Talk:Valley High School (West Des Moines, Iowa)

Assess

Needs more lengthy topics in places, refs essential, pics nice.... have a go! Victuallers 19:33, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Please cite sources for questionable statements. Due to the abuse of this site I am going to simply request cites on any statement I disagree with to any extent and simply let someone else delete it. I am not going to tolerate pure POV so don't post it. (Kiyae 07:25, 12 October 2007 (UTC))

Student teacher ratio. There is an error here- there can't be 11,900 kids. 11,900 kids and 122 teachers would be a 100:1 ratio. 1,900 would make a lot more sense. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 170.54.58.5 (talk) 15:09, 8 September 2009 (UTC)

The Band

If you guys repost all that useless information about the band's accomplishments, listing everything marchmaster's has ever done of note I am just going to delete it again. STOP REPOSTING IT!!! And if something is just a current issue on the band or of no real importance to anything, such as the name of the performance or whatever for whatever particular year, DON'T POST IT!! If you cannot tell me, by memory, all the things in the topic you are posting about (ie. the drum majors-if you can't name every drum major marchmaster's has ever had) DO NOT POST IT!! Maybe drum majors OF NOTE! Just keep it simple and concise. Kiyae 09:29, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

Your opinion does not establish a consensus. If different people keep reverting it, maybe YOU should get a clue. #NOVAR#__undefined__} <span style="background-color:T;color:green;">#NOVAR#__undefined__} <span style="background-color:C;color:green;">#NOVAR#__undefined__} 19:00, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

Grammy

In 1999, Valley High School Music Program was named the first-ever National Grammy Signature School in Music Education in America.

Source is http://www.governor.state.ia.us/news/1999/february/February0999_1.html. Lensheppard 14:46, 13 December 2006 (UTC) Len

4 A's

Show Choir is ALSO a p[ar]t of this school! We get no recognition and we work just as hard as any of the athletes in this stupid school. [S]o please, show us some well deserved love and respect and put Choralation show choir on the list of activities. Also, I don't understand why the choirs only get one sent[e]nce when marchmasters gets a whole flippin paragraph, I mean, COME ON!!!

As a former member of jazz band, Marchmasters, symphonic band, concert ensemble, acapella choir, Choralation and a few others, I'd have to say "deal with it", the marching band is really better known and more noteworthy. I was in the cast for one year, and the band for two, and really...sorry, not that special. #NOVAR#__undefined__} <span style="background-color:T;color:green;">#NOVAR#__undefined__} <span style="background-color:C;color:green;">#NOVAR#__undefined__} 02:09, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

If people want more about the choirs, feel free to add it. And I have cut back significantly on the band's portion of this page. Marchmasters may be noteworthy and well known to band afficionadoes and their ilk, but that does not mean they deserve half a page of information. They're not so much better than Choralation really. Kiyae (talk) 08:06, 19 November 2007 (UTC)

shut up. the valley high school band will always be better than ths choir. hands down anyday of the week. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sharvey89 (talk • contribs) 04:19, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

Infighting will get you nowhere-if people want more about the choirs feel free to add stuff about the choir. Keep it notable and NPOV. (Kiyae (talk) 10:21, 11 November 2008 (UTC))

Notable Alumni Incorrect

Shawn Johnson definitely needs to be recognized on this page, but as of now, she should not be in the "Notable Alumni" section simply because she is not an alumni, but rather is still a student at the school.

If you want to include her in the page, create a separate header for her and link to her page (I'm sure she has her own page). —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sharsch1 (talk • contribs) 20:41, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

Well, I agree that technically she's not an alumna, but I'm not sure it really matters. Aar☢n Bruce^Talk/_Contribs 08:51, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

safe schools?

The section is longer than any other, yet I find the information only marginally notable. In addition, it is poorly written and does not come across in a neutral fashion, but rather advocates the school's position (in repeatedly mentions sexual identity/preference). I think the section should be deleted, unless it is extremely significant (in which case it should be reduced and edited). Rugz (talk) 20:24, 15 August 2008 (UTC)

I wrote most of that section at like, 4am. I've been meaning to cut it up into multiple sections about various topics but have been extremely lazy (though I thought it was quite NPOV, I was just pointing out that the school/state/district has taken that position, not that that position is necessarily correct) so I haven't done it. Basically I couldn't think of a better way to throw in some random odds and ends that should be on this page. (Kiyae (talk) 10:21, 11 November 2008 (UTC))

Lists of names

Lists of names in this article should be sourced in accordance with WP:BLP. As there is no way of constantly maintaining linked articles, this applies to names which have a Wikipedia article as well as those that do not. Any name listed with no verifiable citations should be removed. Refer to WP:NLIST for guidance. Fæ (talk) 21:05, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Debate

You can't make statements on the importance, relative or otherwise, of the school's debate program without independent secondary sources that back up those statements. Further, even high levels of achievement in the debate organization this school participates in cannot be characterized as anything other than winning the tournament the school participated in. You cannot call it a national championship, or characterize it as prominent or important unless you have reliable sources, independent of the school and the sanctioning body, that characterize it as such. This is an encyclopedia, not the debate team's webpage. John from Idegon (talk) 07:46, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

The Valley debate team is world-class; I'm not from there, I was just checking out what the top debate schools in the country had about debate on their wiki pages, but denying it is silly. Ask any debater you know about Valley; you don't even have to say it's in Iowa or West Des Moines, you could ask someone in New York (like me) and they'd know about the team. Valley has won the TOC, the main debate national championship, many times. This is all independently verifiable if you know where to look; you wouldn't know a reliable source from the debate world if it hit you in the face. (talk) 01:10, 18 February 2016 (UTC)

None of that changes the fact that this is an encyclopedia, by definition a tertiary source. Content here comes from reliable secondary sources, independent of the subject. Period. It is written to inform people not knowledgeable of the subject. It is not written to promote or publicize. Determining the reliability or independence of a source is not dependent in any way on knowledge of the subject. Reliability is determined by the source's editorial policies. Independence is determined by the facts. It is obvious that unless students from every state compete in the tournaments in question, and that these tournaments are the primary competition in the field, their claim of being THE national championship is dubious. You would need reliable sources completely independent of them, such as books, magazines, newspapers or vetted academic papers calling them that in order to use that in term here in describing them. The burden is not on me to find the verification of information added here; it is on the person wanting to include it. You are a debater, you should know what a red herring argument is. You made one. John from Idegon (talk) 17:56, 18 February 2016 (UTC)

How embarrassing; you both misidentified a red herring and made the section ungrammatical. You're editing wikipedia, save the pretension. The TOC is essentially unanimously recognized as the most elite of American high school debate's national championships (of which there are two or three, depending on how you count it); a Chicago Tribune article stating that has been added. Geographic qualification makes no sense in the context of debate, which is why lack of it does not impede the widespread agreement on the TOC's prestige. Also, a secondary source from a major debate news website on the tournament and the team this year has been added. Are you satisfied now? debatelol (talk) 16:21, 18 February 2016 (UTC)