Talk:Martha MacKenzie

Latest comment: 6 years ago by InternetArchiveBot in topic External links modified (January 2018)
Good articleMartha MacKenzie has been listed as one of the Media and drama good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
Article milestones
DateProcessResult
May 10, 2008Articles for deletionKept
October 25, 2010Good article nomineeListed
Current status: Good article

Untitled

edit

If the title of this article is Martha MacKenzie, and someone gave her away to Jack Holden, then shouldn't her article be titled "Martha Holden", as the Home and Away credits (from June 2006) say that her surname is Holden.

Will Kinsella, 5th June 2007 @ 21:03

Jesus some people have a lot of time on their hands! Surely it's more important/relevant to get Jodi Gordon's page up to scratch before this one, no?

Jack sux Martha fanaticism

edit

Why is it that Home And Away's fanbase seems to have established a subculture of "I want Jack and Martha to be back together"?? Rumours (even undocumented rumours) about future episodes are jumped on and excite starry-eyed little schoolgirls about the "bright future" of Jack and Martha living happily ever after. This is not helped by the fact that this storyline has been dragging on well over a year. Canberra User (talk) 05:11, 29 January 2008 (UTC)Reply

Ha, too true. A boring storyline about two idiots with an inexplicable fan base. Well, not too inexplicable I guess, as they are both pretty people even if their characters are awful.125.239.69.56 (talk) 05:07, 26 March 2008 (UTC)Reply

GA Review

edit
This review is transcluded from Talk:Martha MacKenzie/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Fences&Windows 14:29, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply

1. Well-written?

edit

(a) the prose is clear and concise, and the spelling and grammar are correct; and (b) it complies with the manual of style guidelines for lead sections, layout, words to watch, fiction, and list incorporation.

  • It's fairly clear. There are some grammar issues and I need to check it in detail against the MOS and MOS for fiction; I'll do a copy-edit. Fences&Windows 15:36, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
  • This sentence is really awkward, but I'm not sure how to reword it: "The story line progresses Martha into a downward spiral and being manipulated into doing bad deeds by new boyfriend Cam." Something like "Martha begins a new relationship with Cam and progresses into a downward spiral as he manipulates her"? Fences&Windows 18:51, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
I just noticed that the first sentence in the lead now reads as "Martha was a fictional character in Home and Away". However, it should read "Martha is a fictional character from Home and Away". Just because she has left, doesn't mean she stops being a fictional character from the show. - JuneGloom07 Talk? 20:33, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
I also noticed that in addition to this, a copyedit made earlier.. has made another paragraph suggest that Martha left, when in reality she hadn't, more so, she was still filming.RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 20:40, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply

Corrections made.RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 14:55, 24 October 2010 (UTC)Reply

2. Factually accurate and verifiable?

edit

(a) it provides references to all sources of information in the section(s) dedicated to the attribution of these sources according to the guide to layout; (b) it provides in-line citations from reliable sources for direct quotations, statistics, published opinion, counter-intuitive or controversial statements that are challenged or likely to be challenged, and contentious material relating to living persons—science-based articles should follow the scientific citation guidelines; and (c) it contains no original research.

Haven't we archived this link ourselves Junegloom?RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 17:33, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
You're right, it's used as a reference. Good planning. Fences&Windows 18:13, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply

That's the only one around I think, I searched a lot for the original.RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 17:33, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply

I couldn't find it either. Fences&Windows 18:13, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
It's from the old home and away website, which was still hosted by Yahoo7. .. but they deleted the old layout and content and started again with a new look... so it's gone. Doesn't the video act as a archive? It's possible to archive video, so who do you do that?RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 18:20, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
I don't think there's any leeway on this. WP:ELNEVER says that "For policy or technical reasons, editors are restricted from linking to the following, without exception: 1. Material that violates the copyrights of others per contributors' rights and obligations should not be linked." Can we find other sources to verify the material on the relationship between Martha and Jack? Fences&Windows 18:38, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
Well not really as most are quotes exclusive to this video. Why is there the option of archiving the video content on wikipedia then, you can add an archive link containing the file type, why's it there?RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 18:56, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply

3. Broad in its coverage?

edit

(a) it addresses the main aspects of the topic; and (b) it stays focused on the topic without going into unnecessary detail (see summary style).

