Talk:OSNAZ

Old talk

Why for all the confusion between Osnaz and Spetsnaz? It is a very straightforward matter. --Numerousfalx 08:38, 9 Oct 2004 (UTC)

--69.105.137.23 (talk) 00:44, 14 June 2016 (UTC)--69.105.137.23 (talk) 00:44, 14 June 2016 (UTC)--69.105.137.23 (talk) 00:44, 14 June 2016 (UTC)--69.105.137.23 (talk) 00:44, 14 June 2016 (UTC)==OSNAZ is the obsolete term== "OSNAZ" term seems to be obsoleted in the 1970s or even in the 1960s by spetsnaz term. It is not (or almost not) used to refer to special forces of Russia. Please, adjust the article, Alpha Group, Vympel,etc. should not be here. Cmapm 00:59, 25 November 2005 (UTC)

STill official parts of names--71.246.30.208 (talk) 02:02, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

It doesn't matter if the term is considered obsolete. It is still the Official name of Russian Non-armed forces special forces.--71.162.161.175 (talk) 21:41, 18 June 2011 (UTC)

Please stop forwarding this page to OMSDON, even the OMSDON page states that it was created out of OSNAZ.--71.244.102.25 (talk) 17:03, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Former GRU officer Viktor Suvorov, in his book Spetsnaz, asserted that OSNAZ (and by extension, its successor units such as "Alpha Group") was entirely distinct from Spetsnaz and controlled entirely by KGB (and its successor agencies). Suvorov (who defected to Great Britain in 1978) was caustic about OSNAZ in his book Spetsnaz, describing it as "military-terrorist units which came into being as shock troops of the Communist Party whose job was to defend the party," then going on to say that early on, OZNAZ was handed over to the Soviet secret police. It seems to me that the two general sorts of organizations, having such radically different lines of command and purposes, ought to be described in separate articles. Comments? loupgarous (talk) 00:11, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

I'm also noticing that while this page now redirects to spetsnaz, they removed any references to oznaz on that page. 24.99.56.211 (talk) 05:05, 29 January 2015 (UTC)

restoring unsourced information

Please do not revert the redirect to OMSDON to the earlier version of the article. This article has been tagged with UNREFERENCED for 2 years and no-one has ever supplied any sources. This term is a generic "special purpose" in Russian and does not seem to carry any special meaning in English as well.

Adding references that link to the older version of this same Wikipedia article published by some third-party site is not considered a valid reference. --188.123.231.4 (talk) 20:47, 28 June 2011 (UTC)

Get a wiki account and we will discuss the errors of your ways.--Degen Earthfast (talk) 20:41, 5 July 2011 (UTC)

OSNAZ IS still the official name of the MVD special purpose forces.--209.213.220.227 (talk) 02:16, 9 September 2011 (UTC)

Stop reverting this to OMSDON. OSNAZ IS the official name of the MVD special purpose forces.--71.244.102.25 (talk) 17:12, 12 October 2011 (UTC)

OMSDON is also practically unreferenced. Anyway, Google Books for research (over 700 of them): http://www.google.pl/search?tbm=bks&hl=en&q=osnaz --Niemti (talk) 19:19, 28 September 2012 (UTC)

Former GRU officer Viktor Suvorov, in his book Spetsnaz, gives a basic expansion of the Russian acronym OSNAZ - osobogo nazhacheniya — "special purpose detachments" - but asserts that osobogo has a significantly different meaning than spetsialny, the word which is translated "special" in the translation of "spetsnaz."

Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, in his history The Gulag Archipelago, and Raymond Leonard in his Secret Soldiers of the Revolution: Soviet Military Intelligence, 1918-1933 refer to osoby otdely as an early name for the military intelligence branch of the vCheka - the earliest incarnation of the Soviet secret police, used to assure that Red Army intelligence was under tight Cheka (hence Communist Party) control. The resulting tension between the secret police military intelligence directorate and the Red Army's own military intelligence directorate may (I don't have a source for this surmise, it's pure WP:SYNTH, so don't put it in the article till I can source it) be responsible for Viktor Suvorov's disdain for the OSNAZ. It's an interesting thing to research, and depending on my health, I may do so. loupgarous (talk) 01:25, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

I've read that book as well. While I haven't seen any other material corroborating Suvorov's account, nor have I seen anything contradicting it (nor have I seen any indication that the name changed later, either). Media reports typically refer to Russian special forces of all types as "spetsnaz", regardless of whether they're actually part of the army or not. They do the same for US special operations troops-- calling them "Special Forces" despite the fact that that refers solely to green berets. I'm happy to entertain someone who can cite a real live source that contradicts Suvorov or documents that the KGB's special operations troops are also called Spetsnaz now, but so far it seems the ones doing so don't have any sources to cite. 24.99.56.211 (talk) 05:02, 29 January 2015 (UTC)