are done except a few ones. That's great, that they are tagged. Charleenmerced ^Talk 21:33, 8 March 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced

Carmenre pic

Hey Agne - just saw your new pic, I am drinking Carmenere as well but this wine is too dark to take a good pic. Charleenmerced ^Talk 06:47, 9 March 2007 (UTC)Charleenmmerced

Yeah it is hard. That pic was the best of several tries. I figure it would be a placeholder till someone came up with a better pic. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 06:57, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

• I'll try to get a better pic. Charleenmerced ^Talk 06:59, 9 March 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced
  • For future reference, check out the first comment on the blog: [1] Charleenmerced ^Talk 07:06, 9 March 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced

LOL, I see you were also disappointed with the J&F Lurton. They are truly overrated. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 07:10, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

• • Yeah, I wish I knew that before I bought it today. I just told my wine guy, get me every single Carmenere in the book and he did. Damn screwcaps! Totally bland this wine, totally bland. Charleenmerced ^Talk 07:14, 9 March 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced

Screw caps aren't that bad. Though I will casually point out that somebody did try to warn folks about J&F Lurton. ;) Agne^Cheese/^Wine 07:17, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

• • • ok ok, lesson learned: remember what you read. I do have 2 Carmens (1 reserve and the other the regular cosecha (the regualr one, sorry I sometimes forget some English words; it's rare but it happens) and a bunch of Casillero del Diablo (which is my fave Carmenere to this date (we'll see about tomorrow). But, J& F, I agree - so totally overrated. Re: corks v. screwcaps - 1. I collect the corks and 2. I like the wine better than with screwcaps. Charleenmerced ^Talk 07:23, 9 March 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced

Wine Project Newsletter

The Wine Project Newsletter! Issue III - March 18, 2007

In this edition: News & Notes New look for Wine Project Page; Wine Article assessment; Operation Stub-killer; New Template for Australian Wineries; New wine stub categories proposed. Wiki-Winos This issue's feature Christopher Tanner, CCC Wine Improvement Drive - Pinot Gris plus update on last WID article Languedoc wine

This newsletter is sent to those listed under Participants on the Wine Project page. If you wish to no longer receive this newsletter please include Decline newsletter next to your name on the Participant list. If you have any Wikipedia wine related news, announcements or suggestions drop a note in the Comments/Suggestion area of Wikipedia:WikiProject Wine/Newsletter.

Thank you for promoting Saprang Kalayanamitr

Thank you for evaluating Saprang Kalayanamitr and promoting it to Good Article status. I will try to integrate the material in the Trivia section into the article body or else move it into other articles. Patiwat 23:36, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

Chateau Yaldara

In what way does this article not meet our guidelines? It needs work, sure. I'll have a go at next week (we have visitors until Monday), but I'm removing the prod tag now. If you think this is not needed, then every winery in Australia does not need an article apart from a very small number. I do not think this is the way to go. --Bduke 23:16, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Well first off, don't fret and enjoy your time with visitors. I am in no rush or inclination to delete articles, especially those that a fellow editor has a desire to improve. In evaluating wine stubs, I prodded Chateau Yaldara because the article didn't make any claims or notability and a google search did not produce any info on the winery that seemed to pass WP:CORP or distinguish itself apart from being just another winery. Obviously, Google is not the omniscience bearer of knowledge so if you have faith and knowledge that there is info that can be added to the article-I have every trust and faith in your judgment. I think the point of WP:WINEGUIDE is that Wikipedia is not meant to be catalog listing of every winery that produces wine but rather an encyclopedic reference for Wineries that have done something significant or a unique contribution to the world of wine. That covers a rather vague span and there is a fair amount of wiggle room there. With articles like Chateau Yaldara, all we are looking for is really something that distinguishes it self-like the largest producer in the area, or of a particular varietal, the first to do <blank>, international tasting competitions, ownership or employment of a significant wine personality, etc. But again, don't fret and have fun this weekend. The articles will still be there for you. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 05:45, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Denominación de Origen article

Hi Agne. I just rewrote the Denominación de Origen page and wondered if you could look it over for me sometime... it must be the wine and cheese together, but it made me think of you ;) I'm not sure if it's worth expanding, where to link to, etc. Thanks. mikaul 01:57, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Left some thoughts on the talk page. Good job. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 06:09, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Aligoté

Thanks so much for getting that photo!!Charleenmerced ^Talk 12:51, 27 March 2007 (UTC)Charleenmerced

Charles Heidsieck GA hold

Just letting you know that I've put this article on GA hold - it's been a long time since it was nominated so I wasn't sure if you were still keeping an eye on it. -Malkinann 08:29, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

Languedoc wine GA on hold

 GA on hold — Notes left on talk page. Nehrams2020 22:23, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

Merger proposals

Agnes, part of posting merger tags is including reasons on the talk page. Tanner's "belief" that the articles should be merged, especially while he is expecting to find California tourist destinations listed as AVA's, has nothing to do with AfD and mergers. If you have a genuine reason behind the merger, please post it on both talk pages for feedback. If you don't, please remove the tags. KP Botany 17:42, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Let's stay on target, as you are not doing well by attacking me rather than putting forth support for your proposals. At this point it is hard to follow what you are saying, as it is all mixed up in your misdirected attacks on me. Limegreen made the proposal towards which you seem to be directing your attacks of me, so shift to the correct user on that. Either you made the counterproposal you made and it requires your supporting arguments, or you withdraw it. Either way, please clarify by supporting your proposal for the redirect of wine country to the "list of wine producing regions" or withdrawing it. Misdirected and poorly articulated attacks on me will do nothing to further the correct sorting of the article. I am far more interested in the article than in you. Many Wikipedia editors have excellent ideas that never occurred to me, so I am willing to listen to other ideas, as I listened to and agree with Limegreen's proposal. If you have an honest proposal simply support it, otherwise withdraw it. KP Botany 19:01, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

Well looking for personal attacks where there aren't any is an easy way to get distracted. I commented on your actions and behaviors (which are growing more and more transparent), not on your person. You are again avoiding those fundamental issues, even with this post here. Agne^Cheese/^Wine 19:05, 31 March 2007 (UTC)