  • The backstory is missing details of the story of Roo's pregnancy with Martha, and her decision to have her adopted. Martha appeared as a baby in season 1, episodes 177 and 182. I can find episode summaries on "Back to the Bay", but I am unsure on the reliability:[1][2]. They also have a character summary that might be OK to use as an external link? [3] Fences&Windows 16:09, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
Backtothebay is just a fansite, I know that they were pretty shoddy with factual info and posting rumours until recent when they get the odd exclusive peice of info.RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 16:42, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
That's what I thought. Can we find a better source to fill in the details of the back story? Fences&Windows 16:52, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
Everything in this source has already been covered in the downward spiral and characterisation sections..RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 18:45, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
I didn't think there was a requirement to source storylines?RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 18:45, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
That's true, though WP:SOAP says "The article should not be used for a collection of storyline trivia about the character. As a rule of thumb, only those events which were significant enough to have been written about in third-party sources should be included." How do we know if the plot points are significant if they aren't verified? Besides, using sources allows the reader to check up on plot details without having to view the original episodes. And using sources helps improve plot summaries by focussing them and making sure that they are accurate. Fences&Windows 18:55, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
Well if they want to check plot details out I'd advice them to visit the fansites etc... It does say that in the WP for soap opera, but this article is more than a collection of plot details. I'll add them though. Junegloom, can you help me with it?RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 19:45, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
I'm back, sorry about that. Are the storylines considered a primary source? WP:PASI says "Even with strict adherence to the real-world perspective, writing about fiction always includes using the original fiction itself as a source". Or am I barking up the wrong tree there? I just ask, because a ref for the date of the character's first appearance is proving tricky to find. If I cite the episode, is that okay? Adding secondary sources to the storylines should (hopefully) be easy to do. - JuneGloom07 Talk? 19:57, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
About that too, I've never come across anyone wnating to prove the date the episode aired for a character. I thought the fiction itself comes back into play. All these guidelines we have, we have played by, then there are conflicting ones being dragged up.RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 20:03, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
Also you've asked for these citations for the lead, where we don't place references.. There is a claim that a sentance is not covered in the source provided, but it is, it's just reworded into prose, which is encouraged so there aren't as many blocks of stacking quotes, because there are a few. You also want to know when Martha returned filming behind the scenes, we don't know that. Plus you're asking for a citation for Jack and Martha's backstory, the refs elsewhere beyond that line basically prove it.RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 20:08, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
Refs added to the lead..

  Done - Requests for changes in this section have all been carried out.RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 14:54, 24 October 2010 (UTC)Reply

4. Neutral?

edit

it represents viewpoints fairly and without bias.

5. Stable?

edit

it does not change significantly from day to day because of an ongoing edit war or content dispute.

6. Illustrated?

edit

if possible, by images: (a) images are tagged with their copyright status, and valid fair use rationales are provided for non-free content; and (b) images are relevant to the topic, and have suitable captions.

Hi, thank you for taking this article on! This is a joint nomination, but my name got removed from the GAN list. :( Lol. In regards to the image of the character pole dancing, WP:SOAPS says that images used to "illustrate only notable elements discussed in the article, such as characters/relationships, storylines, or real-world coverage on magazine or book covers" can be used, but if it fails WP:NFCC (which is probably the more important guideline), then it can go. - JuneGloom07 Talk? 16:07, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
I'm not saying the image does fail that criterion, just that I'd like to see a solid justification. Thanks for the link to WP:SOAPS! Fences&Windows 16:25, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
I'd say it holds it's own if the pixel size is reduced, it should be lower resolution, I can sort that. It's her storyline that was covered the most, the scene itself recieved media attention, a fact that has been cited with a source.RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 16:37, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
I've reduced the image, now under 300 px in height.RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 17:32, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
Thanks. Another issue with that image: you state it was "Personally acquired, taken from an episode of the named programme" (I guess as a screengrab), but that precise image appeared in The Sun in 2007:[15] and a crop also appeared in various Australian newspapers, e.g. [16]. What is the actual source of the image? Fences&Windows 17:42, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
Oh yes, it's the old rationale for the original, I realised I uploaded a image from the wrong pole dance scene, this one was the one that got the complaint. That picture itself is a essentially a screengrab... One of the refs, whatonTV have the video of it in the interview. So what do you want done now?RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 18:17, 25 September 2010 (UTC)Reply
The source for File:Martha MacKenzie Dancer.jpg needs updating, the image wasn't "personally acquired". Otherwise it is fine. Fences&Windows 22:20, 4 October 2010 (UTC)Reply

  Done - Requests for changes in this section have all been carried out.RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 14:54, 24 October 2010 (UTC)Reply

Note

edit

Sorry I've not finished this yet, I've been really busy. I've done some more copy edits, and I will get to this asap. Fences&Windows 22:52, 4 October 2010 (UTC)Reply

It's okay aslong as we know, I do look foward to it's completion though.RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 19:05, 5 October 2010 (UTC)Reply
I've been distracted by a rival soap, but now it's on a two week break, I look forward to getting this finished. I've managed to find and add a few refs to the storylines section. - JuneGloom07 Talk? 20:24, 5 October 2010 (UTC)Reply

It's been another two weeks now and nothing from the reviewer.RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 15:31, 17 October 2010 (UTC)Reply

Per Fences' note, if he doesn't wrap this up by weekend's end, I'll take over and finish this up. Wizardman Operation Big Bear 23:22, 21 October 2010 (UTC)Reply
Thankyou Wizardman for offering to take the review through it's final stages.RAIN..the..ONE HOTLINE 14:54, 24 October 2010 (UTC)Reply

No problem. Upon reading this article, I found no further issues, so I'll pass it as a GA. One thing does bug me though, unrelated to the article. After reading through it, I'm trying to figure out just how the show has a G rating, I'll just chalk it up to that only be an occasional rating for some episodes. Wizardman Operation Big Bear 04:10, 25 October 2010 (UTC)Reply

Sources

edit
edit

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Martha MacKenzie. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 04:55, 5 May 2017 (UTC)Reply

edit

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Martha MacKenzie. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 04:40, 4 June 2017 (UTC)Reply

edit

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Martha MacKenzie. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 05:23, 19 January 2018 (UTC)Reply