Talk:Party of Slovenian People

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By economic orientation they are center left. (far right parties are libertal parties)

Dubious

I could find no source whatsoever that the party was originally founded in 1945. Instead, a reliable source says that the party has its roots in the far-right party Slovenian National Right, which was transformed and renamed after the failure at the 1996 parliamentary election - see Trplan, Tomaž (2005). "Slovenia". In Mudde, Cas (ed.). Racist Extremism in Central and Eastern Europe. Routledge. pp. 225–246. ISBN 9781134252534. {{cite book}}: External link in |chapterurl= (help); Unknown parameter |chapterurl= ignored (|chapter-url= suggested) (help) SNR itself was established after a split from Slovenian National Party in 1993. User:Jazbar keeps removing this information (among others) without any explanation, which I suspect is an attempt of whitewashing. I'd like to avoid edit-warring so I'm inviting other editors to weigh in. — Yerpo ^Eh? 07:43, 4 May 2014 (UTC)

PS: it also appears that the user wanted to scare me at his user page. — Yerpo ^Eh? 07:46, 4 May 2014 (UTC)

Yerpo, which reliable source? Are those successors of the totalitarian Communist regime still on power, your extreme left Anarchy friends? Party of Slovenian People (SSN) has nothing to do with right nacionalism! SSN is not ideological political party! SSN represent all Slovenian people regardless of their personal view (liberal, libertarian, socialist, conservative etc.) refuse to dealing with any of extremists left or right. SSN is a modern political party of national reconciliation, without any of ideological lumber (www.ssn.si). Source of the history of the Party of Slovenian People are testimonials from the people and documentary of the RTV Ljubljana from the 20th century early 80s, when first time Dachau trials was mentioned ever in the public. Since the most members of the Party of Slovenian People from the period 1945-1946 were executed by totalitarian Communists regime and documentation destroyed, off course its hard to find evidences.

P.S. Regarding the thought I wrote and "Yerpo" is scared by. I still think that pack of users which previously arranged attack with the sole purpose to violate right information and politically retaliates with Party of Slovenian People is by all legal definitions criminal act. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jazbar (talk • contribs) 09:22, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

If you have a source for the disputed 1945 and 1946 dates in the article, please cite it in the article. Information should be supported by reliable sources. If you also have a source that contradicts the material from the cited Routledge book and the news sources (Finance, 24ur, Dnevnik), please cite it or explain why the cited book and the news sources are not reliable sources. Doremo (talk) 10:31, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

The current party has nothing to do with the alleged group with a similar name in 1945. It's as if I started a political party under inspiration by the ducal inauguration in Carantania, then start to claim that we were founded in the 15th century. So please, User:Jazbar, start selling those fantasies somewhere else. This is an encyclopedia, not an outlet for political propaganda. The fact that SSN was formed out of the right-wing extremist party Slovenian National Right is documented in an academic source, the one you removed trying to conceal the verifiable facts. You will have to do much better than quoting irrelevant documentaries and posing empty threats to convince us otherwise. — Yerpo ^Eh? 15:19, 10 May 2014 (UTC)

PS: SSN is labeled as nationalistic in reputable sources like The New York Times (among other, Slovenian sources which you also removed) so please spare us your empty words about how progressive it is and how I'm an evil communist because I don't buy it. Among other serious violations of Wikipedia principles, you're making personal attacks, which alone is a ground for revoking your editing rights. But I'm not a hateful person, so I'm giving you one more chance to start debating this subject as an adult (which includes leaving referenced content alone until better references are found). — Yerpo ^Eh? 16:20, 10 May 2014 (UTC)

If Eugen Brcic a Croat said in NYT that Party of Slovenian People is nationalist political party that must be true!? Is this source really best you can do, why don't you try harder!? SSN should be proud to oppose Croatian aggression on Slovenian land. BTW Croats invade and occupy a half of Piran municipality but god forbid if someone oppose that fact. Is not an issue politics but Andrej Sisko of which SSN was victim and must persecute him in the court of law, and your other fabrications like SNN has had connections with cheering group Viole... The problem is that your kind deliberately confuse patriotism with nationalism and turn things around to fit your purposes. We Slovenians are sick and tired the way you operate in manner to disqualify someone, you give him a fast label of nationalist or even a Nazi so he is already labeled before any arguments. Sorry Yerpo, Wikipedia should be an correct information portal not a left extremists political manifest. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jazbar (talk • contribs) 03:18, 12 May 2014‎

Your personal opinions about sources, Croatia-Slovenia border dispute, Andrej Šiško and me are irrelevant here. I don't have to try harder, because I did a lot more than you. My every addition is supported by sources, contrary to your claims. In over one week of our conflict, you still haven't provided a single source to refute me (web page of SSN doesn't count per WP:RS) and as far as Wikipedia is concerned, this is everything that matters. The sooner you understand this, the better. — Yerpo ^Eh? 07:14, 12 May 2014 (UTC)

PS: I don't recall giving you permission to speak in my name ("We Slovenians" - I'm just as Slovenian as you), so don't. — Yerpo ^Eh? 07:32, 12 May 2014 (UTC)

