Talk:McLaren F1 LM
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Need edit
Is there really a need for this to be a seperate article? The McLaren F1 GTR article was split because in order to fit all the necessary information, it needed to be very long and would make the McLaren F1 article too long overall. However, there is very little information on the F1 LM that would wawrrent the need for it to have a seperate article, especially since there were only 6 in existance. The359 23:14, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
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I just added it, because I believe it to be a rather different vehicle, especially considering why it was ever made (as a celebration) - kinda like the Ferrari F40/50. Many supercar enthusiasts would agree, but if you think it is uncalled for, I can delete it
Ducard
- Except it's not a "rather different vehicle" from the McLaren F1, just a modification. The Ferrari F40 and F50 are not modifications of existing Ferraris, nor are they built is such few numbers. The359 14:58, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
- I would say that the F1 LM is indeed a "rather different vehicle", seeing that it weighs quite a bit less than the regular F1, doesn't sport all the electronic parts of the regular F1, such as the dynamic brake cooling ducts, air brake, etc. It also weighs significantly less, even 84 lbs lighter than the GTR that won Le Mans, and is substantially more powerful. The interior is much more rudimentary in nature, preferring to show that Carbon Fiber is used extensively inside, rather than covering it up with leather and others. It's loud enough that 3 noise cancelling headsets are built in for communications inside the car, a condition that is not true of the F1. The motor is modified in that the rev limit is raised to 8500 RPM, the ECU is remapped, and a less restrictive exhaust is fitted. The Aero package is quite different, so that the drag coefficient went from .32 to .39. And Gordon Murray himself says that the F1 was turned into a race car, The GTR. This was then used as the base for the LM; they added what was necessary for road use. I think that makes it different enough to warrant a different article. Ferrariman60 01:13, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
- You're just describing modifications to existing hardware though. It's like saying the C6 Z06 deserves a seperate article from the normal C6 Corvette. All of this stuff, plus the extremely short article here, could easily (and did) fit within the normal McLaren F1 article. The only reason the McLaren F1 GTR article was placed seperately was due to the fact that it is so long. The359 01:46, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
- I see what you're saying, and perhaps you're right. However, as the F1 LM is a modification of the F1 GTR, I don't know that it is very clear regarding how different this car is, in my opinion. The C6 Z06 is still based on the C6- The LM would be like the Z06 being based on the C6R, which it isn't. I guess that so long as the LM is clearly noted as being based on the race car rather than the production car, and that it is actually quite different. It is a different vehicle, based on the GTR, and make road-worthy. This is an important distinction to make, I believe. If this is noted in the main article on the F1, then go for it, by all means. I think that there is enough that is unique about the LM that it could take up quite a bit of space, but I suppose we can simply work on the main article, and if it grows too large, make another article on the LM, as was done with the GTR. What do you think? Ferrariman60 08:00, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
- The F1 LM is not a modification of an F1 GTR, it's an F1 with elements of the GTR. The only cars that can truly be called "based on" the GTR are GTRs that have been converted to a street legal spec. The LM is not this case.