To summarize, here are some of the sources confirming the label "nationalistic" and/or "(extreme) right-wing":

• Trplan, Tomaž (2005). "Slovenia". In Mudde, Cas (ed.). Racist Extremism in Central and Eastern Europe. Routledge. pp. 225–246. ISBN 9781134252534. {{cite book}}: External link in |chapterurl= (help); Unknown parameter |chapterurl= ignored (|chapter-url= suggested) (help) (academic monograph)
• Bajt, Veronika (2011). "Myths of Nationhood: Slovenians, Caranthania and the Venetic Theory". ANNALES - Ser. hist. sociol. 21 (2): 249–260. (academic paper)
• Werts, Han (2010). Euro-scepticism and extreme right-wing voting behaviour in Europe, 2002‐2008 (PDF) (M.Sc.). Radboud University Nijmegen. p. 37. (master's thesis at a Dutch university)
• "Konzervativni nemški FAZ: Slovenija hoče preprečiti vstop Hrvaške v zvezo Nato". Dnevnik. 2009-02-18. (news article from a major Slovene newspaper, quoting the German newspaper FAZ)
• Bilefsky, Dan (2009-03-22). "Slovenia Border Spat Imperils Croatia's NATO Bid". The New York Times. (NYT is a reputable newspaper which checks its facts, despite what you think about their sources)

All this against your personal opinion. Does it still surprise you that nobody is taking you seriously? Now on a more human level, I believe that there are different opinions within the party (are you one of the functionaries to speak so surely about them?) and maybe it will change its ideological foundations in the near future. However, there's a thin line between self-proclaimed patriotism and nationalism - currently, SSN has a reputation of being across that line, and it is our duty as editors to report it. It will take effort to change it if the party leaders want that, but trying to conceal the past on Wikipedia is not the right way. — Yerpo ^Eh? 09:38, 12 May 2014 (UTC)

Yerpo, you are floating around! What has antic and medieval history with your claims that SSN is far right and with Andrej Sisko. What about border dispute with Croatia? Your opinion and all this topics you randomly stated only proves that you are simply intolerant for everything which has something with Slovenian identity. And your method is a typical totalitarian disqualification aka fascism. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jazbar (talk • contribs) 16:38, 12 May 2014 (UTC)

Do you even understand English? The claim that SSN is nationalistic and far-right is not mine, but from the sources I gave you. This is an article about the Party of Slovenian People, not about the border dispute. — Yerpo ^Eh? 16:41, 12 May 2014 (UTC)

Where specific is mentioned Party of Slovenian People as far right political party? And where is stated that PSP had something with cheering group Viole? You made it all up. And if some foreign media cited wrong conclusions of Slovenian media is that relevant? You must state some real event or some action which clearly indicate that PSP is far right. What you are doing is pure fascism, you are doing political retaliation with written things out of the context and with written lies. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jazbar (talk • contribs) 06:08, 16 May 2014‎

The article doesn't say that PSP is far right, but that it originated from a far right party. As supported by sources. And no, I don't need to state events (that would be original research which is prohibited in Wikipedia), I must only quote sources. Which I did. The connection with Viole is clearly stated in the source you are trying to remove: Finance, and nationalistic tendencies (not far right) are proven with the sources above. Such conclusions are the only one permitted here, and your personal opinion about the media is irrelevant. You should also note that the connection with Viole is described in past tense, I didn't imply that it still exists because there's no proof for that. However, what happened in 2008-2009 is very relevant for encyclopedic description of PSP. Of course the PSP leadership is very welcome to put the past behind them and prove with actions that they're different now. After they are reported in independent sources, the 2008-2009 period will only be noted as history. Until then, we have nothing to work with. — Yerpo ^Eh? 05:41, 16 May 2014 (UTC)

Your link to this article Finance is clearly prove what I stated all the time. That you made it all up and how you operate in manner to smear Party of Slovenian People. In this article nowhere is written that Party of Slovenian People has anything with cheering group Viole. Andrej Šiško has history with this group, not PSP! And Šiško has never been member of the PSP just outsider candidate on PHP's candidate list for elections in 2008. I rest my case! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jazbar (talk • contribs) 11:14, 16 May 2014 (UTC)

From the context, it's quite obvious that the sentence "pogajanja s predsednikom SSN, ki je blizu mariborskim Violam" refers to SSN, not Andrej Šiško alone. Mr. Šiško was not just "close" to Viole, he was their president. But ok, I'm willing to omit directly mentioning the Viole connection because it does rest on a single source and is open to interpretation. Would that satisfy you? Regardless of the conflicts within the party, mr. Šiško was not just some random outsider in relation to PSP (how could he even be their candidate if he didn't represent the party?) - the readers should note that even Miha Majc, who is still very active in the party today, was once explaining on a Q&A session on the national TV what will happen if their candidate gets elected after being imprisoned. See this link. — Yerpo ^Eh? 11:55, 16 May 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 22 May 2014

Bratcroat (talk) 11:14, 22 May 2014 (UTC) Current text if full of lies

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. — Yerpo ^Eh? 11:50, 22 May 2014 (UTC)