- However, whatever it is, I still think it is far too short to really deserve an article seperate from the F1 article. As I said before, length was the key reason for the GTR article to be broken away. The359 17:14, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
- I think that if It's given a bit more real estate in the main article, it would be appropriate to delete this article. I have been looking at the quote that Murray had in a recent article to explain the origins of the LM, and he's sort of ambiguous, but I think that you're correct. I guess the cars all start on the same chassis, my bad. I think it should be mentioned that the LM makes use of components designed for/used in the '95/'96 GTR, and the scope of the mods seems to make it more similar to the GTR than to the road car. Sorry about the confusion there, and I think that so long as these things are noted, it's fine to get rid of this article. Ferrariman60 23:29, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
- I agree that the F1 LM space on the F1 article can certainly stand to be more indepth and should most definately contain all the upgraded elements over the standard F1. The359 00:43, 5 May 2007 (UTC)
- I think that if It's given a bit more real estate in the main article, it would be appropriate to delete this article. I have been looking at the quote that Murray had in a recent article to explain the origins of the LM, and he's sort of ambiguous, but I think that you're correct. I guess the cars all start on the same chassis, my bad. I think it should be mentioned that the LM makes use of components designed for/used in the '95/'96 GTR, and the scope of the mods seems to make it more similar to the GTR than to the road car. Sorry about the confusion there, and I think that so long as these things are noted, it's fine to get rid of this article. Ferrariman60 23:29, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
- I see what you're saying, and perhaps you're right. However, as the F1 LM is a modification of the F1 GTR, I don't know that it is very clear regarding how different this car is, in my opinion. The C6 Z06 is still based on the C6- The LM would be like the Z06 being based on the C6R, which it isn't. I guess that so long as the LM is clearly noted as being based on the race car rather than the production car, and that it is actually quite different. It is a different vehicle, based on the GTR, and make road-worthy. This is an important distinction to make, I believe. If this is noted in the main article on the F1, then go for it, by all means. I think that there is enough that is unique about the LM that it could take up quite a bit of space, but I suppose we can simply work on the main article, and if it grows too large, make another article on the LM, as was done with the GTR. What do you think? Ferrariman60 08:00, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
- You're just describing modifications to existing hardware though. It's like saying the C6 Z06 deserves a seperate article from the normal C6 Corvette. All of this stuff, plus the extremely short article here, could easily (and did) fit within the normal McLaren F1 article. The only reason the McLaren F1 GTR article was placed seperately was due to the fact that it is so long. The359 01:46, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
- I would say that the F1 LM is indeed a "rather different vehicle", seeing that it weighs quite a bit less than the regular F1, doesn't sport all the electronic parts of the regular F1, such as the dynamic brake cooling ducts, air brake, etc. It also weighs significantly less, even 84 lbs lighter than the GTR that won Le Mans, and is substantially more powerful. The interior is much more rudimentary in nature, preferring to show that Carbon Fiber is used extensively inside, rather than covering it up with leather and others. It's loud enough that 3 noise cancelling headsets are built in for communications inside the car, a condition that is not true of the F1. The motor is modified in that the rev limit is raised to 8500 RPM, the ECU is remapped, and a less restrictive exhaust is fitted. The Aero package is quite different, so that the drag coefficient went from .32 to .39. And Gordon Murray himself says that the F1 was turned into a race car, The GTR. This was then used as the base for the LM; they added what was necessary for road use. I think that makes it different enough to warrant a different article. Ferrariman60 01:13, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
While I don't have a problem with the idea of a separate article, this article is going to look awfully bare after the image is deleted. We'd really need a free image of the F1 LM to make this a decent standalone article. TomTheHand 13:30, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
- I feel that if all or most of the interesting material on the LM is written within the standard McLaren F1 article it will either be too compact with too many figures cramped into one space that it is cumbersome to locate specific information for the reader, or, if presented more surveyable it would consist of too many subsections taking up too much space in the main article. I think it would be especially interesting and noteworthy how the LM shows what the relatively comfortable standard F1 is able to do when tuned more as a track machine -- i.e. lateral acceleration and track figures would certainly be interesting to compare against the standard F1 and other supercars that are able to be competitive against it. If anyone knows where to find this information or has books that contain it please feel free to include this information here, with references. Posix memalign (talk) 09:38, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
- There is a free image, it's on McLaren F1. For some reason, Ducard simply copied that image and re-uploaded it under a slightly difference name without any license information. The359 14:58, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
- Ah, I see. I've gone ahead and replaced it with the one from Commons and speedy deleted the one here. TomTheHand 15:06, 17 April 2007 (UTC)
Categories edit
I just came back to this page for the first time in a while and saw it was uncategorized. As such, I added several categories, but there is probably room for more, which I'll get to if this article is indeed going to survive. I added Supercars, Mid-Engine/Rear Drive, and Cars manufactured in the UK.Ferrariman60 01:01, 4 August 2007 (UTC)
Acceleration edit
See discussion here for LM performance: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:McLaren_F1#Pessimistic_performance_numbers The only test of the LM was posted in CAR Magazine. There has never been another. The figure of 2.9 is fabricated. Reverting to include it is an intentional misstatement of fact. Alexdi (talk) 14:41, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
External links modified edit
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Merge proposal of McLaren F1 LM article edit
The proposal to merge this to McLaren F1 GTR or McLaren F1 is being discussed on WP:CARS - Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Automobiles#Merge proposal of McLaren F1 LM article SpacedFarmer (talk) 14:15, 12 January 2024 (UTC)